Supercheap Auto Winch

[Matto]

OK - let's get the following points out of the way first:

• I should have bought a Warn
• You get what you pay for
• It may be cheap now but it'll break when you need it most and you'll be stuck costing you more money
• SCA only sell cheap Chinese junk
• I should have bought a Warn 

Right. Down to business. So I now have this:



...sitting on my dining room table. $490 from the local SCA. It's the 12,000lb version, strung with synthetic rope. From the other thread ("tigerz11 on sale"), there seems good reason to believe that this is the same winch that BCF sell under their XTM brand. Following on from that, there's a good probability that this is the same winch that Tigerz11 sell under their brand. No way to tell for sure, and it's completely possible that the tigerz11 winches are made from better steel, have better gears, etc, while this one is made from jelly. If so, let me tell you it's at least VERY HEAVY jelly.

So far, my research on these things has indicated the following points:

• They're slow, based on the gearing needed to get the 12,000lb rating.
• They have a low duty cycle, especially with a lot of rope left on the drum.
• They need new quality marine grease as a priority.
• The solenoid pack isn't flash, and needs proper waterproofing to stay alive. Long term plan is to replace with solid-state pack.
• You need to really watch the heat build up, and only winch for short bursts.

All that, I can live with. There seem to be a few people out there (4WDA forums, AULRO, couple of other vehicle-specific forums) that have been running what looks to be the same winch for a few years now, generally with good results. These people seem to have been dishing out much more abuse than I'm likely to.

There is a lot of bad blood out there for SCA winches, but most of that seems to relate to the 9,500lb winch. There's some people who seem to have had these 12k ones fail, but they seem in the vast minority compared to the 9.5's. Heck - there's some people out there that bought the 12k version, were very happy with themselves, took it home, ready a forum thread about someone else not liking them, so took it straight back in it's box for a refund. To each their own, I guess.

I don't intend this to be a "should I take back my new winch" thread. I hope it doesn't degrade into a "should've bought a Warn, everything else is crap" / "Warn are overpriced" fight either. As noted above, I've already covered this for you. 

What I do want to do with this is use it as a place to catalogue my adventures with this winch, starting with the purchase and the fitting. From there, we'll give it a few trial runs to see how it goes, and then load it up and test it properly somewhere. I'm hoping that so long as I stay within the parameters outlined, I will get a good run out of it. Time will tell.

Hopefully I'll get time this week to strip it down and re-grease, clock the gearbox housing, mount it to the car and get it all wired in. It'll probably be a very basic setup at first, but with time we'll relocate the control box and wire in some in-cab controls. For now though, I'll be happy to get it on the bar and turning.

I'll let you know how I get on!

Cheers!
Matto

[D4D]

Make sure you take all the rope off and power-in under tension otherwise you will have to cut it off and buy a new rope.

[Crockett]

• The solenoid pack isn't flash, and needs proper waterproofing to stay alive. Long term plan is to replace with solid-state pack.

Cheers!
Matto

Not sure but may already have one of these, a solid state one that is. 

Will be keen to follow your thread on these, as its what Im going to fit ( at the price if it gets me out of the poo once a year its  )

[speewa158]

That seems afair bit to part with for a cloths line 

[heath74]

Matto,
Looks very similar to my tigerz 11.  Although different solinoid by the sounds of it.

[Matto]

Make sure you take all the rope off and power-in under tension otherwise you will have to cut it off and buy a new rope.

Will do. That was going to be the first test for it - try and tension the rope by pulling the car up the backyard.  Will probably have to pull the rope all the way off to get the gearbox off anyway. Am contemplating clocking the motor as well to get the terminals protected a bit more on top of the motor, and also to give an excuse to pull the motor off and have a look-see. Thoughts?

Not sure but may already have one of these, a solid state one that is. 

It very well may. I've not even had a chance to open the control box yet. Will hopefully do so tonight, and let you know what I find. It's heavier than I expected.

That seems afair bit to part with for a cloths line 

It may be, but it's pretty and orange. My plan is to spool it out across our camp, then offer it's use free of charge to the bevy of Swedish Backpackers that seem to follow me around, for the drying out of their small bikinis. I'm sure Mrs Matto won't see a problem with that at all.

Looks very similar to my tigerz 11.  Although different solinoid by the sounds of it.

We'll see - once I get it open I'll take some photos of the insides.

Quote from Ropes in the other thread, talking about the BCF version of the SCA winch that he has just acquired:

I went with my gut and took the plunge and bought the BCF one.
I pulled it apart to check grease etc before installing it and compared it to my mates TigerzII Grande and the internals are identical (he was a little disgruntled after shelling out $845 for his)
As you say though, the warranty is also a difference.

Time will tell. If the solenoid is indeed different, I'll probably upgrade it relatively shortly. Seems the OEM solenoid pack is one of the major complaints about these winches.

Cheers guys - this has been a much more positive discussion than I thought I was about to get into!   

Txt from the wife today at lunch time "That winch is huge!!!!" - yes, yes it is.

Cheers!
Matto

[wholehog]

...good reason to believe that this is the same winch that BCF sell under their XTM brand.

Given that Super Cheap....BCF and Rays outdoors are all owned by the Super Cheap group i would say this is highly probable

[chisel]

I'll keep an eye on this thread closely.
I went into supercheap on the weekend for a look-see.  Seemed to be only about 25kgs which is good compared to the 9500lb wire cable version at 37kgs.  Still a bit reluctant to put it on the front of the cruiser though (standard suspension, heavy bullbar, heavy dual-batteries... add a winch??). 

Hard to go past at $500 though.  $500 is still $500 wasted if I never use it - although perhaps it will give me peace of mind when tackling tough tracks.

[Matto]

although perhaps it will give me peace of mind when tackling tough tracks.

That's why we took the plunge on ours. The Pathy isn't a heavy car, but once you add 1.5t of camper on the back, what was easy suddenly takes on a different persona. To me, a winch recovery is a bit more controllable than a snatch, especially with the additional weight of the camper involved.

I'll be sure to take lots of photos of the winch, as well as the install.

Cheers!
Matto

[Mrs smith]

From memory you can only rotate the gearbox end on these winches, and maybe the motor 180' there is a small dowel cast into the end plate that the motor bolts up to. Happy to be proven wrong, it's been awhile.
Good to see people doing a bit of research and then making an informed purchase, hope it's a good thing for ya.

[Bill]

Your exactly right Matto the BCF, Rays and Super Cheap winches are all identical except the stickers.
Same as the Ridge Ryder gear all the same except the stickers.
As someone already said Super Cheap Group own BCF, Rays, Gold Cross Cycle and now Amart All Sport and Rebel Sport.
The main complaint we have had with the winches is indeed the selinoid.
But to be 100% honest the selinoids can go bad on any winch.
I do hope you like the winch and if you need a hand mounting it just give me a holler...
Bill and Morag

[Matto]

From memory you can only rotate the gearbox end on these winches, and maybe the motor 180' there is a small dowel cast into the end plate that the motor bolts up to.

bugger. Will pull it apart and see, but that's OK if it can't be rotated. I would like the terminals on top to give them a bit more protection, but on the rear they're less likely to have mud and crap build up on them I guess, so it's 6 of one, half a dozen of another...

I do hope you like the winch and if you need a hand mounting it just give me a holler...

Cheers Bill - much appreciated. We'll see how we go - I might need to call on your expertise closer to the day. I'm sure it'll be a good investment for us.

Here's a photo of the solenoid inside the control box. Not the greatest, but should be enough for those In The Know to spot what it is. I intend to pull the control box apart again and seal it all up with silicone to make it a bit more weatherproof, hopefully give the solenoid a bit longer life.



Cheers!
Matto

[speewa158]

Matto ,,,, back packers mmm,,,, DREAMING 

[Blue Bravo]

Yeh Speewah just dream on

[Mrs smith]

One of the Tigerz type solenoids, check the smaller screws for tightness.
I have a brand one new in the shed  and can't tight'n one screw enough to be happy it's water resistant.
Think I'll end up buying a Albright and mount it in the engine bay.

[oldblade]

It looks like the same winch as my tigerz11 if you need to turn. The grearbox like I did here is an instruction video
Tigerz11 12000lb Gear Box Turning 2009 Winch

[Crockett]

The one at my local has grey rope, is it just older stock. They let me open it up and it has the same solenoid in the control box. The engage lever and stickers look the same.

[D4D]

Looks like it is fitted with a contactor not a set of solenoids

[Matto]

Looks like it is fitted with a contactor not a set of solenoids

That's what I thought too, looking at it. Def not seperate solenoids.

It's different to the Titan contactor that Tigerz11 use, but is probably a similar beast.

Either way, I'm pretty happy that it's not a pack of 4 old solenoids stuck in there.

The one at my local has grey rope, is it just older stock. They let me open it up and it has the same solenoid in the control box. The engage lever and stickers look the same.

I would guess that you're assuming right - it's just older stock with grey rope instead of orange. This particular winch unit has been sold for a while under various names. About the only thing I'd be concerned abotu with older stock is whether it had an older solenoid pack, but it looks like you're in luck there.

It looks like the same winch as my tigerz11 if you need to turn. The grearbox like I did here is an instruction video

Cheers Oldblade - that'll come in very handy.

One of the Tigerz type solenoids, check the smaller screws for tightness.

Thanks for the tip - will do!

Cheers!
Matto

[Paul and Bern]

  Well I can't say anything, cause if it was on special a week earlier one would be sitting on my patrol instead on the ironman one.  They said it was $925 off special against the $899 of the monster.... Was looking for counter weight so wire vs rope not so much an issue, however, am still waiting for S/cheep to have sale so can pick up some grey dyneema as an extension rope. 
Ironman have competition grade solenoids for around $110 as a ball park figure if you ever need them...... funny the winch would seem to be similar to the monster..... especially in the 'old' wiring diagram... the new one the black & yellow are swapped hence why mine was going reverse. Do the instructions look similar, beats me about the tow ball bit 

Paul
hope it can be read, had to shrink it to fit....

[Mrs smith]

That's what I thought too, looking at it. Def not seperate solenoids.

It's different to the Titan contactor that Tigerz11 use, but is probably a similar beast.

Cheers!
Matto

Tigerz sell 2 types of solenoids, I have one of each and have pulled mine right down
and like i said ("I'll be fitting an Albright at a later date")

[McGirr]

My $2 (inflation) worth:

Never had a winch as I have never needed one. Personal opinion too much work required to keep them going especially when traversing water and mud. I make sure I travel with mates who have them. 

I understand some people travel the tracks that do require them and they get used all the time but I bet alot have winches that have never been used. But I suppose that can be said on many things we buy.

Ps Matto you should have got a warn 

Mark 

[Jukebox]

Good onya Matto
I see/here people bag out everything form this to that, but when asked did they own one they say no just heard this and that.
You doing this will be interesting as its form the owner.

Harry 

[Matto]

Never had a winch as I have never needed one.

That's OK - I've got no problems admitting I'm a bad driver! 

I've never needed one either, and don't envisage that I'll start dropping my car into big bog holes any time soon. That said, I do tend to avoid anything that looks marginally interesting when we're out by ourselves, simply because I don't like getting stuck. I'm looking forward to a bit better security by having the big lump of lead bolted into the front bar. Am happy with the maintainence requirements - I do similar with the brand new generator that I've not had a chance to use in anger yet.

As for the Warn - you win a prize! I'm amazed that D4D in particular left it go through to the keeper .

I see/here people bag out everything form this to that, but when asked did they own one they say no just heard this and that.

Cheers Harry - that's part of the reason I'm doing this. Put your money where your mouth is. It might burn me badly, but I figure I can get it installed and running with only minimal investment in things like grease and waterproofing. If it stuffs up, I'll take it back and won't be too far out of pocket.

I'm quietly confident though.

Cheers for the encouragement!
Matto

[McGirr]

But now you have a winch Matto..... I love you long time 

If we camp together I know you will winch me out ......I hope 

Mark