Will Myswag.org live on? It's up to you...

[Brett]

Righto Swaggers,

We've reached a crossroads in the life of the Forum and we as a community need to work out which way we are going to go.The plan to move the hosting from Digital Pacific to Amazon (to try and make the server fees a bit more affordable) hasn't worked out. Whilst one of our IT savvy Forum members has had a red-hot crack at getting it sorted, it has proven to be too problematic.  We thank him so very much for his time though and give him an A+++ for effort. Asking Firefox (the Forum member who volunteered his expertise and moved the Forum to Digital Pacific back in 2012) to sort it is out of the question as he is a man-in-demand in his job.

As some of you may have noticed over the last little while, the Forum has become quite laggy. That's because, effective 1st July 2024, it has not been receiving critical security or cPanel updates or vendor support. The server will continue to function, however newly discovered vulnerabilities will no longer be patched. This increases the risk to the server and data over time.

Because the Forum is proving too hard to move, our only viable option at this point in time (if we want Myswag to live on), is to upgrade our server with Digital Pacific. After speaking with Brett and checking the specification of our current dedicated server, Digital Pacific have come to the conclusion the server that will suit best is a cPanel Managed VPS 3. For a fee, they can assist us with the migration. They will also provide a bulk migration discount to make this transition more affordable. The catch is, to be eligible for the bulk migration discount, we need to pay the annual Server Fee up front. See below:

   
• 1 Month: $308.90/mo  +  Migration charges

   
• 1 year:    $3,069.20   (18% Discount) + No migration charges

   
• 2 year:   $5,482.30   (28% Discount) + No migration charges

   
• 3 year:    $7,845.36    (33% Discount) + No migration charges

We (Brett and Jill) are not prepared to front the $3K on top of the $14K we already have.  We simply cannot keep pouring money into it. So this is where a decision needs to be made.


As a community, do you want to:

   
• Take up Digital Pacific on their offer and all Members (not just the same old people who cough up every single time) contribute in some way to raising the at-least $3069.20 (1 year Server Fee) so that there are no migration charges. This option would mean Members would then need to be prepared to keep coming up with the Server fees each month/year for the life of the Forum.

OR

   
• Say, "well it was a good run of 18+ years Myswag but it's time to pull the plug" and shut the Forum down before anyone's data is breached

We love the Forum and we have met many Members that we now call friends because of it. We are however at a point in our lives where we can't give the Forum as much attention as we used to so it needs to remain fairly self-sufficient. Between Brett's work (DIDO), Jill's work (permanent night shift), two tweens, aging parents etc our lives are pretty hectic.

I'm going to add a poll to this post to start with and then we'll go from there.

All thoughts and alternative ideas are welcome...

Brett & Jillsy

[Hairs]

It's a tuff one Brett,
We certainly don't want you Brett & Jill out of pocket.
Running/moderating a forum Web based is a costly and time consuming exercise.
Most groups, community based, even businesses have made the transition to Facebook, Whatsap.
Our 4wd Club is even questioning the dollars spent on a Web site, is it worth it?
And yes there are many who don't use social media platforms forms, for many reasons.
What ever is chosen, I will support, because I have received support from many Myswag members.
Just my two Bobs worth.


You don't use magic to disappear, ya use a 4x4 & Swag.

[Gandalf the White]

I've enjoyed the forum and have met and made many new friends across the nation as a result, inc some now lifelong friends. 

As with any good thing I.e. Tupperware, Old Format Camping Stores, Canvas Campers, Freedom of Speech in the USA etc, times are a changing, priorities and future plans for all of us will continue to evolve. 

I think you and the mods have done a great job, even potentially saving some people's sanity and possibly lives, but it might be time to wrap it up.

I know there's some that don't use social media and use this forum to stay in touch, but if the friendships are strong, they'll find a way to stay in touch.

[xcvator]

I know that this subject has been raised before, but what about advertising on the site ?

[Harbourmaster]

The proverbial rock & a hard place. Done the Northern Simpson trip purely because of this forum. Would be a loss to see it go but social media is making it hard for many forums. If there are enough to throw in some money I'm willing to contribute to help keep it going. Haven't been on fb since Jan it just gives me the Shites.

[MattNQ]

I find the forum format much better for going back to old posts for reference - eg when I was building a kitchen for my camper- can pull up previous threads on kitchens. Facebook is horrible for that sort of thing.

I was up until recently on a US camera forum (Nikonians) where you pay a small subscription - $12 USD per year for access to all the forum.

Do you think a yearly fee of $20-30 would work for MySwag? I would pay it.

[duggie]

I for one would love to see the forum live , happy to pay a  subscription every year to help make that happen , only need 150 members pay a $20m fee and your server costs are covered .

[GeoffA]

I've been waiting for something like this...

I'm in for a subscription.

As I sit here at 6am, there are 369 Guests, 2 Users logged in. That is not unusual.

[Fizzie]

That was a heck of a thing to be hit with, first thing on Monday morning!

After thinking about it for a while, I've got to say that I can't see an answer that I like

I for one would love to see the forum live , happy to pay a  subscription every year to help make that happen , only need 150 members pay a $20m fee and your server costs are covered .

Which is what I've been suggesting for a few years now, of just setting up a direct transfer of $1/mth (which I've recently upped to $2!!!), but it hasn't worked From previous updates to the Bank Balance thread, monthly donations = $3 (which my change should have taken to $4)

Yes, 150 people x $2/mth = $3600 / year = problem solvered, but do we actually have 150 active members When you look at names on posts, I'd think we'd be flat out having 30 members on here regularly, which would then mean $10 / mth from each of them, which is well & truly getting up there, especially if you're retired / pension

On that, according to the members list (which, by a scary coincidence, shows 10666 members!), we've had 131 people sign up since 1/7/24, but only 5 of them have ever posted. Maybe it has to become a requirement that you pay $2 / mth to become a member

Of course, the simple answer is somebody winning the Lotto, then donating $20k, which would fix everything! (& I've been trying, but it hasn't worked yet )

[DannyG]

Sorry if any of this is out of line but does the forum need to be on such expensive server these days?

I am far from an expert but I have a forum on the same software which has over 10,000 members and is about as active as this one is these days and I have it on a cheapo US server that works fine. I am sure it gets a bit laggy at peak times but so be it, its free and the resources for zero cost are huge.

I am right in the middle of the Gibb River road at the moment but I am happy to see if I can help with any of the migration when I am in a better spot.....(not better, it doesnt get better than this but you know what I mean hahaha)

Either way I am certain youll get enough or already have enough of a base following that would pitch in on a sign up and youre in, dont pay and youre out basis.

[WilSurf]

Wow, 18+ years already.
This forum has very valuable information, I always come here to see info for tracks or areas to go to.

What are the other site options?
I have asked another forum I am member off how they do it as they don't ask for donations.
That forum is hosted on XenForo https://xenforo.com/

[Bird]

I see it both ways. keep or close.
There is a crazy amount of outstanding tech info on this board that would be very sad to see disappear.

Its been unfair on Brett and Jill for a long time to wear those sorts of costs. I'm really shocked at the prices mentioned- but I'm shocked at the cost of most things these days.
I'd like to see it keep going, I'd be willing like few others to chip in.... but not at that cost... also how do you keep it fair for those who pay and those who dont.

I also find forums that ask for $ from when you register are off putting (eg: some photography forums), which may not help keep the turn over of new members and those leaving...
In 18yrs theres been many great members come and go just through natural changes in their personal situations - all forums/boards/groups/clubs go through it... Also some of those who left have started their own forums.. but this place has outlasted em.

Certainly Danny's hosting suggestion is worth investigating...

I think Fizz hit on something - think we'd be flat out having 30 members on here regularly, I thought by lunchtime today there'd be outrage and 20-30 posts on this, but see if that changes by the end of the week.. that may help Brett decide.

YMMV

[Bad Scott]

Need to keep the forum going. How many friendships have been made just from this site. How many trips have been ran where friendships have been formed.
As the famous Hutchie once said. It's an internet dating site for camper trailers.
Bad Scott was formerly announced at the Knockwood camp fire on the Friday night antics hosted by Lost, aka Bird in 2014
Swagmail tom toastie adventures travelling the world, to be finally delivered to Lost at the famous National Meet in Victoria.
I'm in for whatever it takes.

[NZMarkb]

I'm ok with paying an annual fee but we need a lot more than the 11 people that have voted that way (a least 100) and it will be viable

[GGV8Cruza]

I have been waiting for this to happen for a while. I take my hat off to Brett and Jillsy for their continued financial support of the forum. Also to all the regular members that have supported the forum for little of a lot, thanks for keeping this forum viable.

As others have said, this is a place of great knowledge and a resource for all things outdoors and camper related. I have also met lifelong friends as so  have my kids, who we still go camping with and have a fantastic time.

I am not sure if the fees that have been mentioned can be backed up by the smaller regular users and contributors of the forum at present. I am currently remote and have limited access but maybe a quick poll could be set up to see what size of contributions could be raised from the members that would like too. It could give us an idea of what sort of monies could be raised.

GG

Sent from my SM-S928B using Tapatalk

[nab]

Those costs are crazy, but as Bird said it seems most things are going this way in terms of price. I am happy to pay a small annual fee.

I still enjoy logging on and posting my trip reports whenever we get out there. Would love to see others do the same, it's the most enjoyable part of the forum for me. A forum is only as good as the input it gets.

In saying that, if the only reason the forum is still alive is to keep in touch with mates, seems an expensive way to do it. Be a shame to lose all the info though.

[GeoffA]

The current stats show 1540 Guests, 4 Users.

Just saying....

[Fizzie]

I think Fizz hit on something - think we'd be flat out having 30 members on here regularly, I thought by lunchtime today there'd be outrage and 20-30 posts on this, but see if that changes by the end of the week.. that may help Brett decide.

Backing this up further, after ~24 hours, the thread now shows as having 865 views with 16 replies, & the vote is currently standing at 14:3. Geoff has 2 replies, so only 15 people have actually commented, which means that 2 voters didn't say anything. Views will be slightly different, as this is the ~4th time I've opened it, but still means that ~800 people apparently don't care enough to either vote or comment

In regards to

The current stats show 1540 Guests, 4 Users.

are those 865 viewers actually real members though

I mentioned figures like Geoff's a while back & people thought the "guests" would most likely be bots scanning for something or other

Would you need to be logged in, i.e. an actual member, to view a thread though

[lloydus67]

I'm more than happy to contribute a couple of dollars a month to help keep the forum going, particularly if it could be done as a subscription through Apple Pay or something similar. However 10's of dollars per month would probably make it prohibitive.

After just logging in through the actual website, rather than my normal Tapatalk, I don't see any option to vote only results?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[wakychapmans]

despite my years here... I get the feeling that I'm still relatively *new*.

I don't get to participate here as much as I once did. Like everyone work and the like suck my time. But also because I'm living my best life out here in the remote NT.

I think a small monthly automatic direct debit (Patreon style?) would be the go. For muppets like me... with zero control over week to week cash flow... a year subscription is difficult. But the same amount, split into a monthly (or weekly/fortnightly) would be easy as.

[Pottsy]

My camping days are pretty much over due to the wife's health situation but we still travel when we can so I live thru this site vicariously for my camping fix. I visit Myswag every day, have contributed to the server fees in the past and would be happy to continue to do so. An annual fee would require building member numbers year on year.
I appreciate that advertising has never been a part of the forum, maybe it's time to allow major sponsors to advertise on the forum with every guest seeing their ads, members having the option to opt out of advertising if they wish.

[Foo]

A rock and a hard place! 

Foo

[Bird]

The current stats show 1540 Guests, 4 Users.
Just saying....

Most of those would be bots... Search engines etc.

Theres more chance of walking on the sun in thongs and speedos than 1500 physical individuals being logged on in a month. Would be interesting to see how many individual members are logging in regularly

It would also be good to know in the poll what sort of $ we were talking about chipping in... $20/mth is a lot to some and center console change to others.
With the 16 that have said they are willing to contribute - its around 190/yr each

[lloydus67]

Most of those would be bots... Search engines etc.

Theres more chance of walking on the sun in thongs and speedos than 1500 physical individuals being logged on in a month. Would be interesting to see how many individual members are logging in regularly

It would also be good to know in the poll what sort of $ we were talking about chipping in... $20/mth is a lot to some and center console change to others.
With the 16 that have said they are willing to contribute - its around 190/yr each

$190 a year works out to $15.84 per month or $3.66 per week.
I think that few new members would join if it cost them more than Netflix a month.
Even though it's the same money, $3.66 per week is pretty manageable, as you go up to $15.84 per month or $190 per year the cost gets more difficult for people to justify. Everyone knows the cost of just living in the current economy.
As others have said, advertising may be the way forward, or at least a combination of advertising and a small subscription fee.
Just my thoughts
Lloyd


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[wakychapmans]

With the 16 that have said they are willing to contribute - its around 190/yr each

$15.83 a month is quite fine by me.

But locking the place down with the only way to see anything is to become a financial member will stop most new members from joining. I don't know if it's possible... but unpaid members get to make two posts a month and to view four threads (for example)

Same system that the SMH and other papers use. A certain... % is free... but after that if you like what you see... you pay.