Post by: nab on November 10, 2023, 11:30:09 PM
Have camped for years without but our next big trip looks like we may be on the go quite a bit so this extra convenience/luxury might get me in the good books.
My initial thoughts are 1500W inverter, 120A Lithium battery (and associated charging equipment), just not sure if the 120Ah battery will have enough peak current output to use these items. Done a little research and have an idea what I'll do but would rather hear from people that use it as I intend to.
Will a 1500W inverter be OK or cutting it fine? Do I need to go to a 2000W+ inverter?
Any 120Ah lithiums able to supply the load current for my loads? Likely I'll need 2 of them or one 200Ah-ish battery but just double checking.
Any brands to use/avoid?
I'm happy to go bigger but that just means I'll have to change my setup a bit to fit it in.
Post by: xcvator on November 11, 2023, 08:23:24 AM
Post by: nab on November 11, 2023, 07:16:25 PM
Post by: Spada on November 12, 2023, 05:54:11 AM
With a 2000w inverter I have no trouble running the Nespresso Mini pod machine and the milk frother together, but that was off a 300ah battery so not sure on the total draw for the 12ah?
Cheers
Post by: lloydus67 on November 12, 2023, 10:53:51 AM
The inverter alarmed as it reached it maximum current the whole time the pod machine was running, my clamp meter told me that I was drawing 136 amps for the 3-4 minutes that the machine was operating.
I think that 2 lithium’s in parallel would be a better option (depending on brand) should give 200amp discharge capacity and a better quality inverter would probably cope as a 1500 watt one. If you go cheap like I did get the 2000 watt for added security, I don’t think that 1500 would last pushing to its maximum all the time.
Lloyd
Just saw the figures in your post above, while they are probably calculated figures, don’t forget about the inefficiency of the cheap ass inverter. My figures were measured using a calibrated instrument.
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Post by: nab on November 17, 2023, 09:35:56 PM
This all started when we were talking about an upcoming Gibb River Rd trip and we were talking about adding a freezer drawer to the canopy. Decided to use my 32L Engel that is in the shed but I need extra battery power to supply my 57L Fridge and 32L freezer. Then we thought, well if we are going for a lithium battery, what about an inverter haha!
Looks like a 200A lithium is the go.
Post by: westvic on November 18, 2023, 11:26:01 AM
Battery Renogy 100Ah lithium
https://au.renogy.com/core-12v-24v-48v-100ah-deep-cycle-lithium-iron-phosphate-battery/ (https://au.renogy.com/core-12v-24v-48v-100ah-deep-cycle-lithium-iron-phosphate-battery/)
In a box
https://hardkorr.com/au/product/heavy-duty-battery-box/?attribute_colour=White&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIhsL00KvMggMVBKtmAh21pAiIEAAYASAAEgIRX_D_BwE (https://hardkorr.com/au/product/heavy-duty-battery-box/?attribute_colour=White&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIhsL00KvMggMVBKtmAh21pAiIEAAYASAAEgIRX_D_BwE)
Inverter Renogy 2000W
https://au.renogy.com/renogy-2000-12v-to-230v-pure-sine-wave-inverter-with-ups-function/ (https://au.renogy.com/renogy-2000-12v-to-230v-pure-sine-wave-inverter-with-ups-function/)
Connected with a fairly serious cable 175Amp anderson and 3 gauge wire 1m
https://www.homeof12voltonline.com.au/products/175-amp-anderson-to-ring-terminals-25sq-cable-8mm-eyelets-1-5mt?variant=44009067086083¤cy=AUD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIu_XHk6zMggMV6qNmAh1WLwWPEAQYASABEgJEuvD_BwE (https://www.homeof12voltonline.com.au/products/175-amp-anderson-to-ring-terminals-25sq-cable-8mm-eyelets-1-5mt?variant=44009067086083¤cy=AUD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIu_XHk6zMggMV6qNmAh1WLwWPEAQYASABEgJEuvD_BwE)
this is running a 2000w induction cook plate
https://www.kmart.com.au/product/induction-cooker-black-42715863/?sku=42715863®ion_id=300001&&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIgeK78azMggMVbKZmAh26jwe7EAQYASABEgKEBfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds (https://www.kmart.com.au/product/induction-cooker-black-42715863/?sku=42715863®ion_id=300001&&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIgeK78azMggMVbKZmAh26jwe7EAQYASABEgKEBfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds)
Numbers quoted are from the readout of the battery monitor
https://au.renogy.com/500a-battery-monitor/ (https://au.renogy.com/500a-battery-monitor/)
Just been using a saucepan of water to get an idea of current draw.
When I have the induction cook plate running at 1600w I'm pulling about 160amps from the battery. When I crank it up a bit it goes over the 175amp make and the inverter starts beeping which I think is trying to tell me it isn't getting enough current and the draw gets a bit over 175amp.
The battery isn't rated for that sort of continuous draw. It seems to be doing it ok but only for a while. I think the limiting factor is the wiring (cable size and connection) and the battery's ability to feed it.
Does work very nicely at 1600w though ;D
To do this properly I reckon I would need a second battery in parallel and heavier wiring. This should allow a bigger current draw for longer and be a bit easier on the batteries.
This is playing with some fairly serious current though. If things go pear shaped it should be quite spectacular.
Post by: lloydus67 on November 18, 2023, 01:02:43 PM
If you look at the Anderson website
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20231118/e9dfade75e9fc2761746286f17c6be86.jpg)
The 175amp plug is actually good for up to 280 amps but is only able to be safely disconnected with 100 amps running through it. It is also able to take 1/0 cable or 50mm flexible cable if you use metric.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20231118/81ebc289ff9cb10e476435e57d1657aa.jpg)
Using the enerdrive installation chart, (this information is taken from Blue Seas a very reputable company)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20231118/e0f04104eae5f4b8e0870c5e026ce35e.jpg)
Using the maximum 3% volt drop sizing part of the chart (0.42volts on a 14volt system, the charging voltage. Less if calculated at 12v)
1/0 Awg cable or 50mm on a circuit 4.5m to 6 meters long can safely carry 150amps.
1awg can carry 120amps and 3/0 Awg can carry 200amps
While the chart doesn’t specifically mention 1/0 Awg below this length of your follow the diagonal line across using the other sizes and lengths of circuits, it’s pretty easy to draw the conclusion that 1/0 cable can easily carry in excess of 200 amps in a circuit under 2 meters in total length.
These tables are based on continuous use, not short term loads, where they can easily carry 50% more load as a safety factor.
If you use the 10% volt drop chart (maximum 1.4v) you could safely use 1/0 Awg to run 150amps for a circuit 15-19 meters long. I wouldn’t, but you can.
They key thought is to ensure you have 200 amp continuous draw, so get at least 2 x 100A/h lithium batteries.
Lloyd
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Post by: westvic on November 18, 2023, 03:59:54 PM
I will be sticking to what I've got as it works (and no more budget). Probably overkill with a 2000w inverter but better to be over than under.
Just trying to point out the level of cabling required and how to look at what your battery will support if you do want to run a 2000w device.
Post by: lloydus67 on November 18, 2023, 04:00:59 PM
No worries
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Post by: loanrangie on November 20, 2023, 11:32:15 AM
Post by: WilSurf on November 20, 2023, 11:34:34 AM
Post by: Bird on November 20, 2023, 12:18:20 PM
Post by: Bad Scott on November 20, 2023, 03:19:01 PM
https://cdn0.woolworths.media/content/wowproductimages/medium/341164.jpg (https://cdn0.woolworths.media/content/wowproductimages/medium/341164.jpg)No difference to international roast >:D
Post by: Rob C on November 20, 2023, 04:03:47 PM
I draw 135 to 145A when making coffee. Sometimes with the milk frother & Pod machine both working it will pop the CB out (200A) but not often.
I have worked out that to make 1 cup of coffee it uses 4.5AH.
Check out the batteries discharge rating as most 100-120 have only 100A Max so 2 batteries are generally required
Rob
Post by: lloydus67 on November 20, 2023, 08:46:40 PM
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Post by: Bird on November 21, 2023, 08:48:13 AM
Quote from: Bad Scott
No difference to international roast >:DInternational Rust comes from alien technology.. not fit for human consumption...
Post by: loanrangie on November 21, 2023, 09:40:45 AM
International Rust comes from alien technology.. not fit for human consumption...
Transport industry drives on international roast :) found in every warehouse lunchroom in Aus.
Post by: Bad Scott on November 21, 2023, 10:33:27 AM
Transport industry drives on international roast :) found in every warehouse lunchroom in Aus.And construction sites.
I did fill up my empty macona jar with international roast and placed it in the lunch room when in WA. It was well received for a whole day till I couldn't hold my laughter in any longer. My crew thought it was the best practical/harmless joke. The site coffee did get changed after that to macona
Post by: Bird on November 21, 2023, 10:58:11 AM
Quote from: loanrangie
Transport industry drives on international roast :) found in every warehouse lunchroom in Aus.
so true... thus why most carry a small jar of their own... anything else but Rust used to get stolen so most places i drove for never supplied anything else but rust
Post by: Fizzie on November 22, 2023, 07:40:20 AM
And construction sites.
Used to be Army as well :'(
Post by: Foo on November 24, 2023, 04:19:13 AM
International Rust comes from alien technology.. not fit for human consumption...
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :cup:
Foo
Post by: DandyD on November 24, 2023, 04:50:23 AM
We now run a toaster off a 1000w Renogy inverter powered by a pair of 110 AH lead carbon gel batteries.
It is expensive toast.
Happy wife, happy life.
Post by: loanrangie on November 24, 2023, 03:35:46 PM
My wife declared that she was no longer prepared to make toast with a gas grill. Too much stress apparently.
We now run a toaster off a 1000w Renogy inverter powered by a pair of 110 AH lead carbon gel batteries.
It is expensive toast.
Happy wife, happy life.
I was testing using a toaster off a 2000w inverter powered by 2x100ah AGM's, alhtough the power dipped when using it as long as we have sun its pretty soon recharged.
Small 1100w kettle was the best purchase, makes that first cuppa a lot easier.
Post by: nab on November 27, 2023, 10:10:28 PM
Next question, anyone had experience having a DCDC charger mounted under their tray or underbonnet long term? It will be subjected to dust and possibly moisture.
While I'm here, a weatherproof shunt?
Post by: lloydus67 on November 28, 2023, 08:00:20 AM
Lloyd
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Post by: WilSurf on November 28, 2023, 11:22:08 AM
Next question, anyone had experience having a DCDC charger mounted under their tray or underbonnet long term? It will be subjected to dust and possibly moisture.
Yes, I have a Projecta DCDC charger under the bonnet for a few years now, charging the dual battery.
It works, but when it's hot and i do many start-stops, it will cut out due to temperature protection.
Post by: WilSurf on November 28, 2023, 11:26:55 AM
Not to throw a Spanner in the works, but most of the 200amp batteries I have looked at, have a maximum discharge rate of 100amps. I assume that you have checked yours can deliver 200amps?
Lloyd
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I have a Renogy 200Ah in the camper trailer which has 200A continues discharge.
Post by: plusnq on November 28, 2023, 01:06:48 PM
Post by: nab on November 29, 2023, 09:33:01 PM
Post by: plusnq on November 30, 2023, 02:39:38 AM
Post by: WilSurf on November 30, 2023, 10:24:58 AM
Both work as intended, both have MPPT solar.
Post by: nab on December 29, 2023, 01:25:38 AM
First step was to remove all the existing non factory fuses/VSR battery isolator from under the bonnet and install an 8-way midi fuse holder. Decided the best place was on top of the battery so just welded some bolts to the existing battery clamp. Simple to remove when a new battery is required too. Would have been nice if the existing cables were 50mm longer but didn't want to extend them 50mm for the sake of a neater install haha! I labelled the inside of the lid to make fuse identification easy, room for a few extra circuits too.
Ran a new 25mm cable to the rear battery while I was there.
(https://i.imgur.com/15lBGbt.jpg)
The battery dimensions are 238W x 521L x 219H so it is a big unit. I literally had 3mm spare to play with to get the battery tucked right up under the tray between chassis and tie down rails so took a bit of fluffing around to get the mounts right. 2 mounts are directly attached to the chassis and 2 will hang from the tray. I used bolts on the bottom so the tray will hinge down for access and to physically get the battery in there.
(https://i.imgur.com/MRPFfRe.jpg)
Post by: nab on December 29, 2023, 01:29:50 AM
Any shunts that have an IP67 display, surface or flush mount? I can't seem to find any...
Post by: lloydus67 on December 30, 2023, 07:46:08 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20231230/263a6f278c37f6f141c532ac7a3210ba.jpg)
This is flush mount and says that it’s a water proof surface.
So I presume up rating of some description
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Post by: nab on December 31, 2023, 02:18:16 AM
I ended up flush mounting it to my under tray "connection box." We'll see how it holds up on the Gibb next year... I also mounted my compressor where the old battery was and installed some covers to neaten it up.
(https://i.imgur.com/K1fhm0G.jpg)
Post by: WilSurf on January 02, 2024, 12:41:42 PM
Finally made a start to the install. So far I have a 200A Kings lithium battery, Renogy 2000W inverter, Renogy 50A weatherproof DCDC charger and Renogy shunt/monitor (found some good deals so stuck with Renogy).
I hope you didn't use the supplied wiring for the inverter as they are way too thin?
Post by: nab on January 02, 2024, 10:20:13 PM
Post by: WilSurf on January 03, 2024, 12:11:35 PM
I have used 0B&S for my AllSparks invertor.
Made a bracket for the remote switch which is now easiy reachable and still out of the way.
Post by: nab on January 03, 2024, 05:35:38 PM
Post by: nab on January 30, 2024, 06:59:20 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/G4vhlDk.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/9v0vYBs.jpg)
Max power usage was 1.9kw @ 156A. That was with coffee machine, milk heater/frother and freezer going at the same time.
(https://i.imgur.com/QqLwhiz.jpg)
The 200A lithium worked great. I have a 110W solar panel mounted on the roofrack which at it's peak was pumping 107W, 8A. Easily powered the freezer and fridge all day - along with making 3 coffees - and put in a poofteeth back into the battery but still "lost" around 40Ah a night.
By sunset of day 5 of not starting the car, the lithium was at 26%. I wasn't confident the lithium would last the night so I plugged the freezer into the van which was fully charged.
(https://i.imgur.com/qXhTa6e.png)
Another experiment was to see if the 98AH AGM and 320W of roof mounted solar in the van would handle the freezer/fridge combo. For 3 nights I put the freezer into the van, by morning the battery was at 12.2V. Without the freezer, the battery was in float mode by around 9:00am. With the freezer attached it went into float mode after lunch some time. The panels put out max 308W so I was very happy with that.
Again, thanks for all the input. My usage seems to compare to others here.
Post by: WilSurf on January 31, 2024, 10:26:16 AM
Using the induction cooktop, we boiled water for tea and made a meal.
Maximum power draw was 176A and we used for the cooking a total of 10Ah.
Wife was very happy with induction, cooking just like home. :-)
With the 300W solar blanket, the 200Ah battery was full in no time.
Post by: nab on February 01, 2024, 01:14:35 AM
What is your induction cooktop rated at?
What brand is it?
What heat setting did you use it on?
Post by: Foo on February 01, 2024, 04:49:37 AM
I haven't told my missus that we can run an induction hotplate yet....
What is your induction cooktop rated at?
What brand is it?
What heat setting did you use it on?
That can be fixed for you. ;D :angel:
Foo
Post by: Spada on February 01, 2024, 06:53:32 AM
Our new van is gasless so all cooking is 240v now (or bbq). Last weekend cooking dinner was a Japanese curry. Chicken in the air fryer for 10 minutes at 180°, curry sauce & veg in a frypan on the induction level 5 for about 10min, and microwave rice 700w for 3min. combined use was around 45ah.
From a 3000w inverter I could run the air fryer & microwave or the induction & microwave both together no worries, but the air fryer & induction together would trip the inverter if the induction went above level 5.
It was great cooking outside without being affected by the wind 8)
2 coffees from a Nespresso mini & milk frother in the morning was about 6ah.
I've got 600ah lithium, so should be good for about 3 days of no charge at all, but with the overcast weather my 1060w solar had me back at full capacity by around 11am ;D
Post by: WilSurf on February 01, 2024, 10:48:27 AM
I haven't told my missus that we can run an induction hotplate yet....
What is your induction cooktop rated at? - 2000W
What brand is it? - Dune 4WD ($59.99)
What heat setting did you use it on? - We used wattage settings, we have used 1200W, 1600W and 1800W.
Post by: Fizzie on February 01, 2024, 12:44:41 PM
Our new van
& hi-jacking the thread for a moment >:D, but we haven't seen a write-up yet! ::)
Post by: Spada on February 01, 2024, 02:05:29 PM
& hi-jacking the thread for a moment >:D, but we haven't seen a write-up yet! ::)
You got me there Fizzie, not a lot to say really other than we've turned fully to the dark side and bought a stock standard off the shelf caravan ;) I'm struggling to find any real mods to do :'(
Maybe I could get a little white poodle to complete the look :-\
Post by: nab on February 01, 2024, 05:46:05 PM
:cheers: