Dilemma - What would you do?

[Alexstein]

Yeah a saw that. Shame ive got to wait till tax time to have a look around at pre-owned

[fuji]

Thanks for the suggestions guys.

I'm based down in the SE Melb burbs so would be looking at this kind of area if looking for 2nd hand. If and when i do anything it will be post taxman refund (already calculated 7k return so far) so will have to see the options. I'm currently just weighing up the costs of everything at the moment.

All the better, plenty of people in Melbourne on Myswag to help you out with a 2nd hand trailer.

[McTavish]

You have us all curious as to what you do - keep us up to date hey !

[Jon]

one worry noted with the Mars is the welded joint in the drawbar just in front of the tub. From an engineering standpoint, this joint could not be in a worse location, especially considering the thin walled tube (see side pic from site showing front spring hanger).

Lots of good value second hand.

[Alexstein]

You have us all curious as to what you do - keep us up to date hey !

Will do mate.

Jon, Which weld are you refering to. In this picture there are 2 welds.

Is it the weld behind the box or the weld on the cross beam in front of it?

A

[ozstickman]

We bought new but thinking back I should of went second hand.

Especially up here in central Queensland at present, nearly every second person are selling their toys including their camper trailers. There are some great bargains.  Most up here have been used once or twice and selling for 75% or less of what they would of paid for them.  I know of once lifestyle camper that was for sale with everything, water pump, batts, wiring, full kitchen, boat rack, you name it. Used once for a two night stay in a caravan park here is Rocky and then sat in their yard for 12 months, sold it for $9500. Worth a hell of a lot more than that!

Even if you do find one up here I'm sure anyone of us CQ swaggers can check it out for you.

[Cruiser 105Tvan]

Alexstein, I believe the weld on the A frame, between the boxes is the culprit.
Make more sense for it to be straight tube, than cut and stuck back together.
You can run the A frame rails under the frame and back as far as the front spring hangers and get loads more strength.
Also end up with a bigger front box area or more room for fuel cans.

[Alexstein]

Do you have an image that i can compare as im trying to understand what your referring to.

[Cruiser 105Tvan]

http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=35908.0

Have a look at blackwdw's trailer.
The A frame sits under the front of the trailer and is continuous.
There are no welded joints.

Its almost  like the  designer intended your trailer to be a lot longer.
And then had someone change it.  Hope the inside of the joint is plated, to return some of the strength that was lost by joining in this fashion.

[Alexstein]

Im just wondering if the picture shows an extended draw-bar as they do offer that as an option.

I guess its something to clarify with the guys at Mars unless they are able to comment on here.

[Topender]

one worry noted with the Mars is the welded joint in the drawbar just in front of the tub. From an engineering standpoint, this joint could not be in a worse location, especially considering the thin walled tube (see side pic from site showing front spring hanger).

Lots of good value second hand.

Now this is just my opinion and what I have heard fifteenth hand so don't quote me, but some imported trailers (not necessarily the one pictured) arrive in Australia without a draw bar attached and it is welded on here.  It serves two purposes 1) obviously size and fitting them in a sea container 2) something to with import duty and with no draw bar attached they are not seen as a trailer just parts.

Something along those lines any way.  Nothing sinister, although as stated form an engineering perspective that join is anything but ideal in that location.  Like I said don't shoot the messenger and I'm sure someone can verify this.   I'm sure they are fine like that otherwise they wouldn't be able to register them. 

Dave

[dazzler]

Here is a link to the website and the trailer that matches the photo.

http://www.marscampers.com.au/off-road-camper-trailers/off-road-camper/mars-campers-on-and-off-road-7x5ft-soft-floor-camper-trailer-gs-14-surveyor.html#product_tabs_product_review

If I was going to design a trailer where it had a randomly detachable drawbar I would go with that design.  Of course thats 'IF' I wanted that particular feature.

If I was going to design a trailer where random detachment was not a feature I would do it like this;

http://gallery.myswag.org/gallery/d/8434-2/camper+trailer+chassis+with+drawbar+in+colour.jpg

Or as appears to done with this model;

http://www.marscampers.com.au/off-road-camper-trailers/off-road-camper/extremo-xhf14-hard-floor-australia-best-valueoff-road-camper-trailer.html

From a strength perspective an angled drawbar has to be designed to deal with the weak spot that is created at the bend.  The correct way is to have it mandrel rolled and a strengthening plate put on the inside.  You need quality gear to do it right and there are manufacturers out there that do it right.

Why there is a weld on the outside of that drawbar is beyond my comprehension. 

cheers

[dazzler]

  I'm sure they are fine like that otherwise they wouldn't be able to register them. 

Dave

The regs are about as helpful as ice to eskimos;


This is from the Vehicle Standards 1 for small trailers;

Attachments and Couplings
16.1 Drawbars
Drawbars must be securely attached to a substantial portion of the trailer.

Drawbars must withstand the following forces applied at the centre of the intended coupling without detachment or any distortion or failure, which will affect the safe drawing of the towed trailer:

Longitudinal tension and compression (N)   1.5 x 9.81 x ATM (kg)
Transverse thrust (N)   0.5 x 9.81 x ATM (kg)
Vertical tension and compression for rigid drawbar trailer (N)   0.5 x 9.81 x ATM (kg)


This is from the design Rules 2006

14.                                      ‘DRAWBAR’ REQUIREMENTS

14.1.                                The ‘Drawbar’ must be securely attached to a substantial portion of the trailer.

14.2.                                The ‘Drawbar’ including the connections between ‘Drawbar’ and trailer must withstand loads as per Clause 14.2.1 or 14.2.2 without incurring either any residual deformation that would interfere or degrade the function of the assembly or any breaks, cracks and separation of components.  Alternatively approval can be by calculation as per Clause 14.2.3.

14.2.1.                          ‘Drawbars’ to withstand a dynamic endurance test for 2 million cycles:

14.2.1.1.                    ‘Drawbars’ for ‘Pig trailers’ up to 3.5 tonnes ‘ATM’ and hinged ‘Drawbars’ for other trailers to withstand a horizontal oscillating force of ± 0.6 x ‘Coupling’ ‘D-value’ in the longitudinal direction concurrently for 2 million cycles, applied at the intended ‘Coupling’ centreline.  The frequency must not exceed 35 Hz, and must be chosen not to coincide with  any natural frequency of the system;

14.2.1.2.                    Rigid ‘Drawbars’ for ‘Pig trailers’ over 3.5 tonnes ‘ATM’, to withstand a minimum horizontal alternating force of (± 0.6 x ‘Coupling’ ‘D-value’) acting in the longitudinal axis of the ‘Coupling’ and a minimum vertical alternating force of (static vertical coupling load ± 0.6 x ‘Coupling’
‘V-value’) in the vertical axis of the ‘Coupling’ applied through the ‘Coupling’ centre asynchronously for 2 million cycles.

Static vertical coupling load in kN = g x S

where:

g = acceleration due to gravity (assumed to be 9.81 m/sec2)

S = vertical load in tonnes (‘ATM’ - ‘GTM’)

The frequency of the longitudinal and vertical forces must differ by between 1 % and 3 % and not exceed 35 Hz, but must be chosen not to coincide with any natural frequency of the system.

14.2.2.                          ‘Drawbars’ to withstand a static test:

14.2.2.1.                    For trailers other than ‘Convertor Dollies’ and up to 23.5 tonnes ‘ATM’ the following minimum static forces separately applied at the intended ‘Coupling’ centreline:

14.2.2.1.1.              longitudinal tension and compression(N) = 1.5 x 9.81 x ‘ATM’(Kg); and

14.2.2.1.2.              transverse thrust (N)= 0.5  x 9.81 x ‘ATM’(Kg); and

14.2.2.1.3.              except for hinged ‘Drawbar’ trailers vertical tension
and compression(N) = 0.5  x 9.81 x ‘ATM’(Kg);

14.2.2.2.                    For ‘Convertor Dollies’ or trailers over 23.5 tonnes ‘ATM’, the following minimum static forces separately applied at the intended ‘Coupling’ centreline:

14.2.2.2.1.              longitudinal tension and compression = 350kN; and

14.2.2.2.2.              transverse thrust = 120kN; and


So they just have to say they meet them when they register them.  Nothing about correct design.  Go figure - like a yes minister episode but enough to screw them at coroners court but then they just go bankrupt and avoid payment.

[McTavish]

With all the spam ads that pop up on my computer regards camper trailers - cookies must have me pegged as a camping enthusiast - go figure !!   I saw this pop up and thought of you..

Customline tent (latest design with quality canvas), with a basic but well made trailer... and you'd have plenty of coin left over to mod how you like as you use it..  Battery, LED's, bigger tool box, kitchen box etc  As mentioned - plenty of bargains to be had in the myswag classifieds, gumtree and caravancampingsales etc.  ps I'm not affiliated with this seller...   Fun looking though!!

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/currumbin-waters/camper-trailers/customline-camper-trailer-2010/1037064431?mpch=ads

[Alexstein]

Yeah ive seen this on Gumtree.

Unfortunately its still a bit early for me to make a purchase since im waiting on tax time. This advert was also for an on-road trailer though at that price im sure there are options to upgrade to off-road suspension.

I also noticed that Skamper have a single beam chassis on their offroad trailer > http://skamper.com.au/products/off-road-ranger/

[dazzler]

Yes they do as do a few home fabricators. Just has to be done correctly however it can never be as strong as a straight beam.   You would only do it if the design requires it.

Cheers


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Armadillo & Customline Campers]

Yeah ive seen this on Gumtree.

Unfortunately its still a bit early for me to make a purchase since im waiting on tax time. This advert was also for an on-road trailer though at that price im sure there are options to upgrade to off-road suspension.

To upgrade an on road trailer to an off road trailer is quite easy.
But if you do this than the drop of the tent may not reach the ground.
As you are lifting the whole trailer up.

 

Rod.......

[Alexstein]

Yeah i was aware of that

So many factors in this camper trailer mollarky
Keeps me motivated at work though.

[ozstickman]

My draw bar on my Swag Campers camper starts just in front of the axle and goes in one single piece right to the hitch.  100mm x 50mm rhs

[dazzler]

In reality which is more important? Galvanised fully or independent suspension. There is an option for about $1400 to put independent suspension onto the Mars trailer if needed.

Would there be a major difference on a trailer like this with independent suspension or not?

Do you need it to be galvanised?  Will it be seeing salt and not being washed down afterwards?  Will it be sitting outside uncovered?

Independent is a luxury as others have said.  If you do want it my 2c is get the ALKO.  Simple, proven and quality.  $1500 would be about right.

[ScottH]

To throw my 2c in as well:

I paid about the same as you are planning to spend on the whole kit for just my tent top from Trackabout. Now I'm sure they made money off the job, but I doubt it was enough for them to retire.

So when you are putting $8k of tent on top of a trailer, and charging $8k for it, the trailer can't be all that expensive, or the canvas has to be much cheaper.

Prior to my current setup, I had a locally made trailer with a chinese import tent top. The canvas was ok, and the top cost ~$2k with 3 annexes, but the number of poles required to set it all up was ridiculous. The most we ever set up was 2 annexes, and only when we had some friends camping in tents with us. A single annex plus a kids room is all anyone short of the Brady Bunch would need.

My vote would be to spend $6-7k on a secondhand camper, and save a few $ for any upgrades/extras you might want. A new kitchen, bike rack or tool box might be needed to bring a secondhand unit up to your required comfort level.

Regardless of what you buy, enjoy it. The worst investment is a camper trailer gathering cobwebs in the shed/driveway!

[Streetkid]

With all the spam ads that pop up on my computer regards camper trailers - cookies must have me pegged as a camping enthusiast - go figure !!   I saw this pop up and thought of you..

Customline tent (latest design with quality canvas), with a basic but well made trailer... and you'd have plenty of coin left over to mod how you like as you use it..  Battery, LED's, bigger tool box, kitchen box etc  As mentioned - plenty of bargains to be had in the myswag classifieds, gumtree and caravancampingsales etc.  ps I'm not affiliated with this seller...   Fun looking though!!

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/currumbin-waters/camper-trailers/customline-camper-trailer-2010/1037064431?mpch=ads

I bought this trailer. 

[McTavish]

I bought this trailer. 

You got a bargain Streetkid! How funny is that... and you bought it - Congrats... 

Hopefully Alexstein can pick one like this up when he get's Mr Hockey's refund for borrowing too much tax paid...  Scamble your group certificate and tax deductions mate.