Post by: Bird on October 29, 2017, 01:50:40 PM
Need to replace some floor boards on the deck, currently treated pine and stained. Stain has worn off the traffic area badly and some have split at the ends of boards where water sat/ran down the uprights and dripped on to them...
also need to replace the boards on the uprights too (38 at 840 long)
EG:the white boards here, and how to stop the water pooling on the ends of the floorboards and causing it to deteriorate/spilt... ???
(http://www.recycledtimbers.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/IMG_4241-400x400.jpg)
So went to Bunnings and much to my shock, took 15 minutes for the fukin idiots to work out how to get into the caroark, then find a spot, take 20 forwards/backwards to get the **** into a parking spot with nobody around them. I then walked in walked around the timber section and walked out without a ****in soul saying a word to me like "Can I help you" or "do you need a hand or advice"... The 3 dudes were happier to lean on a broom and talk about the blowy he got at the club carpark last night.
Went to Mitre10 - and there was a young bloke in the timber section, had a basic idea, but was always happy to go find out the info I needed - hey we all started somewhere...
But my question is Merbu or Treated pine or other??..
Do you need to do anything to Merbu or just screw it down and walk on it??? the treated Pine would need staining - we used rags to stain it last time and **** it soaked up the stain!!!!!1
Any other timber I should consider??? Hardwood? Spotted Gum??
Anyone know good places in SE Melb to buy the stuff?
Post by: Bill on October 29, 2017, 02:09:28 PM
Timber made of/with plastic.
That’s was 12 or more years ago and it looks as good now as it did then.
No maintenance required.
Swmbo made me use Kwila on these decks. Still looks good 11 years later but needs stain/sealer once a year...
Bill
Post by: Bird on October 29, 2017, 02:14:35 PM
Post by: two up on October 29, 2017, 02:19:32 PM
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Post by: Rumpig on October 29, 2017, 02:34:09 PM
Merbau / Kwila is the same timber but called different names in the countries it comes from, when you lay it you are supposed to wait a certain period of time for the tannin to bleed out before staining it, downside is the mess it can make to stuff underneath when it bleeds out. Out in the elements you really need to restain the deck every 6 months, 12 months at the very worst or it'll start to show it's wear.
Composite decking like Modwood is gaining popularity due to lack of maintenance needed on them, though earlier products did fade over time in the sun...supposably the newer stuff is better, but time will tell i guess.
Your uprights / balustrades will just be pre primed pine, make sure you prime the ends of them when cut to length....you can use a hardwood, but it makes them painful to nail to the top and bottom rails.
I layed a mixed species of hardwood decking at my place (about 1300 LM all up), if you've got pine already and aren't replacing the lot, just use Merbau / Kwila to replace the odd piece instead if you don't want to stain the pine again.
Post by: Moggy on October 29, 2017, 07:07:14 PM
1 day
2 days
4 days
7 days
2 weeks
1 month
2 months
4 months
6 months
Yearly thereafter.
As you can see 10 coats in the first year, but can guarantee it will look stunning & last forever.
I'd recommend spotted gum over kwila purely for looks or jarrah if you want a red colour & use natural decking oil is my suggestion
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Post by: plusnq on October 29, 2017, 08:01:53 PM
Post by: Watty2975 on October 30, 2017, 06:09:12 AM
It is very dense compared to the natural decking wood.
It is on our landing, fully exposed to the sun and elements. Been down a year, seems to be going well. Used it as a trial before committing to the other 180 square metres!
Post by: gordo350 on October 30, 2017, 07:08:10 AM
When I was doing renos with kwila decking I reckoned the best way was to coat it all round before installing & then all the cuts as installing. I used to advise clients to get the best result you should double the days between coats til you get to yearly, so basically this coating scheduleThere's no way I could recommend spotted gum as a decking. Way too reactive. Merbau should be banned as it is ALL rainforest timber no matter what the sticker says. I've been using Black Butt for a few years now. Stable, hard and termite resistant.
1 day
2 days
4 days
7 days
2 weeks
1 month
2 months
4 months
6 months
Yearly thereafter.
As you can see 10 coats in the first year, but can guarantee it will look stunning & last forever.
I'd recommend spotted gum over kwila purely for looks or jarrah if you want a red colour & use natural decking oil is my suggestion
Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk
Post by: achjimmy on October 30, 2017, 07:36:04 AM
Post by: GBC on October 30, 2017, 12:01:46 PM
Pine decking is rubbish, it's what you put on a cheap deck if you are looking to flog the place off...the amount it swells and contracts with wet and dry weather is why you need to put about 5mm gaps atleast between the boards. If you want to go the whole hog, lay it upside down with ripple side up as a non slip thing like all the home handy man shows used to do, because you know, the ripples weren't put on it to allow air flow between the joist and decking to stop them rotting out after all...lol.We have installed a lot of the larger section modwood commercially. It is going well. Probably too expensive for domestic decks in a lot of situations.
Merbau / Kwila is the same timber but called different names in the countries it comes from, when you lay it you are supposed to wait a certain period of time for the tannin to bleed out before staining it, downside is the mess it can make to stuff underneath when it bleeds out. Out in the elements you really need to restain the deck every 6 months, 12 months at the very worst or it'll start to show it's wear.
Composite decking like Modwood is gaining popularity due to lack of maintenance needed on them, though earlier products did fade over time in the sun...supposably the newer stuff is better, but time will tell i guess.
Your uprights / balustrades will just be pre primed pine, make sure you prime the ends of them when cut to length....you can use a hardwood, but it makes them painful to nail to the top and bottom rails.
I layed a mixed species of hardwood decking at my place (about 1300 LM all up), if you've got pine already and aren't replacing the lot, just use Merbau / Kwila to replace the odd piece instead if you don't want to stain the pine again.
The tolerances required for expansion and contraction don't really reward tradesmanlike installation either. Every morning the gaps are huge and by smoko they have closed up again in the sun.
Post by: loanrangie on October 30, 2017, 12:57:05 PM
While picking up something off gumtree i met a block that used A bond plywood in 19mm for his deck flooring and said once it was sealed properly it was good, my deck is fully covered so this appeals to me.
Post by: GBC on October 30, 2017, 01:27:01 PM
Bruce, is there no gap between the decking ? I need to re do our deck but want to go for a solid floor so i can enclose the area underneath (10x4m) and make a rumpus/pool room.Compressed FC with a membrane is the orthodox method of doing what you propose. Joist size and spacing will probably require attention though.
While picking up something off gumtree i met a block that used A bond plywood in 19mm for his deck flooring and said once it was sealed properly it was good, my deck is fully covered so this appeals to me.
Post by: Bird on October 30, 2017, 02:13:26 PM
Bruce, is there no gap between the decking ? I need to re do our deck but want to go for a solid floor so i can enclose the area underneath (10x4m) and make a rumpus/pool room.yea theres a small gap between boards, just enough for your keys to fall down through and plenty of cukinfa cash when your wallet hits the deck, or the pizza delivery arsehat drops the money :'(
While picking up something off gumtree i met a block that used A bond plywood in 19mm for his deck flooring and said once it was sealed properly it was good, my deck is fully covered so this appeals to me.
Post by: loanrangie on October 30, 2017, 02:35:14 PM
Compressed FC with a membrane is the orthodox method of doing what you propose. Joist size and spacing will probably require attention though.
Yeah, weight is an issue though with FC which is what i would like to avoid otherwise i would need to replace the timber with steel posts and beams.
Post by: b1 on October 31, 2017, 04:36:41 AM
http://www.ubiq.com.au/ubiq-inexdecking/ (http://www.ubiq.com.au/ubiq-inexdecking/)
Post by: Beachman on October 31, 2017, 07:47:16 AM
The only downside that I can think of is they are a really hard timber, so decking oil doesn’t really seep in but rather becomes a top coat which can scratch easily.
Post by: Bird on October 31, 2017, 08:31:29 AM
Quote from: Beachman
The only downside that I can think of is they are a really hard timber, so decking oil doesn’t really seep in but rather becomes a top coat which can scratch easily
That's something I hadn't thought of with harder timbers.
with all this decking I kept thinking of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KW5rhvmAu0c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KW5rhvmAu0c)
Post by: chester ver2.0 on October 31, 2017, 09:01:11 AM
When I was doing renos with kwila decking I reckoned the best way was to coat it all round before installing & then all the cuts as installing. I used to advise clients to get the best result you should double the days between coats til you get to yearly, so basically this coating schedule
1 day
2 days
4 days
7 days
2 weeks
1 month
2 months
4 months
6 months
Yearly thereafter.
As you can see 10 coats in the first year, but can guarantee it will look stunning & last forever.
I'd recommend spotted gum over kwila purely for looks or jarrah if you want a red colour & use natural decking oil is my suggestion
Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk
Jesus its no wonder i like tiles
Post by: rags on October 31, 2017, 05:51:45 PM
A great spot to sit this arvo celebrating my birthday watching the sunset over the river.
Post by: GBC on October 31, 2017, 07:17:15 PM
I kinda like the effort gone into fixing our Verandah decking. No fixings visible, all screwed into the steel floor joists, countersunk and then plugged to conceal any evidence with a sanded finish before a oil finish. Like the rest of the house a craftsmanship effort.
A great spot to sit this arvo celebrating my birthday watching the sunset over the river.
Most chippies wouldn't know what a plug cutter was anymore. Someone obviously had a whole lot of time on their hands.
Post by: rags on October 31, 2017, 09:04:10 PM
Most chippies wouldn't know what a plug cutter was anymore. Someone obviously had a whole lot of time on their hands.
Weather boards fixed to steel frame done in a similar fashion, along with all the internal timber joinery.
Even I as a Plumber with a bit of a knack for timber work can appreciate the craftsmanship of the carpenter responsible. Don't know who the carpenter was as we bought the place at pre-auction as a deceased estate, but the owner certainly didn't crimp on his build budget.
Post by: GBC on October 31, 2017, 09:33:28 PM
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Post by: Rumpig on November 01, 2017, 06:38:59 AM
Most chippies wouldn't know what a plug cutter was anymore. Someone obviously had a whole lot of time on their hands.probably because most customers aren't prepared to pay what it costs to do a job like that....I've done one deck in 25 years of being a chippie that was a plug job, it also had the 140mm x 35mm boards rebated along the edges and filled with black Sika....flash looking deck but very expensive to do
Post by: GBC on November 01, 2017, 07:52:15 AM
I did part of my time for a shopfitter at Moorooka who had a joinery shop. They won the jobs that nobody else could build (a round mansion with hand machined radius doors and windows at double bay in Sydney etc). I learned a lot, but what the older generation could do with their hands just blew me away. My generation wasn't taught those skills.
Post by: Fizzie on November 01, 2017, 09:19:44 AM
A great spot to sit this arvo celebrating my birthday watching the sunset over the river.
Happy birthday Rags :cheers:
Post by: Fizzie on November 01, 2017, 09:26:39 AM
probably because most customers aren't prepared to pay what it costs to do a job like that
Spot on, aggressive consumerism has killed our game... My generation wasn't taught those skills.
My young bloke is loving woodwork (Furniture Studies) in Grade 11, & has mentioned he wouldn't mind keeping going with it (although, as per most teens, he doesn't have any real idea of what he wants to do yet :'().
I take it there's no real career path in, I guess you'd call it, cabinet making ???
Would I be right in saying most "cabinet makers" these days just assemble flat-packs & that's about it ??? (& apologies to any cabinet makers out there who can & do use real skills & abilities :cup:)
Post by: Bird on November 01, 2017, 11:13:57 AM
Quote from: Fizzie
he doesn't have any real idea of what he wants to do yet :'().I'm 50 and don't know what I wanna do... :(
Post by: Rumpig on November 01, 2017, 11:57:17 AM
My young bloke is loving woodwork (Furniture Studies) in Grade 11, & has mentioned he wouldn't mind keeping going with it (although, as per most teens, he doesn't have any real idea of what he wants to do yet :'().would really depend who and where he worked for, but for the most part yeah that is modern day cabinet making....30 years ago I did work experience in a furniture making factory, after 2 days I was "making" cabinets alone that were going out to shops to be sold, the hard work was done by the wood machinest already. Not to many people want to pay the dollars it cost to buy high end furniture these days, can't imagine there's many job vacancies around for jobs like that'll, though I guess the occasional one would pop up. Just like hardly anyone wants to pay for high end tradies to spend the hours it takes to do jobs a certain way, it's a knock it out as quick and cheaply as you can world these days for the most part.
I take it there's no real career path in, I guess you'd call it, cabinet making ???
Would I be right in saying most "cabinet makers" these days just assemble flat-packs & that's about it ??? (& apologies to any cabinet makers out there who can & do use real skills & abilities :cup:)
Post by: loanrangie on November 01, 2017, 12:34:40 PM
I'm 50 and don't know what I wanna do... :(
50 next year and also still unsure ::)
Post by: MadMarv on November 01, 2017, 06:23:37 PM
50 next year and also still unsure ::)
I just hope im still breathing when i get to 50 ... and thats in 3 years ... hahahaha
Post by: prodigyrf on November 01, 2017, 07:58:15 PM
http://klevaklip.com.au/How-to-build-a-deck-with-Modwood (http://klevaklip.com.au/How-to-build-a-deck-with-Modwood)
although you'll certainly enjoy the beer watching your neighbours regularly recoat their timber decks and replace them at some stage. Timber outdoors is like buying a timber boat.
PS: Don't forget with decks- http://www.build.com.au/bushfire-regulations-decking-and-pergolas (http://www.build.com.au/bushfire-regulations-decking-and-pergolas)
ie- http://www.modwood.com.au/flame-shield/ (http://www.modwood.com.au/flame-shield/)
Post by: gronk on November 01, 2017, 08:03:52 PM
https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiimZm5j53XAhVMjJQKHdPIAIgQtwIIMzAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DvRMI1bT-7eE&usg=AOvVaw1U3ivNDB8eYsK5HobV3JrQ (https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiimZm5j53XAhVMjJQKHdPIAIgQtwIIMzAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DvRMI1bT-7eE&usg=AOvVaw1U3ivNDB8eYsK5HobV3JrQ)
Post by: Bird on November 02, 2017, 08:58:20 AM
Quote from: MadMarv
I just hope im still breathing when i get to 50 ... and thats in 3 years ... hahahaha
you young whippersnapper
(http://i.imgur.com/oFtJ1hI.jpg)
Post by: Troopy_03 on November 03, 2017, 08:21:09 AM
Post by: GBC on November 03, 2017, 09:58:25 AM
Not going to seal mine with anything..... ;D
Is that recycled teak from the Hunter area? Looks a whole lot like a floor we did for Emirates. The problem with small batches is when they decide they want to do a small reno 6 months later and there isn't any left..... :'(
It gives a great effect though. That wouldn't be out in the weather?
Post by: #jonesy on November 03, 2017, 05:18:10 PM
I use the "natural" oil and not the "merbau". The merbau has a tint that makes the timber look good when first done, but over time builds up a layer that starts to look patchy.
Post by: gronk on November 03, 2017, 05:34:42 PM
In a new life, it would be fake maintenance free decking....along with the artificial grass !!
Post by: Troopy_03 on November 04, 2017, 12:46:20 PM
Is that recycled teak from the Hunter area? Looks a whole lot like a floor we did for Emirates. The problem with small batches is when they decide they want to do a small reno 6 months later and there isn't any left..... :'(
It gives a great effect though. That wouldn't be out in the weather?
Actually it's tiles.. ;D 200mm X 1200mm but yeah it looks pretty good. It's semi outdoors, under a patio with dado walls..
Post by: GBC on November 04, 2017, 02:29:51 PM
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