MySwag.org The Off-road Camper Trailer Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: McGirr on February 25, 2012, 06:11:53 PM
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With the up coming Cape trip we may have to join snatch straps together depending on the crossing.
What have people used that works and makes un joining the straps easy.
Mark
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Newspaper, magazine, bog roll, jumper or other article of clothing.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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How to join recovery straps
www.tektrek.com.au/.../4WD%20RECOVERY_ (http://www.tektrek.com.au/.../4WD%20RECOVERY_)...
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Best way is with a rolled up newspaper ... cheap, and disposable when it is buggered ... easy to get them apart ... :D
Cheers Chippy :D
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The best way IMHO is not too!
If, as a very last resort and I mean after winching has failed as an option, you have too, then some sort of rolled up reading material might enable you to unjoin them afterwards.
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There is no reason why NOT to join snatch straps. Sometimes it isnt always possible to back up close enough to attach a single strap.
For safety reasons I must add ***NEVER EVER USE SHACKLES TO JOIN SNATCH STRAPS.***
As most of you know, in the event of a possible failure of one strap, the shackle may become a high speed missile.
[End of safety warning ]
Cheers Chippy :D
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***NEVER EVER USE SHACKLES TO JOIN SNATCH STRAPS.***
Cheers Chippy :D
Worth repeating i reckon!!
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I keep some bits of dowel in my recovery kit. I've seen newspapers bind up.
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Try this link
http://www.tektrek.com.au/images/4WD%20RECOVERY_How%20to%20join%20recovery%20straps.pdf (http://www.tektrek.com.au/images/4WD%20RECOVERY_How%20to%20join%20recovery%20straps.pdf)
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Try this link
http://www.tektrek.com.au/images/4WD%20RECOVERY_How%20to%20join%20recovery%20straps.pdf (http://www.tektrek.com.au/images/4WD%20RECOVERY_How%20to%20join%20recovery%20straps.pdf)
good post ute701, the towel is a good idea :cheers:
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I like the rolled up rubber car mat......
Cheers
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I managed to get 30' of this stuff - http://www.nobles.com.au/products.aspx?doc_id=1807, (http://www.nobles.com.au/products.aspx?doc_id=1807,) and the way you splice it is here - http://www.nobles.com.au/media/11946/supermax_4wd_splicing_instructions.pdf (http://www.nobles.com.au/media/11946/supermax_4wd_splicing_instructions.pdf)
What I'm keen to try at Nolans this year (if we need to) is to use this connected to a single snatch strap. If it gets bound up I think it would be pretty easy to undo the splice and get it free again.
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Newspaper, magazines or a short piece of timber at last resort. We have had four joined together once before, a 1 hour drive turned into a 4 hour recovery
GG
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When I bought my 'black snake' I was told not to join 2 x snatch straps together, but use a synthetic (tow) rope to extend the distance between the 2 x vehicles.
So now I've 20m of synthetic tow rope for extending the distance of the 2 x vehicles in cases where one is stuck in sand etc and a long way from any form solid ground for the tow vehicle to get close to it and to only use rated shackles attached at each vehicle.
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Wow Mainey, you didn't post a pic of your 'black snake'. Are you feeling ok?
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Wow Mainey, you didn't post a pic of your 'black snake'.
Are you feeling ok?
Yes, for a Sunday morning feeling terrific
But if you want a photo I can do it for you ;D
the black headed snake 'security guard' at the tyre shop in Surfers
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x2 for a piece of dowel
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I use a pease of PVC pipe it's lite but strong just feed the straps together to make a reef knot and use the PVC pipe to stop them binding up
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When I bought my 'black snake' I was told not to join 2 x snatch straps together, but use a synthetic (tow) rope to extend the distance between the 2 x vehicles.
What was the reasoning for that Mainey ? I would suggest NOT using a "tow" rope to extend the distance, or a tree protector, or winch ext strap , as they are NOT rated to take the load placed on a snatch strap during a snatch recovery. Yes they are rated highly, but the sudden jolt from a snatch recovery could potentially overload the strap at the WORST possible moment ... , at full load!
So yes I would be comfortable joining 2 cables with newspaper, magazine, rubber mat, etc. All would be considered safe options in my books.
Cheers Chippy :D
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Just Straps sell these...joining strap (https://www.juststraps.com.au/store/cart_detail.asp?group1=Specialty_4x4)
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What was the reasoning for that Mainey ?
I was told, rightly or wrongly, to get the extra distance away from the bogged vehicle in sand etc, which could realistically be at least 30mt, to use a rated tow rope, as it will have a lower stretch ability and will allow the snatch strap to do its job without hindrance to it's ability to stretch when the load is applied to it by the snatching vehicle.
Two connected snatch straps will only give about 16 Mts distance between the 2 x vehicles and who carries 2 x snatch straps anyway ???
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What was the reasoning for that Mainey ? I would suggest NOT using a "tow" rope to extend the distance, or a tree protector, or winch ext strap , as they are NOT rated to take the load placed on a snatch strap during a snatch recovery. Yes they are rated highly, but the sudden jolt from a snatch recovery could potentially overload the strap at the WORST possible moment ... , at full load!
So yes I would be comfortable joining 2 cables with newspaper, magazine, rubber mat, etc. All would be considered safe options in my books.
Cheers Chippy :D
I agree with Chippy as I have done this. Used a snatch strap and a winch extention strap joined together recoverying my mates badly bogged F250 with my Landcruiser. We had broken a number of old straps and were down to these and had not many other options. We broke the extention straps on every 4th or 5th snatch.
I wouldnt recommend it unless you had no other options
Regards
Jas
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Having been lucky enough to have been given a Black Snake! - it does state on the attached note that no attachment should have a rated capacity less than the breaking strain of the snake - 8,000 kg.
As others have said, appears that joining should be done when no other option.
:cheers:
Mace
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What Ute posted.
:cheers:
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I have recently been working in china while there i seen the workers unloading a shipping container with a folk lift pulling a machine out with snatch straps the join in the middle was a G clamp a large G clamp but a G clamp machine would have been close to 1 ton and the straps were well worn but as in china it worked. I do not recommend this for use in Australia.
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Ive gotta say I like the towel idea that ute posted ...I will have to try this and see how well it works ...
Cheers Chippy :D
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Two connected snatch straps will only give about 16 Mts distance between the 2 x vehicles and who carries 2 x snatch straps anyway ???
Actually 18m as most straps I believe are 9m in length.
"Who carries two straps?" Are you kidding? I carry three snatch straps, two equaliser straps, a winch extension strap, and a spare winch rope in addition to the one on the winch. I would hardly call that abnormal. I'm actually considering getting another snatch strap before the Cape trip, as I'm sure one of the ones I currently carry would be worn out by the time June rolls around.
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O.K. I think this is what they call "pouring fuel on the fire"and I'll accept all abuse fired at me, as I willingly pose this question.
It is however not to troll, or cause a ruckus, but to satisfy a burning argument I've had going on with some other folk for some time now.
I am pretty sure after the flames die down I'll make reason out of the intellect from this site ???
Can you join a snatch strap with an extension strap? If you are going to answer, please let me know your reasoning so I can use it.
If you choose just to plainly abuse me as a keyboard warrior or just cos you can, please remember I'm married so give it your best shot. :police: :police: :police:
In hope of not only some good sensible replies, but also to finally lay this beast to rest with some mates ;D
Brian
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Yes you can join a snatch strap with an extension strap. There is a risk that you will overload and break the extension strap, but to be quite frank this is not a problem in my books. I would much prefer to have straps break than to have the recovery points let go.
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Yes you CAN join snatch straps with a extension strap, tho it is not considered best practice.
The reasoning for this?
Extension straps are primarily designed to take the weight associatewd with winching. This is a slow constant load, as opposed to a sudden high shock load. Whilst winch straps ARE designed to take high loads, they are NOT designed to take sudden (and VERY high) shock loads. They may be fine when used a few times like this, but the chances of a failure are very much increased with each use.
Snatch straps - altho "soft"- still store ALOT of potential energy when stretched to full stretch, and when that releases, such as in a failure, the consequences can be horrific. They are still more than capable of tearing through sheetmetal like it was paper. What it would do to any bystanders is just unimaginable.
Like I said Im not saying it is a dead set no -no, however if you MUST do it .... please dont do it near me ... :D
Cheers Chippy :D
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Yes you can join a snatch strap with an extension strap. There is a risk that you will overload and break the extension strap, but to be quite frank this is not a problem in my books. I would much prefer to have straps break than to have the recovery points let go.
I agree with Symon.
Having done this, I snapped the extention straps. It took a number of full on snatches (Bogged fully loaded F250) before they broke, but I am glade they let go before any recovery points. Normally I would have prefered to use 2 snatch straps joined together. For this recovery we only had two snatch straps and decided to use the extentions so we didn't stuff both snatch straps in the early part of the recovery. As it was they were both nackered by the end (Went in the bin and were replaced) we broke 3 extention straps.
Regards
Jas
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why would you have your foot so close to a snake
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Two connected snatch straps will only give about 16 Mts distance between the 2 x vehicles and who carries 2 x snatch straps anyway ???
Mainey I carry at least 2 snatch straps, 2 x 20m winch extention straps, and a tree trunk protector as a minimum in my kit. I always keep one brand new unused snatch strap in the kit. When the one in use starts to look tatty or has done its share of recoveries I bin it and start to use the new one. I then buy a brand new one to take the old ones place. Because they are so dangerous $70 - $90 bucks once of twice a year is cheap insurance.
Regards
Jas
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For sure you can join an extension strap and a snatch strap, if you need to reach further. It doesn't matter that the extension strap is static, as opposed to the dynamic nature of a snatch strap. The snatch strap will do it's thing. Recovery points are static too.
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I say yes as well...
Reason - Walking home sucks LOL. ;D
I belive the answer lies in the recovery being effected, some times all that is required is a slight pull ,not a full snatch where a lifting motion is required on the bogged vehicle.
If its a full 3rd gear pedal to the floor snatch ,then I would try and find a 2nd or 3rd (2 should be a min on any trip) snatch strap. As its the built up energy of the snatch straps that create the lift required to free the bogged car.
But if all you have is an extension strap then factor that into your overall recovery teq. More digging or jacking might be required. as opposed to a full noise snatch.
When stuck you have only the resourses avail at the time so design your recovery in order to achive the objective in the safeset possible fashion (Vehc & persons). Having regard for the equip you have avail.
I have seen recoveries effected safley using some very strange pieces of equip.
The objective is to free or recover the 4x4 in the safest possible fashion, this can look and be different to a normall snatch as seen on TV.
Bit like fishing when using light line you always back the drag off a little, when using 100lb handlines the skull drag teq seems to be the go.
Hope thats not anymore fuel ;D ;D ;D A worthy topic though
Jet :cheers:
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and who carries 2 x snatch straps anyway ???
I have three in my kit ;D
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Hi guys,
Winch extension kits should not be used for snatching applications. The reason being is plasma rope or supermax rope is very stiff, it is almost as stiff as wire rope. Snatch straps by their very nature are designed to snatch the load and stretch / absorbs some of the transmitted load. These hope ropes are so stiff they transmit the load without absorbing it which results in huge peak loads if used as a snatch strap. It will either snap or you vehicle recovery hooks will fail if used as a snatch stap replacement!
If interested in hmpe ropes and their applications including winch extensions, plasma by the meter etc, I run this website for plasma rope for the company I work for. It's the genuine product, no Chinema and exclusive in Australia! I can do a deal if interested. Site is www.plasmarope.com.au (http://www.plasmarope.com.au)
Tim
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Hi guys,
Winch extension kits should not be used for snatching applications. The reason being is plasma rope or supermax rope is very stiff, it is almost as stiff as wire rope. Snatch straps by their very nature are designed to snatch the load and stretch / absorbs some of the transmitted load. These hope ropes are so stiff they transmit the load without absorbing it which results in huge peak loads if used as a snatch strap. It will either snap or you vehicle recovery hooks will fail if used as a snatch stap replacement!
If interested in hmpe ropes and their applications including winch extensions, plasma by the meter etc, I run this website for plasma rope for the company I work for. It's the genuine product, no Chinema and exclusive in Australia! I can do a deal if interested. Site is www.plasmarope.com.au (http://www.plasmarope.com.au)
Tim
Tim I agree with you, you can't use a winch extention strap or plasma rope as a snatch strap as that would end in drama. The discussion here is using an extention strap/plasma rope in conjunction with a snatch strap (to add distance between vehicles). This is quite acceptable in many situations, as stated above particularly when the vehicle being recovered is only lighly bogged.
Regards
Jas
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We aren't saying you can use an extension strap as a snatch strap, but you can join an extension strap to a snatch strap if needed.
Not recommended, but can be done if no other choice.
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Tim I agree with you, you can't use a winch extention strap or plasma rope as a snatch strap as that would end in drama. The discussion here is using an extention strap/plasma rope in conjunction with a snatch strap (to add distance between vehicles). This is quite acceptable in many situations, as stated above particularly when the vehicle being recovered is only lighly bogged.
Regards
Jas
Hi jas,
I should have probably clarified this, yes an extension is probably ok when used with a snatch strap, so long as their is stretch in the system, but not as I described - just using the winch extension kit!
Tim
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For everyone to understand our predicament last year at the Cape was when we were crossing Nolan's Creek. 3 vehicles got across but the next 2 did not and got stuck coming out. No problem there as 1 single snatch strap was used.
The other problem was 6 other cars were on the other side. The crossing was about 15 meters wide and up to the headlights in depth. We used 3 straps joined together so that we had enough length for yogi to get some speed up and get the cars across. All safety measures were discussed and all non essential help was well away from the action.
I was the sucker in the water with the hand held giving directions and getting soaked when the cars hit the water. We got everyone across but the straps were too hard to un do even with joiners we had which were ones I think JK had.
Mark
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As UTE 701 posted - http://www.tektrek.com.au/images/4WD%20RECOVERY_How%20to%20join%20recovery%20straps.pdf (http://www.tektrek.com.au/images/4WD%20RECOVERY_How%20to%20join%20recovery%20straps.pdf)
The only safe method!!!
As for using an extension strap combined with snatch straps in the recovery, the extension strap should be placed at the end point of recovey IE: attached to the vehicle -- recovering or to be recovered and then and only then it should be used as a tow/pull NOT a snatch recovery.
Simple guide lines can save grief........and the first rule of any recovery is................boil the billy and have a cuppa while ya contemplate what ya gonna do next!!
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For everyone to understand our predicament last year at the Cape was when we were crossing Nolan's Creek. 3 vehicles got across but the next 2 did not and got stuck coming out. No problem there as 1 single snatch strap was used.
The other problem was 6 other cars were on the other side. The crossing was about 15 meters wide and up to the headlights in depth. We used 3 straps joined together so that we had enough length for yogi to get some speed up and get the cars across. All safety measures were discussed and all non essential help was well away from the action.
I was the sucker in the water with the hand held giving directions and getting soaked when the cars hit the water. We got everyone across but the straps were too hard to un do even with joiners we had which were ones I think JK had.
Mark
In reality we only used the snatch straps because we needed the length. We could have used extension straps instead, taken up the strain slowly and then got Yogi to floor it. But to be honest I really don't think it mattered, there wasn't that much strain on the straps (we weren't really recovering, just merely giving the vehicles a helping hand through) and I'm pretty sure the only reason the straps bound up is because the join slipped a bit so that the bit of webbing we had in there didn't do its job properly.
More a bit of bad luck than bad technique in my opinion, happy to be told otherwise though.
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Spot on Symon, the strap that stayed in place came out without much trouble but the second one slipped sideways during the numerous recoveries and we had to cut the oldest of the snatch straps to retrieve the other strap and the joiner.
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why would you have your foot so close to a snake
I "trust" the snake ;D
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Got me thinking about some of the replies on here about using more than one snatch strap to increase the distance between the 2 x vehicles 8)
I think if the snatch strap is attached to one vehicle and a suitably rated extension 'rope' or 'cable' etc, is securely attached to the other vehicle then what can be wrong with that ??
The kinetic energy is created only in the snatch strap, as the rated 'rope' or 'cable' etc, is just acting like an extension of the existing anchor point on the vehicle it is attached to, and does not affect the kinetic energy, or the rebound of the snatch strap, in any way.
However, using 2 x snatch straps will have a different effect than just one snatch strap, this is due to the length being double of the original strap, the kinetic energy created is therefore different.
If the length made no difference at all, then the converse could be said that a 4mt snatch strap creates as much kinetic energy as an 8mt, or a 16mt snatch strap, and we know that is not true at all.
From my understanding of the workings of a snatch strap, they are designed to stretch to a point, then the kinetic energy, (rubber band recoil) is used to pull the bogged vehicle from the bog, the pulling vehicle is moved forward slowly in low range, 1st or 2nd gear and the rubber band (kinetic energy) effect of the snatch strap pulls the second vehicle from the 'bog'
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I keep some bits of dowel in my recovery kit.
I also have 2 pieces of dowel with a hole drilled at each end. One end has a twine tied to it. Once it's been placed between the 2 straps I just tie the twine to the other hole and it stops the dowel from falling out.
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I "trust" the snake ;D
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I think if the snatch strap is attached to one vehicle and a suitably rated extension 'rope' or 'cable' etc, is securely attached to the other vehicle then what can be wrong with that ??
Mainey.
You will get away with one strap, but it leaves you no margin if you break your one and only snatch strap, as good as your strap looks, it happens.
NEVER EVER USE A CABLE IN A SNATCH RECOVERY. An extention strap is one thing but a steel cable IS WAY TO DANGEROUS TO EVEN CONSIDER. I will post a pic of one of our work trucks with a steel cable inserted in the windscreen. DONT EVEN CONSIDER IT.
Regards
Jas
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Just Straps sell these...joining strap (https://www.juststraps.com.au/store/cart_detail.asp?group1=Specialty_4x4)
X 2 The work a treat.
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I also have 2 pieces of dowel with a hole drilled at each end. One end has a twine tied to it. Once it's been placed between the 2 straps I just tie the twine to the other hole and it stops the dowel from falling out.
A slight variation; I use three pieces of dowel each about 30cm long and join the straps in a reef knot fashion as per Utes' examples earlier. The three pieces form a triangle and as they don't crush like a rolled up magazine, are quite easy to remove afterwards. I keep them together with some insulation tape in the recovery bag.
In saying that, a full snatch recovery is generally a last resort in our club and after other options of driving, jacking, digging, towing or winching don't or won't work. Joining a snatch strap and extension strap would be OK for a tow in my view, but I would opt for the proper straps when snatching.
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Mainey.
You will get away with one strap, but it leaves you no margin if you break your one and only snatch strap, as good as your strap looks, it happens.
NEVER EVER USE A CABLE IN A SNATCH RECOVERY. An extention strap is one thing but a steel cable IS WAY TO DANGEROUS TO EVEN CONSIDER. I will post a pic of one of our work trucks with a steel cable inserted in the windscreen. DONT EVEN CONSIDER IT.
Jas,
Point taken, however I was only using the words 'rope' and 'cable' as I could think of no other word that could be used as an 'extension lead' or 'extension cable' or 'extension rope' that made any sense in showing it was an 'extension' of the attachment on the vehicle and not another snatch strap.
I have a 8mt polly rope as my 'extension strap' if required because of the inability to stretch, unlike nylon rope.
A steel 'rope' or 'cable' would never be considered for the reasons you have nominated ;D
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Jas,
Point taken, however I was only using the words 'rope' and 'cable' as I could think of no other word that could be used as an 'extension lead' or 'extension cable' or 'extension rope' that made any sense in showing it was an 'extension' of the attachment on the vehicle and not another snatch strap.
I have a 8mt polly rope as my 'extension strap' if required because of the inability to stretch, unlike nylon rope.
A steel 'rope' or 'cable' would never be considered for the reasons you have nominated ;D
Gday Mainey,
Ive been doing a bit of googling today looking at Black Snake Products (Straps & strops) and trying to understand how they behave.
Your strap - like mine, has inbuilt metal receivers at each end, designed to attach to rated recovery points of an equal breaking strength. It would seem that in most applications, you purchase a various lengths to suit your needs, from 6m up to 40 plus).
From what Ive deduced, it is best not to attach you black snake to another snatch strap. Behaviour of the black snake is known (relatively), not the other strap in the time of breakage. Attachment to another non elastic equivalent rated extention strap seems to be fine - by whatever suitable method shown previously.
The issue to me is that the metal receiver ends in the black snake straps are the higher mass in the combined link and may be perceived as a potential projectile because they are metal, although low mass. Its interesting that the black snake "strops" do not have any metal in them, just fabrick, and would seem to be a lower projectile mass.
In direct relationship to this, from what Ive read, If a black snake strap breaks, the end receivers on the metallic straps DO NOT travel very far if the unit is tested to breaking point. They are recorded as coming to ground between 2 and 4 metres away from the point of break (depending on strap length), because of the higher physical density of the material and construction type (radial coiled) they are made of.
So, we've got a great piece of gear, but we need to be mindfull of what ever we attach up to if extending their range. I tried to post up a link, but couldnt find it on this PC, maybe 2morro.
Cheers, Mace.
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OK...................
Thanks for all your replies.
To set the scene, I was arguing with some people over whether to use one or not.
I was of the opinion that ÿes"you can as long as you take the rating of the lowest item.
In this case the extension strap.
If using a 12,000 pound snatch strap joined to an 8,000 pound extension strap, then your max rating would be 8,000 pound.
I was also of the opinion that if you joined 3 or 4 straps together to give you the required length, you'd have a lot of elasticity to take up during the snatch.
I was argued against with the opinion that you cant use an extension strap because it had no elasticity.
Of course not, but that is the role of the added snatch strap.
Say for instance you have one of those overpriced recovery hooks in your hayman reece - is that not a static extension of your towbar. Is not the block in the hitch an extension?
Where is their elasticity?
They are a static object connect to the elastic strap.
I have no problems using a winch strap as long as it is in line with a snatch strap. It is really just extending the recovery point............
I acknowledge it is my opinion, but I believe it to be an educated correct one.
lord only knows what will follow, but from these posts, I can safely tell these blokes to go rebury their heads in the mud!!!! :police: :police: :police:
Cheers
Brian
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As mentioned it all depends on the predicament you are in. As Symon mentioned we were snatching across a creek which is the easiest recovery. If the vehicle was bogged then this situation would have to be analyzed and depending what recovery gear is available and the safest way to recover the vehicle.
Mark
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(http://mazeguy.net/expressive/headinsand.gif)
Sand, not mud!!
Ive also been looking at smileys 2day!!
:cheers:
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I was of the opinion that ÿes you can as long as you take the rating of the lowest item.
In this case the extension strap.
If using a 12,000 pound snatch strap joined to an 8,000 pound extension strap, then your max rating would be 8,000 pound. yes
I was also of the opinion that if you joined 3 or 4 straps together to give you the required length, you'd have a lot of elasticity to take up during the snatch. yes
I was argued against with the opinion that you cant use an extension strap because it had no elasticity.
Of course not, but that is the role of the added snatch strap. yes
Say for instance you have one of those overpriced recovery hooks in your hayman reece - is that not a static extension of your towbar. Is not the block in the hitch an extension? yes it is
Where is their elasticity?
They are a static object connect to the elastic strap.
I have no problems using a winch strap as long as it is in line with a snatch strap. It is really just extending the recovery point............ yes
I acknowledge it is my opinion, but I believe it to be an educated correct one. I agree with you 100%
lord only knows what will follow, but from these posts, I can safely tell these blokes to go rebury their heads in the mud!!!!
Could not have said it any more correctly - I also believe your 100% correct ;D
As a test of the 3 x strap situation:
get 3 x large rubber bands, join them together, and see their kinetic energy release when compared to just 1 x rubber band ;D
(for the test 3 x RUBBER BANDS won't break your bones)
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OK...Flame suit on...
My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.
If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.
Cheers Ian.
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OK...Flame suit on...
My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.
If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.
Cheers Ian.
I, for one agree.
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OK...Flame suit on...
My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.
If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.
Cheers Ian.
Very true Ian ... although it would not do a great deal of damage to the snatch strap ...
Cheers Chippy :D
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OK...Flame suit on...
My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not meant for towing.
If you tow, say across a river use a extension strap.
Yes, X 2
I also agree with you
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Jas,
Point taken, however I was only using the words 'rope' and 'cable' as I could think of no other word that could be used as an 'extension lead' or 'extension cable' or 'extension rope' that made any sense in showing it was an 'extension' of the attachment on the vehicle and not another snatch strap.
I have a 8mt polly rope as my 'extension strap' if required because of the inability to stretch, unlike nylon rope.
A steel 'rope' or 'cable' would never be considered for the reasons you have nominated ;D
No worries sorry about my rant.
I just wanted to be sure we weren't talking about a steel cable. One of my staff was bogged and was recovered by a good Samaritan, however they used his recovery gear which included a steel rope, the one of the eye's of which let go and the lot went through my guys windscreen. Could have been a real ugly end (will try and find the photo tomorrow) to a days work.
Regards
Jas
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For everyone to understand our predicament last year at the Cape was when we were crossing Nolan's Creek. 3 vehicles got across but the next 2 did not and got stuck coming out. No problem there as 1 single snatch strap was used.
The other problem was 6 other cars were on the other side. The crossing was about 15 meters wide and up to the headlights in depth. We used 3 straps joined together so that we had enough length for yogi to get some speed up and get the cars across. All safety measures were discussed and all non essential help was well away from the action.
I was the sucker in the water with the hand held giving directions and getting soaked when the cars hit the water. We got everyone across but the straps were too hard to un do even with joiners we had which were ones I think JK had.
Mark
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Wouldn,t it be easier to tow across with a extension strap (20M) if the creek is only 15 metres wide rather then snatch into water then across a creek
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In reality we only used the snatch straps because we needed the length. We could have used extension straps instead, taken up the strain slowly and then got Yogi to floor it. But to be honest I really don't think it mattered, there wasn't that much strain on the straps (we weren't really recovering, just merely giving the vehicles a helping hand through) and I'm pretty sure the only reason the straps bound up is because the join slipped a bit so that the bit of webbing we had in there didn't do its job properly.
More a bit of bad luck than bad technique in my opinion, happy to be told otherwise though.
Fully agree with the above , it would not have mattered what type of straps were used they would have still bound up. From what I have seen and heard you guys did a bloody good job :cup: getting all the vehicals through , if one strap had to be cut after all was said and done it was a top effort .at $80 each i'd be happy to sacrifice a strap to safley get 20 vehicals through chest deep water with campers on. :cheers:
Might be a good spot to use all our old straps if its just a pull through. ;D
Jet ;D ;D
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For everyone to understand our predicament last year at the Cape was when we were crossing Nolan's Creek. 3 vehicles got across but the next 2 did not and got stuck coming out. No problem there as 1 single snatch strap was used.
The other problem was 6 other cars were on the other side. The crossing was about 15 meters wide and up to the headlights in depth. We used 3 straps joined together so that we had enough length for yogi to get some speed up and get the cars across. All safety measures were discussed and all non essential help was well away from the action.
I was the sucker in the water with the hand held giving directions and getting soaked when the cars hit the water. We got everyone across but the straps were too hard to un do even with joiners we had which were ones I think JK had.
Mark
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Wouldn,t it be easier to tow across with a extension strap (20M) if the creek is only 15 metres wide rather then snatch into water then across a creek
We used what we had as we were holding up other vehicles and I am not sure if we had an extension strap that long. Too long ago ;D
Mark
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I carry a 30 metre spare soft Dyneema winch rope with me. It can be used as a winch extension or if needed a tow rope. And that is where MC Girr is coming from at the Nolan's crossing. The snatch straps were been used as a tow rope. I was allready at the Jardine when the rest of the Myswag group done Nolan's otherwise if I had been with them I am sure we would have used my spare winch rope for pulling the vehicles across.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-Dyneema-Winch-Rope-Sk75-Synthetic-Cable-9mm-x-30m-4WD-Recovery-Offroad-Warn-/160744377443?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item256d1c8c63 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-Dyneema-Winch-Rope-Sk75-Synthetic-Cable-9mm-x-30m-4WD-Recovery-Offroad-Warn-/160744377443?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item256d1c8c63)
Cheers duggie
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OK...Flame suit on...
My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.
If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.
Cheers Ian.
In general I would agree with you, but there was nothing wrong with what we did up the Cape. There wasn't that much strain on the straps when Yogi was pulling people through. Another thing to consider is if we were using winch extension straps, if the vehicle did somehow get stuck halfway through we would have to back up and change to a snatch strap. Not exactly the kind of thing you want to do when your vehicle is in the creek with water coming in.....
I really think we are over analysing this one guys.
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Low speed towing (such as what I imagine would have happened at Jardine - I wasnt there) should be no issue for a snatch strap. Bear in mind that they are rated at a higher value than ordinary tow ropes or straps (winch ext or otherwise). So the idea of using them to tow through water should be no issue. There is little to no safety issue, as the water is "containing" the strap in event of failure anyway.
Cheers Chippy :D
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At the risk of prolonging this, I can't see why a snatch strap would not be suitable for towing? The elasticity is still beneficial, taking the jolt out of start or slack, plus you only get the sling shot effect when you apply plenty of force, quickly, which one does not if towing correctly.
The only issue I see is that they're too long in most cases unless doubled up several times, to stop them dragging on the ground.
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I think I have got the answer I wanted as we seem to be focusing on what people would use and their opinions ( which is good ) ;D
Mark
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At the risk of prolonging this, I can't see why a snatch strap would not be suitable for towing? The elasticity is still beneficial, taking the jolt out of start or slack, plus you only get the sling shot effect when you apply plenty of force, quickly, which one does not if towing correctly.
The only issue I see is that they're too long in most cases unless doubled up several times, to stop them dragging on the ground.
I've been told they have only so much 'spring' in them before they are stuffed. So if you use them for towing they are being stretched pretty much constantly (although not as much as in an recovery) shortening their life. Having said that though they are great for towing as the bit of give in them makes starting off much smoother.
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In general I would agree with you, but there was nothing wrong with what we did up the Cape. There wasn't that much strain on the straps when Yogi was pulling people through. Another thing to consider is if we were using winch extension straps, if the vehicle did somehow get stuck halfway through we would have to back up and change to a snatch strap. Not exactly the kind of thing you want to do when your vehicle is in the creek with water coming in.....
I really think we are over analysing this one guys.
I agree it would be a location situation..:)
ian.
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join them with a domestic cat it works a treat
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Not sure if mentioned before.
Was watching a DVD last night and they used a toilet roll inbetween the two snatch strap. Just a different way of doing it.
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join them with a domestic cat it works a treat
Why am I smiling??????????????
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join them with a domestic cat it works a treat
Why not a feral one, they'd be tougher.
;D
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Why not a feral one, they'd be tougher.
;D
....too hard to catch.......
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join them with a cat it works a treat
WOW :o Great idea !
" An Audible Alarm when your snatch strap is getting very tight on the join "
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Good thread guy's.
1. Pulling a fully laden 4x4 towing a 1.5t trailer through a deep soft boggy bottom river is not towing.
There is not a passenger 4x4 on the OZ market rated to tow a 4t+ bogged load.
2. The less elasticity you have in your recovery line the more work and load placed on the recovery vehicle.
Feel free to to take several goes to recovery someone and see how happy they are with a drowned 4x4.
3. If you are really bogged in a heavy vehicle or towing a boat or camper and only using one snatch strap to recover with, the faster you have to accelerate to pull the bogged vehicle out.
Been there done that ..... not my idea of a safe recovery.
4. If you are not experienced at being recovered or the situation your in then all the help you can get is to yours and the recovery vehicles advantage.
I am no expert and do what I can with what I have in as safe a manner a possible.
I have had to recover several bogged vehicles on places like Fraser Island ect. I have done what others have recommended and watch others do things differently and have come up with my own ideas that work for me and my vehicle. My rules are simple ..... bogged in a big way 2 straps. Towing and bogged 2 straps. Towing use a tow strap. Towing through boggy conditions .... try a tow strap but I think you will find that a snatch strap will offer you a little more leniency and give you a bit more of a safety margen when the vehicle being towed starts to slow or becomes bogged. If you have simply driven into a soft spot with hard sand / ground around then a single strap will do the job. Most of the time though you usually get bogged in the middle of a long stretch of boggy ground so not only do you need to pull the stuck vehicle out but assist it all the way to firm ground and not get bogged your self. These are only my humble opinions and what has worked for me over several years. I allways tell people do what you please. But if I think its unsafe wether it be me helping or being helped I always say thanks and wait for some one else or work out how to recover my self. At the end of the day it's your responsibility.
yogi
PS(My preferred recovery method is always winch .... its just not always piratical)
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Good thread guy's.
1. Pulling a fully laden 4x4 towing a 1.5t trailer through a deep soft boggy bottom river is not towing.
There is not a passenger 4x4 on the OZ market rated to tow a 4t+ bogged load.
2. The less elasticity you have in your recovery line the more work and load placed on the recovery vehicle.
Feel free to to take several goes to recovery someone and see how happy they are with a drowned 4x4.
3. If you are really bogged in a heavy vehicle or towing a boat or camper and only using one snatch strap to recover with, the faster you have to accelerate to pull the bogged vehicle out.
Been there done that ..... not my idea of a safe recovery.
4. If you are not experienced at being recovered or the situation your in then all the help you can get is to yours and the recovery vehicles advantage.
I am no expert and do what I can with what I have in as safe a manner a possible.
I have had to recover several bogged vehicles on places like Fraser Island ect. I have done what others have recommended and watch others do things differently and have come up with my own ideas that work for me and my vehicle. My rules are simple ..... bogged in a big way 2 straps. Towing and bogged 2 straps. Towing use a tow strap. Towing through boggy conditions .... try a tow strap but I think you will find that a snatch strap will offer you a little more leniency and give you a bit more of a safety margen when the vehicle being towed starts to slow or becomes bogged. If you have simply driven into a soft spot with hard sand / ground around then a single strap will do the job. Most of the time though you usually get bogged in the middle of a long stretch of boggy ground so not only do you need to pull the stuck vehicle out but assist it all the way to firm ground and not get bogged your self. These are only my humble opinions and what has worked for me over several years. I allways tell people do what you please. But if I think its unsafe wether it be me helping or being helped I always say thanks and wait for some one else or work out how to recover my self. At the end of the day it's your responsibility.
yogi
PS(My preferred recovery method is always winch .... its just not always piratical)
Yogi, when you refer to using two straps, do you mean in series or parallel?
Personally, I would only ever use two straps in series if I needed the extra reach (as you described, bogged in the middle of a long stretch) and I would only use this method as a very last resort.
Using straps in parallel also has it's own dangers, there will be a lot more stress placed on both the vehicles recovery points, especially if the vehicle you are trying to recover has a trailer attached.
IMHO;
If it is a quick recovery i.e. hung up in deep ruts, no traction or stuck in sand, then I use a snatch strap.
Anything more than that and I agree, a winch is the safest and my most preferred method of recovery.
Cheers
Craig
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Can you join a domestic cat to a feral cat?
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Can you join a domestic cat to a feral cat?
yes it can be done but some surgical skills are required I will not get into details but it involves one tail threaded in and out of two orifices and when finished later on that night over the camp fire it makes a delicious pee king duck - did I also mention a thong can be used as a snatch strap but only the double pluggers and I dont think I should advise on how these can be joined
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...did I also mention a thong can be used as a snatch strap but only the double pluggers ...
Ahhh.
I was thinking of the other kind of "thong".
Carry on.
Matto :)
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Ahhh.
I was thinking of the other kind of "thong".
Carry on.
Matto :)
and so was i
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A thong... That might just work you know...