Author Topic: Power and gas is to expensive.  (Read 199766 times)

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Offline tryagain

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #625 on: January 30, 2019, 10:08:00 PM »

Offline gronk

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #626 on: January 31, 2019, 05:50:57 PM »
An interesting article on Snowy 2.0 published today on ABC
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-01-30/snowy-hydro/10683112

And for that sort of money, if it ever gets off the ground, we will farm it out to a foreign investor and pay thru the nose for the next 40 years !!

The concept sounds good, but the way we are going, there won't be any "spare" power to run the system .
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Offline Bird

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #627 on: February 01, 2019, 09:18:41 AM »
Quote from: gronk
And for that sort of money, if it ever gets off the ground, we will farm it out to a foreign investor and pay thru the nose for the next 40 years !!



actually for any money it will be sold off and we will then have more promises on how Gov co will force them to drop the price for us out of the goodness of their hearts.
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Offline tryagain

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #628 on: February 01, 2019, 10:42:26 AM »
The concept sounds good, but the way we are going, there won't be any "spare" power to run the system .

This bit makes it sound like it shouldn't be an issue

Quote
The current rate of solar and wind development is “phenomenal”, according to Doctor Matthew Stocks from the ANU Energy Change Institute.

“If it continues, we are at 100 per cent renewables by 2030, never mind the targets that are being bandied about,” he said

Offline Bird

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Offline Bigfish

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #630 on: February 16, 2019, 02:51:06 PM »

Oil and gas giant BP says renewable energy will rapidly become the world’s main source of power within the next 20 years, as the planet shifts towards a lower carbon future.
 
"The pace at which renewable energy penetrates the global energy system is faster than for any fuel in history," BP said in its latest annual Energy Outlook report.
 
The report looked at a number of scenarios for changing energy demand globally, and said in all forecasts there will be a massive boom in demand and more generation will be needed to supply it.
 
"The increase in energy over and above the evolving transition scenario is roughly the equivalent of China's entire energy consumption in 2017," it said.
 
BP said in all scenarios wind and solar will play an increasing role in keeping the lights on. But oil and gas will remain key fuels in the energy mix, with consumption peaking in the 2030s before demand falls off.
 
While coal demand will flatten in BP's least energy transformation aggressive scenario, the use of coal will see a sharp contraction in all other scenarios.
 
“The world of energy is changing. Renewables and natural gas together account for the great majority of growth in primary energy,” BP chief economist Spencer Dale said.
 
“In our evolving transition scenario, 85 per cent of new energy is lower carbon.”
 
BP chief executive Bob Dudley said the transition to renewables is inevitable.
 
“This outlook again brings into sharp focus just how fast the world’s energy systems are changing and how the dual challenge of more energy with fewer emissions is framing the future. Meeting this challenge will undoubtedly require many forms of energy to play a role,” Mr Dudley said.
 
“Predicting how this energy transition will evolve is a vast, complex challenge. In BP, we know the outcome that’s needed but we don’t know the exact path the transition will take.”
 
Renewable power in Australia now accounts for a fifth of all energy generated, the first time it has done so since the 1970s.
 
The latest Green Energy Markets report says renewable power levels punched through the 20 per cent market share threshold in 2018, although coal still accounts for more than 70 per cent of Australian power, leading to high carbon emissions from the energy sector.
 
Mr Dudley said strong leadership on energy policy - aimed at electricity generation - is needed from governments to ensure carbon emissions are reduced in line with the global Paris Agreement targets.
 
“Policies aimed at the power sector are central to achieving a material reduction in carbon emissions over the next 20 years,” Mr Dudley said.
 
He has also previously called for a price on carbon to drive down emissions created by the electricity industry.
 
“Put a price on carbon and you incentivize everyone to use less energy,” Mr Dudley said.
 
Fellow energy giant Shell's Australian chairman Zoe Yujnovich also made calls this week for a carbon price.
 
"Part of the role for government will be to encourage consumers and businesses into lower carbon choices," Ms Yujnovich said, "perhaps through government-led carbon-pricing mechanisms that avoid the pitfalls of previous designs."
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Offline GeoffA

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #631 on: February 17, 2019, 06:16:10 AM »
......
“Put a price on carbon and you incentivize everyone to use less energy,” Mr Dudley said.
......
"Part of the role for government will be to encourage consumers and businesses into lower carbon choices," Ms Yujnovich said, "perhaps through government-led carbon-pricing mechanisms that avoid the pitfalls of previous designs."

So, where does the money from the price on carbon end up?

Reeks of subsidy chasing......
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Offline gronk

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #632 on: February 17, 2019, 07:44:09 AM »
A price on carbon ??  Is it calculated by the electricity used.....or by another method made up by pollies or "experts" ??
Just another method to tax people for using electricity.
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Offline lloydus67

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Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #633 on: February 17, 2019, 10:11:57 AM »
When I lived and worked in the uk, I worked for a company called (edit probably shouldn’t name them on a public forum). At the time they were the only licensed traders for “carbon”
The way it worked was you worked out your carbon footprint, then we came along and made you more efficient, used those improvments in efficiency to leverage better tarrif rates and subsidies, then sold on the leftover carbon usage to less efficient businesses to save them being charged higher tax rates
Win win
Well except for possibly the environment, but the Pollies looked good and we were very profitable


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« Last Edit: February 17, 2019, 10:13:57 AM by lloydus67 »

Offline lloydus67

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #634 on: February 17, 2019, 10:15:36 AM »
A price on carbon ??  Is it calculated by the electricity used.....or by another method made up by pollies or "experts" ??
Just another method to tax people for using electricity.
It’s calculated on all energy used, electricity, gas, diesel, fuel oil, etc.


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Offline alnjan

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #635 on: February 17, 2019, 01:13:14 PM »
A price on carbon ??  Is it calculated by the electricity used.....or by another method made up by pollies or "experts" ??
Just another method to tax people for using electricity.


What he said
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Offline Bird

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #636 on: February 17, 2019, 03:18:49 PM »
what happened to the latest fashion 5-10yrs ago with everyone buying carbon credits here in AU LMAO... bet they feel stupid now
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Offline tryagain

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #637 on: February 26, 2019, 10:20:38 AM »

Offline gronk

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #638 on: February 26, 2019, 07:24:47 PM »
Looks like the Snowy 2.0 pumped hydro is getting the green light.

https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/groundbreaking-snowy-hydro-20-project-gets-the-goahead/news-story/83994e49171dbd8d6279934ab5de7642

When finished it would provide peak power for 500,000 homes ??

That's a lot of money for 1/18th of the homes in Australia.
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Offline glenm64

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #639 on: February 26, 2019, 07:29:24 PM »
Looks like the Snowy 2.0 pumped hydro is getting the green light.

https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/groundbreaking-snowy-hydro-20-project-gets-the-goahead/news-story/83994e49171dbd8d6279934ab5de7642
Must be an election coming up. Theres money falling from every tree at the moment.

Cheers Glen

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Offline tryagain

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #640 on: February 26, 2019, 08:14:30 PM »
Must be an election coming up. Theres money falling from every tree at the moment.

Cheers Glen

There is certainly that, this is one of the few things that actually has bipartisan support though as long as the business case stacked up. So suspect it would be going ahead even if it wasn't.

Offline tryagain

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #641 on: February 26, 2019, 08:34:36 PM »
When finished it would provide peak power for 500,000 homes ??

That's a lot of money for 1/18th of the homes in Australia.

It will provide 350,000MWh of storage, compare that to the Tesla big battery in SA which provides 130mWh and it goes some way to show the scale of it. Not a solution in and of itself but certainly a decent piece of the puzzle.

Offline gronk

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #642 on: February 26, 2019, 09:22:33 PM »
It will provide 350,000MWh of storage, compare that to the Tesla big battery in SA which provides 130mWh and it goes some way to show the scale of it. Not a solution in and of itself but certainly a decent piece of the puzzle.

Even though it will use cheaper ( not cheap as advertised ) electricity in off peak times, this cost will be passed onto us. During summer, when the most load is normally needed, is when the dams are at their lowest, so I'd assume they have thought of that ?

They haven't even done the test tunnel yet, so this story is a bit premature....although probably rushed thru in time for the election !!
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Offline Paddler Ed

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #643 on: February 27, 2019, 10:15:02 AM »
Interesting piece from the SMH et al on the power companies who are doing well in the rankings:
https://www.smh.com.au/business/consumer-affairs/simple-deals-no-discounts-small-power-companies-beat-big-end-of-town-20190227-p510h3.html


Offline Bird

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #644 on: February 27, 2019, 10:24:10 AM »
Interesting piece from the SMH et al on the power companies who are doing well in the rankings:
https://www.smh.com.au/business/consumer-affairs/simple-deals-no-discounts-small-power-companies-beat-big-end-of-town-20190227-p510h3.html
Interesting, havent heard of many of those companies - the 'winner' in Vic sounds positive.
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Offline Paddler Ed

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #645 on: February 27, 2019, 10:36:45 AM »
Interesting, havent heard of many of those companies - the 'winner' in Vic sounds positive.

Plug your details into here and see what it fires up - when I did it RedEnergy were the best option for me:
https://www.energymadeeasy.gov.au/

Just ran it back through again, and Red aren't the best option any longer, but with the deal I'm on, it's pretty close still once I get prompt payment taken into account ($20 in it)

Ed
« Last Edit: February 27, 2019, 10:41:45 AM by Paddler Ed »

Offline Bird

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #646 on: February 27, 2019, 10:44:52 AM »
Plug your details into here and see what it fires up - when I did it RedEnergy were the best option for me:
https://www.energymadeeasy.gov.au/

Just ran it back through again, and Red aren't the best option any longer, but with the deal I'm on, it's pretty close still once I get prompt payment taken into account ($20 in it)

Ed
will sus it later... sounds interesting.
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Offline Pete79

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #647 on: February 27, 2019, 12:45:11 PM »
Must be an election coming up. Theres money falling from every tree at the moment.

Cheers Glen
You might be on to something there mate. ;)

Watching Lib pollies in Tassie right now promising more studies on another pumped hydro site down there.
You can physically see the pain in their faces as they’re saying how much they like renewable energy.

Offline tryagain

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #648 on: February 27, 2019, 04:07:34 PM »
You might be on to something there mate. ;)

Watching Lib pollies in Tassie right now promising more studies on another pumped hydro site down there.
You can physically see the pain in their faces as they’re saying how much they like renewable energy.

I think they will like wedging the likes of the Greens, especially Bob Brown who has a history of opposing daming rivers in Tas.

Offline Fizzie

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Re: Power and gas is to expensive.
« Reply #649 on: February 28, 2019, 09:37:09 AM »
Interesting piece from the SMH et al on the power companies who are doing well in the rankings:

We've been with Diamond Energy for a couple of years now, & very happy with them, especially their solar FiT! 8)
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