Author Topic: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour  (Read 6575 times)

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Offline alnjan

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Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« on: September 27, 2018, 10:42:15 PM »
Wasn't sure to put this in the Rant thread or News thread. 

The RMS have recently released the latest proposed Coffs Harbour Bypass of the Pacific Highway.

http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/projects/northern-nsw/coffs-harbour-bypass/index.html

https://www.collaborativemap.com/CoffsHarbourBypass

While this should be a good thing it appears a number of people don't think so.   

As most people that know Coffs harbour it is where the Great Dividing Range meets the ocean and there are a few hills.  In the route around Coffs there are three main hills.  While earlier plans had these marked as possible tunnels the final proposal has three cuttings with two land bridges for wildlife corridors. 

From media sources, there appears to be a group of people strongly opposing the lack of tunnels.  Even our lady Mayor treats the Bypass Proposal as a 'cheapskate' offer.  From what I can gather, or understand the main reasoning for the want of tunnels is somehow tunnels will stop the highway noise, where as the 'trenches' as described by our local Labor Candidate calls them will cause the highway noise to reverberate all over Coffs Harbour. 

From my researching from what I have found, tunnels do not stop highway noise and it will still be as 'bad' as without tunnels. 

Also my research shows a lot more against tunnels then for tunnels.  The tunnels the Mayor and Labor candidate are wanting would become Managed Tunnels which causes a few extra problems.  One being NO hazardous goods can go into the tunnels.  So ALL vehicles carrying Hazardous Goods will still have to travel through the CBD of Coffs Harbour.  Also as Managed Tunnels apart from all the 'safety' infrastructure that goes into building the tunnels is the 24/7 monitoringof each Tunnel and the regular maintenance required for each tunnel. 

From the RMS website I can compare that to the tunnels at St Helena, (Byron Bay) and Tugan. 

 https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/projects/northern-nsw/northern-tunnels/index.html

Looking at the St Helena tunnel, each tunnel would be closed for routine maintenance for two nights every three months.  So for three tunnels, that is up to six nights every three months a tunnel is completely closed to ALL traffic and ALL traffic will be back into the Coffs Harbour CBD.  The cost involved of tunneling is nothing compared to the ongoing monitoring and maintenance. 

All for the sake of noise and trenches. 

A few years ago the RMS had their Community Consultation period and due to the backlash about the bypass being a bypass and not a complete re-routing of the Highway from south of Coffs inland to either north of Woolgoolga, Halfway Creek or even Grafton, the whole Bypass was stalled.  So instead of doing the bypass back then, they did the Sapphire to Woolgoolga was done. 

Now.  Before you get too excited about a uninterrupted dual carriageway up the north coast of NSW.  The visible construction work is not expected until late 2020 at the earliest, with construction times to be three years for the Coffs Bypass and four years for the 2km section connecting the northern interchange to the existing highway.  So lets say by 2024/6 we should have a good clear run up and down the highway.  Depending of course just how many hold up they have.  The first being the people demanding tunnels. 

Of the ones demanding tunnels or opposing the Proposed Bypass, while some are residence of Coffs Harbour with their own concerns.  Others appear to be more politically driven.  Does make we wonder if their Political party was in power, just how much they would be complaining about the Bypass, or trying to sell the idea.  It would be a challenge for them to actually try and do the right thing for the community they are supposed to be representing rather then just being in Opposition and taking that word literally and opposing everything.   

Yeah.  So there you have it. 
Cheers

Al and/or Jan

Offline achjimmy

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2018, 07:44:27 AM »
Wasn't sure to put this in the Rant thread or News thread. 

The RMS have recently released the latest proposed Coffs Harbour Bypass of the Pacific Highway.

http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/projects/northern-nsw/coffs-harbour-bypass/index.html

https://www.collaborativemap.com/CoffsHarbourBypass

While this should be a good thing it appears a number of people don't think so.   

As most people that know Coffs harbour it is where the Great Dividing Range meets the ocean and there are a few hills.  In the route around Coffs there are three main hills.  While earlier plans had these marked as possible tunnels the final proposal has three cuttings with two land bridges for wildlife corridors. 

From media sources, there appears to be a group of people strongly opposing the lack of tunnels.  Even our lady Mayor treats the Bypass Proposal as a 'cheapskate' offer.  From what I can gather, or understand the main reasoning for the want of tunnels is somehow tunnels will stop the highway noise, where as the 'trenches' as described by our local Labor Candidate calls them will cause the highway noise to reverberate all over Coffs Harbour. 

From my researching from what I have found, tunnels do not stop highway noise and it will still be as 'bad' as without tunnels. 

Also my research shows a lot more against tunnels then for tunnels.  The tunnels the Mayor and Labor candidate are wanting would become Managed Tunnels which causes a few extra problems.  One being NO hazardous goods can go into the tunnels.  So ALL vehicles carrying Hazardous Goods will still have to travel through the CBD of Coffs Harbour.  Also as Managed Tunnels apart from all the 'safety' infrastructure that goes into building the tunnels is the 24/7 monitoringof each Tunnel and the regular maintenance required for each tunnel. 

From the RMS website I can compare that to the tunnels at St Helena, (Byron Bay) and Tugan. 

 https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/projects/northern-nsw/northern-tunnels/index.html

Looking at the St Helena tunnel, each tunnel would be closed for routine maintenance for two nights every three months.  So for three tunnels, that is up to six nights every three months a tunnel is completely closed to ALL traffic and ALL traffic will be back into the Coffs Harbour CBD.  The cost involved of tunneling is nothing compared to the ongoing monitoring and maintenance. 

All for the sake of noise and trenches. 

A few years ago the RMS had their Community Consultation period and due to the backlash about the bypass being a bypass and not a complete re-routing of the Highway from south of Coffs inland to either north of Woolgoolga, Halfway Creek or even Grafton, the whole Bypass was stalled.  So instead of doing the bypass back then, they did the Sapphire to Woolgoolga was done. 

Now.  Before you get too excited about a uninterrupted dual carriageway up the north coast of NSW.  The visible construction work is not expected until late 2020 at the earliest, with construction times to be three years for the Coffs Bypass and four years for the 2km section connecting the northern interchange to the existing highway.  So lets say by 2024/6 we should have a good clear run up and down the highway.  Depending of course just how many hold up they have.  The first being the people demanding tunnels. 

Of the ones demanding tunnels or opposing the Proposed Bypass, while some are residence of Coffs Harbour with their own concerns.  Others appear to be more politically driven.  Does make we wonder if their Political party was in power, just how much they would be complaining about the Bypass, or trying to sell the idea.  It would be a challenge for them to actually try and do the right thing for the community they are supposed to be representing rather then just being in Opposition and taking that word literally and opposing everything.   

Yeah.  So there you have it.


Never considered the implications of managed tunnels Al. Good case there I think cuttings would be quiet as well.

As for the mayor and labor candidate well is the mayor labor aligned ? Yes your right about them in opposition they’ll say anything. (And given they have 15 plus years and did sfa for our roads)

We have just had a fight over marine parks down here and Luke foley who vermantly opposed the proposal on radio is the same Luke foley who when was a past environmental minister who proposed them !
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Offline tryagain

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2018, 08:15:01 AM »
There will always be NIMBY's anti anything.

Offline doc evil

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2018, 08:52:57 AM »
Wasn't sure to put this in the Rant thread or News thread. 



As most people that know Coffs harbour it is where the Great Dividing Range meets the ocean and there are a few hills.



ummmmm…………...you might want to re look at your geography...…..
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Offline edz

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2018, 12:29:23 PM »
Its on the Web site so it must be true ..
  quote " It is also the only place in NSW where the Great Dividing Range meets the Pacific Ocean "
https://www.visitnsw.com/nsw-tales/tag/coffs-harbour/
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Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2018, 12:41:39 PM »
Its on the Web site so it must be true ..
  quote " It is also the only place in NSW where the Great Dividing Range meets the Pacific Ocean "
https://www.visitnsw.com/nsw-tales/tag/coffs-harbour/

I am not saying it is the ONLY place, it's one of the places
Cheers

Al and/or Jan

Offline edz

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2018, 01:08:35 PM »
As a kid growing up  at Dorrigo and surrounds we were told the same thing by our olds ... Just pointing it out to Doc E. that its on the NSW Government tourist info web ...
Looked it up, it should have said 
" the fact that Coffs Harbour is just one of three points in Australia where the Great Dividing Range meets the sea."
All good Al .
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 01:15:16 PM by edz »
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Offline doc evil

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2018, 02:56:11 PM »
Might be a bit far fetched to even claim that  ;D
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Offline doc evil

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2018, 02:57:50 PM »
or
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Offline Hookie

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2018, 05:04:27 PM »
I've always been told and believed it was the only place the GDR comes right to the ocean. It doesn't just come close, it literally comes right to the ocean at Macauleys headland.

I don't care what they do with the bypass as long as it gets the f*#$ing traffic out of Coffs. It's pretty much a nightmare driving around town now at any time of day. The worst part of any camping trip for us is getting from home on the South side to the North side of town.

Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2018, 06:10:34 PM »
I've always been told and believed it was the only place the GDR comes right to the ocean. It doesn't just come close, it literally comes right to the ocean at Macauleys headland.

I don't care what they do with the bypass as long as it gets the f*#$ing traffic out of Coffs. It's pretty much a nightmare driving around town now at any time of day. The worst part of any camping trip for us is getting from home on the South side to the North side of town.

Living on the North side has it's advantages.   ;D ;D
Cheers

Al and/or Jan
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Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2018, 06:37:55 PM »
you may have to move it around and zoom in to find Coffs Harbour in a bit more detail.  But hopefully you get the idea. 

http://en-au.topographic-map.com/places/Great-Dividing-Range-355299/
Cheers

Al and/or Jan

Offline woolgoolgaoffroad

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2018, 09:35:25 PM »
its been a bloody big debacle thats for sure. How do you think the noise will effect ( or is it affect ?? ) you Al ?... knowing where you are
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Offline rags

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2018, 10:01:15 PM »
ieffect ( or is it affect ?? )

Kev,
Affect is to change (verb),
Effect is the result of change (noun)
The rain may affect my plans for camping this weekend.
The rain had an effect on my camping weekend.

Here ends my lesson, but what would I know I just a plumber.

Back on topic,

I hope I get to drive one day from Brisbane to Melbourne without a traffic light. It seems feasible with the completion of the Coffs ByPass and other Pacific Hwy improvements between Coffs and Ballina.
A bypass from Heatherbrae and M1 would be required and under consideration I believe. It would also require the new NorthConnex tunnel underway under Pennant Hills Rd connecting M1 (F3) and M2.
No lights between M7 and Melbourne via the Hume


« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 10:03:44 PM by rags »
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Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2018, 10:16:55 PM »
its been a bloody big debacle thats for sure. How do you think the noise will effect ( or is it affect ?? ) you Al ?... knowing where you are

Can't see there being any change for me at all, it will just go past quicker, which really will be less noise in the long run.  It will be a bit more tortured for us to get into town, go north to head south, but a small price to pay for the greater good of the bypass. 

Cheers

Al and/or Jan

Offline Paddler Ed

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2018, 11:24:18 PM »
I hope I get to drive one day from Brisbane to Melbourne without a traffic light. It seems feasible with the completion of the Coffs ByPass and other Pacific Hwy improvements between Coffs and Ballina.
A bypass from Heatherbrae and M1 would be required and under consideration I believe. It would also require the new NorthConnex tunnel underway under Pennant Hills Rd connecting M1 (F3) and M2.
No lights between M7 and Melbourne via the Hume

I reckon it's pretty close coming the New England Highway - There's some in Stanthorpe, but once you hit NSW, there's lights in Glen Innes, and I think some in Tenterfield, but if you go round the Tamworth bypass and then out to Premer and that way, down to Dunedoo and then onwards to Gundagai I'm not sure you get any... So it is nearly possible to do it without hitting lights, you just have to avoid the coast...
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Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #16 on: October 03, 2018, 08:36:41 PM »
Well the Political and information spin is alive and well. 

As I has stated vehicles carrying Hazardous or Dangerous Goods can not travel in the Managed Tunnels I have been so misinformed about hazardous goods and tunnels. Apparently hazardous or Dangerous Goods can travel in tunnels in Europe, USA, Japan, even Sydney, Brisbane and Melbourne, there is no reason they can not travel through a tunnel only several hundred metres long in Coffs Harbour.   I was also told not to be fooled by the RMS, seek out the facts and do some research to find the facts.  Maybe if I did some research I may change my thinking. 

Well I don't live in Europe, USA or Japan.  The road rules in Queensland and Victoria don't impact on me in New South Wales, so daring to be mislead I checked the RMS website and found

 https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/roads/using-roads/sydney-tunnels/index.html

Now it clearly states

"Dangerous goods vehicles
Dangerous goods vehicles are prohibited from travelling in Sydney’s tunnels. Find out more about dangerous goods."


I did put the link and quote on their posts but after six hours there is still no reply. 


Now as the RMS can not be trusted, I was wondering if any one a bit more knowledge about Sydney can confirm, if Dangerous Goods Vehicles are prohibited from travelling in Sydney tunnels?  Out of curiosity what is the go in Qld and Vic? 
 
Cheers

Al and/or Jan

Offline Raym

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #17 on: October 03, 2018, 09:06:37 PM »
For Qld it appears that in some tunnels it is allowed & in signposted ones not allowed.

https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/safety/driver-guide/tunnel-safety.aspx#dangerousgoods

I am sure I read that one of the reasons they didn't do tunnels for the 2nd Toowoomba range crossing was that dangerous goods wouldn't have been permitted.

Offline rags

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2018, 09:23:50 PM »
Yep it is my understanding that dangerous goods are prohibited from all NSW tunnels including all majors in Sydney.
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Offline gronk

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #19 on: October 03, 2018, 10:01:42 PM »
It seems feasible with the completion of the Coffs ByPass and other Pacific Hwy improvements between Coffs and Ballina.
A bypass from Heatherbrae and M1 would be required and under consideration I believe. It would also require the new NorthConnex tunnel underway under Pennant Hills Rd connecting M1 (F3) and M2.
No lights between M7 and Melbourne via the Hume

The bypass at Heatherbrae might be under consideration, but seeing as there are traffic lights being installed at the end of the M1 at Beresfield, a bypass is sadly years away. The bypass would cost as much as the Coffs bypass, and the govt won't/can't spend that much..
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Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #20 on: October 05, 2018, 11:38:31 AM »
Must say I will not be holding my breath for the 2020 start the RMS is hoping for.  Not the way certain persons are moving and now with Bypass Action Groups being organised I can see history repeating itself like it did about 10 years ago. 

Everyone saying yes we want a Bypass, some saying we want it built right and sounding like they are meaning, don't build it in my neighbourhood. 

And all this because the proposal has cuttings with land bridges and not tunnels or trenches as the Labor candidate calls them.  All worried about the noise the trenches will make and deafen everyone in west Coffs.  I have been googling at noise mapping a little lately.  Yeah bring on the tunnels, then they can have something to complain about then.  But the funny part about it, well funny for me, is the proposed cuttings/trenches with land bridges they don't want are the furtherest  sections from the main residential area.  No one is complaining about the open highway that travels closer to them, except the current proposal has the bypass raised higher then the old tunnel option from some 14 yrs ago.   From my googling noise mapping a raised bypass may actually be quieter for them. 

Anyhow I hope to still be around to see the eventual Bypass of Coffs, just can't see a completion date anywhere near the 2023/4 of the proposed plan.   
Cheers

Al and/or Jan

Offline GBC

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #21 on: October 05, 2018, 12:00:11 PM »
I can live with Coffs. Macksville bypass is great and the Ballina - Grafton section will be awesome.

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #22 on: October 05, 2018, 12:17:47 PM »
Hi,
    If only we could bypass Melbourne!
An Albury / Devonport ferry was suggested,  but Vic wasn't amused.
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Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #23 on: October 05, 2018, 12:24:27 PM »
I can live with Coffs. Macksville bypass is great and the Ballina - Grafton section will be awesome.

Yeah I can see them going back to saying, we already have a divided road through Coffs harbour, see ya later.  Yep when the rest of the Woolgoolga to Ballina bit is done it will be great, Brissy under four hours.  The track south, well all depends what time of the day you hit it for us but after the last roundabout it's another good run.
Cheers

Al and/or Jan
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Offline alnjan

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Re: Pacific Highway Bypass of Coffs Harbour
« Reply #24 on: October 05, 2018, 12:25:34 PM »
Hi,
    If only we could bypass Melbourne!
An Albury / Devonport ferry was suggested,  but Vic wasn't amused.
Cheers

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thought the same years ago now, early 1990s when we visited Tasmania, how to get around Melbourne?
Cheers

Al and/or Jan