Author Topic: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...  (Read 11009 times)

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Offline Squalo

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #25 on: May 26, 2011, 01:16:50 PM »
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Sorry, I’ve taken a light hearted approach to this, but if I was to worry about everything I do, and analyse every risk I take..... I reckon you would find me naked, curled up into a foetal position and sucking my thumb.

Big difference between kids who've not long ago learned to walk, and adults who understand risk vs. reward. Sorry but your point, although valid in that life itself is a risk, is irrelevant to the discussion.

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Offline rotare

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2011, 01:52:02 PM »
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Big difference between kids who've not long ago learned to walk, and adults who understand risk vs. reward. Sorry but your point, although valid in that life itself is a risk, is irrelevant to the discussion.

Sorry for wasting your time by posting some irrelevant crap. You have just reinforced why I don't bother posting much on this forum... 

Offline NewcastleKnight

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2011, 01:58:26 PM »
Big difference between kids who've not long ago learned to walk, and adults who understand risk vs. reward. Sorry but your point, although valid in that life itself is a risk, is irrelevant to the discussion.



His point and his opinion is as relvant as yours who made you the forum cop??  Some of you blokes need to take a chill pill...deep breaths in and out...

Offline 2 Brutal

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #28 on: May 26, 2011, 02:03:03 PM »
I'm gunna head off to Woolies and buy all the stock of cotton wool and go wrap my kids up in it. My 2 boys have been racing Motorbikes for about 4 years, only giving up this year due to lack of time. Yer they fall off bit with the right gear they dust themselves off and get back on. Lack of protection with riding gear is 1 of the biggest factors, which at race level why is it compulsory for juniors to where body armour. Beats me why seniours don't wear it.
If you want to know facts, horses riding is the most dangerous recreation going, got that from an Ambo driver.
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Offline Redback

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #29 on: May 26, 2011, 02:24:12 PM »
Again, if you're going to quote stats and compare them, do it properly.

There are no doubt many more kids in 6-15 and adulst 16-25 riding quads than 0-5 year olds. 

Therefore statistically the 0-5 year olds are far and away more likely to have an accident, because there are 8 deaths out of what is a smaller sample.  There are probably 100x more people aged 16-25 riding quads than there are 0-5 year olds (probably far more).

I personally don't care what age people let their kids ride quad bikes (but stay away from me), but don't use statistics incorrectly in an attempt to support an argument.

It's like saying there were zero 0-5 year olds killed while operating forklifts, therefore they must be good forklift drivers ... of course ignoring the fact that 0-5 years don't operate forklifts and thus the sample size was 0!  Statistics and data are only useful in context, taken as absolutes like you have done is absolutely pointless.

I wonder how a 0 yr old would be killed riding a quad or driving a forklift, would a pregnant mother be involed ???
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Offline Squalo

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #30 on: May 26, 2011, 03:16:59 PM »
Sorry for wasting your time by posting some irrelevant crap. You have just reinforced why I don't bother posting much on this forum...

If things strangers wrote on the internet upset me I wouldn't bother either, and if everyone agreed with me it would all be a bit boring. I don't write because I want to upset people so I'm sorry you took it that way.

This isn't a topic about how the glory of life is lost to people who wrap themselves up in cotton wool, it's about whether the risks associated with powered bikes are worthwhile for small kids. Context.

In the context of your post - surely you can see that there is a hell of a big difference between deciding - as an adult - that you are prepared to cop the possible consequences of taking a risk, and putting someone with undeveloped reasoning and comprehension skills in charge of a powered vehicle? You seem to have kids, why not write from their position rather than your own? I bet you wouldn't be so keen to dismiss risk if it was your kids climbing 60ft trees.

I'm simply playing devil's advocate here, as I've said all along, nothing wrong with it if you provide proper supervision - but in my experience, people don't, and worst case scenario - a kid slams into a fencepost, or is sliced up by fencing wire, or gets their little ribs crushed by 50+kg of flying quad bike and dies because they drowned in their own blood before medical aid could get to them.

See, there are worse things in life than disagreements on the internet.

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Offline Squalo

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #31 on: May 26, 2011, 03:20:51 PM »
His point and his opinion is as relvant as yours who made you the forum cop??  Some of you blokes need to take a chill pill...deep breaths in and out...

I'm engaged in a calm and occasionally thoughtful discussion about a serious topic. What is your contribution to the topic, or was that it?
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Offline D4D

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2011, 03:23:22 PM »
I think this thread has run its natural course

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Offline NewcastleKnight

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2011, 03:39:53 PM »
I'm engaged in a calm and occasionally thoughtful discussion about a serious topic. What is your contribution to the topic, or was that it?

Wow is that your attempt to put in my place?  If it was not so funny I would possibly be offended.

The word "thoughtful" is an interesting choice of words because I see alot of inaccuracies, assumptions and opinions based on little fact.  Quoting of statistics that are not properly referenced and that in the five minutes that I took the time to have a look at them and criticaly examin them actually asked more questions then they answered.  

I could go on and point out all of the issues however, I will take your line and make an assumption that its a waste of time trying to point this out to people because they won't listen anyway.  So there is my "thoughtful" contribution hope you enjoyed it..... :cheers:

Offline Patr80l

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2011, 03:53:55 PM »
X2 ??? ??? ??? ???
There's a different forum where you might get a chance to voice your opinion...

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Its what you might find yourself saying in the witness box at the Coroner's Court.

Sorry if thats a bit obscure.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2011, 03:57:34 PM by Patr80l »
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Offline NewcastleKnight

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #35 on: May 26, 2011, 03:56:32 PM »
Its what you might find yourself saying in the witness box at the Coroner's Court.

Sorry if thats a bit obscure.

No it was not obscure I just thought it is a bit of leap to make an assumption about someones comments and decide they may find themselves in a Court, Coroners or otherwise and thought I best have it clarified...

Offline rotare

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2011, 04:43:31 PM »
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This isn't a topic about how the glory of life is lost to people who wrap themselves up in cotton wool, it's about whether the risks associated with powered bikes are worthwhile for small kids. Context.

It's pretty rare to have any thread that is started, on any forum, stay exactly on track.  Your impression of what this thread is about is apparently the risks associated with powered bikes and are they worthwhile for small kids..... if you are so concerned about context and staying on topic, why do we then need to know that you and your wife have ridden bikes all your life, your wife didn't get her first car till she was 22, and you've got your first car in 13 years..... so what?  What's that got to do with small kids and quad bikes....... swings and round abouts.

Quote
You seem to have kids, why not write from their position rather than your own?


Why? Cause I chose not to.  I thought the conversation in this thread was getting a bit serious and a bit heated, so thought I might tell you something that I experienced recently, that I thought was funny.... you know light hearted.  Sure, it wasn’t specifically about kids and quad bikes, nor was it meant to be serious.  Was I really that far off topic?  I mean, it's not like I came out and started talking about the best fridge to buy for my camper trailer??  

I thought people may take a step back, take a deep breath, maybe have a laugh and get the gist of what I was saying..... So in regards to my previous post, replace references to me, with my 4.5 year old, and replace the seemingly risky things I do everyday, with them learning to ride a push bike without trainer wheels, climbing over a fence, building a tree house or having a pretend sword fight with a branch from a tree with their brother..... any of these seemingly innocent things kids do, everyday, have the potential to cause an injury or death.  Doesn’t just take a quad bike.  


« Last Edit: May 26, 2011, 04:53:07 PM by rotare »

Offline singo-26

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #37 on: May 26, 2011, 04:57:32 PM »
I think this thread has run its natural course




X2 or 3 or 4 or whatever we are up to now.
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Offline areyonga

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #38 on: May 26, 2011, 04:57:55 PM »
I think this thread has run its natural course




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Offline Squalo

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #39 on: May 26, 2011, 04:59:40 PM »
It's pretty rare to have any thread that is started, on any forum, stay exactly on track.  Your impression of what this thread is about is apparently the risks associated with powered bikes and are they worthwhile for small kids..... if you are so concerned about context and staying on topic, why do we then need to know that you and your wife have ridden bikes all your life, your wife didn't get her first car till she was 22, and you've got your first car in 13 years..... so what?  What's that got to do with small kids and quad bikes....... swings and round abouts.

First of all, thanks for your considered response, Rotare. Why mention that my wife and I ride? Because I feel that it gives some weight to my comments because I also have a 3yo, a 4yo and a 7yo, all of whom have asked at various times if they can have dirtbikes. In other words, I know about bikes, and kids. I also know about the kid/dirtbike combination, as I have had a bit to do with motocross clubs. And I've seen plenty of stupid parenting on display.

I suspect that some of the people here either have no kids, or their kids already have dirtbikes and they are unhappy that people like me are not validating the choice they made.
 
Why? Cause I chose not to.  I thought the conversation in this thread was getting a bit serious and a bit heated, so thought I might tell you something that I experience recently, that I thought was funny.... you know light hearted.  Sure, it wasn’t specifically about kids and quad bikes, nor was it meant to be serious.  But I thought people may take a step back, take a deep breath, maybe have a laugh and get the gist of what I was saying..... So in regards to my previous post, replace references to me, with my 4.5 year old, and replace the seemingly risky things I do everyday, with them learning to ride a push bike without trainer wheels, climbing over a fence, building a tree house or having a pretend sword fight with a branch from a tree with their brother..... any of these seemingly innocent things kids do, everyday, have the potential to cause an injury or death to a kid.  Doesn’t just take a quad bike.

All fair points, and again I apologise, I didn't intend to cause offence. I don't apologise for taking the subject matter seriously, however - although to others it seems to be boring, or a good opportunity to make personal attacks because I'm not making them feel good about their choices.

My kids ride bicycles and I'm in the process of getting my 4yo son involved in BMW racing. Will he get hurt? Sure he will. I'll hate it each time, but I won't stop him from racing if that's what he wants to do. But there is quite a difference between racing a BMX bike and riding a quad bike without adequate supervision... another contributor mentioned that in his/her view the statistics aren't compelling because they lack context and that is a fair comment, but again in my experience the one common factor is poor supervision. Which is the point that I am trying, and clearly failing, to make.



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Offline rockman

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #40 on: May 26, 2011, 05:12:11 PM »
At the end of the day ....... it is the parents choice and responsibility's to allow their children to do what they want .

Offline Swogjb

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #41 on: May 26, 2011, 10:57:54 PM »
I just hope this is read by the poster who wants to know what brand of quad bike to buy for his daughter's THIRD birthday. Cheers, Tony

Yes I've read this thread,
I am very aware of the dangers of quad bikes having owned them all of my life.
But when used in a supervised and safe environment, with all safety gear i believe quad bikes to be a safe and enjoyable hobby. No more dangerous than swimming or playing in a playground unsupervised.
For christs sake...... I could buy my daughter some Lego for her birthday and she could choke on a piece of it or I could buy her a puppy and she could be mauled to death..... The list goes on.
I guess I could wrap her up in cotton wool until she's 21.
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Offline olddigger

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #42 on: May 26, 2011, 11:32:52 PM »
The real worry here is that people who think it's OK to get 3-year-olds to ride motorbikes are also allowed to vote. Explains a lot about what we have in Canberra at present.
Cheers, Tony

Offline Patr80l

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #43 on: May 27, 2011, 12:04:59 AM »
In surveys, 80% of people say that they're better than average drivers.
0% think they are below average drivers.
50% are below average drivers.
We all tend to over-estimate our driving ability.
Statistics aint rocket science.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2011, 12:10:58 AM by Patr80l »
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Offline singo-26

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #44 on: May 27, 2011, 12:25:34 AM »

Statistics aint rocket science.

Being that was my wife's major at uni, Do you want to tell her she wasted her time. It maybe not quite as easy as you think.

Ffs this is going to be argued forever. The op has made a decision, He is buying a quad. He may or may not see your point of view in the future, But his decision is made now. We have to assume he is going to be responsible and supervise his kids on it.
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Offline Swogjb

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #45 on: May 27, 2011, 08:05:25 AM »
The real worry here is that people who think it's OK to get 3-year-olds to ride motorbikes are also allowed to vote. Explains a lot about what we have in Canberra at present.
Cheers, Tony

With a response like that you clearly have NFI. ?

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Offline Snow

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Re: Sorry , but just some sobering facts...
« Reply #46 on: May 27, 2011, 08:14:48 AM »
Whooa K, I think this thread has been let to its own devices long enough. Any unfinished business can be sorted via PM.

Thread is closed.
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