Author Topic: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...  (Read 1198 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline MuruCycles

  • Hard Floor Camper User
  • *****
  • Posts: 876
  • Thanked: 97 times
new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« on: January 30, 2020, 01:58:50 PM »
So the "new" Patriot X3 is released...

looks a hell of a lot like the "not so new" Ultimate Camper to me...

Wayne & Kyria Chapman
www.desertchallenge.org
www.murucycles.com
105 series Landcruiser 1HZ
1994, Supreme Getaway 14' (a "renovators dream")
our "half an 80 series" camper trailer build http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=48738.0
Muru Cycles Witjira trail with Rohloff and 4.8" tyres

Offline Rhojef

  • Learning the Ropes
  • *
  • Posts: 11
  • Thanked: 3 times
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2020, 02:49:58 PM »
I think we'll stick with our Ultimate. Still going strong after 8 years  .

Offline KathyL

  • Tent User
  • ***
  • Posts: 127
  • Thanked: 30 times
    • Ron & Kathy's Adventures
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2020, 03:14:11 PM »
I think we'll stick with our Ultimate. Still going strong after 8 years.
Ditto (after 4 years) plus I like having the option of not having to cook outside in the rain, hail, dust, wind and/or with the mozzies, flies and midges ...
2013 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers)
2016 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers2)
2015 Ultimate Xplor GT
Travel Blog:  Not At Home Today

Offline tryagain

  • Hard Top Camper User
  • ******
  • Posts: 3681
  • Thanked: 486 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2020, 04:20:10 PM »
70K is a lot of coin for a little camper, guess it's a similar price point to the ultimate though, but then ultimate did go bust too.

Offline KathyL

  • Tent User
  • ***
  • Posts: 127
  • Thanked: 30 times
    • Ron & Kathy's Adventures
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2020, 05:17:33 PM »
70K is a lot of coin for a little camper, guess it's a similar price point to the ultimate though, but then ultimate did go bust too.
And they were back in business a few months later with new owners and, by all accounts, the company is doing very well again ...
2013 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers)
2016 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers2)
2015 Ultimate Xplor GT
Travel Blog:  Not At Home Today

Offline JusyApples

  • Soft Floor Camper User
  • ****
  • Posts: 586
  • Thanked: 36 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2020, 06:39:07 PM »
$70k is a lot of money. I’m sure it’s sleek though


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Bought a what?
Researching my next camper

Offline jmorgan1981

  • Soft Floor Camper User
  • ****
  • Posts: 281
  • Thanked: 8 times
  • Gender: Male
  • It was that last beer!!!!
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2020, 08:08:08 PM »
Yeah just seen the price. I did drop an F bomb but the misses wasn't surprised.
One thing I must say when we looked at them at their factory they were first class. They looks to have had a lot of R & D put in. The X1 looked to be one of the better built campers I have seen.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

2017 Mazda BT-50 XT
Exploer Lawson

Offline tryagain

  • Hard Top Camper User
  • ******
  • Posts: 3681
  • Thanked: 486 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2020, 10:57:41 AM »
And they were back in business a few months later with new owners and, by all accounts, the company is doing very well again ...

They still went bust after a long time of doing well, so something changed. There are likely a number of contributing factors but the big one is likely competition, you can get alot more for your money than you have been able to get in the past.

I am not saying there isn't a market for 70k campers as there obviously is, but as the gap between what you get in a 70k camper, and something half it's price continues to narrow, you really need to justify your premium price, Patriot will do this with their build quality, reputation, and slick marketing. It could go either way for Ultimate, it might take a decent percentage of the small existing 70k camper market, or it could be like the effect of Apple introducing the iPad on the existing tablet market, which increased the market exponentially for everyone. Patriot will be looking to dramatically expand the market like they have done from the beginning so alot of it depends on how successful they are in doing this.

Offline KathyL

  • Tent User
  • ***
  • Posts: 127
  • Thanked: 30 times
    • Ron & Kathy's Adventures
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2020, 11:19:55 AM »
They still went bust after a long time of doing well, so something changed.
The Nautilus was what changed (I've been told they lost substantial amounts of money on every one) and given that the price of new campers has actually dropped since the new owners took over I suspect people who bought new Ultimate campers in the year or two prior to the collapse (including my husband and I) paid a 'Nautilus Tax' ...
2013 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers)
2016 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers2)
2015 Ultimate Xplor GT
Travel Blog:  Not At Home Today
The following users thanked this post: MuruCycles

Offline MuruCycles

  • Hard Floor Camper User
  • *****
  • Posts: 876
  • Thanked: 97 times
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2020, 11:23:29 AM »
They still went bust after a long time of doing well, so something changed. There are likely a number of contributing factors but the big one is likely competition, you can get alot more for your money than you have been able to get in the past..

happy to be told I'm wrong... But my understanding of the situation with Ultimate was that the owner simply wanted to retire. So he voluntarily stopped accepting orders until a new owner was found. (rather than do a half arsed job of producing them while his heart wasn't in it anymore)

other Ultimate owners here may know more though...

Wayne & Kyria Chapman
www.desertchallenge.org
www.murucycles.com
105 series Landcruiser 1HZ
1994, Supreme Getaway 14' (a "renovators dream")
our "half an 80 series" camper trailer build http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=48738.0
Muru Cycles Witjira trail with Rohloff and 4.8" tyres

Offline rossm

  • Soft Floor Camper User
  • ****
  • Posts: 476
  • Thanked: 37 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2020, 02:17:28 PM »
happy to be told I'm wrong... But my understanding of the situation with Ultimate was that the owner simply wanted to retire. So he voluntarily stopped accepting orders until a new owner was found. (rather than do a half arsed job of producing them while his heart wasn't in it anymore)

other Ultimate owners here may know more though...

It was bit murky, one of those things where only those very close to the action would know.

Even a suggestion of government grant provided while business was trading insolvent.   


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/nov/13/regional-grant-scheme-business-awarded-750000-then-goes-bust-six-months-later

Offline tryagain

  • Hard Top Camper User
  • ******
  • Posts: 3681
  • Thanked: 486 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2020, 03:50:30 PM »
It was bit murky, one of those things where only those very close to the action would know.

Even a suggestion of government grant provided while business was trading insolvent.   


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/nov/13/regional-grant-scheme-business-awarded-750000-then-goes-bust-six-months-later

Over 5 mill in total liabilities, that's more than a bit of a loss on some campers, and that is after having taken the $750,000 government grant and other injections of funds from the owners.. Reading between the lines but that sounds like it was in a downward spiral that didn't happen overnight.

Offline Bird

  • Once Was Lost, now am found
  • Hard Top Camper User
  • ******
  • Posts: 21046
  • Thanked: 1222 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Life is far too long....
    • My Place.
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2020, 03:56:24 PM »
Over 5 mill in total liabilities, that's more than a bit of a loss on some campers, and that is after having taken the $750,000 government grant and other injections of funds from the owners.. Reading between the lines but that sounds like it was in a downward spiral that didn't happen overnight.
I think thats been mentioned in another threat when it all happened
-
Click to enlarge

Assembled by Lifestyle Qld
Transformed by me, Kiwi, Evo n Farkaway Electrics

Offline Moxley

  • Tent User
  • ***
  • Posts: 206
  • Thanked: 12 times
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2020, 07:32:55 PM »
70K is a lot of coin for a little camper, guess it's a similar price point to the ultimate though, but then ultimate did go bust too.

Some people might be prepared to spend $70G new , but not me. I would even spend $35G second hand. But, Patriot k ow the market better than me!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline Frawls

  • Sleeping Bag User
  • *
  • Posts: 32
  • Thanked: 8 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2020, 07:43:02 PM »
No storage for clothes, chairs etc?
🍻🍻🍻🍻🍾🍾🍾🍾🍾🍻🍻🍻🍻

Offline RonnieQ

  • Swag User
  • **
  • Posts: 74
  • Thanked: 11 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2020, 08:21:26 AM »
It must be tiny inside as well.
Nearly all the photos have been stretched to make the inside look bigger.

Photoshop Fail.

So for $70k + you are getting a tent on a trailer with another tent on the side that can sorta sleep 5 people if you are all under 5'6.

I'll keep my Modcon and my $70k

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

{IMG}{IMG}

Offline KathyL

  • Tent User
  • ***
  • Posts: 127
  • Thanked: 30 times
    • Ron & Kathy's Adventures
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #16 on: February 01, 2020, 08:50:08 AM »
... after having taken the $750,000 government grant ...
Even though the company was awarded the grant, and according to the new owners, the previous owners didn't receive any grant money because the T&Cs of the grant required money to be invested in new equipment prior to payments being made and the previous owners didn't have the money to purchase the equipment.
2013 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers)
2016 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers2)
2015 Ultimate Xplor GT
Travel Blog:  Not At Home Today

Offline Kangaron

  • "Don't make excuses, Make it Happen."
  • Hard Top Camper User
  • ******
  • Posts: 1935
  • Thanked: 81 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2020, 10:34:42 AM »
From where I sit it is just another tent on a trailer.

Offline tryagain

  • Hard Top Camper User
  • ******
  • Posts: 3681
  • Thanked: 486 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2020, 10:40:41 AM »
the previous owners didn't receive any grant money...

Can't see anything about them actually getting it so it looks to be the case.

Nearly all the photos have been stretched to make the inside look bigger.

Photoshop Fail.

She just has really long legs  ;D in their defence, it's likely just the fish eye type lense required to get the wide angle.

It must be tiny inside as well.

The unavoidable issue with campers/vans, you can only choose 2 out of the three of the following list to be good at without compromising the others.

1) Compact / Good off-road ability.
2) Roomy inside.
3) Quick set up time.

Patriot are all about number 1, 1+2 is basically a softfloor, 1+3 is  what they are aiming at which is where most Hybrids fit, but as Patriots focus is on number 1, then 2, number 3 suffers.
 


Offline RonnieQ

  • Swag User
  • **
  • Posts: 74
  • Thanked: 11 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #19 on: February 01, 2020, 11:00:34 AM »
No I don't agree. The fish eye would stretch it in evenly in all planes not just the horizontal.
They would have foreheads like Herman Munster with a fisheye lense.
I understand most campers are a compromise but at $70k they would want to be small compromises. So not for me and probably the reason why I didn't end up buying an Ultimate camper.




Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

{IMG}{IMG}

Offline tryagain

  • Hard Top Camper User
  • ******
  • Posts: 3681
  • Thanked: 486 times
  • Gender: Male
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #20 on: February 01, 2020, 12:28:02 PM »
No I don't agree. The fish eye would stretch it in evenly in all planes not just the horizontal.
They would have foreheads like Herman Munster with a fisheye lense.

That wide of an angle wouldn't be possible with a normal lense, it may not be a fish eye lense but a normal wide angle lense, both tend to stretch the edges, a cropped wide angle shot is likely all that has happened here, I just think the idea that they deliberately stretched it to make it look longer requires jumping to unsubstantiated conclusions..


I understand most campers are a compromise but at $70k they would want to be small compromises. So not for me and probably the reason why I didn't end up buying an Ultimate camper.

Those three constraints are for the most part irrespective of price, they apply to cheap and expensive campers all the same. Cost is more a result of build quality and inclusions. There is no way I'd pay 70K for one, but I also wouldn't pay the price for their cheaper campers but many do. They are not aimed at people wanting lots of internal space, but people wanting the ability to take it anywhere, every option is a compromise, it just different people choose to make different compromises to suit their needs.





Offline KathyL

  • Tent User
  • ***
  • Posts: 127
  • Thanked: 30 times
    • Ron & Kathy's Adventures
Re: new Patriot Ultimate, I mean... Ultimate patriot...
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2020, 12:59:10 PM »
Thought they might have had an X3 at the Queanbeyan show this weekend but all I saw were two X1 models ...
2013 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers)
2016 Toyota FJ Cruiser (aka Hers2)
2015 Ultimate Xplor GT
Travel Blog:  Not At Home Today