Your Local Pharmacy Needs your Signature and Support

[scarps]

Mods, if you feel this thread is not appropriate, understand if you remove.

I currently work in the Australian Pharmacy industry supporting several hundred of your local pharmacists, their local business and their local team of pharmacy assistants to provide Australians everywhere with access to medications that ensure we all get to live long healthy lives (and go camping etc). In the current election, the long term viability of many of these local businesses is under threat and they are asking for you to visit them, show your support and sign their petition that will be presented to the Federal Government late next week.

Thnx in advance for this.

Scott

[Marschy]

They get to charge the Brand Premium surcharge if a customer opts not to buy a generic, then still charge the full PBS price for a generic. This happens with National Pharmacies and many others. They don't pass on the saving to the customer for generics if they opt for the generic and then charge the Brand Premium surcharge if you decide to stick with the patent drug.

Let them eat cake. The majority of chemists are theiving rougues with their snouts in the trough.

[Bird]

They get to charge the Brand Premium surcharge if a customer opts not to buy a generic, then still charge the full PBS price for a generic. This happens with National Pharmacies and many others. They don't pass on the saving to the customer for generics if they opt for the generic and then charge the Brand Premium surcharge if you decide to stick with the patent drug.

Let them eat cake. The majority of chemists are theiving rougues with their snouts in the trough.

Thats any business these days

we have to start giving a **** about business and jobs in this country.  I want somewhere for my kids to work one day thats not data entry for a chinese website...

[Marschy]

I can buy atorvastatin sandoz at chemist warehouse for $17. Exactly the same drug at National, $46.10. If I opt for atorvastatin pfizer at National, I will be charged $46.10 plus a $5 Brand Premium surcharge for not opting for the generic. Similar story with Sinemet. My guess is that chemist warehouse is still making a profit.

Who's livelyhood is at stake here, the pharmacy who is working on a pretty healthy margin or the consumer, some of whom have difficulty affording their medication.

[scarps]

Thnx Marschy, I take it you don't want to sign the petition?

Maybe have a read of this instead.

http://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/medicare/pbs-safety-net

[Marschy]

Thanks for that Scarps, the Brand Premium surcharge is not covered under the PBS safety net. This is a charge that the pharmacist can charge if they feel like it.

They can also pass on the savings for generics if they want to, but few seem to be doing it because the profit margin on generics is much higher as the pharmacist can charge up to the full PBS price. Hence the reason why pharmacies love generics. They can charge what they like and make bigger profit margins than they can on patent drugs.

By the way, the Pharmacy Guild is supposedly the largest lobby group in Australia, hence the reason why they were able to convince the government that if they made less profit on patent drugs, they should be able to charge a premium on top of the PBS price to make up the short fall on the profit they make on generics, but the savings for the consumer when they buy a generic are for the most part not passed on and go straight into the pharmacists pocket. And we are not talking about small margins of profit here, we are talking about profit margins on some generic drugs of over 100 %.

There are currently around 100 drugs that attract the Brand Premium surcharge and the list is growing. And no prizes for guessing which drugs attract the premium, the most commonly prescribed drugs.

If chemist warehouse can make a profit on atorvastatin sandoz, the highest prescribe drug by volume in Australia today, at $17 dollars for the generic, and National are charging $46.10 for the same generic, and even with a membership, doesn't get you any discount, I'll vote with my wallet and get my drugs where I can best afford them.

[McGirr]

talk about mark ups......don't go to a jewellry store 

We all have a perspective on how much profit businesses should make. Yes sometimes you wonder how one company can sell the same product a lot cheaper than the other. But at the end of the day we all vote with our wallets.

In saying that I am happy to sign the petition if it keeps jobs going.

Mark 

[oldmate]

Thats any business these days

we have to start giving a **** about business and jobs in this country.  I want somewhere for my kids to work one day thats not data entry for a chinese website...

Only have read as far as this post and, man you hit the nail on the head right there.

[Marschy]

Atorvastatin PBS Discount Calculation

Current List Price (excl. premium free incentive) $51.00
Less:
Dispense fee $6.52
Mark-up $4.50
Funded price to pharmacy for medicine cost $39.98
Estimated generic purchase price discount % 75%
Estimated generic purchase price discount $ $29.99
Example generic price to pharmacy for medicine cost $10.00

Chemist warehouse profit - $7.00
National Pharmacy profit - $36.10

# prescriptions annually 10,507,613 across 5000+ pharmacies. Average profit $226,439,060.15 or average of $45,287.00 per pharmacy.

That is one drug alone, doesn't take into account Brand Premium surcharges.

I think they cry poor too often quite frankly, and as a consumer, I will not be supporting their campaign.

[scarps]

I am respectful of everyone's opinion on this forum and would prefer not to turn this thread into a two sided debate. Again to the Mod's if you feel this thread is not in keeping with the culture of this forum, more than happy for you to delete or lock it.

The comparison being made is relative to South Australia (and to a lesser extent Vic) where National Pharmacies operates.  National Pharmacies are not an independantly owned and operated business, instead a Corporate Managed business under the terms of the historic Friendly Society Associations.  If National Pharmacies have made a stance that they don't want to be competetive in their market, I guess their members/customers can make the choice to shop there or not.
In most other states in Australia, price competition amoung pharmacies is just as robust as any other retail business (coles v woolworths v iga, holden v ford v kia, bunnings v masters v Mitre10 v Home Hardware). In this case Chemist Warehouse v Amcal v Chemmart v Discount Drug Stores.

This thread was initiated to highlight concern that many local owned and operated businesses may be at risk as a viable long term healthcare support model.

Every business has a right to be a viable operation to allow the business owner (in this instance Pharmacist) to be able to pay rent (local landlord or shopping centre), to be able to employ staff (usually from local people), to be able to pay for light & power, gas, telephone, insurance  etc, and yes for the the business owner to own a nice house, nice car and even send their children to the best school possible.

Having said all that, if you know your local Pharmacy Team, you will in the main find that your health and personal care takes priority in everything they do.

[Marschy]

You are encouraging people to sign a petition that could potentially mean higher prices to the consumer for prescription drugs.

If you encourage people to sign the petition, I think there should be a bit of clarity given as to what this petition means to the consumer.

[crackacoldie]

I've signed the petition, we have a local pharmacist in the Barossa, where the big guns don't wish to operate.

Just my 2c

[Barry G]

...
we have to start giving a **** about business and jobs in this country.  I want somewhere for my kids to work one day thats not data entry for a chinese website...

Surely profit gouging isn't a pre-requisite for ensuring jobs.  What next, low wages as well?
The fact is that pharmacies are a protected industry, in that there are limits on how close new pharmacies can set up in proximity to existing ones.  Also concerns me when patients being encouraged to brand swap to maximise profit.  I'm sure the average person, when being asked if they would accept the generic ('no name') would expect lower price and profit, not higher profit to the chemist.  That alone is not exactly ethical.

[Goose]

Remember that as far as business goes, pharmaceutical makers and major pharmacy chains are the basically the most robust and defensive businesses out there. They will never run out of customers. They will never see any significant drop in sales in bad times.

I worked for one of the huge pharma companies during the GFC and their revenue and share price rose constantly whilst everything else tanked. Yet they will go before the TDA and cry poor, then try and obliterate their competition in court etc.

It will be a dark day when people like Marshy stop buying their medicines. They will give up just about everything else first. The pharmaceutical and pharmacy guys have guaranteed income.

Sorry, i appreciate the threat of job losses but I struggle to sympathise with big business on this count. People arnt going to stop buying drugs.

[Marschy]

OK, I'll give a bit of clarity about what this petition is about if scarps doesn't want to.

In 2007 John Howard introduced price disclosure. This is basically, the pharmacies had to disclose to the government every 18 months what price they are selling generic drugs for. The reason is that the government knew that pharmacies were selling drugs without passing on the savings to consumers. With price disclosure, the government is able to say to the pharmacist industry as a whole, hey, your average profit is 'x' so we are only going to rebate 'y'% of the purchase price that you get the drug from the wholesaler.

This affects the profit that the pharmacy gets.

The Rudd government want to change it so the pharmacies have to report every 12 months.

This means 12 months less price gouging in a 3 year period, and the pharmacies don't like it.

[muzza01]

My sons nasal medication costs $38, there is no alternative cheaper option. His Dr informed me of some of ridiculous differences in prices around this area.  It is $38 at Chemist Whorehouse, up to $70 at other Chemists, but unbelievably $90 in the Atherton Tableands or Mossman which are both only an hour out of Cairns.

[Ynot]

Interesting thread. There is much more to the story than first appears


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