We all clear on the roundabout rules in Oz?

[GeoffA]

No idea what their thinking was, but it was all over, not just in Melbourne. I think I did hear that it was to clear traffic on the main road quicker, but that didn't make sense either.

Yep. Like I said, blanket rule....but it did help clear traffic from the centre of the road.....just not sure is warranted the confusion for visitors.

[macca]

Dont worry it was just as confusing for us when we went  interstate, glad its all the same now.  I still get a kick out of hanging a youi at the traffic lights when i am driving work college's from NSW around Melbourne, they squeal like little girls

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[GeoffA]

....I still get a kick out of hanging a youi at the traffic lights when i am driving work college's from NSW around Melbourne, they squeal like little girls

Onya macca...

[macca]

Onya macca...

Its OK, their always much more at ease when I reassure them its their door that gets hit if I misjudge the distance of the approaching traffic

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[nab]

Have a look at basic T junctions on a multi lane road, when you are turning left, and a car approaching from the right, in the other lane, do you still need to give way?

The law states that you need to give way to traffic on the continuing road. I can't find anywhere where it says give way only to traffic that is in the lane you want to turn into. In reality, your way is how 90% of drivers do it and traffic generally flows better if you do, doesn't mean it's correct.

[Bad Scott]

Dont worry it was just as confusing for us when we went  interstate, glad its all the same now.  I still get a kick out of hanging a youi at the traffic lights when i am driving work college's from NSW around Melbourne, they squeal like little girls

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PMSL 

[Jeepers Creepers]

What about push bike riders in all of this.

Do you what for them even though they are slow and just go and take a shot.

[Beepa]

What about push bike riders in all of this.

Do you what for them even though they are slow and just go and take a shot.

And look at all the expensive infrastructure that is built for push bike riders, dedicated cycle paths with bridges (some of them quite large), lane extensions on roads, extra push buttons and lanterns at traffic signals (which includes extra wiring and upgraded program for controller) etc. etc. Yet not a cent paid for bike rego, no wonder the roads are in such a poor condition when our car rego gets spent on bikes.

[Troopy_03]

The law states that you need to give way to traffic on the continuing road. I can't find anywhere where it says give way only to traffic that is in the lane you want to turn into. In reality, your way is how 90% of drivers do it and traffic generally flows better if you do, doesn't mean it's correct.

That's correct, you give way to them by not entering into the lane they are driving in. Driving into the unoccupied lane is not "failing to give way", as you are not causing a risk of collision.

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_reg/rr2014104/sch99.html
https://www.legislation.sa.gov.au/LZ/C/R/AUSTRALIAN%20ROAD%20RULES/CURRENT/2014.205.UN.PDF

"give way" , for a driver or pedestrian, means:

    (a) if the driver or pedestrian is stopped-remain stationary until it is safe to proceed, or

    (b) in any other case-slow down and, if necessary, stop to avoid a collision.

[#jonesy]

Using cars a,b,c like the bad hand drawn one and the attached pic.  Car a& b have to give way to c as he enters the roundabout in the one and only lane. That 1 lane becomes 2 and the markings don't specifically direct him into either lane, therefore he can choose either.


The old Vic rule of left turning to give way to right turners was a good rule.  It got the guy who was sitting in no-mans land in the middle of the intersection out of the way.  It would be less useful these days as we have a lot of dedicated turn lanes. NZ also has/had the same rule.

[Merts]

Using cars a,b,c like the bad hand drawn one and the attached pic.  Car a& b have to give way to c as he enters the roundabout in the one and only lane. That 1 lane becomes 2 and the markings don't specifically direct him into either lane, therefore he can choose either.

Nope.

Car C is going more than halfway around a roundabout, so he MUST use the right lane. Whilst there is only one entry lane, that lane continues around the inside of the central island. You will note that the left lane is effectively blocked by the painted island marking, to prevent it being used. If the driver of car C wants to go into the other lane, he MUST indicate and give way to change lanes. He can't just choose either lane.

[Bird]

[GUEY]

The two lanes on the Main Rd, would indicate it's a two lane roundabout, and if not, it would be a bl@@dy s#1t fight for cars going from two lanes into a single lane roundabout. But he did say it was a rough sketch....

Just for reference, this is the roundabout my sketch is ever so accurately copied from 

It does have another entry point, but is rarely used.

[GUEY]

like the bad hand drawn one

Sheesh, you guys are harsh critics 

I reckon it is better than half the "art" I've seen hanging around the place   

[GBC]

Nope.

Car C is going more than halfway around a roundabout, so he MUST use the right lane. Whilst there is only one entry lane, that lane continues around the inside of the central island. You will note that the left lane is effectively blocked by the painted island marking, to prevent it being used. If the driver of car C wants to go into the other lane, he MUST indicate and give way to change lanes. He can't just choose either lane.

They put those give way dots on that left lane just for you mate......they knew you'd run it.

[Ben.Archer]

And look at all the expensive infrastructure that is built for push bike riders, dedicated cycle paths with bridges (some of them quite large), lane extensions on roads, extra push buttons and lanterns at traffic signals (which includes extra wiring and upgraded program for controller) etc. etc. Yet not a cent paid for bike rego, no wonder the roads are in such a poor condition when our car rego gets spent on bikes.

What a total load of nonsense - I have heard members of the green party make more sense.

The cost of bike infrastructure is absolutely negligible, compared to that for motorised vehicles, and unlike motorised vehicles they have a net gain to the economy in better health for those riding and don't contribute noxious NO2, CO2 to atmosphere.

The costs to the economy of your car is nowhere near met by your rego.

[#jonesy]

Nope.

Car C is going more than halfway around a roundabout, so he MUST use the right lane. Whilst there is only one entry lane, that lane continues around the inside of the central island. You will note that the left lane is effectively blocked by the painted island marking, to prevent it being used. If the driver of car C wants to go into the other lane, he MUST indicate and give way to change lanes. He can't just choose either lane.

Show me a reference that says he must use the right lane.  It requires him to use the right lane of a multi lane road ENTERING but there is only one lane on entry.   No mention what lane he has to be in, in the roundabout. For him the one lane becomes 2 so he does not "change" lanes. Painted island is as good as a solid island so isn't regarded as a lane. It would be different if there were clearly marked lanes for 2 right turn lanes.


C has to give way to all traffic in roundabout, it doesn't have a rider of "except those changing lanes"
Changing lanes requires you to give way to vehicles in that lane. If you aren't in the roundabout you aren't in that lane. 

[wakychapmans]

And look at all the expensive infrastructure that is built for push bike riders, dedicated cycle paths with bridges (some of them quite large), lane extensions on roads, extra push buttons and lanterns at traffic signals (which includes extra wiring and upgraded program for controller) etc. etc. Yet not a cent paid for bike rego, no wonder the roads are in such a poor condition when our car rego gets spent on bikes.

ya know... I usually try to avoid replying to these kinds of  comments. Mainly because of the way they usually flare up into a "bikes v's cars" holy war thing. 

I've ridden bikes my entire life. Driven cars and 4wd's since I was old enough to legally. (52yo now) So I can see both sides of the story here.

But the constant misconception from the anti cyclist crowd that only those with cars are contributing to road upkeep (from rego, licensing and fuel etc) is just plain wrong.

1. Road construction is paid for out of general taxation. We all fund the roads, even those who only ever walk. Besides, rego revenue falls far short of the amount spent on roads, and is swallowed up by administration fees and third party insurance.

But just like we all pay for schools (whether we have kids or not), we all pay for hospitals (whether we need them or not), we all pay one way or another for road and cycle paths maintenance. In most cases, cyclists are also car owners who leave their cars at home to commute to work on their bikes.

2. Local road repairs are paid for by councils – your rates are subsidising people who drive through your suburb (the bludgers!).

3. Cars are charged by weight and the damage they do. In NSW, a 1.51-tonne car costs $459 to register and a 950-kilogram vehicle, $243; on that sliding scale, what might the owner of a 10-kilogram bicycle pay?

The second theory that drive me batShit crazy is regards registration plates being used for law enforcement: "I could report the number of a cyclist breaking the road rules, and they'd get a fine."

Really... this idea fails in so many areas it's hard to know where to start. Have you ever noted the number of a car that breaks the law, (runs a red light, doesn't indicate, drives while on the phone) and phoned it in to the police? They will sigh and tell you there's nothing they can do.

But I'm a fair man... I'm happy to have bicycle license, pay rego, insurance, green slip and everything else the bike haters demand... but see... then I'd be classed as an official road user and be legally required to use the road (not the cycle paths). And I'd also be required to stay in the centre of the most left hand lane.  Bet that'd be fun during rush hour when I'm commuting to work...

[scblack]

And look at all the expensive infrastructure that is built for push bike riders, dedicated cycle paths with bridges (some of them quite large), lane extensions on roads, extra push buttons and lanterns at traffic signals (which includes extra wiring and upgraded program for controller) etc. etc. Yet not a cent paid for bike rego, no wonder the roads are in such a poor condition when our car rego gets spent on bikes.

Wow, do you SERIOUSLY believe that car rego pays for roads and infrastructure? Rego does not even cover the administration and RTA departments required.

Muru has countered that completely as it is a common (and very ignorant) argument thrown up about bike rego not being paid.

How much of that poor condition of roads that you see, has been caused by a bike that weighs less than 10kilos?

Haha, the dumb is strong in this one. Wonder if he lives in the "Smart State"?

[wakychapmans]

How much of that poor condition of roads that you see, has been caused by a bike that weighs less than 10kilos?

actually to be fair... my fatbike, weighs around 30kgs. Though... if we include my fat arse then it goes up quite considerably... 

[Merts]

Show me a reference that says he must use the right lane.  It requires him to use the right lane of a multi lane road ENTERING but there is only one lane on entry.   No mention what lane he has to be in, in the roundabout. For him the one lane becomes 2 so he does not "change" lanes. Painted island is as good as a solid island so isn't regarded as a lane. It would be different if there were clearly marked lanes for 2 right turn lanes.


C has to give way to all traffic in roundabout, it doesn't have a rider of "except those changing lanes"
Changing lanes requires you to give way to vehicles in that lane. If you aren't in the roundabout you aren't in that lane.

So, you are telling me that in a normal 4 way roundabout, with single lane entry/exits on 2 legs, and double lanes on the other two, you can turn to the right using the left hand lane if you enter from one of the single lane roads? Good luck trying that. Don't let the lack of a straight through option for car C confuse you. Car C most definitely does have to use the inside lane to make a right turn at any roundabout with two circulating lanes.

The single lane does not become two. It continues on the inside. The other lane is the continuation of the left lane from the road from the west. If you drive into that lane you are changing lanes within the roundabout. Using your logic, car B could just veer over into the left lane withing the roundabout without giving way to car A. That's not how it works.

[Jeepers Creepers]

Correct, but you have to be on a pushbike or its illegal.

[Bird]

This thread is a perfect round about... its been going in circles with nobody knowing what the **** is going on  for days....

[Merts]

This thread is a perfect round about... its been going in circles with nobody knowing what the **** is going on  for days....

Indeed.....
(I'm pretty confident I know what's going on, which is probably good, as I have designed a few roundabouts over the last couple of decades)

[scblack]

actually to be fair... my fatbike, weighs around 30kgs. Though... if we include my fat arse then it goes up quite considerably... 

Haha, but how often are ever riding your fatbike on the road?

I only ride my carbon roadie that weighs under 7kilos on the road. My DH bike only sees dirt tracks.

Lets not raise the can of worms of how fat my arse is.