Post by: Onion on January 29, 2017, 01:56:02 PM
Our issue is finding something that fits the budget (under 30k would be nice) that has more creature comforts than a truck, is diesel, has a good name, isn't too much larger and has more power than we currently have.
Maybe something older with an upgraded/tweaked engine would fit the bill.
There seem to be too many choices, but as I work through each car it seem's to fall down in one or more ways. I'm scratching for idea's here so if anyone has any thoughts, please do post and I'll answer with feedback.
Post by: ravenhard on January 29, 2017, 02:07:05 PM
Post by: Onion on January 29, 2017, 02:14:08 PM
You might just be able to get a Isuzu MUX for you price.Wouldn't be bad, but they have less torque and a worse power/weight ratio than the Captiva.
Post by: Coolblue80 on January 29, 2017, 02:24:36 PM
Cheers, Mike.
Post by: Onion on January 29, 2017, 02:31:32 PM
I'm a bit biased towards Pajeros as I'm on my second, but could be right up your alley.The Pajero's don't look bad at all. They have slightly more torque and a slightly worse power to weight.
Cheers, Mike.
So should I be looking at gearing as well for towing purposes (as well as torque)?
Post by: Alan Loy on January 29, 2017, 02:50:41 PM
Worth driving a few IMHO
Post by: gronk on January 29, 2017, 02:54:50 PM
MUX 130kw and 380Nm
Apart from vehicle weight, on the road you wouldn't tell the difference between them.
Post by: markymark on January 29, 2017, 02:56:02 PM
Wouldn't be bad, but they have less torque and a worse power/weight ratio than the Captiva.That will change this year though - the updated MU-X and D-Max will have the same 130KW as current but 430NM with choice of 6 speed manual or 6 speed auto. Sticking with the old 3L motor but with DPF to bring it up to Euro 5 spec.
Post by: silverfox1111 on January 29, 2017, 02:57:13 PM
2012 model would be in your price range, more than enough power (550 nm), very comfortable, more features for the dollars than anything else.
Weve got 105000k on ours with no probs. Best car I've had.
Before you decide on anything, take one for a spin & go in with an open mind.
Silverfox
Post by: PatrolEv on January 29, 2017, 03:49:57 PM
Post by: IanS on January 29, 2017, 04:03:59 PM
Post by: Nomad on January 29, 2017, 06:12:13 PM
Does it have low range?
:cheers:
Post by: Alan Loy on January 29, 2017, 06:49:18 PM
Post by: Alan Loy on January 29, 2017, 07:13:40 PM
Post by: Merts on January 29, 2017, 07:47:07 PM
If your happy with your Captiva what about just putting smaller rims with more rubber on it.Captivas are not suitable for off-road use. Fine for dirt roads and well maintained tracks, but anything that's steep and/or rutted will be a proble, even with decent rubber. No low range, no centre diff lock, and very little ground clearance.
Does it have low range?
:cheers:
Post by: Bird on January 29, 2017, 07:54:26 PM
Quote from: Onion
but as I work through each car it seem's to fall down in one or more ways.had this chat with 2 different people today.. if I sold the Patrol, theres nothing out there that stands out saying "I'm the replacement you are looking for"...
I still laugh at a couple modern utes if you drain the engine oil too long the oil pump needs priming..
Technology??? yes, that's a big move forward.
Post by: Nomad on January 29, 2017, 08:21:40 PM
Captivas are not suitable for off-road use. Fine for dirt roads and well maintained tracks, but anything that's steep and/or rutted will be a proble, even with decent rubber. No low range, no centre diff lock, and very little ground clearance.
Fair enough. I know nothing about them.....obviously ;D
Secondhand Prado or Paj for my money.
Post by: Pete79 on January 29, 2017, 08:22:10 PM
I know this wont be popular but have you considered a jeep grand cherokee (wk2).An observation from a few recent trips around QLD; pretty much the only cars towing big vans driving at the speed limit where Grand Cherokees.
2012 model would be in your price range, more than enough power (550 nm), very comfortable, more features for the dollars than anything else.
Weve got 105000k on ours with no probs. Best car I've had.
Before you decide on anything, take one for a spin & go in with an open mind.
Silverfox
I don't know if that says more about the car or the people that buy them, but I don't recall ever getting stuck behind one with a van holding up traffic. I wish I could say the same for most of the other makes/models being used to tow these days.
Post by: Kiwijohn on January 29, 2017, 08:22:47 PM
I think both are worth a drive, they are very different but both are good vehicles.
Thanks
John
Post by: gronk on January 29, 2017, 08:53:22 PM
I wish I could say the same for most of the other makes/models being used to tow these days.
Money aside, there are a few 4wds that outperform the Jeep in all ways.
Grey nomads like them for their price ( and good towing ability ), but haven't read up on their shortfalls......which don't need spelling out here !!
Post by: Bird on January 29, 2017, 08:55:39 PM
Quote from: Kiwijohn
I biased as own Colorado7 - we test drove the MU-X and Colorado7, my wife didn't like the MU-X on the road but really liked the Colorado7.but as Gronk said not much improvement on neddies - not sure what the solution is..
I think both are worth a drive, they are very different but both are good vehicles.
Captiva 135kw and 400Nm
MUX 130kw and 380Nm
GU 4.2 with 12mm fuel pump, Garrett Turbo and Laminova Intercooler :D
or
Good used GU Patrol with Brunswick V8 Chev Diesel Turbo Intercooled...
Post by: Pete79 on January 29, 2017, 08:58:43 PM
Money aside, there are a few 4wds that outperform the Jeep in all ways.Purely an observation there. I know better then to try an convince anyone that a Jeep is anything but a disaster waiting to happen. That seams to be the general consensus here, happy to leave it at that.
Grey nomads like them for their price ( and good towing ability ), but haven't read up on their shortfalls......which don't need spelling out here !!
But from what I've seen (for what ever reason) they tow big vans really well on the highway and I'm yet to be stuck behind one doing 80 in a 110 zone.
Post by: GeoffA on January 29, 2017, 09:09:41 PM
.....
GU 4.2 with 12mm fuel pump, Garrett Turbo and Laminova Intercooler :D
Do it ;D, but without the Laminova. They don't flow enough air....
Good used GU Patrol with Brunswick V8 Chev Diesel Turbo Intercooled...
They're a pretty well sorted conversion now, but you'll get better from the TD for fewer $$.....
:cheers:
Post by: Railey on January 29, 2017, 09:14:44 PM
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Post by: mrdenn1s on January 29, 2017, 09:22:05 PM
Post by: edz on January 29, 2017, 09:39:58 PM
Post by: nab on January 29, 2017, 09:45:27 PM
Post by: DrewXT on January 29, 2017, 11:04:34 PM
I'm biased though...
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Post by: cheif carlos on January 30, 2017, 12:56:51 AM
but as Gronk said not much improvement on neddies - not sure what the solution is..
Captiva 135kw and 400Nm
MUX 130kw and 380Nm
GU 4.2 with 12mm fuel pump, Garrett Turbo and Laminova Intercooler :D
or
Good used GU Patrol with Brunswick V8 Chev Diesel Turbo Intercooled...
I see a difference between the Captive and MUX/Colorado 7, one being towing capacity and ease of towing. I think the gears on the heavier vehicle will be between suited to towing and the slightly more space will make moving equipment easier.
That said my wife bought a Colorado 7 over an MUX as both of us found the gearbox and engine slightly smoother and the fact reversing camera only available on the top model of the MUX, but more so the engine and gearbox.
We tow a CC at 1.5-1.7t ok with our C7, I am one who to rate a car good for towing only needs to put foot down about 1/4 to 1/2 going up a steep hill, not need to put the foot through the fire wall to get up the same hill
Bird time to get your mind off your GU's they are about to become a dinosaur ;)
Post by: Fathom on January 30, 2017, 06:02:44 AM
I have a FF Camper, probably about 1.5t ish. Loaded.
My Challenger tows it just fine on the highway in regard to torque etc.
My Patrol (less kw and Torque than the Challenger) has much more chance of slowing down on hills etc.
But as the Troll weighs about 8 million tons, I can hardly feel the camper on the Troll, yet I feel every bump the trailer touches in the Challenger.
In short. On the beach, off road, etc. Despite it having less kw and torque I'd pick the Troll all day every day.
Up the highway/straight roads. The Challenger.
Rather than being about toque. It's probably more about usable torque/ gearing.
So driving them will most likely give you a better idea than specs on paper.
Post by: Onion on January 30, 2017, 06:10:59 AM
2nd hand Prado?The Missus would love one.
Post by: Onion on January 30, 2017, 06:11:53 AM
If your happy with your Captiva what about just putting smaller rims with more rubber on it.No low range. They're an AWD, not a 4WD.
Does it have low range?
:cheers:
Post by: Onion on January 30, 2017, 06:13:12 AM
A strange suggestion as it means going to an older car is the Nissan Pathfinder Ti 550 R51. With 170kw and 550nm they might suit.Will check it out.
Post by: Onion on January 30, 2017, 06:18:18 AM
Have a look at the Discovery 3's. Or if you're willing to stretch the budget a bit, an early model D4.The neighbour has had a couple. Based on his experience you couldn't pay me to have one! But for some reason he keeps buying them... Another mate has one and loves his also. They must be good - when they're running :D
Post by: petrolburner on January 30, 2017, 06:22:09 AM
Carlike handling, good off road ability and by all reports a pretty reliable vehicle. My parents have a late model one, it's pretty comfy and tows their tandem axle pop top at the limit.
I think you will get a lot newer one for your money than buying a Prado.
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 30, 2017, 06:37:14 AM
I sold my 2012 Grand Cherokee Laredo which was a beast on road, but disintegrated off road. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170129/ed164746e3f1ab54e1b7f07468a57e10.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170129/72dd5c6296af7d3b4bb9b479bec7cd6f.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170129/8d3dae63cde7ca121b6e39b0d6198cdd.jpg)
Post by: DropBearRacing on January 30, 2017, 07:23:35 AM
I drive a Pajero for work everyday and take it to places most people only dream of 4WDing. I am constantly amazed at where I can point the Paj and get out again.
I highly recommend both vehicles. The only reason I went with the MUX over the Paj is the 3rd row seats in the MUX are split which gives me more options for carrying items inside the vehicle.
Post by: GBC on January 30, 2017, 10:32:23 AM
Final output figures in peaky passenger cars are lightyears away from being relevant to tow ability - torque curves are what you should be looking at to get any sort of meaningful idea of how a vehicle is going to tow.
Post by: Bird on January 30, 2017, 10:50:58 AM
Quote from: GeoffA
Do it ;D, but without the Laminova. They don't flow enough air....... that depends on the radiator you use for it and where placed ;)
Quote from: petrolburner
With the supplied budget I would be looking at a used Pajero.
Test drove a VRX few years back up the road from work here (think its where Speewa got his), and I'd have one if I didn't wanna go do any serious wheeling anymore. VERY comfortable and VERY smooth... If it towed as well as it drove, it would be brilliant.
The only issue is the rear tyre wear with the 180B style squatting..
Post by: Merts on January 30, 2017, 10:55:32 AM
The MQ has barwork all around, LT tyres, drawer system, extra battery etc. etc., so it's pretty heavy just by itself. When I hitch the camper on the back, you know it's there because it takes a little longer to accelerate to any given speed, but apart from that you would hardly know it's on the back. As far as a daily driver goes, the X-trail was the winner for comfort and ease of use, but for off-road and towing, there is no comparison. The 'proper' 4wds are the clear winners.
Post by: GeoffA on January 30, 2017, 11:03:49 AM
........
Bird time to get your mind off your GU's they are about to become a dinosaur ;)
...about to??
;D
Post by: Bird on January 30, 2017, 12:10:42 PM
Quote from: Merts
... you know it's there because it takes a little longer to accelerate to any given speed, but apart from that you would hardly know it's on the back.you could say that about nearly any car once the trailer is rolling, the hard work is done ;)
Post by: Merts on January 30, 2017, 12:36:59 PM
you could say that about nearly any car once the trailer is rolling, the hard work is done ;)
I think you missed my point.
I've towed heavy things behind quite a few different vehicles, and with some of them, you are constantly aware of the load behind.
As the MQ is fairly heavy, and has plenty of torque at 'normal' revs, you don't notice the load behind as much as you do in a lighter vehicle with less torque at cruising revs.
Post by: rotare on January 30, 2017, 01:15:09 PM
The only issue is the rear tyre wear with the 180B style squatting..
Like any vehicle, whether IRS or live axle, if you plan to tow a lot or often a good idea is to invest in some heavier springs and airbags (particularly for the Pajero).
Have done this and I tow 2.5T regularly with my Paj, and don't get uneven tire wear. A spring upgrade over the soft factory ones are a pretty common mod, so there's a good chance that most second hand Pajero's have had this done already....
Post by: Bird on January 30, 2017, 01:17:47 PM
Quote from: rotare
Like any vehicle, whether IRS or live axle, if you plan to tow a lot or often a good idea is to invest in some heavier springs and airbags (particularly for the Pajero).kewl .. thought there would be some sort of solution out there.
Have done this and I tow 2.5T regularly with my Paj, and don't get uneven tire wear. A spring upgrade over the soft factory ones are a pretty common mod, so there's a good chance that most second hand Pajero's have had this done already....
Post by: kylarama on January 30, 2017, 03:09:17 PM
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Post by: Onion on January 30, 2017, 03:26:08 PM
Another option, Navara STX V6TD.Interesting indeed. What are they like offroad?
Post by: RebsWA on January 30, 2017, 03:48:12 PM
I gave up on that a few years ago and got a his and hers solution.
His is a solid, competent 4wd tow come recreational vehicle that does everything we ask of it but minus a few creature comforts.
Hers is a sedan car with all the necessary creature comforts.
Works for us and did not cost as much as
A plus is we have plenty of shed or garage space.
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 30, 2017, 04:00:14 PM
Interesting indeed. What are they like offroad?You mentioned in your OP that you wouldn't be doing any extreme off road work. Mine's done the Flinders Ranges and quite a bit of the Vic High Country and has some minor battle scars to prove it. Several trip reports here on myswag if you search ScarpsD40 to Mt Pinnabar, Corryong, Blue Rag to name a few. My days of bush bashing are long gone but I do like the views after a good steep climb.
Apart from the dust issue which applies to most dual cabs, for extreme off road descents, this model with the auto gearbox sometimes pops out of first gear to second in low range. This is part of the gearbox design to make sure you don't damage or over stress the gear box. In the same model Pathfinder they have added an electronic hill descent system, to cater for this. There is a mechanical fix for this on the Navara forum, but I found an easier solution of, on those one or two steep descents I may come across each year, to just pull the handbrake on half and it acts somewhat like a manual hill descent control by applying moderate but constant braking without locking up the wheels. To complete my touring rig, I'm seriously considering ripping the tub off the back and installing a custom pod as this will solve the dust issue. Really looking forward to longer trips to the NT and WA where this won't be a problem and the grunty V6TD can tow the 1.4t loaded Tracky CT on long hauls.
Two of my mate drive V8T's and I love it when they follow my dust up a hill
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170130/cdf299f4b387b6452ac178a75f756dae.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170130/d022ba34f3f5bdad066551335d67abb3.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170130/ed9d5d1be0e12c35653caeab2e76c7a8.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170130/ca5363d0fd2ace5d666c479be8766237.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170130/c33584e46ceb6a881d9d91bb3d5ca08b.jpg)
Post by: silverfox1111 on January 30, 2017, 04:21:10 PM
Your recommending a car that jumps out of gear?!
My jeep has done similar if not the same trips as your navara (high country, flinders) & I've never needed to use the handbrake for going downhill. As you'd know the jeep has hill descent control.
Also the fuel economy of the jeep will be one of the best with the same or similar power & weight figures.
If I recall correctly from your posts when you had the jeep, you only sold it cause you had doubts about its longevity. You never stated any probs with it. Yours was an impressive set up.
In saying all this, my next car will be a duel cab ute so i can have a better touring set up now that it's just the missus & me. Cause jerp don't make one, the navara will be one I'll be considering. ?
Silverfox
Post by: petrolburner on January 30, 2017, 04:27:13 PM
Like any vehicle, whether IRS or live axle, if you plan to tow a lot or often a good idea is to invest in some heavier springs and airbags (particularly for the Pajero).
Have done this and I tow 2.5T regularly with my Paj, and don't get uneven tire wear. A spring upgrade over the soft factory ones are a pretty common mod, so there's a good chance that most second hand Pajero's have had this done already....
I agree, IRS is fine for towing. My Y62 even with the stock suspension out towed my GU which had constant load OME lift as far as stability and security goes (I am talking 2700kg of boat and trailer) Now has heavier springs under it and it's even better.
I have not had any adverse tyre wear and I have towed heavy quite a lot.
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 30, 2017, 04:39:23 PM
Scarpsd40PM sent
Your recommending a car that jumps out of gear?!
My jeep has done similar if not the same trips as your navara (high country, flinders) & I've never needed to use the handbrake for going downhill. As you'd know the jeep has hill descent control.
Also the fuel economy of the jeep will be one of the best with the same or similar power & weight figures.
If I recall correctly from your posts when you had the jeep, you only sold it cause you had doubts about its longevity. You never stated any probs with it. Yours was an impressive set up.
In saying all this, my next car will be a duel cab ute so i can have a better touring set up now that it's just the missus & me. Cause jerp don't make one, the navara will be one I'll be considering. ?
Silverfox
As others have said, every option is a compromise, just so glad I didn't buy the 2hungie having heard some of their issues
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170130/c9165e7efdf3072338cc078443c7b30f.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170130/d6e4f754eb8776421f1d87cc2f181850.jpg)
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 30, 2017, 05:00:00 PM
Interesting indeed. What are they like offroad?PM sent re my Navara. By the way, I believe the Dmax and MUX are a good allrounder and their owners some of the nicest people I know
Post by: Bird on January 30, 2017, 06:30:16 PM
Post by: DropBearRacing on January 30, 2017, 06:45:55 PM
PM sent re my Navara. By the way, I believe the Dmax and MUX are a good allrounder and their owners some of the nicest people I know
:cheers: Scarps ;D
Post by: oldmate on January 30, 2017, 07:17:19 PM
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 30, 2017, 07:24:39 PM
We have recently gone from a gu to a colorado 7. We are happy so far. Tows the camper great.Be honest, you've got DMUX envy
Post by: NewieCamper on January 30, 2017, 10:18:03 PM
Edit: we upgraded from a diesel Captiva when we found the Captiva was starting to play up. The Pathfinder seemed to have better interior space than a Prado which was also on the shortlist at the time.
Post by: Onion on January 31, 2017, 09:07:10 AM
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 31, 2017, 09:20:37 AM
Have been looking at the TD V6 Navara's. They don't use this motor anymore (on new one's)? If not, what years were they sold with? Am guessing 2012 - 201?.Emission controls & fuel economy etc have forced most supliers to downsize to 4cyl. It's good to see VW introduce a new V6 model this year and hopefully others will follow. The new Navara's have a gutsy twin turbo which seems to be getting a good wrap but only 4cyl.
The V6TD STX came out between 2011 and 2013. There is a STX550 model also with leather and quite a few should be starting to come off lease cycles at the moment. When I bought mine, I was told there were only 6 left in Aus not already registered and sold or as dealer demo's. As I'm sure you've read, some of the teething problems I had was a result of it sitting in storage for a prolonged period without starting or movement. Are you coming to the National meet? Happy to show you over mine and for you to take it for a drive.
If searching on car sales for one, in the search make sure you select STX diesel fuel and 6cyl
Post by: Onion on January 31, 2017, 09:45:45 AM
Post by: GBC on January 31, 2017, 09:46:09 AM
I wouldn't recommend any D40 for offroad towing. They have a woeful history of bending.
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 31, 2017, 10:25:41 AM
https://www.superiorengineering.com.au/chassis-repair-plate-spainish-models-21680 (https://www.superiorengineering.com.au/chassis-repair-plate-spainish-models-21680)Yep, check for this everytime I wash the Nav. Nothing to see so far, but do have on my list to include these if I replace the tub with a pod.
I wouldn't recommend any D40 for offroad towing. They have a woeful history of bending.
Post by: Isuzumu on January 31, 2017, 10:38:21 AM
Our 2012 D.Max, lastest shape, has done 120k towing our van which is near 3 ton. We cruise at 95 kph averaging 16lp100.
Done the GRR twice and towed the van to the Cape and the only problem we have had is a blown high light bulb. It is fitted with a DP Chip and exhaust and produces 150 Kw and 450 Nm. The auto boxes used in the Isuzus are the same as in the Toyotas, the new 6 speed will be the same as in the lastest Pardo, the one in ours is the 5 speed which was used in thev100 series and the older model Pardo.
Post by: Bird on January 31, 2017, 10:39:35 AM
https://www.superiorengineering.com.au/chassis-repair-plate-spainish-models-21680 (https://www.superiorengineering.com.au/chassis-repair-plate-spainish-models-21680)https://goo.gl/un0zJa (https://goo.gl/un0zJa)
I wouldn't recommend any D40 for offroad towing. They have a woeful history of bending.
Post by: RebsWA on January 31, 2017, 11:50:33 AM
I am not sure who is trying to convince who that they have the ultimate machine. >:D
Post by: Pete79 on January 31, 2017, 12:04:48 PM
https://goo.gl/un0zJa (https://goo.gl/un0zJa)I spy with my little eye......
Something bent from every brand... :)
Nissan, Toyota, Mitsi, Ford, etc. all doing their best banana impersonation.
Who would have thought ehh, put too much weight behind the rear axle and the chassis snaps.....
Post by: GUEY on January 31, 2017, 12:16:11 PM
We have recently gone from a gu to a colorado 7. We are happy so far. Tows the camper great.
Same same, and totally agree. Have been pretty surprised so far. Have not found it lacking for power when towing at all. (Patrol made nicer noises though ;D )
The GU probably felt the camper less, but it was setup suspension wise to suit. The Col 7 is still bog stock suspension wise.
Post by: ScarpsD40 on January 31, 2017, 01:12:49 PM
I spy with my little eye......Looks to me like the Navara's got it nailed
Something bent from every brand... :)
Nissan, Toyota, Mitsi, Ford, etc. all doing their best banana impersonation.
Who would have thought ehh, put too much weight behind the rear axle and the chassis snaps.....
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170131/f4a6c48fe3f9ac5df61b9731c8ad29b7.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170131/a91070a8f714315de0ce374992b7705f.jpg)
Post by: DrewXT on January 31, 2017, 01:20:01 PM
The only dual cab I'm not are of bending anywhere is the Amaroks, as they have a 7 rung chassis rather than 5
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Post by: Pete79 on January 31, 2017, 02:17:14 PM
Looks to me like the Navara's got it nailedNot exactly something I would like to be towing around the country, but yeah, at least the weight looks to be in the right place.
Post by: Isuzumu on February 01, 2017, 07:43:34 AM
Navara and Triton if you talk to Dave Cox...
The only dual cab I'm not are of bending anywhere is the Amaroks, as they have a 7 rung chassis rather than 5
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
So does the D.Max, so the Collie would have to.
Post by: DrewXT on February 01, 2017, 07:56:42 AM
So does the D.Max, so the Collie would have to.Yeah, apparently there's been a couple of bent Isuzu, but ones massively over gvm
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Post by: Isuzumu on February 01, 2017, 08:01:51 AM
Yeah, apparently there's been a couple of bent Isuzu, but ones massively over gvm
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Not heard of one on our Isuzu forums as yet.
Post by: GBC on February 01, 2017, 11:00:29 AM
Post by: Pete79 on February 01, 2017, 02:31:49 PM
Same with the px/px2 ranger/mazda. Apart from the grotesquely bent blue one on the net that looks like it was dropped from heaven. All of the current/new ones seem to be kicking goals in that department.(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTkwXEwSDUdjaCmKBXy_kc-Iqb1Mc02EJEAQvRqAA86g4TvaLvgv6Sd5cQh0Q)
Post by: DrewXT on February 01, 2017, 04:15:06 PM
Not heard of one on our Isuzu forums as yet.If my memory serves, it was somewhere in the Pilbara, and I think it was a mine vehicle, so all bets are off on that environment!!
The DMax was my second of two choices when I got the Rok, but I couldn't find a dealer interested in selling one...
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Post by: GBC on February 01, 2017, 04:19:47 PM
(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTkwXEwSDUdjaCmKBXy_kc-Iqb1Mc02EJEAQvRqAA86g4TvaLvgv6Sd5cQh0Q)
That's an old pk mate
Post by: RebsWA on February 01, 2017, 05:35:22 PM
IMO any of the brands will bend cos they are weak to start with, overrated for tow capacity (to aid sales), and the bent ones subject to more stress than ever designed for, for various reasons.
I am sure the OP has got the drift.
Post by: ScarpsD40 on February 01, 2017, 07:02:44 PM
How much more on dual cab bent chassis?Agree
IMO any of the brands will bend cos they are weak to start with, overrated for tow capacity (to aid sales), and the bent ones subject to more stress than ever designed for, for various reasons.
I am sure the OP has got the drift.
Post by: Wortho on February 02, 2017, 12:01:43 PM
The new/updated DMax MUX which should be on the floors end of Feb is going to be the vehicle to be in.I find the 6 month servicing intervals a bit off putting so hopefully they extend this to 12 months as seems to be overkill and a cash grab. Not real happy about the DPF as a mate just had to have his replaced (VW Golf) and they wanted $5000 for OEM. I guess will have to get used to DPF as it appears all new diesel vehicles will need one from this year I understand. The rear diff lock is a big plus for me though! Any cooling issues with the Auto when towing, is the standard Auto cooler a decent size? I have fried a gearbox when towing before so next vehicle I buy will either be a manual or Auto with decent size cooler.
Cheers
Wortho
Post by: Paddler Ed on February 02, 2017, 01:43:40 PM
1) Factory sat nav is nice... But the maps cost a fortune to update and may not include the bush trails that you need. My thought on this: Don't bother with it.
2) How many people do you need to carry? That can shape the vehicle as well.
3) Wagon or Ute? The long running question.... My preference is for a wagon, but that's what works for me. I think that utes also have a better resale value, so higher purchase costs vs the equivalent wagon (see Prado's for a. Example of this)
4) If going wagon, do you go body on frame construction or the semi-monocoque opion? This boils down to Prado etc vs Pathfinder/Pajero/Jeep (non-Wrangler)/Newer Doscoverys and some others.
5) Ludo bits: The only one I like is aircon,but otherwise leather etc are just niceties that might be bundled with less practical/useful options.
Post by: Merts on February 02, 2017, 02:25:43 PM
1) Factory sat nav is nice... But the maps cost a fortune to update and may not include the bush trails that you need. My thought on this: Don't bother with it.
Totally agree.
I went with the GLS in the Triton which didn't have factory sat nav.
I put a $200 Garmin unit on the windscreen for road navigation, and use an iPad with the Hema Navigator Pro app for offroad. Works a treat.
Post by: Isuzumu on February 02, 2017, 03:50:09 PM
I find the 6 month servicing intervals a bit off putting so hopefully they extend this to 12 months as seems to be overkill and a cash grab. Not real happy about the DPF as a mate just had to have his replaced (VW Golf) and they wanted $5000 for OEM. I guess will have to get used to DPF as it appears all new diesel vehicles will need one from this year I understand. The rear diff lock is a big plus for me though! Any cooling issues with the Auto when towing, is the standard Auto cooler a decent size? I have fried a gearbox when towing before so next vehicle I buy will either be a manual or Auto with decent size cooler.
Cheers
Wortho
I may be wrong about the diff lock. I have put an extra cooler on the auto as I am towing quite a bit of weight. As far as servicing goes I do my own now that It is out of warranty, but had it serviced every 10k anyway, but not by a dealer.
Post by: Snow on February 03, 2017, 08:54:48 AM
Post by: GUEY on February 03, 2017, 10:01:59 AM
I looked at em all, and ended up with the Everest. It cost me a bit more than the others bar the Toyotas, but it ticked all the boxes the OP has mentioned.
Bar the price. Can't see anything under 45k, even second hand ;)
Post by: Merts on February 03, 2017, 11:03:31 AM
Bar the price. Can't see anything under 45k, even second hand ;)
When I was looking at what to get for my latest ride, I was fairly interested in the Everest, until they released it and I saw the pricing. Ford are kidding themselves.
Post by: jr on February 04, 2017, 12:12:56 PM
Top level mux $50 K, with other bonuses
Id avoid DPF, expensive to look after and have several reasons to go into limp mode
Post by: sbv20j on February 04, 2017, 04:07:38 PM
No power issues
No diesel issues
No GVM issues
No cargo space issues
(http://i349.photobucket.com/albums/q372/Iva_Nissan/20160722_171407_zpsyxzro72p.jpg) (http://s349.photobucket.com/user/Iva_Nissan/media/20160722_171407_zpsyxzro72p.jpg.html)
Post by: Merts on February 04, 2017, 04:24:09 PM
No bent chassis issue
No power issues
No diesel issues
No GVM issues
No cargo space issues
Yeah good.
It only misses the OP's budget by nearly 50 grand....
Post by: sbv20j on February 04, 2017, 04:26:28 PM
But it does use 2-3ltrs more per 100k than my 3ltr diesel patrol did around town, on the hwy its uses less than the 3ltr did
Post by: SEADOO on February 04, 2017, 05:07:24 PM
No bent chassis issue
No power issues
No diesel issues
No GVM issues
No cargo space issues
(http://i349.photobucket.com/albums/q372/Iva_Nissan/20160722_171407_zpsyxzro72p.jpg) (http://s349.photobucket.com/user/Iva_Nissan/media/20160722_171407_zpsyxzro72p.jpg.html)
Does the seat in the boot lay flat. We looked at one today with the intention of driving away in it. We have never sat in one before.
We were turned off by the $80k (TI model) price tag and the rear seats not folding flat in the boot. I thought they retailed around $70k. At $80k, that is 200 Series money.
Post by: Bird on February 04, 2017, 06:12:49 PM
Quote from: SEADOO
I thought they retailed around $70k. At $80k, that is 200 Series money.Wouldn't pay that for either.
... bout 18mths ago one member was offered a Y62 on run out for <60k drive away....
Post by: petrolburner on February 04, 2017, 06:42:33 PM
Does the seat in the boot lay flat. We looked at one today with the intention of driving away in it. We have never sat in one before.
We were turned off by the $80k (TI model) price tag and the rear seats not folding flat in the boot. I thought they retailed around $70k. At $80k, that is 200 Series money.
Rear seat will fold a little flatter if you pull the head rests out.
I have had my ST-L spec for three years and have not found the rear cargo space an issue at all. Actually I have not found any issues with the beast in that time.
Suggest you check out the Y62 FB page for current prices, you will get a Ti for well under 80k!
Some have reported securing a TI for mid 60's but I don't watch the price topics much and am not bang up to date on what they are selling them for this month.
As for landcruiser prices..... a GXL is somewhere around 80k and it feels very base spec in comparison, a TI needs to be compared to the VX. A TI -L to the Sahara.
Check out my thread here and feel free to ask questions there, I don't think the Y62 has anything to do with this topic as it's not in the OP's price range.
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=44682.0 (http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=44682.0)
Post by: SEADOO on February 04, 2017, 06:59:28 PM
Post by: shanegtr on February 04, 2017, 07:13:27 PM
Have a look at the Discovery 3's. Or if you're willing to stretch the budget a bit, an early model D4.That would be my pick to. But Im a little biased. ;D I think Land Rover really nailed the perfect all rounder with the D3 & D4, very comfortable on the highway and good off it too. No need to worry about suspesion lifts or heavy duty spring as the airbag suspension takes care of all that. The 2.7 diesels can run with 17" rims, but all others 19" is the smallest factory rim which is probably its biggest downfall off road. Can be squeezed down to 18's with aftermarket rims. My D3 runs 17" so no issues for me 8)
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2.7 Diesel 140kw & 440Nm
3.0 Diesel 155kw & 540Nm or 180kw & 600Nm depending on spec
Post by: Railey on February 04, 2017, 08:09:12 PM
That would be my pick to. But Im a little biased. ;D I think Land Rover really nailed the perfect all rounder with the D3 & D4, very comfortable on the highway and good off it too. No need to worry about suspesion lifts or heavy duty spring as the airbag suspension takes care of all that. The 2.7 diesels can run with 17" rims, but all others 19" is the smallest factory rim which is probably its biggest downfall off road. Can be squeezed down to 18's with aftermarket rims. My D3 runs 17" so no issues for me 8)I'm biased as well as I have a D2 and would have suggested that, but at $30k budget, it'd have to be a VERY special D2. ;D
2.7 Diesel 140kw & 440Nm
3.0 Diesel 155kw & 540Nm or 180kw & 600Nm depending on spec
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Post by: jmorgan1981 on February 05, 2017, 11:37:16 AM
That would be my pick to. But Im a little biased. ;D I think Land Rover really nailed the perfect all rounder with the D3 & D4, very comfortable on the highway and good off it too. No need to worry about suspesion lifts or heavy duty spring as the airbag suspension takes care of all that. The 2.7 diesels can run with 17" rims, but all others 19" is the smallest factory rim which is probably its biggest downfall off road. Can be squeezed down to 18's with aftermarket rims. My D3 runs 17" so no issues for me 8)How do you guys go for reliability with the discovery. I like the look etc but could not trust it due to the reputation.
2.7 Diesel 140kw & 440Nm
3.0 Diesel 155kw & 540Nm or 180kw & 600Nm depending on spec
Post by: shanegtr on February 05, 2017, 11:43:24 AM
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Post by: Railey on February 05, 2017, 05:57:14 PM
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Post by: daniel.j.marshal on February 05, 2017, 06:15:18 PM
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Post by: SEADOO on February 05, 2017, 08:27:50 PM
Auto's going into limp mode, when you want it to happen least. Autos swapping between locked and unlocked between 4th and 5th.
The manuals may be better, but the autos suck balls as a towing vehicle.
Apart from towing, they are a very capable 4wd.
Post by: Pete79 on February 06, 2017, 10:54:06 AM
Except they make the worst tow vehicles.
Auto's going into limp mode, when you want it to happen least. Autos swapping between locked and unlocked between 4th and 5th.
The manuals may be better, but the autos suck balls as a towing vehicle.
Apart from towing, they are a very capable 4wd.
So that's all automatic Mitsubishi 4wds out then, or just all automatic vehicles in general?
The auto in my MN triton has never gone into limp mode, maybe I'm just not hard enough on it.... ???
And pretty much all standard factory spec modern autos constantly unlock and jump around between gears. The 6 speed auto in my VE dunnydoor was hopeless at staying in gears.
It's only going to get worse with all of these 8 speed boxes hitting the market now.
Post by: rotare on February 06, 2017, 12:27:24 PM
So that's all automatic Mitsubishi 4wds out then, or just all automatic vehicles in general?
I'm guessing the comments were related only to the Misti Challenger.
For the last few models the Aisin auto gearbox fitted to the Mitsi Pajero is the same or very similar to the ones fitted to some Toyota 4wds...
Post by: SEADOO on February 06, 2017, 05:56:27 PM
So that's all automatic Mitsubishi 4wds out then, or just all automatic vehicles in general?
The auto in my MN triton has never gone into limp mode, maybe I'm just not hard enough on it.... ???
And pretty much all standard factory spec modern autos constantly unlock and jump around between gears. The 6 speed auto in my VE dunnydoor was hopeless at staying in gears.
It's only going to get worse with all of these 8 speed boxes hitting the market now.
I was referring to the PB/PC Challengers only. It's a known fact the auto's will go into limp mode at the worst time.
Something to do with the self protect mode that's built in. If the fluid gets to hot, it just say fk you, I'm having a rest.
Post by: Pete79 on February 06, 2017, 06:05:14 PM
I was referring to the PB/PC Challengers only. It's a known fact the auto's will go into limp mode at the worst time.Ahh, ok.
Something to do with the self protect mode that's built in. If the fluid gets to hot, it just say fk you, I'm having a rest.
I suppose there are a few stories going around. A bit like dual cabs with bent chassis I guess. ;)
Post by: kylarama on February 06, 2017, 06:14:52 PM
I was referring to the PB/PC Challengers only. It's a known fact the auto's will go into limp mode at the worst time.
Something to do with the self protect mode that's built in. If the fluid gets to hot, it just say fk you, I'm having a rest.
Probably not a bad thing. In most cars when the A/T temp light comes on its too late, the damage is already done.
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Post by: petrolburner on February 06, 2017, 07:55:15 PM
So that's all automatic Mitsubishi 4wds out then, or just all automatic vehicles in general?
The auto in my MN triton has never gone into limp mode, maybe I'm just not hard enough on it.... ???
And pretty much all standard factory spec modern autos constantly unlock and jump around between gears. The 6 speed auto in my VE dunnydoor was hopeless at staying in gears.
It's only going to get worse with all of these 8 speed boxes hitting the market now.
No. The new autos coming out are just getting better and better!
My 7speed locks the TC in the top 5 gears, driven manually it won't downshif or unlock the TC even if you have chosen a gear too high.
My experience driving an 8speed jeep behaves very similarly, and from what I have read of the 8speed in the LR's they also lock the TC and don't spend time 'between gears'
Older units like those found in the Pajero and the 200series do not operate as nicely and the driver has to be aware of TC slip and drive to avoid it or Pick a lower gear. Even with old autos a lockup kit can be fitted.
I love manuals, particularly in sports cars, but for towing the auto is now king IMO.
Post by: KeithB on February 06, 2017, 08:34:52 PM
Post by: SEADOO on February 06, 2017, 09:59:02 PM
Probably not a bad thing. In most cars when the A/T temp light comes on its too late, the damage is already done.
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It's not when your driving up the Toowoomba range, then the auto decides to pack it's bat and ball and go home, when your towing the camper and you have a B-double up YA clacker.
The car will just stop. Mr Bishy says there is nothing, it's doing its job. But it always does its job at the worst and most dangerous time.
It's a known common problem amongst the Challenger community.
Post by: Ragman on February 06, 2017, 10:48:39 PM
VW Touareg, top notch comfort, handling and good off road especially if you get
one with air suspension. pick up a good 2011 model for 30k
Post by: petrolburner on February 07, 2017, 08:13:34 AM
They appear to be good buying based on the price second hand, however if you research and check out the owners forums they are pretty expensive and somewhat finicky to service, even having uneven tyre wear of only a few mm across an axle was 'out of spec' and could cause issues.
I was coveting a V8 or V10 option, maintenance and servicing on these beasts is frightfully expensive!!
Then I turned my attention to the D3 /D4 and researched hard again, too many bad stories in amongst the good ones. It felt like a lucky dip buying a Landy. (I still think they are beautiful vehicles)
In the end after a long research I came to the conclusion that as boring as they are the Japanese made wagons offered the best reliability and don't really require any specialised servicing or need a specialist workshop plus being coil spring wagons they are all pretty comfy compared to the dual cab options.
Set a budget, then consider Pajero, Prado, Landcruiser and Patrol options. I still think the bang for buck winner is the Pajero. Mum and dads is nice to drive 👍
Post by: Bird on February 07, 2017, 08:31:01 AM
Quote from: Ragman
Well if you want comfort and towing ability plus value for money.The Torque figures always appealed to me specially for towing... Just VW's reliability, parts and service costs always puts me off.
VW Touareg, top notch comfort, handling and good off road especially if you get
one with air suspension. pick up a good 2011 model for 30k
The 5.0 litre V10 turbo diesel engine is a unique configuration, and its power and torque figures are far beyond any yet seen. It produces 750 Nm of torque at 2000 rpm - the highest output of any petrol or diesel engine on the market.
https://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Volkswagen-Touareg-2010/SSE-AD-4392407/?Cr=10 (https://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Volkswagen-Touareg-2010/SSE-AD-4392407/?Cr=10) Nice....
Post by: Merts on February 07, 2017, 08:32:10 AM
Set a budget, then consider Pajero, Prado, Landcruiser and Patrol options. I still think the bang for buck winner is the Pajero. Mum and dads is nice to drive 👍
The Pajero's are a nice ride, but I gotta say, I am a bit envious of you and your Y62.
Post by: petrolburner on February 07, 2017, 08:58:15 AM
A good friend of mine has a Pajero auto (I am guessing it's about 4 years old now) that cops an absolute pasting! We use it to go paddock bashing, chasing pigs around farms, hitting check banks at speed, flogging across freshly plowed paddocks, squeezing through lignum and salt bush.
It's in serious need of a lift as it is pretty low at the front on stock springs with a bullbar but it takes the abuse and comes back for more :)
An often underrated 4x4
Post by: speewa158 on February 07, 2017, 11:34:49 AM
Post by: Wortho on February 09, 2017, 03:58:59 PM
I may be wrong about the diff lock.. Yep no diff lock by the sounds of it http://performancedrive.com.au/2017-isuzu-d-max-mu-x-not-getting-limited-slip-diff-diff-lock-0618/ (http://performancedrive.com.au/2017-isuzu-d-max-mu-x-not-getting-limited-slip-diff-diff-lock-0618/)
Post by: oldmate on February 10, 2017, 04:50:02 PM
Yes the Y62 is step up in refinement over the Pajero, but it's in another class price wise as well.Your right. The paj is a very underrated 4wd. They are also very comfortable to drive. There are only 2 things wrong with and that is, 1) it's a Mitsubishi and 2) you are not he only person on earth, which means someone will see you driving it. If you can get past that, they are great!
A good friend of mine has a Pajero auto (I am guessing it's about 4 years old now) that cops an absolute pasting! We use it to go paddock bashing, chasing pigs around farms, hitting check banks at speed, flogging across freshly plowed paddocks, squeezing through lignum and salt bush.
It's in serious need of a lift as it is pretty low at the front on stock springs with a bullbar but it takes the abuse and comes back for more :)
An often underrated 4x4
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