MySwag.org The Off-road Camper Trailer Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Bird on December 04, 2017, 04:15:28 PM
-
Another rule made up by some clueless desk jockey.
http://www.mcnews.com.au/abs-become-mandatory-motorcycles-2019/
?All new motorcycle models sold in Australia from 2019 must have ABS.
All previous generation motorcycles sold in Australia must have ABS by 2021. Yes I believe this means your 10 yr old R1. What exactly is previous generation...
This means popular machines like DR650 must have ABS by 2021 or be phased out.
Enduro and Trials Motorcycles are exempted.
Trailbikes with a 21? front and designed primarily for off-road use and with no pillion capability are also exempted.
Adventure Motorcycles can have switchable ABS but it must default to on.
There is no pending legislation for mandatory traction control.
-
Another rule made up by some clueless desk jockey.
WTF?? What arsehat came up with that brilliant scheme?
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
-
I'm only a novice, but is this a bad thing?
I know a lot of curent dirt bikes are still a late 90's design with a new sticker kit.
But is adding ABS a bad thing?
-
Excellent idea. Rode an ABS equipped bike all over Australia. And on many, many dirt roads. Yes, I had the option of switching the ABS off, but never bothered.
-
http://www.mcnews.com.au/abs-become-mandatory-motorcycles-2019/ (http://www.mcnews.com.au/abs-become-mandatory-motorcycles-2019/)
All new motorcycle models sold in Australia from 2019 must have ABS.
All previous generation motorcycles sold in Australia must have ABS by 2021.
I think this means that each new generations of models launched after 2019 must have ABS.
Models in existence at 2019 have until 2021 to include ABS in their specs or they can't be sold after 2021.
It's not retrospective to the extent that models sold before 2021 can be ridden without ABS if sold without ABS.
Make sense ???
... reading it again, only Adventure bikes can have switchable ABS (presumably to cater for dirt roads) - does this imply that pure road bikes will not have switchable ABS ??? ???
-
Just wait, some bright spark in Authority will put their own interpretation on it and make all bikes do it.
-
Just wait, some bright spark in Authority will put their own interpretation on it and make all bikes do it.
Can’t see a problem with that myself.
-
Every bike I've owned since the late 80's has had ABS. In that time I have only needed it twice, but on both occasions I was very thankful it was there. I don't know why anyone wouldn't want ABS.
-
Exactly :cup: :cup:
-
Ok, just seemed like it might have been a problem from the point of view of some one else.
Not pointing the finger or nufin.
You will probably get some bright spark try to invoke it on the "Historic bkes", I can see that coming.
A real early Indian, Trumpy, or an 'Ariel Square Four' or something like them.
It seems they are trying to get rid of a lot of the bikes, and make people buy new ones they can't afford.
Just like the standards that Insurance Companies use for crash damage, and writing them off.
-
http://www.mcnews.com.au/abs-become-mandatory-motorcycles-2019/ (http://www.mcnews.com.au/abs-become-mandatory-motorcycles-2019/)
All new motorcycle models sold in Australia from 2019 must have ABS.
All previous generation motorcycles sold in Australia must have ABS by 2021.
I think this means that each new generations of models launched after 2019 must have ABS.
Models in existence at 2019 have until 2021 to include ABS in their specs or they can't be sold after 2021.
It's not retrospective to the extent that models sold before 2021 can be ridden without ABS if sold without ABS.
Make sense ???
... reading it again, only Adventure bikes can have switchable ABS (presumably to cater for dirt roads) - does this imply that pure road bikes will not have switchable ABS ??? ???
You have nailed it Topcat, it is exactly what it means. Similar to when electronic stability control was introduced into cars in 2009 as an example we suddenly didn't need to retrofit the VK commodore to comply. It meant that new models to market needed to comply from said date and subsequently any existing model sold to market needed to comply by the later date.
Example statement below;
On 22 June 2009, the Australian Government announced the introduction of an Australian Design Rule, based on Global Technical Regulation No.8, for the mandatory fitting of ESC to passenger cars and SUVs from November 2011 (for new models) and November 2013 (for all vehicles).
-
So what your saying Rags, is if it's never sold again and remains continuously registered in that same owners name, you dodge the requirement.
Is that right?
-
If it’s not fitted from factory you don’t have to fit ABS to sell it on a second hand bike.
Only the manufacturers have to worry about complying. No one has to do anything if they want to sell a older model bike as it isn’t fitted from new
-
Thanks.
-
If it’s not fitted from factory you don’t have to fit ABS to sell it on a second hand bike.
Only the manufacturers have to worry about complying. No one has to do anything if they want to sell a older model bike as it isn’t fitted from new
That,s how it will be. Bikes have all sorts of electronic gadgetry on them now from Yaw sensors, electronic suspension control, ABS, engine management ETC....99% of riders wouldn,t have the skills to completely master the capabilities of a modern performance motorcycle. The electronic aides make up for some riders shortfalls and ABS is one of them. ABS would be hellishly expensive to retrofit and downright impossible on many older bikes.
-
Still reckon it would be far better for Gumbies that want to ride a bike, go out and do the O'l Skool thing and heaven forbid actualy learn some riding skills.
Dumbing things down and have a computer do things for the masses will breed a dumber rider that will get complacent and have less skills than needed, that thinks a computer will save them when ever they push things too far .
Bring in the Body bags to pick up the meat ..
My opinion of course .
-
does this mean that the postie will stop skidding up to the letter box ;D
-
Probably find it would double the cost of a postie bike if they have to comply as well
-
This is the same way all new ADR and Australian Standards come in.
Most of these changes would often be a standard feature anyway by the time it comes in. It is a way of bringing the bottom end of the market up to a better standard.
This has no effect on the second hand market as they are not "new"
-
Still reckon it would be far better for Gumbies that want to ride a bike, go out and do the O'l Skool thing and heaven forbid actualy learn some riding skills.
Dumbing things down and have a computer do things for the masses will breed a dumber rider that will get complacent and have less skills than needed, that thinks a computer will save them when ever they push things too far .
Bring in the Body bags to pick up the meat ..
My opinion of course .
I agree edz
You would probably also be surprised how unobtrusive modern abs/traction control is, most people are not even aware it's working. However try putting you modern dual cab ute or fourby into off-road mode and turn off traction control on a wet day and you will soon see how much the rear end slips and spins, you will also be surprised how often the front brakes lock up for a fraction of a second or more
Lloyd
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Still reckon it would be far better for Gumbies that want to ride a bike, go out and do the O'l Skool thing and heaven forbid actualy learn some riding skills.
Dumbing things down and have a computer do things for the masses will breed a dumber rider that will get complacent and have less skills than needed, that thinks a computer will save them when ever they push things too far .
Bring in the Body bags to pick up the meat ..
My opinion of course .
Hope you tell ya kids that in the hospital after they have made an honest mistake due to inexperience
-
Still reckon it would be far better for Gumbies that want to ride a bike, go out and do the O'l Skool thing and heaven forbid actualy learn some riding skills.
Dumbing things down and have a computer do things for the masses will breed a dumber rider that will get complacent and have less skills than needed, that thinks a computer will save them when ever they push things too far .
Bring in the Body bags to pick up the meat ..
My opinion of course .
What a dumbarse comment. So remove all the electronic stuff off cars as well? You know all that stuff the Gumbie car drivers use everyday, mostly without even knowing that they do, to save you and your family? Like ABS, ESC, TC, EBD, etc etc
-
Very similar discussion and positions to the issue of wearing safety gear - a lot of the points (and differences) centre around freedom of choice v's mandatory.
TC
-
What, like being made to wear a helmet?
-
The Ol Skool way? That,s how I learnt and am lucky to be alive today. Modern technology is making transport safer, more reliable and easier to ride/drive. Would you trade your power assisted brakes in? What about power steering? Traction control, anti=wheelie, yaw sensors, riding modes..etc,etc. Electronics are doing a brilliant job at helping to save lives. Experience is the greatest thing you can have when riding a bike. Being armed with a safe bike is also a blessing. The number of times my Mach 3 and Mach 4 Kwakas threw me off was crazy. Skills are learnt and experience is gained from riding more. Todays bikes are so far ahead of what I had as a young rider that there is no comparison.
-
in all my years in the bike industry and people I still know in it, not many have good things to say about ABS.. infact most disable it as soon as possible.. Even blokes in my club at the get together in Sydney other week only 1 hadn't disabled it..
Same as on the bike forums I was on - VFR forum specially it was not liked, but sadly most were Americans.
With braking on bikes, its certainly is a personal thing... And if you wanna use it you can, but you shouldn't be forced to use it if it doesn't suit your riding style. I've only tried it on early versions on VFR's and didn't like it either, but thankfully it was easily disabled :D
-
ABS will come into play only when it detects that the wheel is close to lock up. I have ridden large Yammie and Suzie road bikes with it and it has no effect. Ride as if it wasnt fitted to the bike and you,ll not notice it. Like it or not it here to stay. I,ve drop a few bikes from wheel lock ups and anything that helps a rider avoid gravel rash is a good thing.
-
All these doo dads may make vehicles safer but its still morons that get behind the wheel that have no idea how to think for themselves that cause the issues.
-
All these doo dads may make vehicles safer but its still morons that get behind the wheel that have no idea how to think for themselves that cause the issues.
Those same morons would do the same thing in a model T Ford or a Audi R8. If only euthanasia was the fine for using a mobile whilst driving......
-
With braking on bikes, its certainly is a personal thing... And if you wanna use it you can, but you shouldn't be forced to use it if it doesn't suit your riding style.
Mr Bird you seem to be an expert on most things but I have a question for you about ABS on motorcycles. When do you need to lock a wheel up when riding a bike on bitumen? I have riden for a year or two and I used to like locking the rear up on the dirt to have a bit of fun in the corners but never locked a wheel, intentionally anyway, on the black stuff. Educate me.
-
It's possible for an expert to match or better braking distances in the dirt without ABS compared with, but it takes a lot of training.
Max grip occurs just before breaking loose and you have to learn by locking up the wheel when this occurs. Locking up the front is hair raising. It cost me a broken rib in the course I did.
Bosch leaning ABS/TC is up to gen 10 now I think. Very sophisticated. On bitumen it's only a dash light telling you it kicked in. Other systems are not nearly as good.
-
Still reckon it would be far better for Gumbies that want to ride a bike, go out and do the O'l Skool thing and heaven forbid actualy learn some riding skills.
Dumbing things down and have a computer do things for the masses will breed a dumber rider that will get complacent and have less skills than needed, that thinks a computer will save them when ever they push things too far .
Bring in the Body bags to pick up the meat ..
My opinion of course .
We have a winner. :cup:
If the powers to be, actually taught folks how to ride/drive, "MOST" wouldn't need the electronic crap they fit today.
Go and turn off the parking beepers on 10 cars and see how many drivers could park it without tapping the other car.
The lack of ability, to actually "drive/ride" the vehicle has been lost and Shit like this, means it will get worse, as the rider/driver, thinks,i won't have a stack or a front wheel go out from under me, I've got ABS.
Then, one day, it fails to work and the poor diddums have no idea what the F*** to do.
Stop dumbing people down, you're only making it worse.
-
We have a winner. :cup:
If the powers to be, actually taught folks how to ride/drive, "MOST" wouldn't need the electronic crap they fit today.
Go and turn off the parking beepers on 10 cars and see how many drivers could park it without tapping the other car.
The lack of ability, to actually "drive/ride" the vehicle has been lost and Shit like this, means it will get worse, as the rider/driver, thinks,i won't have a stack or a front wheel go out from under me, I've got ABS.
Then, one day, it fails to work and the poor diddums have no idea what the F*** to do.
Stop dumbing people down, you're only making it worse.
So do we ban automatic transmissions, power assisted steering, power assisted brakes, air conditioning, radial tyres,driving lights and say steering dampers on bikes, traction control.etc.etc...All these things are taken for granted now but revolutionary when put out to the public. All help to save lives. Every new bike rider should be made to do a one day course at a race track , with qualified instructors with such topics as braking, cornering lines, use of rear vision mirrors, lane swapping etc.etc. Technology is assisting riders, not making them dumber.
-
Wont have to worry about learning anything soon, With Motobot you will ride almost fast as a pro racer and the computer will take all your riding risks for you.
No experience needed at all, complete Novices welcome, you can sit at home in Airconditioned comfort safe and sound on the lounge chair and sip a latte, [ optional fan for that wind in your face experience and no bugs ] While watching the POV cam from the bot and enjoy the thrill of riding where ever you want on TV along with that big surround sound experience..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISz8Mvs7GcE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISz8Mvs7GcE) ... There ya go ESC, ABS, TC, AL, AR, AI, AE, PS, PT and probably PMS Its go the lot, Hell no worries about getting done for DUI either, But I wonder who gets the fine for speeding though ? Wasnt me officer ! I was sitting at home watching TV. ;D
-
You will never prevent all accident/crashes. Just not possible. While people can buy a dodgey license it wont happen. But why do we always have to pander to the weakest link?
The best way to save lives which is not cheap which is why it will NEVER happen in Australia - is better Education/Training Cars/bikes/trucks/towing. Until some Gov bites the bullet and says we need to change... nothing will get better.
Even simple things like the old 3-4 second rule - keeping a safe distance between cars or on bikes. Driving along eastlink today looking at how close some cars are to others or semi trailers to cars, there is less than 1 car length at 100kph between them.... and there are 5-10 lined up that close.
Don't dive infront of that fully loaded b-double coming to a traffic light.. wait till light turns green and you can pass safely as you'll pickup speed quicker.
Lane splitting on bikes - some dudes I see on the Monash or other freeways in peak hour traffic which is at a stand still lane split at 80+... you know some facktard is going to see a gap and take it - even though they are going nowhere, and your gone.
Dont sit in blind spots on bikes, its not hard.. watch the greasy magnet, although nowhere near as bad as when I started riding etc etc There are basics in cars and bikes and trucks...
So much out there isnt rocket science... sadly so much is common sense :( which has died
Autos, Driving lights, radial tyres, Air conditioning saves lives? wow... You learn something every day. Not everything they do saves lives.
I know in NSW we polled for years in the 80/90's to have proper rider training courses but nobody wanted to listen - we had the support of bike shops and all... There were things like Stayupright but they were not mandatory so nobody did em. I did a few, even when I was racing.. still picked up things each time I went.
In Victoria every rider does have to do a 2 day rider training course - including out on the road, dunno about in other states but Vic courses have been around for years. Not sure how good it is - in th way I hope it wasnt designed by some desk flog thats never ridden a bike before but has 'good ideas'. 2 days seems pretty short to me, even 7 days would be good with real world riding, dry, wet on properly controlled wet circuits.
http://www.armstrongsdrivereducation.com.au/motorcycle-learners-permit-course.html
On March 19, 2016 Stage 2 of the new VicRoads Motorcycle Graduated Licensing System (M-GLS) commenced. The M-GLS was introduced in order to provide new riders with an appropriate level of training for on-road riding.
Under the M-GLS, in order to obtain a motorcycle learners permit you must complete a standardised and compulsory 2 Day Learner Permit course.
There are so many items that are just gimicks to sell to the fools out there that pander to the brain dead who cannot actually drive and have bought thelr license at the pub. .. Shit like lane asssist, reverse park assist.. If you can't reverse park - you shouldn't have a license. Simple. It's part or was part of the exam.
My son is going through his learners stuff at moment and one instructor said 'we'll teach you how to get your license' - and its obvious driving down any road any day of the week - that is all they are doing... not teaching people how to drive but how to pass a test.. even worse around Box Hill area where I work.
-
i saw a dickhead on the ring rd this morning riding a speed triple in shorts and weaving in and out of traffic, nothing will save him from himself.
Never ridden a bike with ABS and only just now own a vehicle with ABS, DSC etc, learnt in cars without even boosted brakes back when you had to drive a vehicle, now you just point and shoot.
FFS they even park themselves now.
-
i saw a dickhead on the ring rd this morning riding a speed triple in shorts and weaving in and out of traffic, nothing will save him from himself.
Bet he had gloves on though LMAO!
-
Bet he had gloves on though LMAO!
Leather jacket, gloves and work boots ::)
-
So do we ban automatic transmissions, power assisted steering, power assisted brakes, air conditioning, radial tyres,driving lights and say steering dampers on bikes, traction control.etc.etc...All these things are taken for granted now but revolutionary when put out to the public. All help to save lives. Every new bike rider should be made to do a one day course at a race track , with qualified instructors with such topics as braking, cornering lines, use of rear vision mirrors, lane swapping etc.etc. Technology is assisting riders, not making them dumber.
Oh well, guess we'll agree to disagree..... but I've never seen air conditioning save a life.
-
It is also unbelievable the amount of city slickers who come up to Cairns for a holiday and want to get around on hired scooters. All dressed in thongs,t shirts and shorts. Absolute dickheads...Plenty of the tuff harley boys only wearing t shirts as well...obviously never had gravel rash.
-
When I was researching my midlife crisis - 1st bike in some 35 years, I actually chose because I wanted ABS. For the life of me I don’t understand why one wouldn’t want safety features.
Perhaps we should do away with seatbelts, helmets, etc. ???
-
It is also unbelievable the amount of city slickers who come up to Cairns for a holiday and want to get around on hired scooters. All dressed in thongs,t shirts and shorts. Absolute dickheads...Plenty of the tuff harley boys only wearing t shirts as well...obviously never had gravel rash.
Hi,
When living in Malaysia for a few years, it was usual practice to ride the few km to the beach in thongs, bathers and a towel over the shoulders.
Yep, much younger/sillier/immortal back then.
Cheers
Sent from my GT-N5110 using Tapatalk
-
I gather ABS on all but mopeds is mandatory in Europe now so that means we'll see it regardless of local regulations.
Of course it pays for itself in an emergency stop when only an expert has a chance of braking in a shorter distance.
Passive and active safety features on vehicles over the decades have led to big reductions in injuries and deaths in crashes. Can't see the problem here. If it infringes your liberty go and ride track days.
-
Taken from a 2015 study done by Monash University...
MONASH UNIVERSITY ACCIDENT RESEARCH CENTREIII
MONASH UNIVERSITY ACCIDENT RESEARCH CENTRE
REPORT DOCUMENTATION PAGE
Report No.
Date
ISBN
ISSN
Pages
327
September2015
0732623979
1835
-
4815 (online)
49
Title and sub-title:
Evaluation of the effectiveness of Anti-Lock Braking Systems on motorcycle safety in Australia
Author(s):
Brian Fildes, Stuart Newstead, Matteo Rizzi, Laurie Budd, and Michael Fitzharris
Sponsoring Organisation(s):Australian Government Department of Infrastructure and Regional Development and VicRoads
Abstract:
This study sets out to assess the benefits of ABS technology fitted to motorcycles, classification, LC>125cc (no scooters with engine cylinder capacity
exceeding 50ml and/or a maximum speed exceeding 50km/h), using Australian crash data, to compare these findings with published international research, and to estimate the likely benefits in reduced crashes and injuries in the years ahead.
Importantly, the findings showed that the presence of ABS on these motorcycles resulted in a 33% reduction in all injuries in relevant crash types and a 39% reduction in severe injuries in these crashes.
The benefits varied depending on the type of crash,whether it was a single or multi-vehicle crash, occurred at an intersection, and whether the road was wet or not. There was good consistency in these findings across the various Australian states and similar international findings. Consequently there are marked savings in fewer fatalities as well as severe and minor injuries in these crashes and even further reductions are predicted over the next 10 years. It is predicted that these savings would be enhanced by efforts to increase the fitment rate of ABS on all new LC motorcycles in the coming years. The rate of fitment could be accelerated by mandating the fitment of ABS technology for all new LC>125cc motorcycles with associated reductions in crashes and severe injuries.