MySwag.org The Off-road Camper Trailer Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Hills Mum Bec on February 03, 2014, 02:11:31 PM
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Hi Everyone,
We currently have a 2009 Nissan Pathfinder. We have had this car for 2 years & have had nothing but trouble with it. A lot of the problems have been covered under warranty so it hasn't cost us a huge amount but I'm really sick of the inconvenience, the first 11 months of owning this car it spent 5 of those months off the road at the Nissan dealer being fixed & waiting for parts. The first problem we had was the timing chain breaking, 3 months off the road & $14,000 engine rebuild which Nissan covered. Next was a hose snapping in the coolant system on a 40C day resulting in warped cylinder heads, again Nissan covered this but another 2 months off the road. I have just replaced the air-conditioning compressor ($1400) & have been told that my injectors need replacing which will cost approx. $4000. I'm really over this car. Before buying this car we had always bought new cars, looked after them & had them serviced properly. With this car we have looked after it & had it serviced just like all our other cars but I guess the unknown is in how the precious owner treated the car although the service log was all up to date. On top of all the mechanical problems there are a lot of other things not working eg. power window button on passenger side has stopped working, power seat control has broken, back door handle has broken. I really need to get rid of this car.
I am really not very keen to buy a second hand car again, all of our other cars we have had we have bought new & have never had any problems. I would love to buy a Prado but they are way out of our budget, I really don't want to spend more than $50k. We have been looking at the Mitsubishi Challenger, well within our price range & I like that it is not a huge car like a Cruiser but still seems to be quite capable off road. The Mitsubishi Pajeros are nice too but still more than I want to pay. Can anybody here give me their thoughts on a Challenger? We live in the country so most of our driving is country roads, not much city driving at all. It will also need to tow our Jayco Eagle.
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The Mitsubishi Pajeros are nice too but still more than I want to pay.
Challengers have a good name, but I'd go a used Paj.. Been looking again myself recently.
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Challengers have a good name, but I'd go a used Paj.. Been looking again myself recently.
Agree, this one is very close to you and a ripper vehicle.
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=34877.0 (http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=34877.0)
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G'day HMB
We don't have A Challenger but we stayed with my wifes nephew at Neurum Creek over the weekend & he has a 2012 Diesel from new. Late last year he, his wife, 2 year old & Jayco Hawk did Brisbane-Adelaide-Oodnadatta Track-The Rock-Plenty-Brisbane without a problem. His is what he calls the "Poverty Pack" but is all they wanted & would suit us down to the ground as well. It has oodles of rear space for a "Medium" off roader. It also has a white colour coordinated steel front bar which looks awesome.
I can't remember what he said his exact fuel consumption was when towing but I do know it was what one would expect for that type of trip. The Challenger is basically a wagon version of the Triton ute, one of which I've done quite a bit of both on & off roading with for work purposes. While it's no where near as capable as, say, a Defender off road, it did it's job for me, albeit a little hard in places, but the IFS & leaf rear wheel travel came into play there. Just mentioning the IFS, be aware that it does not like a long submersion in water after doing a bit of work as cold water on warm rubber diff boots makes them contract & allows H2O ingress. Yes...it happened to me >:(
All the best with your hunt.
Steffo
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, be aware that it does not like a long submersion in water after doing a bit of work as cold water on warm rubber diff boots makes them contract & allows H2O ingress. Yes...it happened to me >:(
that can happen with any 4b.
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Not with my solid axles, maintained front hub seals, extended breathers & diff plugs when needed I would have thought, so I must be ignorant of some fact. Please enlighten??????????
Steffo
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I have a TD 2012 Sept Built Challenger as a work vehicle. I have had it since new and thus far have clocked up 75k+ kms in it.
It is still on the original tyres and about to be replaced.
There is several recalls out including the front suspension requiring a faulty weld to be fixed (make sure they do a wheel alignment when they do this)
On the open highway I get 10L/100km
Around town I get 11L/100km
Towing a heavy trailer (1500kg) and sticking to the speed limit I get about 16L/100km
Towing the same trailer and only doing 90km/h it averages about 13-14L/100km
Cheers Kev
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Best value 4WD wagon on the market IMHO
Will go 99% of the places any other 4WD will at a fraction of the price
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If you can hold off i believe challanger and triton will have updated models released later this year
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Not with my solid axles, maintained front hub seals, extended breathers & diff plugs when needed I would have thought, so I must be ignorant of some fact. Please enlighten??
All diffs get hot when using them and contract when they hit cold water...
The only thing between water and the diff is a seal.. cooling any diff down before entering water is the go.
Doesn't matter if you have breathers over the roof or not - that's not where it comes in.
Live axles will suck water in, GQ's GU's, 80's etc.
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Hmmmm, new Prados arent that dear if you dont want all the extras.
http://www.carsales.com.au/all-cars/results.aspx?silo=stock&q=((((((SiloType%3d%5bBrand+new+cars+in+stock%5d)%7c(SiloType%3d%5bBrand+new+cars+available%5d))%7c(SiloType%3d%5bDemo+and+near+new+cars%5d))%26((Make%7b%3d%7d%5bToyota%5d)%7b%26%7d(Model%7b%3d%7d%5bLandcruiser+Prado%5d)))%26(Service%3d%5bCarsales%5d))%26(Price%3drange%5b45000..60000%5d))&vertical=car&sortby=~Price (http://www.carsales.com.au/all-cars/results.aspx?silo=stock&q=((((((SiloType%3d%5bBrand+new+cars+in+stock%5d)%7c(SiloType%3d%5bBrand+new+cars+available%5d))%7c(SiloType%3d%5bDemo+and+near+new+cars%5d))%26((Make%7b%3d%7d%5bToyota%5d)%7b%26%7d(Model%7b%3d%7d%5bLandcruiser+Prado%5d)))%26(Service%3d%5bCarsales%5d))%26(Price%3drange%5b45000..60000%5d))&vertical=car&sortby=~Price)
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If new then challenger would be a value buy.
We almost bought one before the Prado however we needed the seven seat version and the child restraints are an old design meaning you couldn't put kids in the back if you had carseats in the middle row. Other than that its sweet. Check out the noise vibration levels - Tritons are rattly noisy things compared to the new breed so maybe challenger is similar.
Another option would be an FJ Cruiser. Really capable, good on fuel even for a petrol, tows brilliant with 200kw.
BUT - you either love em or hate em.
Good luck.
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Make sure you can fit in the passenger seat I am 6. 4 and couldn't sit in the front passenger seat in the 2012 model without having knees touching dash. But in the 13 version there was a change to the front seat slide which I believe may have fixed this. Also one quirk was the entry to the back and the positioning if the pillar. This was annoying rather than an issue but the front seat was a show stopper so it went but other than that was in the running
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All diffs get hot when using them and contract when they hit cold water...
The only thing between water and the diff is a seal.. cooling any diff down before entering water is the go.
Doesn't matter if you have breathers over the roof or not - that's not where it comes in.
Live axles will suck water in, GQ's GU's, 80's etc.
Extending your breathers will certainly improve your chances of not sucking water but its not 100% watertight.
When the diff goes from hot to cold in seconds, the air pressure differential tries to equalise, thus the breather takes a deep breath. If the breather is below water level, the diff will swallow water instead of air. That is why we extend the breather. Most Cruzas and Patrols have factory extensions just above the chassis line. Most other 4wds just have the breather on top of the diff.
I extended my breathers on the 100s to the top of the firewall. Extending the Gbox is also a good idea.
As Lost said, a hot diff (even fitted with extendd diff breathers) can still suck water past the seals. Always inspect. Your diff and Gbox oils after a nig trip.
Simply pulling up for five minutes before the water crossing will make all the difference.
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One thing to consider is that the Challenger tail gate opens vertically not horizontally like Prado & the FJ, which is a Prado anyway, so hitting something like the hand brake lever or stone guard on the camper is not an issue.
And, yes I stand corrected, as waiting a bit before a water crossing is the way to go but, Independent suspension is more susceptible than solid axle purely by design & as I mentioned, with wading plugs, chances of a problem are minute.
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An Xtrail is just as capable......(TIC).
I preferred the Prado, but at 50k plus for a 3 yo model was a bit steep.
I paid 42k.
You can get pretty much all,the accessories as the major makes too.
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We have had our Challenger since new (4/13) & are very happy with it.
Our criteria was a vehicle that functioned as a daily drive , highway comfortable & 4 wd capable and IMHO the Challenger fits the bill admirably. In our case all for $41K drive away with capped price servicing.
Fuel consumption is good, about 9L/100 @ 100/110kph on the highway.
I don't think my mates Prado is a $35K better car.
Cheers
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Bingo!
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The challenger has a similar Diesel engine to the pathfinder. Maybe look at cars with petrol engines too. Was the pathfinder your first diesel?
What are your injectors doing that they need replacement? Fixing door handles and power windows is not the end of the world but $4k on injectors is pretty serious.
Maybe your pathfinder is a straight up lemon but you'd hate for history to repeat itself with another crd diesel due to maybe bad diesel in your area or something else.
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Did a 4wd course on the weekend to sharpen the skills. One of the other guys had a Challenger and it performed really well. Got up everything it was put through. Very well set up out of the factory. I know its mostly the driver, but out performed the new Prado that was along too.
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Check out newtriton forum. Great bunch of blokes. Any issues that you may run into with a Challenger are highlighted on this forum.
I have a 2013 Triton dual cab 2.5lt TD and I'm mostly happy with it.
It tows my Jayco Eagle Outback with ease.
Even rock stock standard they are a very capable 4wd.
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An Xtrail is just as capable......(TIC).
I preferred the Prado, but at 50k plus for a 3 yo model was a bit steep.
I paid 42k.
You can get pretty much all,the accessories as the major makes too.
Lmao. You beat me. I was going to say, don't get a challenger, it's not a proper 4wd ;D ;D ;D :D
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Challengers are tuff trucks and awesome value, if I wasn't in need of the twin cab they'd be on the top of my list!
Cheers,
Disco teddy
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^^^^ Good calls above.
I bought a second hand 7 seater with 35k for just over $30 with 3 years new car warranty left. Standard diff lock and great interior room makes it a good choice. Never been bogged and have really enjoyed rescuing the odd bigger fourby when on Fraser. Funnily, the most common car I have been stuck behind is a 200 series- but that is digressing. The Challenger is a great size...not too big, not too small...I guess that is the reason you had the Pathfinder?
It is not without problems but no car is perfect...The stock suspension is a bit marshmallow, stereo is avge and the seats could be better.
Although, there are some sweet deals on Paj at the moment.... ???
One, thing above I do disagree with...don't wait for a new model. Mits knows the issues with these cars and therefore how to fix them. I would never buy a brand spanking new model. Let those who must have the latest of everything work out the problems the hard way. :cheers:
Matt
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Agree, this one is very close to you and a ripper vehicle.
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=34877.0 (http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=34877.0)
Thanks, I don't think you could pay me to buy a second hand vehicle at the moment.
If new then challenger would be a value buy.
We almost bought one before the Prado however we needed the seven seat version and the child restraints are an old design meaning you couldn't put kids in the back if you had carseats in the middle row. Other than that its sweet. Check out the noise vibration levels - Tritons are rattly noisy things compared to the new breed so maybe challenger is similar.
Another option would be an FJ Cruiser. Really capable, good on fuel even for a petrol, tows brilliant with 200kw.
BUT - you either love em or hate em.
Good luck.
We have 3 kids, a 7 seater is nice but not necessary & we are definitely not having any more. One of our best friends has an FJ Cruiser, great car but not very practical for taxiing kids around with how the back doors open.
Make sure you can fit in the passenger seat I am 6. 4 and couldn't sit in the front passenger seat in the 2012 model without having knees touching dash. But in the 13 version there was a change to the front seat slide which I believe may have fixed this. Also one quirk was the entry to the back and the positioning if the pillar. This was annoying rather than an issue but the front seat was a show stopper so it went but other than that was in the running
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I'm only 5.2" so I think I will be OK there.
The challenger has a similar Diesel engine to the pathfinder. Maybe look at cars with petrol engines too. Was the pathfinder your first diesel?
What are your injectors doing that they need replacement? Fixing door handles and power windows is not the end of the world but $4k on injectors is pretty serious.
Maybe your pathfinder is a straight up lemon but you'd hate for history to repeat itself with another crd diesel due to maybe bad diesel in your area or something else.
This was our first diesel car but we have lots of friends who live locally with diesel cars & they have not had the same problems. Not sure what is wrong with the injectors but there is a tapping noise when the car starts up & it goes away once the engine is warm. Mitsubishi has offered us $27,000 trade in which we are pretty happy with. Definitely wanting the fuel efficiency of a diesel.
^^^^ Good calls above.
I bought a second hand 7 seater with 35k for just over $30 with 3 years new car warranty left. Standard diff lock and great interior room makes it a good choice. Never been bogged and have really enjoyed rescuing the odd bigger fourby when on Fraser. Funnily, the most common car I have been stuck behind is a 200 series- but that is digressing. The Challenger is a great size...not too big, not too small...I guess that is the reason you had the Pathfinder?
It is not without problems but no car is perfect...The stock suspension is a bit marshmallow, stereo is avge and the seats could be better.
Although, there are some sweet deals on Paj at the moment.... ???
One, thing above I do disagree with...don't wait for a new model. Mits knows the issues with these cars and therefore how to fix them. I would never buy a brand spanking new model. Let those who must have the latest of everything work out the problems the hard way. :cheers:
Matt
The size of the Challenger definitely appeals to me. I like that it is more station wagon size than huge 4WD size & that was one of the main reasons for buying the Pathfinder. We used to have a Kluger which was a fantastic car, had it 6 years from new but wanted to get a more capable 4WD for our trips away but wanted something a similar size. We won't be waiting for a new model, I want the Pathfinder gone & a new car by the end of the week!
Did a 4wd course on the weekend to sharpen the skills. One of the other guys had a Challenger and it performed really well. Got up everything it was put through. Very well set up out of the factory. I know its mostly the driver, but out performed the new Prado that was along too.
That is great to hear.
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Sounds like your mind is made up! :D Go for it.
On the Pajero forum there is a prices paid thread for the Challenger. Would be a good idea to have a sneak peek at that before hitting the Stealers. Some amazing deals out there!
Matt
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Happy with our challenger manual diesel. Trucks the kids, bikes, ct for 3week trip in January. Average about 11l / 100 km, serves the purpose it was bought for, value for money and capable to get where we need to go. Had a pajero previously, hard to justify price point to buy one again.
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One of our best friends has an FJ Cruiser, great car but not very practical for taxiing kids around with how the back doors open.
This was our first diesel car but we have lots of friends who live locally with diesel cars & they have not had the same problems. Not sure what is wrong with the injectors but there is a tapping noise when the car starts up & it goes away once the engine is warm. Definitely wanting the fuel efficiency of a diesel.
I would have agreed with the doors thing however I had a Ford Ranger xtracab with the funny rear doors and actually found it fine. I always get out before the kids and it kind of traps them.
On the efficiency front - don't forget to factor in the overall costs of diesel. Sure you may win at the pump, but you lose in many other places with these new generation diesels (which I think you have already experienced).
The Prado is a perfect example. Overall running costs end up pretty line ball and even the FJ cruiser is returning better than 11l per hundred k's.
The only reason I consider owning a diesel is I am a diesel mechanic by trade so can service/repair myself. If not I would go petrol - modern diesels are no longer the reliable long term proposition they were simply because we expect them to perform like petrols with diesel economy - stretched to braking point.
If you do decide to grab the challenger at the very least find out what a new set of injectors will cost you at the recommended replacement time. I just replaced the injectors in my Prado at trade and that was $400 as mine was the older style diesel. The new ones are probably 3 to 4 times that much. That buys a heap of petrol.
Have fun.
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This was our first diesel car but we have lots of friends who live locally with diesel cars & they have not had the same problems. Not sure what is wrong with the injectors but there is a tapping noise when the car starts up & it goes away once the engine is warm. Mitsubishi has offered us $27,000 trade in which we are pretty happy with. Definitely wanting the fuel efficiency of a diesel.
I have a similar noise in my diesel pathfinder. Funny tapping when the engine is cold but it goes away after 5 minutes. Also goes away once revs are over about 2000. Some people say its due to do with how the engine warms up and the noise is a pre injection to aid warming. If the engine is hot and you restart the car the noise won't be there. I'm not sure it's an issue but it drives me nuts. There is no loss of performance or power.
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I have a similar noise in my diesel pathfinder. Funny tapping when the engine is cold but it goes away after 5 minutes. Also goes away once revs are over about 2000. Some people say its due to do with how the engine warms up and the noise is a pre injection to aid warming. If the engine is hot and you restart the car the noise won't be there. I'm not sure it's an issue but it drives me nuts. There is no loss of performance or power.
This is exactly the same as ours. I have only noticed it because the air conditioner has been broken so we have been driving with the window down a lot. When the mechanic fixed the air conditioner he also mentioned the noise & suggested the injectors. I don't know whether it's worth getting a second opinion, I think we have already decided to part ways.
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I've done heaps of reading on the topic. People suggest all kinds of things like belts, bearings, pulleys and injectors as possible fixes. Others have said it happens on all the YD25 engines and not to worry.
For me, the fact that it always goes away when warm makes me think its not a bad problem. If it was there 100% of the time, then it would be an issue. I'm hoping for me it gets fixed incidentally during a major service when something is replaced or tweaked.
I think the Challenger is a likely replacement for the Pathfinder owners and if i moved on my Pathfinder the Challenger would be one that i look at.
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We have a Challenger 2010 XLS and have not had a problem with it at all. Taxis the kids around during the week and we have had plenty of fun with it off the beaten track on the weekends (nothing too wild). We have an Aussie Jays Crusher CT and it tows that with no problem whatsoever. Great car!
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So .... we ended up buying a Pajero VRX. Test drove the Challenger & I just didn't like it, it felt a bit cheap & nasty. As much as I wanted to get rid of the Pathfinder I felt the Challenger was a step backwards & I was losing a lot of features that I had in the Pathie. Also, I really, really hate cars that have the middle seatbelt hanging down from the roof so that was the clincher. We should be able to pick up our new rig this Friday!
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Congratulations on the decision.
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So .... we ended up buying a Pajero VRX.
sane as I test drove a while back.. very nice
now wait to you see what 18in tyres are worth... but be laying down not sitting down..... and take 12 valium first.
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Very nice, when I test drove one I thought it was very good, a lot of features for the $$.
Swannie
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I test drove one today, then the Colorado7, will get to the new Isuzu MU later this week I hope..
I liked it... To me they both drove the same.
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So .... we ended up buying a Pajero VRX........
Congratulations, you won't be disappointed :cup:
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I don't have a Challenger but i have a Triton. i recommend you avoid it. I had heaps of problems with mine, probabley not as bad as your Pathfinder, but still something going wrong every 20k or so. Expensive to service. Get a good used 4.2 cGU Patrol or 100 seriers Landcruiser. CRD diesels are rubbish.
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Congratulations on your new toy. The Pajero is a good unit and definitely the pick of the Mitsubishi fleet
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Just thought I would put in my 2 cents worth. Have a series 4 Pathfinder 2010 model and racked up 80ks so far including 2 cape trips towing a camper trailer and several work trips to Weipa. Has not missed a beat and is great on fuel. Didn't make it across Palm Creek without assistance but then again neither did the Prados, Pajeros Tritons ect. Just saying they are not all bad.
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I don't have a Challenger but i have a Triton. i recommend you avoid it. I had heaps of problems with mine, probabley not as bad as your Pathfinder, but still something going wrong every 20k or so. Expensive to service. Get a good used 4.2 cGU Patrol or 100 seriers Landcruiser. CRD diesels are rubbish.
It's a bummer when you get a lemon.....
I have a 2010 Challenger with 65,000K's and it hasn't had a spanner on it yet..
I do run an EGR blank to try and stop the dreaded inlet manifold gunking up issues most newer CRDI motors are stuck with...
Expensive to service ?? don't know as mine is still under warranty and has capped price servicing..
If you want to stick to the blacktop and tow, the Pajero is a nicer 4wd, but I wanted a smaller offroad type of 4wd, so got the Challenger...