MySwag.org The Off-road Camper Trailer Forum

General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 01:02:14 PM

Title: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 01:02:14 PM
Cooma area, Tarcutta, Bega area and more :(

So the Hume will be cut if Tarcutta is under threat, and chances are the coast will be cut, and then down thru the mountains will be under threat... :(


Hope all are safe.

Quote
SOARING temperatures and powerful winds fuelled major bushfires in southern NSW today, fulfilling fears that the state was facing one of its worst fire-risk days on record. 
 
Homes were under threat as up to 90 per cent of NSW was declared in severe danger, with conditions deemed “catastrophic” in some areas.

More than 100 fires were burning across the state, 20 of which remained uncontained, with thousands of firefighters in the field and thousands more on standby.

The worst blazes were near Cooma in southern NSW and near Bega on the NSW south coast.

The NSW Rural Fire Service (RFS) advised residents of about 10 properties around Mount Forest Road in the Cooma-Monaro area to take shelter in their homes as the fire approached bcause it was too late to leave.

The same blaze was threatening about 20 homes in the Kybeyan valley, with firefighters battling to protect properties.

 .
Another fire has broken out on the south coast near Bega and is expected to affect isolated properties north of Eagles Nest Road.

An emergency warning was also issued for the township of Tarcutta, in southwest NSW.

The RFS said the fire front was about 3km from properties shortly before 1pm, and Tarcutta residents were being urged to “shelter in place” as it approached.

Firecrews and water bombers were also scrambling to put out a grass fire as strong winds pushed it towards the NSW Riverina village of Oura, east of Wagga Wagga.

Rural Fire Service officer Lesley Lemon said the fire was only a couple of kilometres away from homes.

NSW Emergency Services Minister Mike Gallagher said the extreme weather - predicted to create one of the worst fire danger days in NSW history - was now “starting to play out”.

“There was a hope that something would abate this weather condition as it moves across NSW, but the fact is that it has not,” he told reporters in Sydney.

“We are being confronted with a situation where up to three areas are deemed to be at catastrophic in terms of the fire conditions, with 90 per cent of NSW being deemed to be severe or higher.

“The far western and far south coast areas of the state have a fire danger of severe, and the rest of NSW will be at the high level.”

People living in Shoalhaven, the Illawarra and the southern ranges face the most risk.

Along NSW's south coast temperatures rose this morning by an average of two degrees every 30 minutes.

In the town of Bega, the temperature rose almost 15 degrees in an hour, going from 23 degrees at 8am (AEDT) to 37.8 degrees at 9am.

Bega then became the first town in the state to hit 40 degrees, which it did at 11.30am (AEDT).

“It's never been that hot, that early, in Bega,” said Julie Evans, from the Bureau of Meteorology (BoM).

Sydney temperatures trailed the rest of the state but were expected to peak at 43C in the afternoon, and hover around the 30 degree mark for most of the evening before a change tomorrow morning.

“Ahead of the cool change, quite warm and very gusty wind conditions are expected,” said Ms Evans.

All NSW national parks, reserves and state forests are closed to the public due to the fire risk.

The ACT also has imposed a total fire ban as fire fighters mop up a forest fire burning in the territory's south.

NSW Rural Fire Service Commissioner Shane Fitzsimmons said it was shaping up to be a long day for the thousands of firefighters in NSW.

“Right across the state we are seeing fires breaching some of their containment lines, and we've also got fire agencies identifying new fires that are starting up under these hot, dry conditions,” he told reporters.

“We've got a lot of daylight left and a lot of nighttime left under these conditions.

“The front that's moving through NSW is not expected to pass through some of our worst areas until much later tonight.”

Sydneysiders would experience extremely hot conditions until after midnight, he said.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/nsw-braces-for-horror-bushfire-threat/story-e6frg6nf-1226549351466 (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/nsw-braces-for-horror-bushfire-threat/story-e6frg6nf-1226549351466)





More here
http://www.smh.com.au/environment/weather/cooma-fire-spreading-by-square-metres-by-the-minute-20130108-2cdxl.html (http://www.smh.com.au/environment/weather/cooma-fire-spreading-by-square-metres-by-the-minute-20130108-2cdxl.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 01:20:31 PM
Yup, the Hume is now closed...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: areyonga on January 08, 2013, 01:36:06 PM
It is getting worse by the minute, I only hope the firies can get them under control quickly.  The one at Narrandera might cut the Sturt Hwy.

Trevor
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 08, 2013, 01:39:46 PM
The RFS website is struggling to cope with the hits it's receiving.
They've ask for people that have access to FB to monitor their FB page for updates will be posted there as well.
NSW Rural Fire Service FB page (https://www.facebook.com/nswrfs)
Quote
State overview at 1410:

124 incidents being fought by 1126 firefighters, backed by 340 trucks and 63 aircraft. 53989.59 hectares has been burnt.

In some great work by NSW RFS firefighters, we have not lost one home.

Thanks to everyone for their hard work.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: aanda69 on January 08, 2013, 01:40:00 PM
I am heading to Eden from Melbounre on Friday for a week camping with the kids. Do people up that way think we should be ok or should I look at cancelling.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: areyonga on January 08, 2013, 01:40:03 PM
NSW Rural Fire Service
State overview at 1410:

124 incidents being fought by 1126 firefighters, backed by 340 trucks and 63 aircraft. 53989.59 hectares has been burnt.

In some great work by NSW RFS firefighters, we have not lost one home.

Thanks to everyone for their hard work.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 01:41:04 PM
and Canberra
http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/live-act-region-faces-extreme-bushfire-conditions-20130108-2cdfi.html (http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/live-act-region-faces-extreme-bushfire-conditions-20130108-2cdfi.html)
Title: NSW Fires
Post by: ozbogwam on January 08, 2013, 02:18:12 PM
Glad we got out of the Bega area on Saturday. We missed a bushfire at Cann River on the way up just before Xmas too.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 02:31:55 PM
Quote from: aanda69
I am heading to Eden from Melbounre on Friday for a week camping with the kids. Do people up that way think we should be ok or should I look at cancelling.
I would consider a plan B incase..
But its only Tuesday at moment, chances are you'll have plenty of black ash and dirt to camp in where the fire went through.

www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/dsp_content.cfm?cat_id=683 (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/dsp_content.cfm?cat_id=683)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: achjimmy on January 08, 2013, 02:38:24 PM
The RFS website is struggling to cope with the hits it's receiving.
They've ask for people that have access to FB to monitor their FB page for updates will be posted there as well.
NSW Rural Fire Service FB page (https://www.facebook.com/nswrfs)

And to acess the FB page you have to sign up! How fcuked is that. I hate FB with a passion.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 02:47:27 PM
Quote from: achjimmy
And to acess the FB page you have to sign up! How fcuked is that. I hate FB with a passion.
I'm with you on that.

I did manage to see this off the main page before it demands you sign up
EMERGENCY WARNING:
Mates Gully, Tarcutta (Wagga)
The township of Tarcutta is currently being impacted by fire. Shelter in place
and

EMERGENCY WARNING
#Warrigal Range (Bega)
http://ow.ly/gCnl4 (http://ow.ly/gCnl4)
leave now if the path is clear and relocate to Bega township. #NSW RFS
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 08, 2013, 02:59:09 PM
Seriously guys, why blow up about FB.
 :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: eman on January 08, 2013, 03:00:22 PM
The twitter page might be useful for those who don't have FB

https://twitter.com/NSWRFS
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 03:15:18 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 03:23:47 PM
Watch and Act - Ryan Road Fire, Munyabla (Lockhart) 08/01/13 16:20
Posted: 08/01/2013
Firefighters have contained  the fire burning near Ryan Road, Munyabla.



Current Situation

The fire has been brought under control and the threat to the township of Henty has eased. A reduction in wind speed and temperature has helped firefighters to contain this fire.

The fire came within 5km of the Henty township. No property or stock losses have been reported at this stage.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 03:25:08 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 03:34:21 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 08, 2013, 03:36:40 PM
G'day Mace,
That's very good of you to cut & paste the information here.  :cheers:
I guess it shows how under prepared people are in these situations that the traffic that the RFS's servers have had to cope with people trying to get information has caused difficulty accessing the site.
In NSW there are some 140 fires atm and 40 are out of control.
In the past two hours 3 fires have been reported on top of the 5 already in the Clarence Valley Councils area alone.
And we don't have the heat or the winds at the moment that the southern areas of the state have experienced.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 03:42:15 PM
deleted

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 03:43:54 PM
No worries Hairs.

Imagine of you were/are on dial up in a rural area?   ???
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 03:44:54 PM
Im surprised theres none from the Shire to Nowra, or Blue Mtns..

No doubt the Grays Pt team will be out and about again.
if you see these boys around, you are in good hands.
Wayne the Capt, and Kempy. Both have 20+yrs up their sleeves. Great crew.  :cup: :cup: :cup: :cup:
(http://www.grayspoint.rfsa.org.au/photogallery/victoriastarg6.JPG)
http://www.grayspoint.rfsa.org.au/photos.htm (http://www.grayspoint.rfsa.org.au/photos.htm)

careful of Sig, like me he has a rooted leg :D
(http://www.grayspoint.rfsa.org.au/photogallery/victoriastarg7.JPG)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 03:47:52 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 08, 2013, 03:48:19 PM
No worries Hairs.

Imagine of you were/are on dial up in a rural area?   ???
Yeah, It would be scarey stuff.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 04:35:22 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 05:35:06 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: POD on January 08, 2013, 05:43:42 PM
It's like we have our own MaceBook page!!

 :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 05:50:15 PM
That is very funny!!  I may have to register that name!

If only 1 person is finding it useful, then worth it.

Before I left Forestry Vic, my Fire Team Role was an "intelligence officer"

Those who know me may find that hard to believe  ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 06:34:37 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 07:10:16 PM
its windy as hell here....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 07:57:15 PM
deleted
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 09:01:18 PM

Major Fire Updates
Emergency Warning - Yarrabin Fire (Cooma-Monaro LGA) 08/01/13 21:46
Posted: 08/01/2013

An Emergency Warning has been issued for an out of control bush fire burning in the Kybeyan Valley area.

Current Information

The fire is burning in  the Kybeyan Valley, west of Tuross River Road. The fire is currently impacting on properties in The Avenue; Hains Road and Warnocks Road, Kybeyan Valley.

People in the Kybeyan Valley area should seek shelter as the fire impacts. Police have been doorknocking homes in the area to advise them of the risk.

The fire is likely to move towards the Dangelong, Numeralla and Countegany areas following a southerly wind change expected to move through the area after midnight. People in these areas should stay aware of the fire activity.

Two Emergency Alert Telephone Warning messages have been sent to residents in the Mount Forest Road and Kybeyan Valley areas. Firefighters have been working to protect local properties in the area throughout the afternoon.

Advice

Seek shelter as the fire impacts. Protect yourself from the radiant heat.

Other information

If your life is at risk, call Triple Zero (000) immediately.

Continue to stay up to date with the bush fire situation by checking  the RFS website www.rfs.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au), listening to your local radio station or by calling the NSW RFS Bush Fire Information Line on 1800 679 737.

For information on road closures, check http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au (http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au). Roads may be closed without warning.
Emergency Warning - Sand Hills fire (Palerang) 08/01/13 21:43
Posted: 08/01/2013

A bush fire is burning in the area 13 kilometres east of Bungendore near the Kings Highway.

Current Situation

The fire is burning in the area of the Kings Highway near Timber Hills Road.

The fire has spotted over near Mulloon Road and properties may come under threat in this area.

Firefighters are working to protect properties in Hazeldell Road. They are experiencing difficult conditions, with winds gusting at more than 100 kilometres per hour.

The Kings Highway is closed at Braidwood intersection and at Bungendore.

Advice

People are advised not to travel along the Kings Highway as it is closed between Braidwood and Bungendore.

People on the northern side of the fire are advised they can still leave the area by travelling north up the Braidwood to Goulburn Road towards Tarago.

Further information

If your life is at risk, call Triple Zero (000) immediately.

Continue to stay up to date with the bush fire situation by checking  the RFS website www.rfs.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au), listening to your local radio station or by calling theNSW RFS Bush Fire Information Line on 1800 679 737.

For information on road closures, check www.livetraffic.com (http://www.livetraffic.com). Roads may be closed without warning.
Emergency Warning - Deans Gap fire (Shoalhaven) 08/01/13 21:32
Posted: 08/01/2013

A bush fire  burning approximately 1.5km to the west of Wandandian in the Deans Gap area has burnt through 1,515 hectares.

Current Situation

An emergency warning is in place for the following areas: WANDANDIAN, BENDALONG ROAD, BENDALONG, NORTH BENDALONG, CUNJURONG POINT, JANUNG LANE, JERRAWANGALA, SUSSEX INLET ROAD, SUSSEX INLET, CUDMIRRAH, SWANHAVEN, MEDLYN AVE, BERRARA. A large bush fire is burning out of control.

The fire is burning in Catastrophic fire danger conditions and is currently between two and six hours from properties.

The fire is currently over 1500ha in size, and has now crossed the Princes Highway. Based on current weather predictions the southerly change is expected to reach the area soon.

The southerly change will cause the fire to head in a northerly direction and impact on Sussex Inlet Road within the next few hours.  It is too late for residents on Sussex Inlet Road to leave the area. There are a number of firefighters working from the road and conditions are not safe to travel.

Rural Fire Service and Fire Rescue New South Wales firefighters are strategically deployed along the Sussex Inlet Road protecting properties.

The southerly change will bring cooler conditions however, the threat to property will remain.

The Princes Highway remains closed at Bendalong Road in the north and Wandean Road in the south.  It is too late for people to leave the area.

Evacuation Centres are open in Sussex Inlet at the Bowling Club and the RSL. The RSL is capable of taking people with pets while the Bowling Club is not. These centres are open for people who have relocated due to the fire. At this stage there are no evacuation orders in place.

The following roads are also closed:  Braidwood Road, Turpentine Road, Wandean Road and Twelve Mile Road

Advice

    Do not wait. Act now to protect you and your family.
    Homes are not designed or constructed to withstand fire in these conditions. Even if your home is specially designed, constructed or modified to withstand a fire and is properly prepared, it may not offer safety from the fire.
    Protect yourself from the heat of the fire. If you are caught in the path of the fire, you may die or be injured.
    Updates on this fire, Bush Fire Survival Plans, details of Neighbourhood Safer Places and the latest reports can be found on the NSW RFS webpage www.rfs.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au) or by calling call 1800 NSW RFS (1800 679 737).

Further information

    People are asked not to call ‘000’ to report smoke in the area – please only call ‘000’if you can see a fire without fire fighters in attendance or if your life is directly threatened.
    For information on road conditions or closures, please call the NSW RTA on 131 700 or check www.rta.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au). Remember roads may be closed without warning.
    For information on closures of National Parks associated with this fire, please visit www.npws.nsw.gov.au (http://www.npws.nsw.gov.au)

Emergency Warning - Cobbler Road Fire (Yass) 08/01/13 21:06
Posted: 08/01/2013

A fast moving grass fire is burning out of control south of the township of Bookham.

More Information

The grass fire is burning very quickly through grasslands south of Bookham.

The fire is currently impacting on Burrinjuck Road and the fire activity has closed the road. People in the area are advised to shelter in place as the fire impacts. People in the Burrinjuck Dam area are also advised to shelter in place, it is too late to leave this area.

The fire has moved through the Childowla Road area, but residents are advised to keep up to date with the changing fire conditions.

It has been confirmed that one home was lost on Bogalara Road.

People in the Bald Hill are are advised that the fire threat has now eased, however they should remain aware of the changing fire situation.

Advice

    Act immediately. You are in danger.
    Homes are not designed or constructed to withstand fire in these conditions.
    Even if your home is specially designed, constructed or modified to withstand a fire and is properly prepared, it may not offer safety from the fire.
    Protect yourself from the heat of the fire. If you are caught in the path of the fire, you may die or be injured.

Other information

    If your life is at risk, call Triple Zero (000) immediately.
    Continue to stay up to date with the bush fire situation by checking http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au), listening to your local radio station or by calling the NSW RFS Bush Fire Information Line on 1800 679 737.
    If you live in the area but are away from home, it may not be safe to return to your property.
    For information on road closures, check http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au (http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au). Roads may be closed without warning.

 
Emergency Warning - Mates Gully Tarcutta (Wagga Wagga) 08/01/13 18:39
Posted: 08/01/2013

A bush fire is currently impacting isolated properties to the north west of Tarcutta township along the Mates Gully Road.

Current Situation

Isolated rural properties to the north west of Tarcutta township along the Mates Gully Road are still under threat from this fire.

Residents in the area are advised to shelter in place as the fire impacts. It is too late to leave the area.

The immediate threat to Tarcutta village has eased as weather conditions improve. Firefighters have been backburning this afternoon to try and contain the fire's spread.

Under these conditions, fires are uncontrollable and move quickly. Embers will be blown up to 4km ahead of the fire, creating spot fires that will move quickly and in different directions. These spot fires may threaten your home earlier than the predicted main fire front.

The Hume Highway has been reopened to traffic.

Advice

    Act immediately. You are in danger.
    Homes are not designed or constructed to withstand fire in these conditions.
    Even if your home is specially designed, constructed or modified to withstand a fire and is properly prepared, it may not offer safety from the fire.
     Protect yourself from the heat of the fire. If you are caught in the path of the fire, you may die or be injured.

Other information

    If your life is at risk, call Triple Zero (000) immediately.
    Continue to stay up to date with the bush fire situation by checking http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au), listening to your local radio station or by calling the NSW RFS Bush Fire Information Line on 1800 679 737.
    If you live in the area but are away from home, it may not be safe to return to your property.
    For information on road closures, check http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au (http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au). Roads may be closed without warning.

Watch & Act - Learys Lane grass fire (Upper Lachlan) 08/01/13 17:37
Posted: 08/01/2013

Firefighters are getting the upper hand on a grass fire burning near Range Road and  Leary Lane, Grabben Gullen (to the south of Crookwell).

Current Information

The fire near Range Road and  Leary Lane, Grabben Gullen (to the south of Crookwell) is burning in Catastrophic Fire Danger Conditions. 

More than 40 firefighters from the NSW RFS are working to contain the fire.

Under these conditions, fires are uncontrollable, unpredictable and fast-moving. Embers will be blown up to 20km ahead of the fire, creating spot fires that will move quickly and in different directions. These spot fires may threaten your home earlier than the predicted main fire front.

Advice

    Homes are not designed or constructed to withstand fire in these conditions. Even if your home is specially designed, constructed or modified to withstand a fire and is properly prepared, it may not offer safety from the fire.
    If you are in doubt or it is not safe to leave, take shelter in a solid structure when the fire front arrives. Protect yourself from the heat of the fire.
    If your life is at risk, call Triple Zero (000) immediately.

Other Information

    Continue to stay up to date with the bush fire situation by checking http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au), listening to your local radio station or by calling the NSW RFS Bush Fire Information Line on 1800 679 737.
    If you live in the area but are away from home, it may not be safe to return to your property.
    For information on road closures, check http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au (http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au). Roads may be closed without warning.

Watch and Act Bogan Gate (west of Parkes) 08/01/13 17:44
Posted: 08/01/2013

A number of fires have started along the railway line at Bogan Gate, west of Parkes.

Current Situation

Firefighters are working to contain a number of fires which have started along the railway line. The fires are burning to both the west and east of Bogan Gate.

Advice

If the fire impacts your property, seek shelter and protect yourself from the radiant heat.

 

Further information

    For information on road conditions or closures, please call the NSW RTA on 131 700 or check www.rta.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au). Remember roads may be closed without warning.

 

    If you need to report a new fire or require urgent assistance, dial Triple Zero (000).
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2013, 09:03:49 PM
deleted
Just Edit em :)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Mace on January 08, 2013, 09:12:13 PM
Yeah, was doing that earlier, works well until someone posts up after you.

I allways had the habit of destroying old evidence tho!  ;D

Still a few going fires in Vic, Flora Hills @ Bendigo, and Walwa, Upper Murray.  Kentbruck (Portland) is now an Alert.

Have a safe night everyone.

Southerly Change is pumping thru NE Vic right now.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Marschy on January 08, 2013, 10:04:15 PM
29 degrees in Adelaide today, hope this reach NSW tomorrow to give the RFS guys some relief  tomorrow.

My son (CFS volunteer) is watching the events closely and he and my entire family are hoping for the best outcome for all concerned.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on January 08, 2013, 10:35:23 PM
Awesome work there Macebook  ;D

Hope all the Swaggers and their familys and friends come through ok.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Finners on January 09, 2013, 01:20:48 PM
Left Gillards Beach (Mimosa Rocks NP) yesterday at 9:30am. Rangers were encouraging (but not enforcing) camper departures. Park closed to new entrants. GG Patrol was due to leave today, and was hoping they'd let his group stay last night. At that stage there were no fires near Bega/Tathra, though clearly 1 flared up near Bega later in the day. (Hope you're home safe now Garrick).

On way home to Sydney, avoided the Princes Hwy due to Sussex Inlet fire, went via Kings Hwy/Braidwood/Goulburn. Very light traffic understandably. 'FiresNearMe' app had a new fire at Bungendore as we approached the area, but sighted no smoke or appliances on Goulburn Rd. Plenty of tree branches down with the strong norwester though. Made it home safe and thoughts are with folks who were/are fire affected.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GGV8Cruza on January 16, 2013, 09:33:15 AM
Left Gillards Beach (Mimosa Rocks NP) yesterday at 9:30am. Rangers were encouraging (but not enforcing) camper departures. Park closed to new entrants. GG Patrol was due to leave today, and was hoping they'd let his group stay last night.

We got to stay but it was a bit hairy for a while. First time I ever had had a fire plan in place as the smoke was coming in from the Bega fire keeping things on edge. Once the Southerly hit all was good though, warmest day for us under canvas though with 46 in the shade

GG
Title: NSW Fires
Post by: ozbogwam on January 16, 2013, 12:29:32 PM
It amazed me how hot it was on the coast,, very rare for Tathra to get so hot
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on September 25, 2017, 04:36:04 PM
Doesnt sound good...


Quote
An out-of-control bushfire is threatening homes in Nowra on the NSW South Coast.

The Rural Fire Service has issued an emergency warning for the blaze that is burning near Filter Road, Depot Road, West Street, Shoalhaven Street and Plunketts Street in West Nowra.
 
The fire is moving in a North-Easterly direction towards West Street and Shoalhaven Street, Nowra.

Telephone warnings have been made to residents, instructing them to take shelter.

Firefighters are working to protect the homes with the assistance of Thor, the large air tanker, that is water bombing the area.

Motorists are being directed away from the area and students at the University of Wollongong's Shoalhaven campus are being told to reconsider travelling there. Those already on campus are being told to remain clam and stay alert.

"Under these conditions, fires are uncontrollable, unpredictable and fast-moving," the RFS said.

By submitting your email you are agreeing to Fairfax Media's  terms and conditions  and  privacy policy  .

"Embers will be blown up to four kilometres ahead of the fire, creating spot fires that will move quickly and in different directions.
"These spot fires may threaten your home earlier than the predicted main fire front."

The RFS said residents in the area of Filter Road and Cavanagh Lane should take shelter.

The fire is moving in a north-easterly direction towards West and Shoalhaven streets and residents in these streets should leave early, the RFS said.

"Well-prepared homes that are actively defended can provide safety but only stay if you are physically and mentally prepared to defend in these conditions," the RFS said.

Rural Fire Service crews were called to bush that was alight off Filter Road on three occasions on Friday and over the weekend.

Police have been investigating if the fires were deliberately lit by ****tards.


http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/outofcontrol-bushfire-threatens-homes-in-nowra-20170925-gyo5el.html (http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/outofcontrol-bushfire-threatens-homes-in-nowra-20170925-gyo5el.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: grizzly on September 25, 2017, 08:33:39 PM
On the Northern Rivers we have been involved in Hazard Reductions and straight into  Wild Fires for over a month now with NPWS  and what may make the Parks haters happy Glady's and her Liberals are trying to gut hundreds of years of fire fighting experience from the ranks in a bid to make her budjet look good for the next election,
So there will be far less full time staff to fight fires do hazard reductions and do all the other behind the scenes work.
I obviously have a vested interest but just shy of 20yrs service teh majority of staff I work with treat the job as more then just a job
we are very proud of what we do andachieve for the public.
Rant over
Cheers
Grizzly  :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on September 25, 2017, 08:44:12 PM
Its amazing where Gov's try and save money... its never where it needs to be saved





And now the Royal is burning
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/outofcontrol-bushfire-threatens-homes-in-nowra-20170925-gyo5el.html (http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/outofcontrol-bushfire-threatens-homes-in-nowra-20170925-gyo5el.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on September 25, 2017, 09:04:19 PM
On the Northern Rivers we have been involved in Hazard Reductions and straight into  Wild Fires for over a month now with NPWS  and what may make the Parks haters happy Glady's and her Liberals are trying to gut hundreds of years of fire fighting experience from the ranks in a bid to make her budjet look good for the next election,
So there will be far less full time staff to fight fires do hazard reductions and do all the other behind the scenes work.
I obviously have a vested interest but just shy of 20yrs service teh majority of staff I work with treat the job as more then just a job
we are very proud of what we do andachieve for the public.
Rant over
Cheers


Grizzly  :cheers:

Is the push to get rid off the RFS white collar staff or NPWS staff?
 Out of the loop of RFS politics now that I am no longer living in NSW and active as part of local brigade, although I am ready to return if the need arises.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on September 26, 2017, 09:02:19 AM
On the Northern Rivers we have been involved in Hazard Reductions and straight into  Wild Fires for over a month now with NPWS  and what may make the Parks haters happy Glady's and her Liberals are trying to gut hundreds of years of fire fighting experience from the ranks in a bid to make her budjet look good for the next election,
So there will be far less full time staff to fight fires do hazard reductions and do all the other behind the scenes work.
I obviously have a vested interest but just shy of 20yrs service teh majority of staff I work with treat the job as more then just a job
we are very proud of what we do andachieve for the public.
Rant over
Cheers
Grizzly  :cheers:
Yep,
We have two Hut Maintenance days planned(Ramornie/Nymboida & Cunglebung), just hope we can get there and clean up around the huts before fire beats us to it.
The Grafton & Districts 4WD Club has a great relationship with NPWS Glenn Innes & Grafton employees, that has grown over the years.
We know what you guys on the ground are going through.

Safe Travels



Sent from my SM-P585Y using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on September 26, 2017, 01:33:56 PM
On the Northern Rivers we have been involved in Hazard Reductions and straight into  Wild Fires for over a month now with NPWS  and what may make the Parks haters happy Glady's and her Liberals are trying to gut hundreds of years of fire fighting experience from the ranks in a bid to make her budjet look good for the next election,
So there will be far less full time staff to fight fires do hazard reductions and do all the other behind the scenes work.
I obviously have a vested interest but just shy of 20yrs service teh majority of staff I work with treat the job as more then just a job
we are very proud of what we do andachieve for the public.
Rant over
Cheers
Grizzly  :cheers:

The other side of RFS, for me anyhow is the continual restrictions placed on trying to do a control burn off or hazard reduction or whatever it is called these days, a lot of the volunteers, the ones with their feet on the ground, on the fire ground just can't do what they want to do or what needs to be done.  Where there used to be regular burn offs around the area, there has been NO hazard reduction.  How can you keep Volunteers if they are not allowed to what needs to be done.  Being on stand by for the inevitable bushfire is NOT best practise. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on September 26, 2017, 01:52:24 PM
Quote from: alnjan
The other side of RFS, for me anyhow is the continual restrictions placed on trying to do a control burn off or hazard reduction or whatever it is called these days, a lot of the volunteers, the ones with their feet on the ground, on the fire ground just can't do what they want to do or what needs to be done.  Where there used to be regular burn offs around the area, there has been NO hazard reduction.  How can you keep Volunteers if they are not allowed to what needs to be done.  Being on stand by for the inevitable bushfire is NOT best practise.

The paper trail involved in arranging backburns when I left the RFS was incredible... The approval process was long and you knew it was always going to get to one place and be blocked. someone would find 1x rare fart fish in 1 puddle

People always miraculously find something when they wanna block things (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-03-29/rare-orchid-halts-motorsports-complex-on-south-coast/8396090=) - one of the burns back the team tried to get approved in the 90's in the shire was blocked by someone finding a rare frog... months later massive fire ripped through with massive losses

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on September 26, 2017, 02:27:58 PM
I agree Bird, a cool burn can preserve so much while a hot burn destroys everything.  Thankfully we haven't had the later but I dread when it will come.  The other annoyance with the prescribed burns is if the date set aside is out of the prescription by one thing it is all tools down and go home and then wait for the next date to be set, which can be weeks later, if at all.  Before the RFS became so well managed, if the weekend was no good the next fine day the call would go out, regardless if it was a week day or not and you would still have more turn up then what you could hope for now. 

I was in the RFS but after a few years of NO burn offs like a lot of others, I left as I had other things to do.  Maybe now I am retired I may rejoin.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on September 27, 2017, 11:25:03 AM
one of the burns back the team tried to get approved in the 90's in the shire was blocked by someone finding a rare frog

One of the researchers at the Uni was a specialist in frogs & toads :-\

He had the knack of being able to find the same species of endangered frogs in the path of airport runway extensions, new motorways, proposed dams & all sorts of spots ::)

We always reckoned he kept them in a tank at home, let them out when he needed to complain about a project, then went back a week later to pick them up again >:D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on September 27, 2017, 11:42:21 AM
Quote from: Fizzie
One of the researchers at the Uni was a specialist in frogs & toads :-\

He had the knack of being able to find the same species of endangered frogs in the path of airport runway extensions, new motorways, proposed dams & all sorts of spots ::)

We always reckoned he kept them in a tank at home, let them out when he needed to complain about a project, then went back a week later to pick them up again >:D

Personally I have no doubt that happens - it wouldnt be hard to destroy any form of Shit you didnt want around your place... Hmmm the paddock over the back fence has just been sold for townhouses :( Wonder if your mate is available and what his rate of $ is...

Probably exactly the same bloke probably does the rare orchids around the Yerriyong motorcycle complex linked above...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on September 27, 2017, 11:42:56 AM
One of the researchers at the Uni was a specialist in frogs & toads :-\

He had the knack of being able to find the same species of endangered frogs in the path of airport runway extensions, new motorways, proposed dams & all sorts of spots ::)

We always reckoned he kept them in a tank at home, let them out when he needed to complain about a project, then went back a week later to pick them up again >:D

so the frog wasn't that rare if he could find them everywhere
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on April 14, 2018, 08:22:59 PM
Nasty sounding one out Holesworthy heading south east - towards Menai/Sandy Point :(

dunno wat the weather is like, but if its windy as it is here it would be a ****in nightmare..


Quote
An out of control bush fire is burning in the vicinity of Moorebank Avenue at Holsworthy, Wattle Grove.

Current Situation

A fast moving bush fire is travelling in a south easterly direction, in the vicinity of Moorebank Road at Wattle Grove.

Residents in the Wattle Grove community and the Holsworthy military complex are advised to shelter in place. It is too late to leave.

The fire has now crossed Heathcote Road and is moving towards Alfords Point, Menai, and Barden Ridge. Residents in this area should take shelter as the fire front approaches and protect yourself from the heat of the fire.

Residents in the Wattle Grove community, the Holsworthy military complex, Voyager Point, Pleasure Point and Sandy Point should shelter in place. It is now too late to leave.

Emergency Alert messages are being sent to people in the area.

Heathcote Road is now closed between Macarthur Drive and New Illawarra Road.

Advice

Put your Bush Fire Survival Plan into action. If you do not have a Bush Fire Survival Plan, know what you will do if the fire threatens your property.

Well prepared and actively defended homes can offer safety during the fire.

An Evacuation Centre has been set up at Moorebank Sports Club, 230 Heathcote Rd, Hammondville.

Other Information

    If your life is at risk, call Triple Zero (000) immediately.
    Continue to stay up to date with the bush fire situation by checking http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au (http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au), listening to your local radio station or by calling the NSW RFS Bush Fire Information Line on 1800 679 737.
    If you live in the area but are away from home, it may not be safe to return to your property.
    For information on road closures, check http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au (http://livetraffic.rta.nsw.gov.au). Roads may be closed without warning.

The next update on this fire will be issued by 14/04/2018 20:30 or if the situation changes.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: oddsocks on April 15, 2018, 01:40:24 PM
Nasty sounding one out Holesworthy heading south east - towards Menai/Sandy Point :(

dunno wat the weather is like, but if its windy as it is here it would be a ****in nightmare..

60 km/h winds were recorded at Sydney Airport yesterday around the time the fire stared. Was extremely gusty and hot and just fanned the flames. Cooler day today but wind is still up. Live just up the road in Revesby.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on April 15, 2018, 02:25:13 PM
They get a few fires go through there .. Tends to get rid of a bit of Unexploded Ordnance on the firing range ..
Though I did hear that this one damaged  Buildings  on the base ..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on April 15, 2018, 02:29:42 PM
From the satellite view of the fire path, there was what looks like a ammunition or hazardous material store in the middle of it all. It has a big berm around it anyway.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on April 15, 2018, 02:35:29 PM
Why don’t the southern states do a burn off each season. Every year major fires start. ???

In the NT they do burn offs and you never hear of a major fire destroying homes.

Mark
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: oddsocks on April 15, 2018, 02:43:04 PM
Talk about it being deliberately lit. Burnoff’s don’t really help in these circumstances especially when they see a munitions dump is in the fire’s path.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: speewa158 on April 15, 2018, 03:31:25 PM
Burn offs are done here with permits as required if its OK with the Greenies that is . Also you have to remember that there is a population difference between Vic & NT . We could do more in the 1st place          :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Cruiser 105Tvan on April 15, 2018, 04:01:16 PM

To add to Speewa's post.
Trouble is, there's a LOT of people want to live in overgrown forested areas away from populated areas.
Mt. Dandenong Ranges area is a great example.  Even though it's not State Forest.  It'll still go up really well.
And people will live in houses with bush right up beside the house and tree rubbish all over their roof's.
And then they scream blue murder if they get caught in a fire situation.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GGV8Cruza on April 15, 2018, 06:38:47 PM
A burn was scheduled for this weekend in the same spot. They cancelled it and this then started up.

GG

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GeoffA on April 15, 2018, 07:01:06 PM
To add to Speewa's post.
Trouble is, there's a LOT of people want to live in overgrown forested areas away from populated areas.
Mt. Dandenong Ranges area is a great example.  Even though it's not State Forest.  It'll still go up really well.
And people will live in houses with bush right up beside the house and tree rubbish all over their roof's.
And then they scream blue murder if they get caught in a fire situation.

Agree Rob. It's just a matter of when.....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on April 15, 2018, 07:43:00 PM
To add to Speewa's post.
Trouble is, there's a LOT of people want to live in overgrown forested areas away from populated areas.
Mt. Dandenong Ranges area is a great example.  Even though it's not State Forest.  It'll still go up really well.
And people will live in houses with bush right up beside the house and tree rubbish all over their roof's.
And then they scream blue murder if they get caught in a fire situation.

I have photographed a number of major bushfires and I can take you to properties that were effected by the fires where people still have vegetation right up to and next to their properties. this will always be the case as people seek the "bush life"

I have no issue with this if they have a clear and concise action plan for bushfires whether that be stay or go and the appropriate firefighting apparatus if they decide to stay and defend. We all have different lifestyle choices. These people do not have the right to scream blue murder though if they caught as the choice was entirely theirs.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Cruiser 105Tvan on April 15, 2018, 07:53:53 PM
I have photographed a number of major bushfires and I can take you to properties that were effected by the fires where people still have vegetation right up to and next to their properties. this will always be the case as people seek the "bush life"

I have no issue with this if they have a clear and concise action plan for bushfires whether that be stay or go and the appropriate firefighting apparatus if they decide to stay and defend. We all have different lifestyle choices. These people do not have the right to scream blue murder though if they caught as the choice was entirely theirs.
Exactly my point Pottsy, they made the choice. 
There's a large percentage of these people who have absolutely no idea what a good 'Fire' can do.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on April 16, 2018, 12:09:45 PM
Quote from: edz
They get a few fires go through there .. Tends to get rid of a bit of Unexploded Ordnance on the firing range ..
Though I did hear that this one damaged  Buildings  on the base ..
we were blocked from going in there one year due to UXB... so we repositioned back at Menai Station LOL!

Quote from: speewa158
Burn offs are done here with permits as required if its OK with the Greenies that is .
adding to this, theres was that much paperwork and "approvals" to go through when I left the RFS in late 90's I cant imagine the bullShit you'd have to go through these days. More than once it was blocked in the shire due to a 'rare' animal being found (a frog one year) - that the burnoff was not approved... several months later some of the biggest fires went through and kermit was ****ed anyway.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on April 16, 2018, 01:26:10 PM
adding to this, theres was that much paperwork and "approvals" to go through when I left the RFS in late 90's I cant imagine the bullShit you'd have to go through these days. More than once it was blocked in the shire due to a 'rare' animal being found (a frog one year) - that the burnoff was not approved... several months later some of the biggest fires went through and kermit was ****ed anyway.

Pretty much the same reason I haven't rejoined the local RFS.  Been ages since they last done a controlled burn off.  Poor old Kermit and his mates have a lot better survival prospect from a cool fire to a out of control bush fire.  Now days just do my own hazard reductions over winter.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on August 15, 2018, 03:34:52 PM
Not cool down south coast way

Quote
Strong winds are fanning an out-of-control bushfire threatening homes near Ulladulla on the NSW south coast, with some residents told to seek shelter as it's too late to leave.

About an hour's drive north, another out-of-control blaze is threatening property at North Nowra, burning east towards the Princes Highway and Bomaderry.

These major south coast bushfires are the worst of dozens of early-season blazes firefighters are battling across the state under severe conditions, with a total fire ban declared for Sydney, the Illawarra and Hunter regions until midnight on Wednesday.

It's the earliest declaration of a total fire ban in the regions in almost a decade, the NSW Rural Fire Service tweeted on Wednesday afternoon.

More than 800 firefighters were battling about 70 fires across the state, with more than 30 of those uncontained, the RFS said.

The fire service issued an emergency warning for the blaze at Mount Kingiman, west of Burrill Lake near Ulladulla.

Residents in Burrill Lake, Kings Point and Ulladulla's south who are not prepared, or plan to leave, have been told to head north into central Ulladulla immediately, the NSW Rural Fire Service says.

Those in Woodstock are being told that it is too late to leave, and they should seek shelter in a solid structure as the fire approaches.

The fire service said a southerly change was expected to send the fire north towards Croobyar on Wednesday afternoon.

"Under these conditions, fires are uncontrollable, unpredictable and fast-moving," the fire service said.
https://www.theage.com.au/national/nsw/bushfire-threatens-homes-near-ulladulla-on-nsw-south-coast-20180815-p4zxk1.html (https://www.theage.com.au/national/nsw/bushfire-threatens-homes-near-ulladulla-on-nsw-south-coast-20180815-p4zxk1.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on August 15, 2018, 05:44:38 PM
Why don’t the southern states do a burn off each season. Every year major fires start. ???

In the NT they do burn offs and you never hear of a major fire destroying homes.

Mark

Ummmmmmmm what????

Are you suggesting to deliberately light fires to control burn areas so we don't end up with "catastrophic" fires? reduce fuel loads or something like that?
I almost chocked on my lentil soup! ;D
Seriously what are you thinking???
A lizard could get burnt, a tree might have to regenerate. Surely some Toyota diesel driving moron and his family's lives are far less important than the smoke that might be produced.
OK, before you retaliate, I know that if when the fires come, it will be 10 times as bad and cost 10 times more and we'll lose more stock and wildlife and put lives at risk, but seriously, think about the poor wombat who loses his home? Have you thought about the wombat estate agents who will be out of business for 6 months? No you just think about yourself and other peoples lives and common sense. Spare a though for the snakes who may have to run off temporarily. Do they get a government grant for moving expenses? And where does that money come from? Higher GST? just cos you want to save lives and be sensible?

Anyway, I would like to rant on about your insensibilities toward nature but my yoga lesson starts in 15 and I have to ride my bike there cos my Prius is out of charge, so I gotta go.
That reminds me I have to charge my prius to get to work tomorrow. Lucky its such clean energy, you know electricity and all. Not like it comes from burning fossil fuel like your landcruiser.
(well I can't see the power station so I don't care - that's your problem, I'm saving the seals!)

Note: Sorry Mark, just couldn't help myself. I'll pull my tongue out my cheek now and take my meds. ;D

Brian
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on August 15, 2018, 06:13:39 PM
Ummmmmmmm what????

Are you suggesting to deliberately light fires to control burn areas so we don't end up with "catastrophic" fires? reduce fuel loads or something like that?
I almost chocked on my lentil soup! ;D
Seriously what are you thinking???
A lizard could get burnt, a tree might have to regenerate. Surely some Toyota diesel driving moron and his family's lives are far less important than the smoke that might be produced.
OK, before you retaliate, I know that if when the fires come, it will be 10 times as bad and cost 10 times more and we'll lose more stock and wildlife and put lives at risk, but seriously, think about the poor wombat who loses his home? Have you thought about the wombat estate agents who will be out of business for 6 months? No you just think about yourself and other peoples lives and common sense. Spare a though for the snakes who may have to run off temporarily. Do they get a government grant for moving expenses? And where does that money come from? Higher GST? just cos you want to save lives and be sensible?

Anyway, I would like to rant on about your insensibilities toward nature but my yoga lesson starts in 15 and I have to ride my bike there cos my Prius is out of charge, so I gotta go.
That reminds me I have to charge my prius to get to work tomorrow. Lucky its such clean energy, you know electricity and all. Not like it comes from burning fossil fuel like your landcruiser.
(well I can't see the power station so I don't care - that's your problem, I'm saving the seals!)

Note: Sorry Mark, just couldn't help myself. I'll pull my tongue out my cheek now and take my meds. ;D

Brian

So you agree  ;D ;D

Mark
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on August 15, 2018, 08:02:35 PM
So you agree  ;D ;D

Mark

Hell yeah. Can't for the life of me understand why they won't. They did it for years with no adverse effects and it actually worked.
Back burning and containment lines. It's not rocket science.

Cheers Mate,
Brian
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: achjimmy on August 15, 2018, 08:40:19 PM
They have done some burn offs up in the mountains here. Fair few  But tbh they seem ineffectual they don’t clear the fuel, it’s still there in loads and seems no containment lines!  and then the latte sippers Brian refers to bitch about some smoke in the city and suburbs.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on August 15, 2018, 09:42:16 PM
In my old local area, hazard reduction burns were done in a mosaic grid pattern, the idea being that a different parcel of land was burnt each year. Over a period of time, there would be neighbouring areas that are burnt, it would be cyclic and resulting in different areas having different fuel loads. The hope being that if a wild fire was to break out then at some point it would pass over a section of land which has been burnt and hopefully be contained or slowed.

It will be getting put to the test ATM as a fire broke out today to the bush west of our old house and is still classified as out of control.

It just so happens we are driving down tomorrow for the weekend so I will throw my gear in and see if they need a hand, although I'm probably not able to assist these days as I haven't trained in over three years since moving away.

But otherwise always plenty to do at the fire shed in times like these.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on August 15, 2018, 09:47:52 PM
Hell yeah. Can't for the life of me understand why they won't.
Different world now.

Too much paperwork and bullShit you to get approvals through.. RFS, councils, greens, EPA, Col Sanders etc. Then you have to pick a date, and weather conditions. if you miss your date due to weather etc.. start gain

Then you get people complaining that there's smoke in the air for a couple of days...
Then you get those people complaining their house burnt down cause there was no burn offs..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on August 16, 2018, 12:29:58 AM
Different world now.

Too much paperwork and bullShit you to get approvals through.. RFS, councils, greens, EPA, Col Sanders etc. Then you have to pick a date, and weather conditions. if you miss your date due to weather etc.. start gain

Then you get people complaining that there's smoke in the air for a couple of days...
Then you get those people complaining their house burnt down cause there was no burn offs..

And they say Queenslanders are strange people  ;D ;D

Mark
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on August 16, 2018, 03:22:19 PM
thats quite a lot of smoke for a 1 jeep fire.

Some sound advice at the bottom too.

Quote
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DknotDIUwAASR4Q.jpg)

The fire remains at a Watch and Act alert level, with Mr Webster saying residents should continue to enact their bushfire survival plan.

“For those people with plans in place, continue to prepare your properties as this fire will be around for some time,” he said.

“If you choose to stay and defend your property, test your equipment, make sure your pumps work and if you have a ladder make sure you’ve got it back from your neighbour,” he added with a wry chuckle.

While it is not currently an emergency situation requiring evacuations, Mr Webster also had vital tips for those who choose to relocate.

“Be sure to take your mobile phones and chargers for those phones, items to confirm your identity and any medication required – those are things people often overlook.

“And another thing I’d say is gather your family photos – you wouldn’t believe the number of times we see people put themselves in harm’s way trying to retrieve photos.

“While you have the time and a window of opportunity get busy, use the time appropriately.”

https://www.begadistrictnews.com.au/news/local-news/5589581/bemboka-bushfire-returns-to-higher-alert-level/ (https://www.begadistrictnews.com.au/news/local-news/5589581/bemboka-bushfire-returns-to-higher-alert-level/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on August 18, 2018, 10:59:50 AM
Bugger :'(

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-17/waterbombing-helicopter-crash-nsw-south-coast-woodstock/10133264 (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-17/waterbombing-helicopter-crash-nsw-south-coast-woodstock/10133264)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on August 18, 2018, 11:53:41 AM
A truck rolled up near Caparra (NSW mid north coast) putting 4 into hospital too.
https://www.winghamchronicle.com.au/story/5590462/update-rural-fire-service-truck-rollover-north-of-wingham/ (https://www.winghamchronicle.com.au/story/5590462/update-rural-fire-service-truck-rollover-north-of-wingham/)

They really need to work on getting some new and younger members in the doors too. I'm a member of 2 brigades, one isn't too bad as we can muster crews that are are in their 20's and 30's, but the other one I'm the 3rd youngest member.... at 48. Dragging yourself and a 38mm hose full of water up and down hills in your 60's and 70's is bloody hard work. This crew were 20, 54, 62 and 71.

(https://s9752.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/TRUCK-ROLLOVER.png)
https://www.nbnnews.com.au/2018/08/16/four-firefighters-hospitalised-after-tanker-rollover/ (https://www.nbnnews.com.au/2018/08/16/four-firefighters-hospitalised-after-tanker-rollover/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on August 19, 2018, 08:16:51 PM
Quote from: Hoyks
Dragging yourself and a 38mm hose full of water up and down hills in your 60's and 70's is bloody hard work. This crew were 20, 54, 62 and 71.
Its always been a challenge in some regions. We found country areas with very small crews struggled to get any youth in... our town people looked down on the volunteers until they had a fire.



This sounds bad too..
Quote
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/too-late-to-leave-emergency-warning-for-hunter-bushfire-20180819-p4zye6.html (https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/too-late-to-leave-emergency-warning-for-hunter-bushfire-20180819-p4zye6.html)

An emergency warning has been issued for a bushfire on the NSW North Coast, just as firefighters rein in an out-of-control blaze in the Hunter region.

The fire at Ellangowan, south-west of Ballina, broke containment lines and jumped a creek about 4.30pm on Sunday, the Rural Fire Service said.

The blaze is burning toward isolated rural properties and emergency warnings have been sent to residents telling them it is too late to leave.

They have been advised to seek shelter as the fire, which has covered 2000 hectare, bears down.

The warning comes just as firefighters start to contain a bushfire at Salt Ash, just north of Newcastle, during which residents were told it was too late to leave as strong westerly winds of up to 60km/h fanned blazes.

The Rural Fire Service said easing conditions on the fire ground had reduced the threat to homes, but warned residents in the area to continue to monitor the situation should it change.

Emergency alerts were sent to residents around Rookes Road, Lemon Tree Passage Road and Brownes Road in Salt Ash just after midday on Sunday as strong winds caused the blaze to intensify.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on August 19, 2018, 08:46:46 PM
Some 25+ fires in the Clarence Valley this evening alone,
Countless more around NSW & QLD.
The wind is picking up.
Our thoughts are with the RFS volunteers and others fighting these fires.
Thank you for your effort.


(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180819/ec2893449cfa6d0bd669779aa75a297b.jpg)

Sent from my SM-P585Y using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on August 19, 2018, 09:03:23 PM
And it is snowing atm at Glenn Innes, 100 klm away.
Go figure.

Sent from my SM-P585Y using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on August 19, 2018, 10:01:53 PM
And it is snowing atm at Glenn Innes, 100 klm away.
Go figure.

And blowing 40km/h+ winds (gusts 75km/h+) all day today another 100km south in Armidale...

Snowing/sleet in Uralla as well... think it had an effort here, but it's warm inside so I didn't go out to see.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on August 20, 2018, 08:02:16 AM
They really need to work on getting some new and younger members in the doors too. I'm a member of 2 brigades, one isn't too bad as we can muster crews that are are in their 20's and 30's, but the other one I'm the 3rd youngest member.... at 48.

I was chatting (socially not professionally! ;D) to a psychologist / counsellor I know a couple of years ago. She was saying that she'd just been at a conference where subject of volunteering came up. The general opinion is that most modern young people (Gen X / Y / Millenials) aren't interested in volunteering to do stuff like this, so it's entirely possible that the next 20 years or so will see groups like SES, Rural Firies, Marine Rescue & so on basically disappear as their active members age out :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on August 20, 2018, 09:41:32 AM
I was chatting (socially not professionally! ;D) to a psychologist / counsellor I know a couple of years ago. She was saying that she'd just been at a conference where subject of volunteering came up. The general opinion is that most modern young people (Gen X / Y / Millenials) aren't interested in volunteering to do stuff like this, so it's entirely possible that the next 20 years or so will see groups like SES, Rural Firies, Marine Rescue & so on basically disappear as their active members age out :'(

I'm not sure that the "aren't interested" bit is quite true - I think there are barriers to enabling them to become involved including time constraints, concerns about not being able to give enough and the distances they are commuting for work. For me the challenge was the uncertainty of how long I was going to be in one place for - was it worth the organisations time to train me if there was some uncertainty as to how long I was going to stay in one place. In fact, had I started when I first moved here in 2013, I'd have done 5 years now... but I wasn't to know how long I was here for.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on August 20, 2018, 12:49:34 PM
We had one a bit close to us. All out now though.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on August 20, 2018, 01:18:40 PM
Quote from: Paddler Ed
I'm not sure that the "aren't interested" bit is quite true - I think there are barriers to enabling them to become involved including time constraints, concerns about not being able to give enough and the distances they are commuting for work
There is quite an investment in time required these days in basic training and on going training.. Also depending on what sort of station your involved with. Ours was 'Village Protection'...

It all changed and got serious around the early 90s which was required, but did turn a lot of people off.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on August 20, 2018, 05:19:55 PM
It depends on the brigade and the larger organization too. Most are happy to get someone and many people move between brigades as work moves them around the state/country.

Both NSW and QLD have a fair bit of theory and OH&S stuff to do online.

In Qld it was a weekend of theory and practical training, a few nights consolidation at the brigade and an assessment day got you all signed up as a Basic Firefighter.

In NSW the training is at brigade level and it all depends on how dedicated the brigade is to getting you trained up. Took me almost a year to get signed up as the guy that held the position of crew trainer wasn't exactly proactive.

Once you have the basic qual, then its as little or as much time as you have to spare, A couple of hours a fortnight for maintenance and available for callout on weekends. The more bodies they have to call on, the less pressure on the others to be always available.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on October 26, 2019, 09:18:26 PM
Doesnt sound good this early

https://www.smh.com.au/environment/weather/it-s-going-to-get-worse-before-it-gets-better-strong-winds-fan-blazes-in-nsw-20191026-p534i2.html (https://www.smh.com.au/environment/weather/it-s-going-to-get-worse-before-it-gets-better-strong-winds-fan-blazes-in-nsw-20191026-p534i2.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on October 26, 2019, 09:22:46 PM
One year in the future someone will re-introduce Control Hazard reduction Burns and wonder why it hasn't been done for years. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on October 26, 2019, 09:31:21 PM
One year in the future someone will re-introduce Control Hazard reduction Burns and wonder why it hasn't been done for years.
not if red tape and the greens have their hand in it....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on October 27, 2019, 07:36:21 AM
It hasn't got any better :((https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191026/1937ef519e062fac7bd7d90b2959dcbe.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: vern on October 27, 2019, 08:05:35 AM
It hasn't got any better :((https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191026/1937ef519e062fac7bd7d90b2959dcbe.jpg)
I'm at woolgoolga, could smell a bit of smoke yesterday when that small belt of rain come through, otherwise nothing, not like a few weeks ago. Could do with a good down pour

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on October 27, 2019, 08:59:30 AM
I'm at woolgoolga, could smell a bit of smoke yesterday when that small belt of rain come through, otherwise nothing, not like a few weeks ago. Could do with a good down pour

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Yesterday wasn't too bad, the couple of days prior was pretty smokey from the Bees Nest and surrounding fires.  After the front went through yesterday afternoon, a surprising number of fires started up around the area.  Didn't seem to be much lightning thunder with it for the fires to start from lightning strikes, maybe some other form of ignition was my thought.  I think the storm front yesterday also brought a fair bit of dust in as well from out west.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on October 30, 2019, 10:09:27 AM
Sounding busy round Port areas....

https://www.theleader.com.au/story/6465188/sydney-faces-smoke-haze-from-nsw-fire/?cs=1507 (https://www.theleader.com.au/story/6465188/sydney-faces-smoke-haze-from-nsw-fire/?cs=1507)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: vern on October 30, 2019, 02:25:26 PM
We really need some good rain about now.
Cars covered in ash this morning here in woolgoolga

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on October 30, 2019, 02:46:06 PM
We've had a blanket of smoke a couple of days a week for about the last month - all depends on wind direction; one way it'll be smoke, the other it's dust...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GGV8Cruza on October 30, 2019, 05:48:20 PM
Sounding busy round Port areas....

https://www.theleader.com.au/story/6465188/sydney-faces-smoke-haze-from-nsw-fire/?cs=1507 (https://www.theleader.com.au/story/6465188/sydney-faces-smoke-haze-from-nsw-fire/?cs=1507)

Just checked in with my Dad who is at Port M and close to Lake Cathie, not looking good up there at the moment

GG
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on October 30, 2019, 06:50:21 PM
Just checked in with my Dad who is at Port M and close to Lake Cathie, not looking good up there at the moment

GG
https://www.portnews.com.au/story/6464112/its-serious-100-firefighters-30-trucks-and-10-aircraft-storm-lake-cathie/ (https://www.portnews.com.au/story/6464112/its-serious-100-firefighters-30-trucks-and-10-aircraft-storm-lake-cathie/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 08, 2019, 04:06:18 PM
Parts of the Pacific Highway are closed, while residents are being evacuated in parts of Port Macquarie
https://twitter.com/NSWRFS (https://twitter.com/NSWRFS)
\also


EMERGENCY WARNING: Riches Av, Woodford (Blue Mountains LGA)
The fire is burning south of the Great Western Hwy, in the Woodford area. If you are in the area around Leumeah Road, Park Road, Mona Road and Riches Avenue, seek shelter as the fire approaches. #nswrfs #nswfires #alert

https://www.theage.com.au/national/nsw/port-macquarie-forster-residents-under-threat-as-rfs-fights-to-contain-out-of-control-blazes-across-state-20191108-p538vx.html (https://www.theage.com.au/national/nsw/port-macquarie-forster-residents-under-threat-as-rfs-fights-to-contain-out-of-control-blazes-across-state-20191108-p538vx.html)





(https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/49db863998e0f82e3c5821e2a092d879?width=650)



Phuk
(https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/fc84aad6ae7a8f95b1152484c8a72241?width=650)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on November 08, 2019, 04:27:25 PM
One year in the future someone will re-introduce Control Hazard reduction Burns and wonder why it hasn't been done for years.

Oh Please!!! As if that would work  >:(

Oh hang on, my apologies.  :-[ It does, and used to and you're right, it should be done again.
Really if a few snakes and lizards lose their home for a short time, they just move on and come back when ready.

Now what is this common sense thing you appear to be using?  ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 08, 2019, 09:22:34 PM
Some 25+ fires in the Clarence Valley this evening alone,
Countless more around NSW & QLD.
The wind is picking up.
Our thoughts are with the RFS volunteers and others fighting these fires.
Thank you for your effort.


(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180819/ec2893449cfa6d0bd669779aa75a297b.jpg)

Sent from my SM-P585Y using Tapatalk

EMERGENCY WARNING: Liberation Trail (Clarence Valley LGA)
The fire has burnt through the area of Nymboida, and is burning towards the area of Coutts Crossing. If you are in the area of Coutts Crossing and you are not prepared, leave now towards Grafton. #nswrfs #nswfires #alert
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: mrsedz on November 08, 2019, 11:18:46 PM
This is the MySwag facebook link: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1598063006984891&set=a.294311430693395&type=3&theater (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1598063006984891&set=a.294311430693395&type=3&theater)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Craig Tomkinson on November 09, 2019, 06:47:07 AM
We have fires north of Noosa where I use to help Control burn in winter when in the BFB  for over 30 years, shore we had the odd fire but nothing like now, when forestry and locals did a great job control burning in winter, now great tracks of land is run buy NPs who do not control burn every year or two and people who want to live in the bush with it right up to thee houses, My heart goes out to everyone but mainly to the poor bastards that have to try and put it out, Craig
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 09, 2019, 07:14:01 AM
EMERGENCY WARNING: Liberation Trail (Clarence Valley LGA)
The fire has burnt through the area of Nymboida, and is burning towards the area of Coutts Crossing. If you are in the area of Coutts Crossing and you are not prepared, leave now towards Grafton. #nswrfs #nswfires #alert
Heard this morning the Nymboida canoe centre and Coaching Station have been destroyed.
:(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on November 09, 2019, 08:54:56 AM
Hopefully there is some miss information due to no access to the area and these two places are still standing    .. Just lifted this from a FB site
quote ::
 Mathew Doherty  2 hrs ago :
 "  Just spoke to my mum - the Coaching Station and houses opposite are fine. The Canoe Centre is still standing, just the front fences that burnt down. These are first hand reports." ..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 09, 2019, 09:09:26 AM
Hopefully there is some miss information due to no access to the area .. Just lifted this from a FB site
quote ::
 Mathew Doherty  2 hrs ago :
 "  Just spoke to my mum - the Coaching Station and houses opposite are fine. The Canoe Centre is still standing, just the front fences that burnt down. These are first hand reports." ..
I believe the shop and residence of the Canoe centre has not been impacted, I can not confirm the coaching stations condition.
Our 4wd club has rfs volunteers and are working in the area, they will inform us with good news hopefully.
Our clubs last president was evacuated at 3am this morning from Kangaroo Crk.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 09, 2019, 09:24:28 AM
I think some reports might be ambiguous for a while, but theres some coverage on the ABC via twitter:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-09/emergency-level-fires-burn-through-nsw-qld-live-blog/11688594 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-09/emergency-level-fires-burn-through-nsw-qld-live-blog/11688594)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 09, 2019, 12:53:45 PM
Just got this from one of our members who is the Glenugie RFS Captain.

"I was at the nymboyda fire over night, the canoe centre has lost lots of timber fence, 1 shed where they store canoes, 1 shipping container with canoe stuff stored.
The office house is ok, the cabins are ok but trees and grass are all burnt.
A number of dwellings were lost in the town and some sheds and some ( an unknown number ) of houses on nearby farms were lost.
The coaching station was not impacted by fire"


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 09, 2019, 01:19:27 PM
Here is a video taken by residents evacuating yesterday evening.

At the 19 sec mark in the video is the entrance to the canoe centre.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1192767319757357056 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1192767319757357056)

For those who attended the National meet at Nymboida, you might remember Dave who drove a white land rover defender?Well, they lost their house in the fire.There has been damage to the centre itself but no one really knows til the authorities allow residents back in.The Canoe centre committee have just told me there has been no loss of life that they are aware or heard of.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 09, 2019, 01:40:23 PM
Mates 94yr old old man refuses to leave his house at Laurieton... all the neighbours and his street have left...
stubbon old ****
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on November 09, 2019, 04:52:28 PM
Its heartbreaking for people loosing their house etc but surely in the future they must start looking at making these areas more fire proof with burn offs.

Mark
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 09, 2019, 05:01:57 PM
WARNING.......EXTREME LANGUAGE.

This bloke is 100% correct.Its high time the shiny arse's in canberra and those water melon greens stepped aside and let the local councils,along with the local RFS maintain areas around towns with winter time burn off's.
https://www.facebook.com/paul.bailey.7777019/videos/2358051624306587/ (https://www.facebook.com/paul.bailey.7777019/videos/2358051624306587/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 09, 2019, 05:06:41 PM
WARNING.......EXTREME LANGUAGE.

This bloke is 100% correct.Its high time the shiny arse's in canberra and those water melon greens stepped aside and let the local councils,along with the local RFS maintain areas around towns with winter time burn off's.
https://www.facebook.com/paul.bailey.7777019/videos/2358051624306587/ (https://www.facebook.com/paul.bailey.7777019/videos/2358051624306587/)

(http://oels.byu.edu/student/idioms/idioms/images/hit_nail_on_head.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 09, 2019, 05:12:42 PM
Its heartbreaking for people losing their house etc but surely in the future they must start looking at making these areas more fire proof with burn offs.

Mark
I agree Mark.
This year we have received about 400m of rain, where as normaly it would be closer to 2000m.
We have a situation where people complain when there is the oppitunatey in winter, they are effected by the smoke.
I know RFS captains who can't believe the red tape involved in burning off,
I also have spoken NPWS employees who are dumb founded by the dicissions of their organisation.
Forestry are bound by regs and resources.
Then you have Green councilors, who some how hog tie councils.

 Al, chime in mate.
You have your views, cheers mate.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 09, 2019, 05:36:26 PM
Quote from: Hairs
I know RFS captains who can't believe the red tape involved in burning off,
I remember it well... the excuses, the paperwork, the planning that goes into a planned hazard reduction only to be Shit canned by some office boy
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 09, 2019, 05:50:13 PM
I remember it well... the excuses, the paperwork, the planning that goes into a planned hazard reduction only to be Shit canned by some office boy
Everything is stopped by the Greens.Time those airheads were considered dead and buried before the rest of the population is.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on November 09, 2019, 05:53:06 PM
Yet when traditional owners do seasonal burns within their country they are praised for helping the ecology??
Go figure.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 09, 2019, 05:58:09 PM
I remember it well... the excuses, the paperwork, the planning that goes into a planned hazard reduction only to be Shit canned by some office boy
The pencil pushers, the green element has played their part, but it's this bloody correct world we have to live in these days.
You can't tell someone you have to deal with it, this what is going to happen.
And of cause, every numpty wants their 10 seconds of fame.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on November 09, 2019, 06:16:20 PM
Here in WA we still do prescibed burns. I just dont understand why it isnt done in the east, especially seeing how much more vunerable you are.
Any hows, just hoping everyone stays safe, it looks like its going to be a long summer.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 09, 2019, 06:25:28 PM
Here in WA we still do prescibed burns. I just dont understand why it isnt done in the east, especially seeing how much more vunerable you are.
Any hows, just hoping everyone stays safe, it looks like its going to be a long summer.
It is going to be a long Summer.
There is no forecast of rain for some time.
Clarence Valley has just gone to level 4 water restrictions.
Even tho our Dam is at 90%?
I believe this is due to infrastructure being damaged from fires.

 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 09, 2019, 06:39:42 PM
Yet when traditional owners do seasonal burns within their country they are praised for helping the ecology??
Go figure.
This x every number in the universe
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Raym on November 09, 2019, 08:08:40 PM
Everything is stopped by the Greens.Time those airheads were considered dead and buried before the rest of the population is.

Not so mate apparently it is the PM's fault, heard this while I was in the shed & just had to check. This is from Adam Bandt's twitter.

 "I’m deeply saddened by the loss of life. Hearts go out to all affected & to brave firefighters.

But words & concern are not enough.

The PM does not have the climate emergency under control.

Unless we lead a global effort to quit coal & cut pollution, more lives will be lost."

Amazing
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on November 09, 2019, 08:18:40 PM
 Even if climate change is the cause of the fires what can we do to control, reduce and address the intensity of fires?

Reduce fuel loads will go along way.
I have attached a submission to the NSW parliament regarding the RFS operating model, now if you read beyond the pros and cons of the RFS you will get a valuable lesson on fuel loads.

https://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/lcdocs/submissions/58450/0090%20Mr%20Brian%20Williams.pdf



Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 09, 2019, 09:45:01 PM
I agree Mark.
This year we have received about 400m of rain, where as normaly it would be closer to 2000m.
We have a situation where people complain when there is the oppitunatey in winter, they are effected by the smoke.
I know RFS captains who can't believe the red tape involved in burning off,
I also have spoken NPWS employees who are dumb founded by the dicissions of their organisation.
Forestry are bound by regs and resources.
Then you have Green councilors, who some how hog tie councils.

 Al, chime in mate.
You have your views, cheers mate.



How times have changed.   My old man was on the family farm from 1930 till 1995 when he retired.   Back then the Volunteer Fireies was you and your neighbours helping one another.  when conditions were right ie no wind, good humidity etc the ridge lines were routinely burnt.  All cool burns low fuel and minimal fire damage done. 

The RFS then became more structured and no longer involved your neighbours.  If not an RFS member, you were not welcome.  That didn't go down well.  From 20-30 blokes at a fire to maybe 10. 

Now days to get a Prescribed Burn it is more a case to go through every reason not to burn and do ever other course of action to remove or reduce 'hazard' or fuel load.  As I say, it is more about ticking boxes not to burn. 

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/13322/Standards-for-Low-Intensity-Bush-Fire-Hazard-Reduction-Burning.pdf

or just look at second last page

CHECKLIST FOR LOW INTENSITY HAZARD
REDUCTION BURNING
PRIOR TO BURNING MAKE SURE YOU HAVE:
£ Obtained an environmental approval such as a Bush Fire Hazard Reduction Certificate
(See “Before You Light That Fire”)
£ Obtained a Fire Permit (See “Before You Light That Fire”)
£ Either :
? Selected the appropriate season and weather conditions having considered:
 Temperature
 Relative humidity
 Wind speed and direction
 Atmospheric stability
OR
? Contacted the RFS for a Forest Fire Danger Index (FFDI), determined your
fuel load, then cross checked with Table 1 to determine whether the chosen day is
suitable.
£ Made a map of burn site taking into consideration:
? Location of assets and control lines
? Direction of fire travel
? Areas of dry and moist fuel loads
? Most appropriate lighting patterns
? Placement of personnel during burn
 Safe escape routes
 Safety zones
£ Established control lines around the burn area including:
? Drainage structures if necessary
? Cleared areas under trees and around logs
£ Conducted a test burn
£ Notified all necessary parties:
? RFS (24 hours prior to burning, unless otherwise specified in your fire permit) or Fire
and Rescue NSW
? Neighbours (24 hours prior to burning, unless otherwise specified in your fire permit)
? RMS (if traffic control is necessary)
? Council (roads)
? Network provider for power lines
£ Checked to ensure it is not a Total Fire Ban day (See “Before You Light That Fire”)
£ Ensured that all personnel are familiar with details of the burn plan and adequately
prepared:
? Appropriate experience
? Protective clothing
? Food and water
? Awareness of safe burning procedures and first aid
£ Considered emergency procedures:
? Efficient communication system
? First Aid Kit
AT COMPLETION OF BURN MAKE SURE YOU HAVE:
£ Extinguished all necessary burning material
£ Returned the completion form from the Bush Fire Hazard Reduction Certificate

As for the BS that the Bushfires are a result of Climate Change, that is what it is.  BS.   We have a situation that is unprecedented.  We have had the weather (not climate) condition the same previously, nothing new there.   What we haven't had for the past 20 odd years is the lack of Fire Prevention Management.  20 years of fuel load is going to create bigger hotter bushfires.  Climate Change has SFA to do with it, poor management is the cause. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 10, 2019, 07:23:53 AM
Not so mate apparently it is the PM's fault, heard this while I was in the shed & just had to check. This is from Adam Bandt's twitter.

 "I’m deeply saddened by the loss of life. Hearts go out to all affected & to brave firefighters.

But words & concern are not enough.

The PM does not have the climate emergency under control.

Unless we lead a global effort to quit coal & cut pollution, more lives will be lost."

Amazing
'Nuff said.............
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Craig Tomkinson on November 10, 2019, 07:37:05 AM
You are spot on alnJan, The same thing happened to our Boreen Piont BFB started with locals farmers my dad was its leader oldest and by far the smartest man on fires in our area, we used old 135 and 35x ferges with carryalls and two 44s drum full of water or our 4wds as well, dad stepped down after many years then other farmers took on number one it ran for years and we never lost a house, there were no rules we just did what had to be done anybody that owed farms burnt off there timbered blocks and unstocked grass paddocks all the time through winter or in summer after rain and late at night not in the middle of the day, the rest of our district was forestry they were fantastic they burnt all the time as the ash made the timber grow and kept the fuel down, Then around the same time as you said the Government stepped in and wanted all of us volunteers have to get chain saw tickets and attend training sessions and be accredited on every bit of gear, it was bullShit all of us had cut timber all our lives and the gear we had to use we used every day on the farm, 90% of our members left in the first round and never helped at a fire again, All we said was make all the older one exempt and any new ones have to do the training, no they said it just stuffed nearly every BFB in our area, ours nearly shut the doors but I see its still going with just eough to make one crew, but the trouble is all the local knowage was gone when and how to burn al the tracks and nohow was left to townies that do not have a clue,and our forestry is now NPs that do not want to control burn now its just a time bomb waiting to for someone to light the fuse, After not being in the BFB for some time and selling our house at Cootharaba we moving to Cooroy I got a permit to burn a heap and asked about joining the local branch the number said I would have to do all the training again, I said what you have differant honda pumps and 4wds do they, no still the same just the rules,  Craig   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 10, 2019, 08:00:55 AM
You are spot on alnJan, The same thing happened to our Boreen Piont BFB started with locals farmers my dad was its leader oldest and by far the smartest man on fires in our area, we used old 135 and 35x ferges with carryalls and two 44s drum full of water or our 4wds as well, dad stepped down after many years then other farmers took on number one it ran for years and we never lost a house, there were no rules we just did what had to be done anybody that owed farms burnt off there timbered blocks and unstocked grass paddocks all the time through winter or in summer after rain and late at night not in the middle of the day, the rest of our district was forestry they were fantastic they burnt all the time as the ash made the timber grow and kept the fuel down, Then around the same time as you said the Government stepped in and wanted all of us volunteers have to get chain saw tickets and attend training sessions and be accredited on every bit of gear, it was bullShit all of us had cut timber all our lives and the gear we had to use we used every day on the farm, 90% of our members left in the first round and never helped at a fire again, All we said was make all the older one exempt and any new ones have to do the training, no they said it just stuffed nearly every BFB in our area, ours nearly shut the doors but I see its still going with just eough to make one crew, but the trouble is all the local knowage was gone when and how to burn al the tracks and nohow was left to townies that do not have a clue,and our forestry is now NPs that do not want to control burn now its just a time bomb waiting to for someone to light the fuse, Craig
"Government stepped in and made all of us be qualified". Yep,typical OH& S bullsit !! .Offered my set of hands  to the RFS this morning to lend a hand in anyway they see fit,only to be told i would have to go thru all the training before donning on a coat.Didnt know you had to be qualified to help out a fellow human being or neighbour in emergency times.And they wonder why the cant get help when needed?
Oh,by the way............ I was general land rescue, CABA qualified, engine keeper & motor driver certified with 12 years as retained firefighter.What would i know  ::)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 10, 2019, 08:48:13 AM
Even if climate change is the cause of the fires what can we do to control, reduce and address the intensity of fires?

Reduce fuel loads will go along way.
I have attached a submission to the NSW parliament regarding the RFS operating model, now if you read beyond the pros and cons of the RFS you will get a valuable lesson on fuel loads.

https://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/lcdocs/submissions/58450/0090%20Mr%20Brian%20Williams.pdf

That report pretty clearly spells it out.   The larger the fuel load the bigger the fire.  Unfortunately that is too simple and too straight forward for those that lack Commonsense to see or understand. 

I like a lot most of the Brigade I was in left for two reasons.  1/ we wanted to be RFS and do our job of keeping the Community safe by doing the Controlled Hazard Reduction Burns but never allowed and the only jobs was the odd call out to a car crash.  2/ Powers that be decided to close our Brigade, that was already covering two other Brigade areas due to lack of Volunteers and then expected us to join another Brigade that was predominantly a village Brigade and then really called on to do any thing as NSWFB attended any house fires. 

When you can't do what you joined for why be there just waiting for the inevitable Bushfire to come that you have always prevented. 


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 10, 2019, 12:19:09 PM
Quote from: MarkGU
Yep,typical OH& S bullsit !! .Offered my set of hands  to the RFS this morning to lend a hand in anyway they see fit,only to be told i would have to go thru all the training before donning on a coat.Didnt know you had to be qualified to help out a fellow human being or neighbour in emergency times.And they wonder why the cant get help when needed?
Oh,by the way............ I was general land rescue, CABA qualified, engine keeper & motor driver certified with 12 years as retained firefighter.What would i know  ::)

The rules are there to save everyone = the new person, and the experienced.. As you'd know Shit can go bad real fast on the fire ground really fast.. The training is there to save most peoples arses - the experienced people who have to save the nuffies..

Its interesting that only when there are insane fires like this people wanna stick up their hands... We had people turning up in their droves - telling us they were members of this RFS station and had 20 yrs experience when they didnt know what an AWG branch was. quick phone call to Rosehill at the time would prove they were full of Shit. You dont want people like that out in the field. You also dont know how people will react in a really code brown situation... You don't let novices hit the field on fires like these, its just asking for problems.

The numbers of people turning up at stations just expecting to be given keys to the truck and some PJs would shock you
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 10, 2019, 01:30:31 PM
Just reading this article this morning: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-10/victorians-in-rural-fringe-prepare-for-bushfire-season/11673826?WT.ac=statenews_vic (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-10/victorians-in-rural-fringe-prepare-for-bushfire-season/11673826?WT.ac=statenews_vic)

Vic not NSW, but the same thing applies - lot's of people moving out for a Tree Change don't have the faintest idea of fire safety :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 10, 2019, 01:52:08 PM
The rules are there to save everyone = the new person, and the experienced.. As you'd know Shit can go bad real fast on the fire ground really fast.. The training is there to save most peoples arses - the experienced people who have to save the nuffies..

Its interesting that only when there are insane fires like this people wanna stick up their hands... We had people turning up in their droves - telling us they were members of this RFS station and had 20 yrs experience when they didnt know what an AWG branch was. quick phone call to Rosehill at the time would prove they were full of Shit. You dont want people like that out in the field. You also dont know how people will react in a really code brown situation... You don't let novices hit the field on fires like these, its just asking for problems.

The numbers of people turning up at stations just expecting to be given keys to the truck and some PJs would shock you
Bird.
Did you not read the whole post?
Novices? Did you read the part about the 12 years experience??
I offered because the situation is at very critical stage, oh thats right, you've seen it 1 st up here.My apologizes.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Craig Tomkinson on November 10, 2019, 02:19:56 PM
Not bagging anyone who is in a BFB now, just saying what happened to ours, and looks like what happened to a lot of BFB over the years, ours went from around 40 active members to 4 in a mater of weeks and months. And they would only come to a fire if we were absolutely desperate, I have found the complete opposite on a couple occasions had one bloke who was our no 1 and was the fire warden for 30 years had the credentials as long your as your arm but was unpredictable and hopeless in the field, its why I gave it a away, I would rather work with a complete novice and teach him in the field what to do around a small bush fire than work with someone with an ego that thinks they no it all, and I gave it away because got sick of fighting fires for many days at a time along side blokes that were fully payed that did buggerall except drive up down on the black top, That did not sit well with me, thank firetruck the QLD laws have changed an urban boys can fight bush fires now, Craig
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on November 10, 2019, 03:33:22 PM
Just reading this article this morning: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-10/victorians-in-rural-fringe-prepare-for-bushfire-season/11673826?WT.ac=statenews_vic (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-10/victorians-in-rural-fringe-prepare-for-bushfire-season/11673826?WT.ac=statenews_vic)

Vic not NSW, but the same thing applies - lot's of people moving out for a Tree Change don't have the faintest idea of fire safety :'(

Why don’t they start doing the burn offs in some areas now.

I understand people need training and to follow the rules but if I turned up to offer my services to assist I would be happy to do anything to help. I know I would not have the experience to fight a major fire but maybe assist in other ways.

Mark


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 10, 2019, 03:53:45 PM
Why don’t they start doing the burn offs in some areas now.

I understand people need training and to follow the rules but if I turned up to offer my services to assist I would be happy to do anything to help. I know I would not have the experience to fight a major fire but maybe assist in other ways.

Mark

Mark

Weather conditions just not suitable along with the resources are not there to put a trainee on the fire ground.  Saying that where possible as a means of controlling the bushfire there are back burning operations being done to help burn the bushfire out.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 10, 2019, 05:44:02 PM


The rules are there to save everyone = the new person, and the experienced.

The numbers of people turning up at stations just expecting to be given keys to the truck and some PJs would shock you
Talking with a brirgrade captain yesterday, he said it overwhelming that people want to help,
But they need to go through the training, if they do have previous experience it means they will be certified easier to be able to be a valued member. 
At the moment they can help at the stations, until they gain their certification, then they can join crews.
Young Jack has his drivers license now, he will join our RFS and go through the training.




Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 10, 2019, 05:57:07 PM
Talking with a brirgrade captain yesterday, he said it overwhelming that people want to help,
But they need to go through the training, if they do have previous experience it means they will be certified easier to be able to be a valued member. 
At the moment they can help at the stations, until they gain their certification, then they can join crews.
Young Jack has his drivers license now, he will join our RFS and go through the training.

Yep as a former RFS member to rejoin I have to go through Training again and really that is the way it should be.  A fire ground is not the place to make mistakes. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on November 10, 2019, 07:03:58 PM
Sorry to be a party pooper but we all knew the conditions were going to be very bad this year for fires and yet nothing has been done to alleviate it. It seems alot of the knowlegable people just sit around and wait for it like they cannot wait for it to justify their jobs.

And now it's the poor firefighters that have to go through this plus the people who lose their homes. It happens every year and nothing is done.

Surely there are smart people out there that can foresee this. Maybe not.

Sorry to say all this but it's true. It's only going to get worse unfortunately due to the lack of foresight.

Mark
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 10, 2019, 07:09:09 PM
Completely agree Mark.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 10, 2019, 08:04:07 PM
Sorry to be a party pooper but we all knew the conditions were going to be very bad this year for fires and yet nothing has been done to alleviate it. It seems alot of the knowlegable people just sit around and wait for it like they cannot wait for it to justify their jobs.

And now it's the poor firefighters that have to go through this plus the people who lose their homes. It happens every year and nothing is done.

Surely there are smart people out there that can foresee this. Maybe not.

Sorry to say all this but it's true. It's only going to get worse unfortunately due to the lack of foresight.

Mark


The same as in Victoria.  I am sure someone from Victoria can give a more correct detail, but following whichever bushfire it was there was the Royal Commission.  Part of the Royal Commission was the reduction of fuel load, Controlled Hazard Reduction Burns, yet the State continually falls drastically short of it's Hazard Reduction Burns and continues to burn over the years.   NSW is just following their lead.   While ever the greenies/environmentalist continue to have their way with 'protecting' the environment with less or no Controlled Hazard Reduction Burns and the fuel load is allowed to continue to 'grow' we will continue to have bigger hotter bushfires with continued death and destruction. 

Fire needs three simple things, Oxygen, Heat and Fuel.  We can't do a great deal about reducing the oxygen level, we can't control the weather, despite what the Climate Changers say, that only leaves reducing the fuel load, that we can do something about. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 10, 2019, 08:09:58 PM



that only leaves reducing the fuel load, that we can do something about.

You are 10000000% correct mate.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: speewa158 on November 10, 2019, 08:26:06 PM
BUT  the 1/2 Wit Greens ask , Where will the beetles, lizards  & snakes live if you do a cool burn  ?
No Stuff it let the fuel load build up  ,,, let the intensity increase ,,, Rip it up the bush as the management has not been taken care of  . The Greens are sadly not on the Big Red Trucks on fire ground as they are sitting Safe in an apartment in town . Ordering a coffee  while others fight their fight  .………………………………………..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 10, 2019, 08:31:54 PM
And the right continue to decimate public services unless there is something in it for their mates to make some money from.

Chronic underinvestment in the National Parks staff levels to keep budgets balanced (and only investing in areas with high tourist numbers), a reliance on volunteers for fire response outside of the metropolitan areas and this is what starts to happen, all conspiring on working against being able to do anything.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on November 10, 2019, 09:17:33 PM
I was down in Yerranderie talking with the caretaker and he pointed out that all the forest through there is new growth. There are a few trees that are a few hundred years old, but even in the photos back at the turn of last century there were very few big trees, the place wasn't a forestry/logging area and no sign of mass ring barking or clearing.

The early explorers described it as grazing land and it was cattle country, by all accounts silver was discovered by some aboriginal stockmen putting in fence posts.

But now we don't have mosaic burning and the place is thick with 60-70 year old trees, there is hardly a blade of grass to be found and the few roos left get by with grazing on the camp ground and the air strip as that's all there is to eat.

Declaring a Wilderness area to protect the wild life is a nice idea, until it all goes up and all you have left is a scorched sterile wasteland. Then when it does rain you get alkaline sediment that kills whats survives in the creeks.

Plants can recover from a low intensity fire and animals can get out of the way, but what I saw up near Forster where the fire was hot and doing several km/h... not so much. Its going to take years for that ecosystem to recover.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 10, 2019, 09:54:26 PM
Quote from: alnjan
Yep as a former RFS member to rejoin I have to go through Training again and really that is the way it should be.  A fire ground is not the place to make mistakes

Even worse when you were a trainer but if things have changed since I left in teh late 90's so training would be a cakewalk, except BA these days, too unfit :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on November 11, 2019, 10:36:05 AM
Interesting view on fires from an experienced person....

https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/this-is-not-normal-what-s-different-about-the-nsw-mega-fires/ar-BBWxUfn?ocid=ob-fb-enau-307&fbclid=IwAR1hp-bg4q-BQaKr_QHxOZnma2nX9PnzD8ZDlqbXI5c7Q38aTu5O8OQrGjw
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 11, 2019, 07:14:02 PM
Interesting view on fires from an experienced person....

https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/this-is-not-normal-what-s-different-about-the-nsw-mega-fires/ar-BBWxUfn?ocid=ob-fb-enau-307&fbclid=IwAR1hp-bg4q-BQaKr_QHxOZnma2nX9PnzD8ZDlqbXI5c7Q38aTu5O8OQrGjw


And this one 

https://www.couriermail.com.au/technology/rural-firefighters-heartbreaking-plea/news-story/602b8b84c7092a232fd6fdceecb37f86?fbclid=IwAR33t1PMnC_xfPtRhxx7zkwXDxy5utSpVth500JG7_eIvJqwsMBaW6yCGLw
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 11, 2019, 07:20:23 PM
A local update for tomorrow.  Best advice they give is to be east of the Highway in a suburban area.  Not sure how that will go.

https://www.facebook.com/coffscouncil/photos/a.730174680478307/1435632606599174/?type=3&theater

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: vern on November 11, 2019, 08:02:09 PM
A local update for tomorrow.  Best advice they give is to be east of the Highway in a suburban area.  Not sure how that will go.

https://www.facebook.com/coffscouncil/photos/a.730174680478307/1435632606599174/?type=3&theater
It's going to be an interesting day. Hopefully it doesn't make it that far.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 11, 2019, 08:12:27 PM
It's going to be an interesting day. Hopefully it doesn't make it that far.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Yep we have packed some stuff in the caravan and wait and see what happens where and when as to which way we go or stay
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 11, 2019, 08:24:05 PM
A local update for tomorrow.  Best advice they give is to be east of the Highway in a suburban area.  Not sure how that will go.

https://www.facebook.com/coffscouncil/photos/a.730174680478307/1435632606599174/?type=3&theater
I would have thought anywhere green would be potential fire risk -0 infact, anywhere in any colour on the map
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 11, 2019, 08:37:27 PM
I would have thought anywhere green would be potential fire risk -0 infact, anywhere in any colour on the map

Yeah I think the eastern fire break will be tested again
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 11, 2019, 09:00:05 PM
The predicted fire zones keep bigger

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on November 11, 2019, 09:49:11 PM
I drove down to the central coast and back over the weekend, was pretty surreal on Friday going down with dark red skies for large sections of the trip down where we had to put our lights on.
I think we might have been the last car through before they shut the highway for Johns River on Sunday on the way north as well, the fire seemed a couple of hundred metres off to the east and a spot fire had just started on the western side of the highway, wasn't sure whether to be happy that we just made it through before the cop car parked in the middle of the road behind us, or to be nervous about what we were about to drive into. 


(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/7KEaj9Lpctf_MA0LffeZGthoT38C2CgC9a7B-mlVd-MeYJ6hjsuofMZPoSoa_68pahjfJF6euVSacTy3HMhb3KNr5pfhOgxvvgvnS6o9esQp6vxHI17d-M6pHOFR6M_juNsFU6natDA=w2400)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 12, 2019, 08:33:26 AM
Here's the latest from the RFS on the fire situation:
There are still 54 fires burning, 26 uncontained, and now 13 at a 'Watch and Act' alert level.
There have been no new fires yet, including in the catastrophic areas and around Sydney, but the fires on the North Coast are increasing in activity.


I think theres a bit of histeria involved here + media throwing some manure in there... I mean Sunrise only had 9 people "LIVE ON SCENE" this morning...

 but its probably a good thing to put the wind up some people... mates dad is still bolted in his living room at Laurieton refusing to leave.
but heard something on the radio this mornin that its now a law or the cops have the power to force you to go and you dont, you get arrested... maybe a good thing.

Dont hang around, GTFO early.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on November 12, 2019, 08:44:41 AM
The predicted fire zones keep bigger

I have to drive from Newcastle to Brisbane on Thursday and back Sunday... guessing I'm not going via the Pacific hway.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: vern on November 12, 2019, 08:59:41 AM
The hysteria is more than likely about today's weather pattern, as the crow flies, the fires at glenreagh are 20km away (woolgoolga), between it and us is all dense dry bush, with strong NW winds increasing, it's a huge concern. At the moment I have from my place about a 300m visibility range due to smoke.
Worst of all, I only have 4 beers left in the fridge!

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 12, 2019, 09:47:24 AM
Quote from: vern
... between it and us is all dense dry bush, with strong NW winds increasing, it's a huge concern. At the moment I have from my place about a 300m visibility range due to smoke.
Worst of all, I only have 4 beers left in the fridge!

Take the opportunity to go for a safe drive to a bottle shop in a safe zone :)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: vern on November 12, 2019, 10:26:12 AM
Take the opportunity to go for a safe drive to a bottle shop in a safe zone :)
I will take this advice very seriously and respond to it asap

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 12, 2019, 12:59:45 PM
Be careful Hairy one.


Two more emergency warnings issued
By Natassia Chrysanthos

Two new emergency warnings have been issued for the Clarence Valley area, just north of Coffs Harbour and Armidale. This brings the total emergency warnings to seven.

The Liberation Trail fire has been described as a "large fire with a large perimeter" near Armidale Road, Coutts Crossing, Nymbodia and Glenreagh. The second fire in Washpool State Forest runs near Redbank Road in Coombadjha.

"Under forecast weather conditions on Tuesday, these fires will spread quickly towards the coast," the RFS says. "The fire may impact on the areas of Woolgoolga, outskirts of Coffs Harbour, Sawtell and surrounding areas. If you are in the area of Nana Glen or Coramba and surrounding area, leave now towards Coffs Harbour. Do not wait."

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-qld-bushfires-live-rfs-continue-to-fight-blazes-across-state-as-greater-sydney-our-on-high-alert-state-of-emergency-declared-20191111-p539ma.html (https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-qld-bushfires-live-rfs-continue-to-fight-blazes-across-state-as-greater-sydney-our-on-high-alert-state-of-emergency-declared-20191111-p539ma.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 12, 2019, 01:51:13 PM
Take the opportunity to go for a safe drive to a bottle shop in a safe zone :)
Done and dusted,
Enjoying a few cold ales atm.
Cheers for the advice,
Love ya work.
Cheers
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 12, 2019, 02:26:40 PM
Just saw this mentioned: https://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/alerts/alerts-list (https://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/alerts/alerts-list)

Stay safe out there, everybody.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 12, 2019, 03:27:16 PM
The hysteria is more than likely about today's weather pattern, as the crow flies, the fires at glenreagh are 20km away (woolgoolga), between it and us is all dense dry bush, with strong NW winds increasing, it's a huge concern. At the moment I have from my place about a 300m visibility range due to smoke.
Worst of all, I only have 4 beers left in the fridge!

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Yep so far today the wind change hasn't happened.  Sitting at home after taking a loaded van and bride into our Son's place in Coffs.   Nice northeasterly gently blowing while I do a few things.  Just had our first charred leaf fall but the bride said they are having ash fall in Coffs.  Might be different when or if the change comes through and the winds pick up and swing to the east with a strong Southwesterly. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 12, 2019, 03:29:54 PM
Yep so far today the wind change hasn't happened.  Sitting at home after taking a loaded van and bride into our Son's place in Coffs.   Nice northeasterly gently blowing while I do a few things.  Just had our first charred leaf fall but the bride said they are having ash fall in Coffs.  Might be different when or if the change comes through and the winds pick up and swing to the east with a strong Southwesterly.
There coming :(


'There have been winds of 80kph in the upper Hunter region, and 70kph in the Blue Mountains.'
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 12, 2019, 03:54:20 PM
There coming :(


'There have been winds of 80kph in the upper Hunter region, and 70kph in the Blue Mountains.'

Yep there was talk we were supposed to get them at Coffs about midday pushing the fires east.  At present the winds are 30km/h from the NNE according to the BOM at the Coffs harbour airport.  This has pushed the fire from Glenreagh to Nana Glen and on to Coramba west of Coffs Harbour. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 12, 2019, 05:41:35 PM
Would just like to give a big shout to Swaggers that have, contacted, phoned, member messaged or asked how other members are at this time.
It's not the time to name names,
I would like to say Thank you.
Watching each others backs, is family.


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 12, 2019, 06:47:23 PM
Now Natio's turn :( Hopefully its only near the turnoff, not inside the park


Sutherland shire fire at watch and act

A fire in the Sutherland Shire is burning out of control, with the Rural Fire Service upgrading the alert level to 'watch and act'.

The fire is burning at Farnell Avenue in Loftus.

Four crews on scene with more in way. They haven’t been able to determine size of fire but the southerly change will be pushing it north, towards Acacia Road and Bollard Street.. No one being evacuated as of yet.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 12, 2019, 09:16:59 PM
Yep there was talk we were supposed to get them at Coffs about midday pushing the fires east.  At present the winds are 30km/h from the NNE according to the BOM at the Coffs harbour airport.  This has pushed the fire from Glenreagh to Nana Glen and on to Coramba west of Coffs Harbour.

Talking to a mate at Glenreagh and the front is now expected between 3 and 4am in the morning.  Tomorrow could be what today was supposed to be if the change is strong enough.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: vern on November 12, 2019, 09:31:40 PM
Talking to a mate at Glenreagh and the front is now expected between 3 and 4am in the morning.  Tomorrow could be what today was supposed to be if the change is strong enough.
Yes tomorrow could be interesting, schools are all still closed around Woopi area just in case

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 12, 2019, 09:46:20 PM
****in shoot em.

Quote
Dispatch from Nana Glen
Many of the last residents have decided to stay because of the threat of looters.

“You’ve got to protect your property,” said one man. “I’ve got too many animals.”

Police issued a warning about looters in the area earlier on Tuesday afternoon, with reports of at least three properties targeted by a group of males spotted in two utes
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on November 13, 2019, 08:08:51 AM
Interesting read from a a former fire chief, and he touches on why prescribed burning has been falling behind.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/this-is-not-normal-what-s-different-about-the-nsw-mega-fires-20191110-p5395e.html

Cheers Glen

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on November 13, 2019, 11:00:34 AM
Interesting read from a a former fire chief, and he touches on why prescribed burning has been falling behind.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/this-is-not-normal-what-s-different-about-the-nsw-mega-fires-20191110-p5395e.html

Cheers Glen

Not to dismiss what he says, but I also read it in the context that he is now also a councillor on the Climate Council https://www.climatecouncil.org.au/team/.

The reality is, is that any Australian government whether it be Lab, Lib or Grn can do sweet FA to effect GLOBAL climate change in any meaningful way, we are just too insignificant in the grand scheme of things. This doesn't mean I advocate for not doing our part, but realise that our government inaction has likely contributed an immeasurably insignificantly small amount to the current bushfire crisis, despite what those trying to politicise it will have you believe.

edit Should say I think he does a reasonable job of not politicising the current bushfires, unlike lots of other commentaries I have seen.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 13, 2019, 11:25:47 AM
Yes tomorrow could be interesting, schools are all still closed around Woopi area just in case

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Well the change finally came in some time after 3am.  Nice cool change with gusty southerly to southeast winds.  The winds have all but stopped again now and not much happening again.  BOM for Coffs Harbour has southerly winds at 20km/h.  For the immediate fires that is blowing most of them back onto burnt ground.  Still a number of homes were lost yesterday. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 13, 2019, 11:34:47 AM
****in shoot em.

Dispatch from Nana Glen
Many of the last residents have decided to stay because of the threat of looters.

“You’ve got to protect your property,” said one man. “I’ve got too many animals.”

Police issued a warning about looters in the area earlier on Tuesday afternoon, with reports of at least three properties targeted by a group of males spotted in two utes

One of the directives was if you are staying put your yellow bin out and if you have left, naturally take your bin in.  Made it easy for fireies and looters to see what houses were vacant. 

Some people don't deserve to be part of the Human Race. 


Going to be hot and dry for a while yet, part way into a drought cycle, going to be several more years till we are out of it.  Just another weather event to deal with. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 13, 2019, 03:05:47 PM
During a bout of insomnia last last night (thanks ribs...) I started to formulate a plan for pulling a couple of different datasets together to make up a (decent) composite set of data from a few different sources as I've found some that are good... but lack details...

So, a bit of work later, and I now have this:

http://arcg.is/0S08iL (http://arcg.is/0S08iL)

It does work in a mobile browser (Firefox and Chrome on my phone via 4G)

What does it do?

Well, it has the NSW RFS Feed on it and it also has the Geoscience Australia information on it for the Hotspots that are spotted by satellite (size and colour denote certainty and how recent), all on top of a NSW Topo map.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on November 13, 2019, 04:25:29 PM
During a bout of insomnia last last night (thanks ribs...) I started to formulate a plan for pulling a couple of different datasets together to make up a (decent) composite set of data from a few different sources as I've found some that are good... but lack details...

So, a bit of work later, and I now have this:

http://arcg.is/0S08iL (http://arcg.is/0S08iL)

It does work in a mobile browser (Firefox and Chrome on my phone via 4G)

What does it do?

Well, it has the NSW RFS Feed on it and it also has the Geoscience Australia information on it for the Hotspots that are spotted by satellite (size and colour denote certainty and how recent), all on top of a NSW Topo map.


Well done Ed.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 13, 2019, 05:00:21 PM
I have to drive from Newcastle to Brisbane on Thursday and back Sunday... guessing I'm not going via the Pacific hway.

I think you should be good that way now as the New England Highway and Thunderbolts Way are both closed (Bendemeer to Moonbi, and Walcha to Wauchope respectively)

I'd be checking just how much you really need to go...

edit: Local news has said the NEH might be open late morning tomorrow... I reckon Pacific Hwy is the best option...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on November 13, 2019, 07:01:04 PM
I think you should be good that way now as the New England Highway and Thunderbolts Way are both closed (Bendemeer to Moonbi, and Walcha to Wauchope respectively)

I'd be checking just how much you really need to go...

edit: Local news has said the NEH might be open late morning tomorrow... I reckon Pacific Hwy is the best option...

Thanks Ed, I was looking at it too. Probably head up to Grafton and pick my way through to Casino, Kyogle, sneak through Lions Rd and to Beaudesert.

As far as traveling goes, Qld fires mapping and warnings are just atrocious. How hard would it be to include a map and indicate where the fire actually is and the spread? They used to have a mobile app that was slightly better than nothing, but that has been discontinued, just in time for the fire season too BTW.
It only shows the point of origin and assumes way to much local knowledge, so too bad for travelers that can't cross reference with google.

Compare this pathetic attempt with what the NSW RFS have put together:   

https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx (https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx)

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/fires-near-me (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/fires-near-me)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 13, 2019, 08:25:41 PM
Thanks Ed, I was looking at it too. Probably head up to Grafton and pick my way through to Casino, Kyogle, sneak through Lions Rd and to Beaudesert.

As far as traveling goes, Qld fires mapping and warnings are just atrocious. How hard would it be to include a map and indicate where the fire actually is and the spread? They used to have a mobile app that was slightly better than nothing, but that has been discontinued, just in time for the fire season too BTW.
It only shows the point of origin and assumes way to much local knowledge, so too bad for travelers that can't cross reference with google.

Compare this pathetic attempt with what the NSW RFS have put together:   

https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx (https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx)

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/fires-near-me (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/fires-near-me)

When I un-break my ArcGIS account, I'll put a QLD map together as well - if you look at the one I have made for NSW, I've pulled in data from GeoScience Australia's Hotspot Mapping system (https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/ (https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/)), so that shows the detected heat in the last 72hrs; this would at least enable you to have some idea as to where the fire fronts are... I've just quickly dropped it into Google Earth, along with the GA Hotspot points, and it does show reasonably well, so I should have something workable soon. BUT the QLD feed only refreshes every 30minutes, so might not be the most accurate.

---------

We've just been out as a friend heading to the other side of town said they could see flames over our way, and the RFS map and App had a fire 5.5km away from us.

Turns out that it was the Carrai fire, 55km from where they'd seen it and 45km from us. At the time, there was nothing else on the RFS pages or anything telling us that. I kept having a look at the map on my phone as we headed out and was happy that it was the Carrai fire we could just see, as that was the only bit picked up by the GA Hotspot map.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Rodt on November 14, 2019, 06:52:42 AM
Thanks Ed, I was looking at it too. Probably head up to Grafton and pick my way through to Casino, Kyogle, sneak through Lions Rd and to Beaudesert.

As far as traveling goes, Qld fires mapping and warnings are just atrocious. How hard would it be to include a map and indicate where the fire actually is and the spread? They used to have a mobile app that was slightly better than nothing, but that has been discontinued, just in time for the fire season too BTW.
It only shows the point of origin and assumes way to much local knowledge, so too bad for travelers that can't cross reference with google.

Compare this pathetic attempt with what the NSW RFS have put together:   

https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx (https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx)

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/fires-near-me (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/fires-near-me)

All the trucks seem to be coming our way going North to Qld. Pretty easy run (heaps of 110km roadway) up the Kamilaroi to Goondiwindi and then across to Bris etc.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 14, 2019, 07:42:30 AM
Thanks Ed, I was looking at it too. Probably head up to Grafton and pick my way through to Casino, Kyogle, sneak through Lions Rd and to Beaudesert.

ATM, Mt Lindesay Hwy is closed at Rathdowney heading South, but Lions Rd appears to be OK

Quote
As far as traveling goes, Qld fires mapping and warnings are just atrocious ... It only shows the point of origin and assumes way to much local knowledge,

I agree with you entirely ::) As you say, it's apparently all based on the original position of any fire, & all subsequent reports refer to that position, so that you have the fire that destroyed Binna Burra listed as Sarabah, 20k away!

& that fire ???, has apparently now flared up again, but it's showing the original location & date, but they refer to a spot south of Binna Burra, even further away ???

https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx (https://www.ruralfire.qld.gov.au/map/Pages/default.aspx)

I'll put a QLD map together as well - if you look at the one I have made for NSW, I've pulled in data from GeoScience Australia's Hotspot Mapping system (https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/ (https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/)), so that shows the detected heat in the last 72hrs; this would at least enable you to have some idea as to where the fire fronts are...

Thanks, Ed - awesome work :cup:

The problem I have with these 2 sites is that they don't match up ???

As above, there's supposedly 3 fires in teh GC Hinterland, but Sentinal only shows 1 ???

https://sentinel.ga.gov.au/#/?utm_source=promotion&utm_medium=homepage&utm_content=Sentinel&utm_campaign=Online-Tools (https://sentinel.ga.gov.au/#/?utm_source=promotion&utm_medium=homepage&utm_content=Sentinel&utm_campaign=Online-Tools)


Tried to show links to the maps but they won't copy at zoomed level :-[
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 15, 2019, 07:22:09 AM
& there you go :D

On the news last night, apparently Qld Firies are complaining that they don't have access to decent maps showing where fires are, as they reckon the Qld RFB map is useless, so they use the WA map https://myfirewatch.landgate.wa.gov.au/ (https://myfirewatch.landgate.wa.gov.au/) (Looks a lot like your work, Ed ???)

Our Dear Leader, Ana Phylaxis, then got up to say they don't know what they're talking about as Qld has the best firies, best resources & best maps in the World!

Cut to one of the QFES top brass who explained that they have fantastic maps in use, but they aren't accessible by the general public, as they're so detailed, you have to be trained specifically in how to read them ::)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 15, 2019, 07:50:35 AM
& there you go :D

On the news last night, apparently Qld Firies are complaining that they don't have access to decent maps showing where fires are, as they reckon the Qld RFB map is useless, so they use the WA map https://myfirewatch.landgate.wa.gov.au/ (https://myfirewatch.landgate.wa.gov.au/) (Looks a lot like your work, Ed ???)

Our Dear Leader, Ana Phylaxis, then got up to say they don't know what they're talking about as Qld has the best firies, best resources & best maps in the World!

Cut to one of the QFES top brass who explained that they have fantastic maps in use, but they aren't accessible by the general public, as they're so detailed, you have to be trained specifically in how to read them ::)

I'd say 99% they're using the same data source, just made nice

Landgate has really good spatial bits and pieces which does make it easier
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 15, 2019, 03:18:47 PM
I've been watching this fire for a few days now, it started in tbe Washpool State Forest, it has burnt nearly 60000ha.
https://sentinel.ga.gov.au/#/
Wind has picked up, pushing it SE, which is only 26km's from Lawrence.
There are also many farms, homes in this country.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191115/ce59cf29c8a6a78af57bd04e4111c087.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 15, 2019, 04:11:57 PM
I've been watching this fire for a few days now, it started in tbe Washpool State Forest, it has burnt nearly 60000ha.
https://sentinel.ga.gov.au/#/
Wind has picked up, pushing it SE, which is only 26km's from Lawrence.
There are also many farms, homes in this country.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191115/ce59cf29c8a6a78af57bd04e4111c087.jpg)

That's the source for the dots on my map, it's just people don't know about that one so this put them together.

Went on the university Twitter feed the other day, on top of on here, Facebook and LinkedIn.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 15, 2019, 05:32:58 PM
That's the source for the dots on my map, it's just people don't know about that one so this put them together.

Went on the university Twitter feed the other day, on top of on here, Facebook and LinkedIn.
The air is thick with smoke here in Lawrence, partially burnt gum leaves are falling.
I hope those that live there are well prepared.
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: JusyApples on November 16, 2019, 06:20:57 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191115/3d56ad25afe42882595b17465351dff4.jpg)

Damn climate change causing fires again


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 16, 2019, 08:01:33 AM
"Back burn for the protection of a cannabis crop"

How much strife are you in now ??? >:D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: bmwfreak on November 16, 2019, 08:04:05 AM
Maybe one of the few allowed to grow for medicinal purposes >:D >:D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: JusyApples on November 16, 2019, 09:30:30 AM
Some people are just brain dead. I read the other day that at least 3 people have been given large fines for breaching the fire ban this week. Who knows how many weren’t caught.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on November 16, 2019, 09:38:55 AM
Some people are just brain dead. I read the other day that at least 3 people have been given large fines for breaching the fire ban this week. Who knows how many weren’t caught.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

To be fair, a lot of people don't listen to the radio or TV, and a lot of "new" Australians in cities have no idea !!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 16, 2019, 10:42:39 AM
"Back burn for the protection of a cannabis crop"

How much strife are you in now ??? >:D

Maybe one of the few allowed to grow for medicinal purposes >:D >:D

From what I've heard today, the fire just scraped someone we knows property, they saved the shed and the house though.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on November 16, 2019, 12:14:46 PM
I sent a strongly worded letter to my local member complaining about the quality of information available to the general public via the QLD RFS website.

I can see people being trapped or killed because the available mapping is that poor that you have no real idea of where the fire actually is and safe evacuation routes.

My letter has been forwarded to the relevant minister, lets see if I get considered reply.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 16, 2019, 02:48:28 PM
I sent a strongly worded letter to my local member complaining about the quality of information available to the general public via the QLD RFS website.

I can see people being trapped or killed because the available mapping is that poor that you have no real idea of where the fire actually is and safe evacuation routes.

My letter has been forwarded to the relevant minister, lets see if I get considered reply.
expect a form letter with your name in a different font
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 16, 2019, 03:26:38 PM
I sent a strongly worded letter to my local member complaining about the quality of information available to the general public via the QLD RFS website.

I can see people being trapped or killed because the available mapping is that poor that you have no real idea of where the fire actually is and safe evacuation routes.

My letter has been forwarded to the relevant minister, lets see if I get considered reply.


Give this a go:
http://arcg.is/1PjK9 (http://arcg.is/1PjK9)

As you've already said, the QLD fire information data contextualisation is a problem, this might help a bit.

In 2 days, my NSW map has had over 2,000 visits, has made it onto the University's official Twitter feed and has quite a few people using it to supplement what is already known.

When you read in the SMH that (https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/safety-in-numbers-as-a-horror-fire-season-looms-firefighters-are-struggling-to-attract-new-volunteers-20191115-p53avi.html)
Quote
“We’re in the best position up here because we can spot fires and helicopters overhead,” says Helen Rushton, who together with husband Owen runs a 60-acre hobby farm, raising some livestock, fruit and vegetables. The couple, in their 50s, have also been monitoring weather maps and radar but have “given up” on the RFS Fires Near Me app.

“You get a warning saying the fire is in your area, but you open the app and you go ‘where the hell is it?’ The Kian Road fire threatened [nine areas] but doesn't tell you whether its burning down the front, up the back, to the left or right,”
Helen says.
(my bolding)

It's a reassuring validation that your stuff is going to do the job...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 16, 2019, 05:45:03 PM
https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-13/nsw-bushfires-conditions-set-to-continue-expert/11698322?pfmredir=sm&fbclid=IwAR1tVGSDqnv0X-hih0vgPz-5GF5j6RdkTg7nogYpuDKOwYAY1sE7zwv6IgY

NSW Police have charged two men with stealing firefighting equipment during Tuesday's bushfire crisis, as they probe several "suspicious" blazes around the state.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 16, 2019, 06:02:11 PM
https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-13/nsw-bushfires-conditions-set-to-continue-expert/11698322?pfmredir=sm&fbclid=IwAR1tVGSDqnv0X-hih0vgPz-5GF5j6RdkTg7nogYpuDKOwYAY1sE7zwv6IgY

NSW Police have charged two men with stealing firefighting equipment during Tuesday's bushfire crisis, as they probe several "suspicious" blazes around the state.
Christ there are some scum that walk among us.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 16, 2019, 07:43:49 PM
Christ there are some scum that walk among us.

The lady at the end sums it up well

https://www.facebook.com/7NEWSsydney/videos/729977397506859/?__tn__=kCH-R&eid=ARBGDaVCpFsJ1obqz4HwmTRHLau7H13OTp-Feht6SRKSAeCpfv8L1tjVgkgyGEVbhIi3JES4DY1dkK62&hc_ref=ARQVutRwxJQC_mFZ9cjxsBvU5CMldMr8IQwxS-JJvGwyO5CSU7yKscz0sgprnVaopAo&fref=nf&__xts__[0]=68.ARBBys1TL3FC3MFbfb56b99GJuQkGhrIi2wKm8q_65AVlMwaJZu4wZbOElWYiG2fAhE3DvSi8fH68fgvCbnwwOPE6ZnekstizoJKiYN9GLckAKKuhfu80koomige6pkyzISr1GhUYGLy9NcuazwnzPQFrTCJ9jyH6-JJgwgqy3Lg_qjTZbIY061OIcqBi61sKBTXSf-B7Hhy-I_wY4yqyO7LyC9Z25v-uQFEQ8HKCvluh7hAaN8uxZn5e96gFQt3RX-6AgmI4qWKgVWzYieBQYha9OonT4gU69lFBrXVeKyaxb6to-lQ54CxOmb8piBDfrp9uxdDpCxi1135YFdSi5dsbWQWKoamxEc
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: JusyApples on November 16, 2019, 09:22:12 PM
To be fair, a lot of people don't listen to the radio or TV, and a lot of "new" Australians in cities have no idea !!
But really when it’s a 30 degree day, it’s dry and windy, do you really need to be told not to light a fire? Common sense..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 17, 2019, 07:19:10 AM
A bit of a worry with the forecasted weather not helping Fireries , if these two fires meet, thst's alot of country and homes in this area.
The country between Banyabba, Bundjalung & Gibbagee, is tinder dry.
I working on a property near Tabbimobile two months ago, there are homes on ten ha blocks everywhere. Normally the country is mosquito infested, didn't notice one.
Yesterday, I thought I haven't seen a Mozzie for ages.
 
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191116/e6a7bc5080cf395f6151fb6229061e96.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 17, 2019, 08:29:03 AM


The lady at the end sums it up.
I read a comment, can't find it now, but some said, 'They live surrounded by bush, they need to deal with it'
FM, some people just have no idea or empathy.
Talking with a couple of RFS guys, they said you couldn't prepare for these fire storms,They still lost property that were prepared.

A nut case of a woman in town here, arguing in a FB group why she isn't allowed to have a fire in her back yard, yet the cane farmers can still burn.
She doesn't understand Her yard is a fire hazard, 3 foot tall grass, dead bushes, trees over hanging the house/sheds,  paper and rubbish across the yard, and it's a Vermin  haven.
How did we get to where some people believe such crap. :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on November 17, 2019, 08:53:22 AM
The lady at the end sums it up well

https://www.facebook.com/7NEWSsydney/videos/729977397506859/?__tn__=kCH-R&eid=ARBGDaVCpFsJ1obqz4HwmTRHLau7H13OTp-Feht6SRKSAeCpfv8L1tjVgkgyGEVbhIi3JES4DY1dkK62&hc_ref=ARQVutRwxJQC_mFZ9cjxsBvU5CMldMr8IQwxS-JJvGwyO5CSU7yKscz0sgprnVaopAo&fref=nf&__xts__[0]=68.ARBBys1TL3FC3MFbfb56b99GJuQkGhrIi2wKm8q_65AVlMwaJZu4wZbOElWYiG2fAhE3DvSi8fH68fgvCbnwwOPE6ZnekstizoJKiYN9GLckAKKuhfu80koomige6pkyzISr1GhUYGLy9NcuazwnzPQFrTCJ9jyH6-JJgwgqy3Lg_qjTZbIY061OIcqBi61sKBTXSf-B7Hhy-I_wY4yqyO7LyC9Z25v-uQFEQ8HKCvluh7hAaN8uxZn5e96gFQt3RX-6AgmI4qWKgVWzYieBQYha9OonT4gU69lFBrXVeKyaxb6to-lQ54CxOmb8piBDfrp9uxdDpCxi1135YFdSi5dsbWQWKoamxEc

This may be easier.

https://www.facebook.com/7NEWSsydney/videos/729977397506859/?__tn__=kCH-R&eid=ARBGDaVCpFsJ1obqz4HwmTRHLau7H13OTp-Feht6SRKSAeCpfv8L1tjVgkgyGEVbhIi3JES4DY1dkK62&hc_ref=ARQVutRwxJQC_mFZ9cjxsBvU5CMldMr8IQwxS-JJvGwyO5CSU7yKscz0sgprnVaopAo&fref=nf (https://www.facebook.com/7NEWSsydney/videos/729977397506859/?__tn__=kCH-R&eid=ARBGDaVCpFsJ1obqz4HwmTRHLau7H13OTp-Feht6SRKSAeCpfv8L1tjVgkgyGEVbhIi3JES4DY1dkK62&hc_ref=ARQVutRwxJQC_mFZ9cjxsBvU5CMldMr8IQwxS-JJvGwyO5CSU7yKscz0sgprnVaopAo&fref=nf)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on November 17, 2019, 09:15:34 AM
I read a comment, can't find it now, but some said, 'They live surrounded by bush, they need to deal with it'
FM, some people just have no idea or empathy.
Talking with a couple of RFS guys, they said you couldn't prepare for these fire storms,They still lost property that were prepared.

A nut case of a woman in town here, arguing in a FB group why she isn't allowed to have a fire in her back yard, yet the cane farmers can still burn.
She doesn't understand Her yard is a fire hazard, 3 foot tall grass, dead bushes, trees over hanging the house/sheds,  paper and rubbish across the yard, and it's a Vermin  haven.
How did we get to where some people believe such crap. :(


And yet we have sugar cane farms still burning their crops with ash falling kilometers away from the fields.  This on a day of fire bans in the Cairns region.  The excuse....we had permits.  FFS ..what do these f wits use for brains..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 17, 2019, 09:41:05 AM
Bigfish,
Please correct my if I'm wrong,
In the Clarence valley I believe there has never been a cane fire, even in a total fire ban that has escaped the controlled area and caused damaged. Yes the paddock next the one being burnt has had to be burnt and harvested.
These guys are very well experienced in this practice.
They are not some numpty that has only ever lite a camp fire, these guys are 3rd/4th generation farmers, but what would they know?
Have you stood and watched a cane burn?
I've watched 100's, they are skilled in their craft.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 17, 2019, 10:21:17 AM

And yet we have sugar cane farms still burning their crops with ash falling kilometers away from the fields.  This on a day of fire bans in the Cairns region.  The excuse....we had permits.  FFS ..what do these f wits use for brains..
Cane farmers even on days where there is no fire restrictions WONT burn where there is wind involved.Cane fires create their own wind when they burn.Cane farmers are not going to burn on those days where we had severe winds. They just wont risk their livelihood by burning in such conditions.
PS.yes, i have worked in the cane industry and have fire up cane fields as a part of that employment. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on November 17, 2019, 10:51:32 AM
Weve had the Black Snow here recently too ..
Farmers are fairly restricted and controled with their  burns, only burning small or larger sections at a time when conditions allow, and there is usualy a decent buffer from other combustables ...
Also from what I gather the ash material  being so light and thin burns out quickly / dosnt hold heat  and continue  burning like heavier tree  embers do .
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 17, 2019, 10:52:08 AM
Give this a go:
http://arcg.is/1PjK9 (http://arcg.is/1PjK9)

As you've already said, the QLD fire information data contextualisation is a problem, this might help a bit.



Thanks Ed.

So where QFES shows fire data at an area, but there is no hotspot shown, what does that mean ???
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 17, 2019, 10:59:00 AM
Thanks Ed.

So where QFES shows fire data at an area, but there is no hotspot shown, what does that mean ???
This maybe of some use.
https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 17, 2019, 11:33:22 AM
Thanks Ed.

So where QFES shows fire data at an area, but there is no hotspot shown, what does that mean ???
This maybe of some use.
https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/ (https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/)

That's the source of the hotspot data, so their explanations are better than I could ever manage.

If there's no hotspots from the last 72hrs I'd say they're just damping down.

One of the good things with the QLD info is that they at least give you idea of the size of the response and how many are there or in the way.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 17, 2019, 11:43:50 AM


This maybe of some use.
https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/ (https://hotspots.dea.ga.gov.au/)


That's the source of the hotspot data, so their explanations are better than I could ever manage.

If there's no hotspots from the last 72hrs I'd say they're just damping down.

One of the good things with the QLD info is that they at least give you idea of the size of the response and how many are there or in the way.

Another useful tool along the sane lines.
This shows the age of the fire.
https://sentinel.ga.gov.au/#/
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 17, 2019, 01:01:49 PM

Another useful tool along the sane lines.
This shows the age of the fire.
https://sentinel.ga.gov.au/#/ (https://sentinel.ga.gov.au/#/)

Just had a quick look - Sentinel shows the age of the fire, whilst the Digital Earth Australia shows the age and the confidence of the detection.

I've dropped Sentinel in as well, so people can choose between the 2. It still defaults to the DEA ones first, but you can switch that layer on easily enough.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 17, 2019, 01:27:34 PM
I flick between several links, each has it's purpose.
The Windy app is also useful.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 18, 2019, 08:26:48 AM
https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/in-devastated-nymboida-dark-humour-keeps-residents-going-20191118-p53bft.html (https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/in-devastated-nymboida-dark-humour-keeps-residents-going-20191118-p53bft.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 18, 2019, 09:12:09 AM
A good friend has just spent two days helping those effected in Nymboida.
She liked it to the black & white films of the Great War, completely void of any colour other than different shades of Black & Grey.
Our ex club president lives at Kangaroo Creek, I spoke with him yesterday, he said the same thing.
He also mentioned that the mapping of the fires(Fires Near Me App) is pretty well spot on,
They both mentioned that peoples spirits are high, they are thankful for all that they have and the support that they are receiving from strangers.
A friend has driven from Logan with a convoy of cars/4wd/trailers with feed for animals, live stock and supplies for people who have lost everything.
One trailer was full of baby wipes, because some have lost their water tanks.
Hmmm,
It's going to be long road for many.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on November 18, 2019, 02:06:34 PM
AND JUST WHEN YOU THOUGHT IT COULDNT GET ANY MORE RIDICULOUS....

'Lunacy': Thousands of firefighters could be banned
Sarah McPhee

The deadline is looming for Queensland Fire and Emergency Services volunteers to apply for a Blue Card to work with children.

Thousands of firefighters could reportedly be banned from battling blazes if they fail to get their applications in by December 1, 2019.

“Any QFES volunteer who is required to have a Blue Card, but refuses to apply for one, or is unable to hold a current Blue Card, will not be able to continue their role,” deputy commissioner John Bolger has told volunteers, The Courier Mail reports.

“As a member of the Rural Fire Service, you are likely to come into contact with children while performing your role, so are required to have a Blue Card. It is the law.’’

Picture: Rob Maccoll/AAP

The Rural Fire Brigades Association Queensland says "the lunacy of bureaucracy" will see 86 per cent of the 22,000 members sacked in the New Year "in Blue Card round 1".

The RFBAQ is calling on Queensland Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk to halt the Blue Card imposition.

"If 86 per cent of Rural Fire Brigade members aren’t complying with your policy, then the overwhelming majority of the brigade membership do not see that this as a requirement, rather a matter of choice," the RFBAQ said last month.

Only a quarter of the state's rural firefighters have reportedly applied.

Picture: Bronwyn Wheatcroft

According to the Queensland Government website, last updated on October 17, Queensland Ambulance Service and Queensland Police Service officers do not need a Blue Card if they are working within their professional capacity.

It states the working-with-children checks are required for anyone providing a "health service" at a place that requires physical contact with a child, or that is provided "while no one else is physically present".

Opposition emergency services spokesman, Lachlan Millar, said the state was facing a "mass exodus".

“If 18,000 rural firefighters hand their badges in over this then the lives of Queenslanders will be put at risk,” he said in a statement on October 23.

The Blue Card application is free for volunteers.

QFES has been contacted for comment.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: weeds on November 18, 2019, 02:58:17 PM
Crazy


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on November 18, 2019, 03:08:39 PM
My card application is being processed, they won't issue or even process PPE orders  without it.

It took a couple of hours as I'm out of the state and the QRFS didn't process the forms correctly, just forwarded them to the Bluecard processing centre, so they came back, then I had to chase down a JP as people that are employed by the federal government and deemed suitable to witness forms for them, aren't deemed suitable by the Qld Government ??? , so that took another couple of hours.

Anyway, I think it was something that seemed like a good idea in a committee, but does the grumpy old bugger from down the road that doesn't turn up to recruiting displays, fund raisers or talk to the public at all, but is willing to turn up to training, roll the truck out of the shed 2am and stand on the end of a hose for 12 hrs really need a blue card?

It wasn't a major inconvenience as my workshop is closing down so we're just packing stuff away and I have access to copier/scanner. But for others its a pain in the bum; scanning forms, getting suitable witnesses, posting stuff in, getting it sent back, and thats assuming that old mate that is an absolute work horse on the fire ground and has a wealth of experience to offer can actually read....

People volunteer to do this stuff in their spare time, they don't need to spend more of their spare time remaining compliant with rules that someone thought were a good idea at the time, yet most can't see adding to capability whatsoever, the more hurdles you put in front, the fewer could be bothered even turning up to the start line.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 18, 2019, 03:38:22 PM
My card application is being processed, they won't issue or even process PPE orders  without it.

It took a couple of hours as I'm out of the state and the QRFS didn't process the forms correctly, just forwarded them to the Bluecard processing centre, so they came back, then I had to chase down a JP as people that are employed by the federal government and deemed suitable to witness forms for them, aren't deemed suitable by the Qld Government ??? , so that took another couple of hours.

Anyway, I think it was something that seemed like a good idea in a committee, but does the grumpy old bugger from down the road that doesn't turn up to recruiting displays, fund raisers or talk to the public at all, but is willing to turn up to training, roll the truck out of the shed 2am and stand on the end of a hose for 12 hrs really need a blue card?

It wasn't a major inconvenience as my workshop is closing down so we're just packing stuff away and I have access to copier/scanner. But for others its a pain in the bum; scanning forms, getting suitable witnesses, posting stuff in, getting it sent back, and thats assuming that old mate that is an absolute work horse on the fire ground and has a wealth of experience to offer can actually read....

People volunteer to do this stuff in their spare time, they don't need to spend more of their spare time remaining compliant with rules that someone thought were a good idea at the time, yet most can't see adding to capability whatsoever, the more hurdles you put in front, the fewer could be bothered even turning up to the start line.

Yep.. its the sort of bullShit that turns people away.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: bmwfreak on November 18, 2019, 05:21:36 PM
It is total BS. If cardinals and the like can be pedifiles, why not the JP who signed off your eligibility for a blue card. The whole thing is built on a house of cards, ie PC gone mad ???
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on November 18, 2019, 05:29:49 PM
The JP is just signing that the documents you're providing as proof of your identity look legit, but the background check that follows only shows convictions.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on November 18, 2019, 05:53:43 PM
???
 ???
 ???

Just when you think it can't get worse.  :'(

What 2 bit snowflake numpty who obviously can't get a r00t, decided this would work???
And then when god forbid some wierdo freak does end up in the brigade, does he/she or whatever the hell frigged up made up crossed up gender "IT" thinks it is, accept liability cos their dip54it plan didn't actually work???

Far out, I need to go into recluse cos this is just doing my head in. >:(

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 18, 2019, 06:47:24 PM
WWC ( working with children check ) is a part of what i had to do with entering the Variety bash,as we work heavily with kids. Great that the government is trying to look after the kids welfare BUT............................

If someone who isnt known to police, hasnt been convicted and is inclined to want to interfere with kids can pass any WWC that is thrown at them.

See where i'm coming from?

Something to think about.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on November 18, 2019, 06:49:54 PM
WWC just means they havent been convicted of child abuse doesnt it?

Cheers Glen

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 18, 2019, 06:51:51 PM
WWC just means they havent been convicted of child abuse doesnt it?

Cheers Glen
Glen.

in a nut shell,yep.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on November 18, 2019, 07:06:15 PM
The working with children checks (Blue cards in QLD) are mandatory in any organisation that has anything to do with kids, schools, churches, boy scouts, charities, any organisation that has anything to do with kids is required for its employees and volunteers to have them done.

I doesn't stop those who haven't been caught from being involved, but any system where those who have been are then still allowed to have contact with kids is woefully deficient.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 18, 2019, 09:35:34 PM
For those of you wondering how the site of the 2013 National Meet faired from our recent fires............here is a link and a few words from the Canoe centre itself.

=68.ARB66rE8e7UUHUtoU9N6la6Ksf-v0ZRyhV-MeC-jGkLeuGJVeU_DPZlERF5sgswGFNAko645AYBGMEAlCBcQfvvDM3ITlqEdkpkKFvs2ljbF5M_LzvhmYe_Rb_l_xCjeHIaVn0AyxlncMoFCqQvNy6OZqohAuIlL64gw6fu_8LPzzVH4dw7LRX-J87Femw3ZWU9CV5jRJwgZXHw2QIaESFoKCDYKYvFYeZytHwCxqx-sCFvBDuhP_-Bx7dTW85VAHkbn9kHalppEHXwzwffKIRzayt1qzZWJbtpblv-WbiW4hMRvxcEYL99EVY9gGIdsy5_os4BJtLAIQTmPItBAZ1W3C9FR]https://www.facebook.com/nymboidacanoecentre/?__tn__=kC-R&eid=ARDDHUmOVlFc7vqohbiTwEywvaRn3vZ_L4jWZMj_yONJnK8R8vrg_ZjEO1mWvvT2UDLQYdSB7urVcwhh&hc_ref=ARSn0-mOS8zMBYqrxpf-0jMS_jlpqzd0mW4IRJ9xzPAitN9GWjDNC31-MjgEeg6J08k&fref=nf&__xts__[0]=68.ARB66rE8e7UUHUtoU9N6la6Ksf-v0ZRyhV-MeC-jGkLeuGJVeU_DPZlERF5sgswGFNAko645AYBGMEAlCBcQfvvDM3ITlqEdkpkKFvs2ljbF5M_LzvhmYe_Rb_l_xCjeHIaVn0AyxlncMoFCqQvNy6OZqohAuIlL64gw6fu_8LPzzVH4dw7LRX-J87Femw3ZWU9CV5jRJwgZXHw2QIaESFoKCDYKYvFYeZytHwCxqx-sCFvBDuhP_-Bx7dTW85VAHkbn9kHalppEHXwzwffKIRzayt1qzZWJbtpblv-WbiW4hMRvxcEYL99EVY9gGIdsy5_os4BJtLAIQTmPItBAZ1W3C9FR (https://www.facebook.com/nymboidacanoecentre/?__tn__=kC-R&eid=ARDDHUmOVlFc7vqohbiTwEywvaRn3vZ_L4jWZMj_yONJnK8R8vrg_ZjEO1mWvvT2UDLQYdSB7urVcwhh&hc_ref=ARSn0-mOS8zMBYqrxpf-0jMS_jlpqzd0mW4IRJ9xzPAitN9GWjDNC31-MjgEeg6J08k&fref=nf&__xts__[0)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on November 19, 2019, 06:32:25 AM
The working with children checks (Blue cards in QLD) are mandatory in any organisation that has anything to do with kids, schools, churches, boy scouts, charities, any organisation that has anything to do with kids is required for its employees and volunteers to have them done.

I doesn't stop those who haven't been caught from being involved, but any system where those who have been are then still allowed to have contact with kids is woefully deficient.

Police ans emergency services dont require them....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on November 19, 2019, 07:26:22 AM
Police ans emergency services dont require them....

Police and emergency services undergo vetting checks as part of their recruitment qualifications.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on November 19, 2019, 07:34:39 AM
Police and emergency services undergo vetting checks as part of their recruitment qualifications.

And that hasnt really helped.  Still lots of cops who get caught doing the wrong thing...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 19, 2019, 04:50:11 PM
This pic might give an idea of what country has been effected over the last few months.
And it's not over.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191119/a72a0f38dde5e95ee73965e71c6b7a6a.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on November 19, 2019, 05:41:46 PM
Police ans emergency services dont require them....

Just looked up and from what I could see it's police officers and teacher that are exempt, I am guessing it's because they already have to go through a similar process when being employed.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 19, 2019, 05:44:13 PM
Just goes to show how far & wide the fires are at the moment.
https://www.weatherzone.com.au/satellite/nsw/visible-true-colour (https://www.weatherzone.com.au/satellite/nsw/visible-true-colour)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on November 19, 2019, 05:48:35 PM
The working with children checks (Blue cards in QLD) are mandatory in any organisation that has anything to do with kids, schools, churches, boy scouts, charities, any organisation that has anything to do with kids is required for its employees and volunteers to have them done.

I doesn't stop those who haven't been caught from being involved, but any system where those who have been are then still allowed to have contact with kids is woefully deficient.

So, why don't parents need to get a blue card? seems odd to me.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on November 19, 2019, 05:54:22 PM
So, why don't parents need to get a blue card? seems odd to me.

Seems odd to me too as the biggest molesters of children are usually family relations or friends.  Bureaucracy at its finest....it will spend millions on bullShit ideas to get a result that will be of little use in a community.  I hope the churches clergy are all made to get a blue card.   Same goes for pollies and councilors too.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 19, 2019, 06:22:13 PM
Quote from: Bigfish
I hope the churches clergy are all made to get a blue card.   
none of em would pass LMAO!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: D4D on November 19, 2019, 06:29:38 PM
So, why don't parents need to get a blue card? seems odd to me.

In VIC I had to get a working with children check to volunteer at my son’s school.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 19, 2019, 06:31:38 PM
Quote from: D4D
In VIC I had to get a working with children check to volunteer at my son’s school.
the missus needed one to go on a schoool bus trip with our kids.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on November 19, 2019, 08:45:29 PM
I hope the churches clergy are all made to get a blue card. 

Not just the clergy, anyone who does anything with kids.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Rodt on November 20, 2019, 05:47:14 AM
This process has been in place for years so not sure why the big hoohaa now. Anything that can be done to protect our kids is 100% worth it. There may be loopholes in the system but I would rather something is being undertaken that can potentially stop the majority of issues occurring.

I don't hear too many solutions coming from this discussion just whinging >:(

Let's keep this discussion about the bushfires and the tragedy (and potentially what we can do to help) and leave the other agendas to somewhere else  :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on November 20, 2019, 08:00:38 AM
This process has been in place for years so not sure why the big hoohaa now. Anything that can be done to protect our kids is 100% worth it. There may be loopholes in the system but I would rather something is being undertaken that can potentially stop the majority of issues occurring.

I don't hear too many solutions coming from this discussion just whinging >:(

Let's keep this discussion about the bushfires and the tragedy (and potentially what we can do to help) and leave the other agendas to somewhere else  :cheers:

But that's where the whole thread divergence started. Making it compulsory for RFS volunteers to get a blue card. I don't see where they would be working with kids anyway. Maybe a remote possibility if they helped a family evacuate or helped protect a residents property, but really, do you think they'd have that much contact where they'd need to get one?

It won't hurt to do so, except it may hinder the RFS doing their job, while trying to get all their members up to scratch with the requirements.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 20, 2019, 08:43:58 AM
Quote from: Troopy_03
But that's where the whole thread divergence started. Making it compulsory for RFS volunteers to get a blue card. I don't see where they would be working with kids anyway.
IT would be less for fire fighting - and more for the community stuff.

We used to take the trucks out and do daycare and school visits and education gigs...
Xmas time being a small town we used to do the Santa run too (thinking back, old Mrs Jacobs who played santa from around 1970 would never have had a blue card...)
(https://scontent.fmel2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/48408105_2222317657813248_7909834011101364224_o.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_oc=AQlR9PSdr5CsAJf5g-YkEUftqg1DfsVQSL0hVMDtMQ1drzHi2zLxv_LFj6VOst2WIzM&_nc_ht=scontent.fmel2-1.fna&oh=2aa5736f5ed70d3875184ec96ae31397&oe=5E4C1040)

Even the Woronora boys would take the boats out for santa runs and community workshops
(https://scontent.fmel2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/15304455_1254276527971445_675477597180119276_o.jpg?_nc_cat=100&_nc_oc=AQmj-6B103Xxig1bMyALbn-GHGijCWPusGOcfQG_K3evIif6OEqc0dEviylZHjCXALk&_nc_ht=scontent.fmel2-1.fna&oh=96e4afc083554f5bca0a7f0235c9cb00&oe=5E517E1D)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on November 20, 2019, 10:43:28 AM
IT would be less for fire fighting - and more for the community stuff.

We used to take the trucks out and do daycare and school visits and education gigs...
Xmas time being a small town we used to do the Santa run too (thinking back, old Mrs Jacobs who played santa from around 1970 would never have had a blue card...)

Even the Woronora boys would take the boats out for santa runs and community workshops


Yep, good point...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 21, 2019, 05:23:05 AM
Something very few people talk about.
The lost of wildlife.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-20/beekeepers-traumatised-by-screaming-animals-after-bushfires/11721756 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-20/beekeepers-traumatised-by-screaming-animals-after-bushfires/11721756)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on November 21, 2019, 07:08:57 AM
Something very few people talk about.
The lost of wildlife.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-20/beekeepers-traumatised-by-screaming-animals-after-bushfires/11721756 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-20/beekeepers-traumatised-by-screaming-animals-after-bushfires/11721756)

This is why any one caught lighting a fire should be hung...regardless of age..f em!!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 21, 2019, 08:45:44 AM
Quote from: Hairs
Something very few people talk about.
The lost of wildlife.
agree. and agree with BFish too.

I'd be happy to hand arsonists over to the towns people who have lost everything... do with them what you will... make em work, make em clean up, then kill em.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 21, 2019, 09:35:15 AM
(https://scontent.fmel8-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69901852_3230855883608429_4311054744547229696_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&_nc_oc=AQltVb863cWQN0ti30oHWLXW3_2uG9ih84J1ymCRkbsDa4L0Qb_as_T5uuj0kQVnIvzerP2dQhjYf1hhSAxEg1qm&_nc_ht=scontent.fmel8-1.fna&oh=892bf8b9aa2d5e9f71b03711a8e86689&oe=5E40BE9D)


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Kangaron on November 21, 2019, 09:42:34 AM
Looking at this they are running some planned burns up NW of Vic in the CODE RED zone.. WTF?
http://emergency.vic.gov.au/respond/ (http://emergency.vic.gov.au/respond/)






Read it again, all in response mode, being patrolled for flareups.
The burns took place a week or so ago.
One planned for Rheola has been put on hold.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 21, 2019, 10:23:46 AM
Quote from: Kangaron
Read it again, all in response mode, being patrolled for flareups.
The burns took place a week or so ago.
One planned for Rheola has been put on hold.
ahhhh different views... thats handy :(


Resume normal programming.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 22, 2019, 11:37:22 AM
Pacific H/way & the Summerland H/ways are now closed.
There is a real concern for the people in Serendipty, Woombah & Iluka.
Tullymorgan, all the properties along Pringles Way and Us in Lawrence.
The water bombers are doing their best in these windy conditions.
Stay safe.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191122/e93d3ff064b26fd4d85421a7248cbdac.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191122/00480cc822cf1fdf13798d0344ed1cd4.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 22, 2019, 12:50:31 PM
Current warnings, just put out 1 hour ago.

NSW RFS - Northern Rivers Zone
1 hr ·

*** MYALL CREEK ROAD FIRE - EMERGENCY WARNING *** Posted Friday 22 November 2019, 12:39

Current situation:
The fire is spreading quickly towards the areas of Jacky Bulbin Flat, Tullymorgan and Mororo.
The fire is also burning west of Whiporie towards the area of Mount Marsh.
Firefighters and aircraft are working in the area to consolidate containment options and protect homes.
Summerland Way is closed in both directions. Check www.livetraffic.com for road information.
The Pacific Highway is closed in both directions between Grafton and Ballina.

Advice:
If you are in the area of Tullymorgan, Mororo or Jacky Bulbin Flat leave now to the south, towards Maclean.
If you are in the area of Whiporie or Mount Marsh, monitor conditions. Ensure you know what you will do if the firefront approaches.
If you are in the areas of Bungawalbin, Gibberagee, or Myrtle Creek, monitor conditions. Know what you will do if the fire threatens.
If you are in an area that has already been affected by fire, there may be small areas of active fire burning for some time. Be aware of the dangers of trees and branches falling.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 22, 2019, 02:36:41 PM
Live Traffic has Crashed.
There is at the - Maclean Showground, (open 8am – 6pm until further notice) 12 Cameron St, Maclean NSW an evacuation centre that has been setup for those needing assistance/accommodation.
Stay safe.
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 23, 2019, 03:33:56 PM
Pacific H/way & the Summerland H/ways are now closed.
There is a real concern for the people in Serendipty, Woombah & Iluka.
Tullymorgan, all the properties along Pringles Way and Us in Lawrence.
The water bombers are doing their best in these windy conditions.
Stay safe.

Was driving up to Brissy yesterday and drove through the Jacky Bulbin under the smoke.  As I got to Maclean the Highway Patrol was just blocking the South bound lane.  Made the return trip a long one.  Live Traffic NSW gave diversion using Gwydir, New England and Bruxner Hwys. 

As I was at Beenleigh I had a quick look at Google Maps on phone, yep straight over to Beaudesert, Boonah up to Warwick and down New England. 

Best made plans of mice and men. 

Found the Highway between Warwick and Aratula closed at The Gap due to Fires.  Check with the Qld version of Live Traffic and along with confirming it's closed says to use Alternative Route and the only direction was is Use alternative route.  With NO alternative route I was back on google Maps trying to find an alternative.  Ended up going north to go west to go south taking an extra 1.5 hrs all up costing me about 2 hrs all up extra, with going the New England and Gwydir Highway meant it was a very late trip back home. 

The Pacific Hwy was reopened about 10.30pm last night so if I sat and waited I would have taken the same time. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 23, 2019, 03:43:53 PM
I'm getting alerts that the Pacific H/way is opening & closing as the winds swings around and back.
Very unprecedented times, even with the technology we have at our finger tips.

This has been the view off the front verandah for the last week nearly.
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191123/071ba18bb5d803025c62a1637a497998.jpg)
This is the cause of it.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191123/e745318f4effd6fe1393224ec6a67ea7.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 23, 2019, 04:39:25 PM
There are no words to describe these tools..............fine was way too little IMO.  >:( >:(

Richmond Police District
2 hrs ·

Richmond Valley Council Rangers will allege that earlier today they detected two Queenslanders illegally camping on Golf Links Road, Evans Head. The Queenslanders had also lit a fire. They said they knew there is currently a bushfire emergency and could not say why they lit the fire. A $2,200.00 fine was issued to them.

The fire danger right now is as high as I have ever seen. Hundreds of emergency services men and women are risking their lives to fight them, and people are losing their homes. We don't need people lighting more fires.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 23, 2019, 07:27:46 PM
Quote from: Hairs
This is the cause of it.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191123/e745318f4effd6fe1393224ec6a67ea7.jpg)
awesome photo....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 23, 2019, 07:43:44 PM
Bird,
The devastation, is gut wrenching, yet we see photos like this and think, WOW.
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 24, 2019, 10:36:24 AM
We might not be able to be on the ground fighting these fires, but we can support the crews doing the hard yards.
Fysh is atm, helping to make sure these crews have food and water.
She is at the local fire shed, making sandwiches, prepare meals and providing support.
I will rock up this arvo and lend a hand, what ever they think I can help with.
Some of these guys have done this non stop for 2 or more weeks now.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 24, 2019, 12:38:21 PM
Give this a go:
http://arcg.is/1PjK9 (http://arcg.is/1PjK9)

...

In 2 days, my NSW map has had over 2,000 visits, has made it onto the University's official Twitter feed and has quite a few people using it to supplement what is already known.

...

It's a reassuring validation that your stuff is going to do the job...


Hi Ed

Just looking to see what's happening, having to change maps to go cross-Border :'(, & just had a thought ...

Could you possibly put a link on each of your pages to go straight to the other maps ???

Maybe, where it changes to blank grey with fire markings when you cross the Qld border, have 2 - 3 nice big clickable buttons " For NSW Fire Map, click here" & vice versa ???
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 24, 2019, 01:57:27 PM
Hi Ed

Just looking to see what's happening, having to change maps to go cross-Border :'(, & just had a thought ...

Could you possibly put a link on each of your pages to go straight to the other maps ???

Maybe, where it changes to blank grey with fire markings when you cross the Qld border, have 2 - 3 nice big clickable buttons " For NSW Fire Map, click here" & vice versa ???


I'm sort of in the dog house at university for it at the moment, so I'm taking a break from doing any more with it until I hear back from some others as to what to do with it next.

There's only so much I can do because of how it's put together in ArcGIS, so that limits that functionality.

I may have ruffled a few feathers in other faculties with it; there is a fancy CRC that has done some stuff with similar data, but are definitely in this category:
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZJFelH1EEdM/TB-_ALTYI5I/AAAAAAAAAB0/JWadOyyiSKg/s1600/Tire_Swing.gif)

So at the moment I'm staying away from doing too much with it until it settles down and I can work out some ways of extricating myself from the dog house...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 24, 2019, 02:10:40 PM
Banyabba has kicked off agaiin with a change in wind direction.
:(
That's only 15 odd ks away.
The water bombers are in the air again.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191124/faa89680269120e79ee94ccfe04b561c.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 24, 2019, 02:14:42 PM
It will be a huge effort if they can stop this reaching the coast.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191124/5bf3d017386cbf14cd609b657127c305.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 24, 2019, 06:38:04 PM
It will be a huge effort if they can stop this reaching the coast.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191124/5bf3d017386cbf14cd609b657127c305.jpg)
save woombbah esk and freshwater, and let the rest burn to the coast...perfect firebreak :)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on November 24, 2019, 06:56:32 PM
A new series on SBS, their exploring the archives and seeing what the country looked like when Cookie and then the 1st fleet rocked up.

Since then it would appear our attempts at preserving the wilderness is just ensuring it gets more messed up when it does burn:

https://www.sbs.com.au/ondemand/video/346404419939/bushfires-inside-the-inferno (https://www.sbs.com.au/ondemand/video/346404419939/bushfires-inside-the-inferno)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 24, 2019, 08:26:28 PM
save woombbah esk and freshwater, and let the rest burn to the coast...perfect firebreak :)

Has always been long referred to as the Eastern firebreak for ages, long before the RFS was formed, even called that by the old now retired Forestry workers. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 25, 2019, 08:42:52 AM
I'm sort of in the dog house at university for it at the moment,

Sorry to hear that :'(

Hope it all comes good again
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 25, 2019, 12:42:57 PM
This how close the fire is to Woombah north of Maclean at the moment.

This video is taken at my wife's brother place.

https://www.facebook.com/713248623/videos/10157835964253624/ (https://www.facebook.com/713248623/videos/10157835964253624/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 25, 2019, 12:43:55 PM
This how close the fire is to Woombah north of Maclean at the moment.

This video is taken at my wife's brother place.

https://www.facebook.com/713248623/videos/10157835964253624/ (https://www.facebook.com/713248623/videos/10157835964253624/)
You must log in to continue
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 25, 2019, 03:32:53 PM
Around lunch time,
Residents of Woombah, Iluka were told to leave.
Now they are told it is too late.
:( :(
The chopper(Jerry)is supported by small planes.
Looks like they are working on the dwellings in woombah.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191125/087f9b0650a8e136820692694f0da5cc.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 25, 2019, 05:21:21 PM
The Air Tanker has done a number of runs north today as well. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 25, 2019, 05:26:06 PM
The Air Tanker has done a number of runs north today as well.
Yes,
People have messaged me saying they have seen her.
I haven't checked the last couple of hours.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on November 25, 2019, 05:49:17 PM
I flew over that area this morning. Looked horrible down there.

Hope everyone stays safe.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on November 25, 2019, 05:54:48 PM
Raining here on the central coast....looks like widespread rain up to approx Coffs ...hope it moves further north for you !!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 25, 2019, 06:04:06 PM
I flew over that area this morning. Looked horrible down there.

Hope everyone stays safe.
We are a long way from these fires, touch wood they don't come closer.
The whole Clarence Valley has come together, people have come from Logan(gld) with med supplies for live stock, native animals.
It is heart wrenching to see the destruction, it is also amazing to hear the stories of strangers helping, giving of their time, effort freely.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 25, 2019, 06:05:51 PM
Raining here on the central coast....looks like widespread rain up to approx Coffs ...hope it moves further north for you !!
Hi mate,
Rain is what everyone is praying for.
Cheers
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 25, 2019, 06:21:08 PM
Raining here on the central coast....looks like widespread rain up to approx Coffs ...hope it moves further north for you !!

No rain here at Coffs, Kempsey maybe. 

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 26, 2019, 03:43:54 PM
Things have gotten worse in the last 8 hours.
Ashby, Woombah, even spot fires in cane fields on Chatsworth Island.
It's not good, a long night ahead for RFS and associated services.


(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191126/19a7417352159ae09ab5dda73b8fd264.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 26, 2019, 03:58:41 PM
Things have gotten worse in the last 8 hours.
Ashby, Woombah, even spot fires in cane fields on Chatsworth Island.
It's not good, a long night ahead for RFS and associated services.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191126/19a7417352159ae09ab5dda73b8fd264.jpg)
yea thats pretty average...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 26, 2019, 04:08:33 PM
Fark me,
Channel ten news just reported this fire as in the Richmond Valley.
Don't these news outlets check their dribble?
That's right,
They won't know Shit from clay if it's out side of NSW, Newcastle, Sydney, Wollongong.
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 26, 2019, 05:05:21 PM
Fark me,
Channel ten news just reported this fire as in the Richmond Valley.
Don't these news outlets check their dribble?
That's right,
They won't know Shit from clay if it's out side of NSW, Newcastle, Sydney, Wollongong.

That's the problem when the journos just go off the RFS website.  They fire is called the Myall Creek Road Fire at Myall Creek Rd, Bora Ridge, NSW in the Richmond Valley Council.  the fact the fire front is now burning in another LGA doesn't matter.  Bit hard to look at the next info screen and the map and work it out for them. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 26, 2019, 05:17:36 PM
That's the problem when the journos just go off the RFS website.  They fire is called the Myall Creek Road Fire at Myall Creek Rd, Bora Ridge, NSW in the Richmond Valley Council.  the fact the fire front is now burning in another LGA doesn't matter.  Bit hard to look at the next info screen and the map and work it out for them.
Yeah, you're right mate.
Now Channel 9 news reports,
'Lucky escape for woombah residents as fire surround them'.

Footage and interview is of a house at Camira Crk, stated at bottom of screen as a bloke recalls how close the fire came.

Who TF does their editing, who does the script preparation?

Hell we learnt that Shit in year 10(1982), proof read Shit.

Edit,
Our local Fire RFS Captain has through FB reassured the local Lawrence residents that at this time there is no threat.

At no time has so many people had such access to information, yet there is so much miss information out there.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on November 26, 2019, 05:46:21 PM
After 2 weeks of working with NPWS and the RFS to cut trails and fire breaks around the Kempsey Road area, mates have had a lightning strike at the edge of their property that they'd managed to keep the fire off of... bollocks...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 26, 2019, 06:51:44 PM
Hope this makes it across the Range  :'(

https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km (https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km)

https://www.essentialenergy.com.au/outages-and-faults/storm-tracker (https://www.essentialenergy.com.au/outages-and-faults/storm-tracker)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 26, 2019, 07:03:22 PM
All this storm front is going to do is give Firies a head ache.
Winds blowing, carrying embers.
What we need is rain, 4-5 inches and then follow up rain.
Talking with farmers, RFS members, they are going to have a busy night.

Edit,
Let alone the lighting strikes on tinder dry grasses and country.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 26, 2019, 07:06:50 PM
All this storm front is going to do is give Firies a head ache.
Winds blowing, carrying embers.
What we need is rain, 4-5 inches and then follow up rain.
Talking with farmers, RFS members, they are going to have a busy night.
windy as **** here, mate in Goulburn said they been gettin flogged all day by wind
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 26, 2019, 07:18:02 PM
windy as **** here, mate in Goulburn said they been gettin flogged all day by wind
It's just #$%#@*
There is no relief in sight.
There is no rain in this, it will be like throwing a bucket of water into a blacksmiths forge.
:(
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191126/56908d1b46203248d5ded7eaaf6df69c.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 26, 2019, 07:29:59 PM
Not my picture, was shared to me
Taken from Harwood kennels looking west towards Ashby.
Just went out side, the sky through the smoke is blood ted.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191126/0812e25ae9584d19eebe38a2ed2ad9a9.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 26, 2019, 07:49:25 PM
It's just #$%#@*
There is no relief in sight.
There is no rain in this, it will be like throwing a bucket of water into a blacksmiths forge.
:(
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191126/56908d1b46203248d5ded7eaaf6df69c.jpg)

So called front is failing big time.  You might be lucky to get a spit or two.  We've had about three cracks of lightning and looking at the BoM the 'front has just about gone. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 26, 2019, 08:15:26 PM
So called front is failing big time.  You might be lucky to get a spit or two.  We've had about three cracks of lightning and looking at the BoM the 'front has just about gone.
Yep gone,
Just took the bins out to the side Street, a couple of drops, a couple of lightening flashes across the sky.
That's it, it's gone.
Wind is still blowin.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 26, 2019, 09:39:35 PM
That be a sleepless night dude.. :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 26, 2019, 09:46:26 PM
Just to add to the night Jon

https://www.facebook.com/731187123648850/photos/a.731272920306937/2163985873702294/?type=3&theater (https://www.facebook.com/731187123648850/photos/a.731272920306937/2163985873702294/?type=3&theater)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Rodt on November 27, 2019, 05:36:40 AM
It's just #$%#@*
There is no relief in sight.
There is no rain in this, it will be like throwing a bucket of water into a blacksmiths forge.
:(
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191126/56908d1b46203248d5ded7eaaf6df69c.jpg)
Barrelled across us and dropped about 3 mm and has then dragged up a massive amount of dust behind it. Looks to have cleared a little this morning but it reminded me of a vehicle driving down a dirt road with all the turbulence behind it
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 27, 2019, 05:38:23 AM
Hi Al,
Just what they would of wanted to deal with last night :(
This morning, HotSpot is showing it has made the ocean.
Heard they lost a house at Ashby Heights.
If it is only one, they have done well.


Pacific H/way is closed north of the Iluka turn off again  this morning due to smoke.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 27, 2019, 02:11:38 PM
Better hope a southerly doesn't blow in,
Evans Head, could be next.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191127/6d8fd5e9bf40c2855557fec2d711ce0b.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 27, 2019, 02:24:03 PM
Quote from: Hairs
Better hope a southerly doesn't blow in,
Evans Head, could be next.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191127/6d8fd5e9bf40c2855557fec2d711ce0b.jpg)

Gee, you'd have as many spare crews as possible wacking in a fire break to the north of that north flank
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 27, 2019, 03:14:21 PM
Gee, you'd have as many spare crews as possible wacking in a fire break to the north of that north flank
Reckon they(crews on tbe ground) would be doing everything they could.
This fire season isn't over by a long shot.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 27, 2019, 03:17:19 PM
Reckon they(crews on tbe ground) would be doing everything they could.
This fire season isn't over by a long shot.
and then some.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 27, 2019, 06:26:38 PM
Hi Al,
Just what they would of wanted to deal with last night :(
This morning, HotSpot is showing it has made the ocean.
Heard they lost a house at Ashby Heights.
If it is only one, they have done well.


Pacific H/way is closed north of the Iluka turn off again  this morning due to smoke.

When you start looking at the number of houses set in a rural setting it is amazing the number lost is not much higher.  I am one of them but I also try to keep a clearing around us and the bush.  But I have policies that stop me from falling trees that I consider are a risk.  Others what the trees growing right up to their house and wonder why their place will burn.   It will be interesting to see what comes out of the Inquiry after the fires. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 27, 2019, 06:43:47 PM


When you start looking at the number of houses set in a rural setting it is amazing the number lost is not much higher.  I am one of them but I also try to keep a clearing around us and the bush.  But I have policies that stop me from falling trees that I consider are a risk.  Others what the trees growing right up to their house and wonder why their place will burn.   It will be interesting to see what comes out of the Inquiry after the fires.

The inquiry needs to be above politics, wishful thinking I know.
All levels of response to events like this has to have a result that makes fire managment accoutable.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 27, 2019, 07:19:21 PM
Quote from: alnjan
have policies that stop me from falling trees that I consider are a risk.
*cough* winch and chainsaw and the boys around for a few hours at dusk, all ash before anyone knows... it fell naturally *cough*
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on November 27, 2019, 07:22:03 PM
When you start looking at the number of houses set in a rural setting it is amazing the number lost is not much higher.  I am one of them but I also try to keep a clearing around us and the bush.  But I have policies that stop me from falling trees that I consider are a risk.  Others what the trees growing right up to their house and wonder why their place will burn.   It will be interesting to see what comes out of the Inquiry after the fires.

Are you in a 10/50 zone?
https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/news-and-media/general-news/1050-vegetation-clearing
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 27, 2019, 08:37:12 PM
Are you in a 10/50 zone?
https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/news-and-media/general-news/1050-vegetation-clearing

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/plan-and-prepare/1050-vegetation-clearing/tool (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/plan-and-prepare/1050-vegetation-clearing/tool)

Yep but......copy and paste from RFS site


"The parcel of land you have selected is located in a designated 10/50 vegetation entitlement clearing area. However, you cannot use the 10/50 exemption to clear vegetation on this parcel of land. This land is excluded from the operation of the 10/50 Code as it has been identified as being wholly or partially within:

specified Koala habitat mapped in Comprehensive Koala Plans of Management and as provided by the Department of Planning and Environment

You cannot use the 10/50 exemption to clear vegetation on this parcel of land. Contact your local council or Local Land Services Office regarding any clearing authorisation required.

You may also contact your local NSW RFS District Office if you are seeking advice regarding your land and bush fire hazard management.
"
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on November 27, 2019, 10:38:24 PM
https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/plan-and-prepare/1050-vegetation-clearing/tool (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/plan-and-prepare/1050-vegetation-clearing/tool)

Yep but......copy and paste from RFS site


"The parcel of land you have selected is located in a designated 10/50 vegetation entitlement clearing area. However, you cannot use the 10/50 exemption to clear vegetation on this parcel of land. This land is excluded from the operation of the 10/50 Code as it has been identified as being wholly or partially within:

specified Koala habitat mapped in Comprehensive Koala Plans of Management and as provided by the Department of Planning and Environment

You cannot use the 10/50 exemption to clear vegetation on this parcel of land. Contact your local council or Local Land Services Office regarding any clearing authorisation required.

You may also contact your local NSW RFS District Office if you are seeking advice regarding your land and bush fire hazard management.
"

Well that’s a bugger for you, our old place we could clear under the 10/50 plan which was good.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: prodigyrf on November 28, 2019, 12:28:35 AM
Makes you wonder how they got on in the past without our modern communications water bombers and CFS capability and in war time too-
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/229265859
Just as well we have them with a lot more people out in that countryside nowadays and be thankful for that.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: prodigyrf on November 28, 2019, 12:45:07 AM
They did learn a trick or two after the tragic bushfires to pass on to us- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/248706451
Lest we forget eh?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 28, 2019, 07:51:38 AM
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/248706451

16 Dec 1951

"A Forests Commission spokesman said today that Victoria was now so well organised for all-out attacks on bushfires that
there were no "black spots" left in the State."

Ummmm ??? :'( ::)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 28, 2019, 10:54:09 AM
Well that’s a bugger for you, our old place we could clear under the 10/50 plan which was good.

Yep, pretty much screwed over.  I have cleared up what I can and the 10/50 would be so much better.   It is an easy and simple solution.  Being in a area that was rural and several years ago rezoned to rural/residential where farms can now be subdivided into 1ha blocks the number of houses in the area has increased, each in it's own rural, bushland setting. 

We have 4ha,  which was part of my Dad's, which was part of his Dad's, (if we make it to 2030 the land will have been in the family for 100yrs).  The 4ha is about half cleared, half timber.  with the timber continuing to grow I am going to have to speak to Council about what I can do to clear around the house or at least to thin it out a bit as well at what I can do to keep the cleared part clear again.   The small amount of timber I would like cleared is not going to have an impact on the koala numbers in the area.  We haven't seen any here since maybe 2000/1.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 29, 2019, 06:51:37 PM
WOO HOOO  :cup:

Storm just passing over with good heavy rain in Maclean area  :cup: :cup:

https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km (https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 29, 2019, 07:20:21 PM
No rain atm recorded in Ashby/Tullymorgan where the fires are, more wind to whip up the fires.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191129/0abcefd900737360186f6f2723662a86.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 29, 2019, 07:32:28 PM
The Myall Crk fire has burnt all the way to the ocean.
:(
Picture shared to me from a mate.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191129/3881bd075658b1ce86063dae841bf994.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on November 29, 2019, 09:35:22 PM
The Myall Crk fire has burnt all the way to the ocean.
:(
Picture shared to me from a mate.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191129/3881bd075658b1ce86063dae841bf994.jpg)
eye opening eh...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 29, 2019, 10:46:24 PM
The Myall Crk fire has burnt all the way to the ocean.
:(
Picture shared to me from a mate.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191129/3881bd075658b1ce86063dae841bf994.jpg)

The Eastern Fire Break worked well.





Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 30, 2019, 05:00:44 AM
A good drop of rain here over night............... 8 mm.

Take all we can get atm.

 :cup:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 30, 2019, 08:36:51 AM
Hey Al,
We knew it's been dry.
https://www.facebook.com/143088949067135/posts/3369712326404765/ (https://www.facebook.com/143088949067135/posts/3369712326404765/)
3mm last night here,  50mm on the coast(yamba), unfortunately not where it was needed.
The wind is predicted to be not very helpful again today.
I just checked the fires near me app, looks like a couple of lightening strikes have sparked a couple of fires north of Tamworth.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on November 30, 2019, 09:52:13 AM
We knew it's been dry.

It has :'(

Over 138 years of records for Southport / GC Seaway, the lowest amount of rain for November has been 9.1mm, with the averge being either 105 or 110mm, depending on which station you use  - so far this month, we've had 0.6 :o, & that was over "rainy" 2 days - one of 0.2 & the other 0.4 :'(

(& please don't get me wrong - for us it's only an inconvenience, not a matter of literally life & death - I'm just agreeing that yes, it's dry)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on November 30, 2019, 11:35:52 AM
It has :'(

(& please don't get me wrong - for us it's only an inconvenience, not a matter of literally life & death - I'm just agreeing that yes, it's dry)

You're right,
Back in Easter, the Clarence sopped flowing at Yates Crossing, second time ever, last time was 103 years ago.
I can't find if the Clarence had ever stopped flowing at the Carnham Bridge before.

Talking with a River Trawlerman yesterday, he has never seen tbe Clarence go for so long with out a Fresh, which mean buggar prawns this Christmas.
Which mean people will buy more imported seafood, it's a vicious cycle.

Farmers have sold their breding stock, they have nothing.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 30, 2019, 12:38:27 PM
Hey Al,
We knew it's been dry.
https://www.facebook.com/143088949067135/posts/3369712326404765/ (https://www.facebook.com/143088949067135/posts/3369712326404765/)
3mm last night here,  50mm on the coast(yamba), unfortunately not where it was needed.
The wind is predicted to be not very helpful again today.
I just checked the fires near me app, looks like a couple of lightening strikes have sparked a couple of fires north of Tamworth.

Yeah, people seem to forget we have had droughts before.  Somehow want to believe it is all new.  Who would have guessed we have had drought and bushfires before. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: bmwfreak on November 30, 2019, 12:58:30 PM
Who would have guessed we have had drought and bushfires before.

https://www.dorotheamackellar.com.au/archive/mycountry.htm (https://www.dorotheamackellar.com.au/archive/mycountry.htm)

Nough said ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 30, 2019, 01:05:32 PM
https://www.dorotheamackellar.com.au/archive/mycountry.htm (https://www.dorotheamackellar.com.au/archive/mycountry.htm)

Nough said ;D


yep    :cup: :cup: :cup:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 30, 2019, 06:23:09 PM
We had a storm over the Clarence Valley earlier today..........now looks like we have a good drop of rain heading our way now.

Maclean area has had 10mm of rain since this time yesterday arvo.

Every journey starts with a step.

https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km (https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on November 30, 2019, 08:54:40 PM
We had a storm over the Clarence Valley earlier today..........now looks like we have a good drop of rain heading our way now.

Maclean area has had 10mm of rain since this time yesterday arvo.

Every journey starts with a step.

https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km (https://www.weatherzone.com.au/radar/nsw/grafton/128km)

And at the end of every drought......is rain.  When is unpredictable, but it will come.....and just as the drought has been unwanted, maybe the rain will be too....floods ??  Time will tell ?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 30, 2019, 09:10:19 PM
And at the end of every drought......is rain.  When is unpredictable, but it will come.....and just as the drought has been unwanted, maybe the rain will be too....floods ??  Time will tell ?
Gees Gronk...........you will start mass panic if the people hear that F word around here  8)
We have had rain ( although a little at a time) for the last few afternoons.It is appreciated no matter how little it is tho.
 :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 30, 2019, 09:41:06 PM
And at the end of every drought......is rain.  When is unpredictable, but it will come.....and just as the drought has been unwanted, maybe the rain will be too....floods ??  Time will tell ?

In a drought 10mls is a flood
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on November 30, 2019, 09:56:27 PM
In a drought 10mls is a flood
and a welcome relief from the heat.  ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on November 30, 2019, 10:35:35 PM
and a welcome relief from the heat.  ;D

Not much of that either, just the bloody flying ants
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hewy54 on December 01, 2019, 07:04:16 AM
Yes, after fires 10 mm of rain can cause flooding.
Working at the Dunedoo fires with Blazeaid a couple of years ago we had to do both fire and flood damage.
The fire had taken out all the vegetation so when they did get rain a bit later, there was nothing to hold it which resulted in flood damage to fences.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 01, 2019, 08:47:51 AM
& with the ground being so dry, to start with, any water just runs over it :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 01, 2019, 10:32:54 AM
Not much of that either, just the bloody flying ants

Bloody Flying Ants last night swarmed at the door.   This is the carnage this morning.

 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 01, 2019, 10:45:03 AM
Bloody hell Al,
Sheeesh.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 01, 2019, 03:26:51 PM
Just having a beer with a Fire Captain and this rain is very welcomed,
What falls in the next few days will be what counts
It's going to give them a breather.
Just on another aspect of these fires, the local energy supplier have done an amazing job in replacing some 350 power poles, with nearly than many again that need replacing.
Not only have people lost power, they have lost polly water tanks, fencing timber bridges to tbeir properties.
There is a huge loss of infrastructure
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MarkGU on December 01, 2019, 03:57:35 PM
Just arrived home from Casino ( kids had a swimming carnival to attend) and it rained all the way home to Maclean.
Also, passed 10 RFS fire units from all over the northern rivers as far as Tweed Heads heading home northbound up the highway.
Thanks for the time you spent with us all you guys & gals............very much appreciated by everyone in the Clarence Valley.  :cup:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 02, 2019, 09:11:12 AM
Sounds a bit bad down Batemans way... hope they dont get the wind we've had for last few days.....


Quote
A bushfire burning at emergency level on NSW's South Coast has crossed the Princes Highway, cutting off several communities, as almost 130 fires burn across NSW amid very dry and windy conditions on Monday.

The Currowan blaze, which has already burnt more than 11,500 hectares, is burning out-of-control in the Bimberamala and Murramarang national parks, north of Batemans Bay.

https://www.smh.com.au/environment/weather/residents-urged-to-evacuate-as-south-coast-fire-burns-out-of-control-20191201-p53fuc.html (https://www.smh.com.au/environment/weather/residents-urged-to-evacuate-as-south-coast-fire-burns-out-of-control-20191201-p53fuc.html)

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on December 02, 2019, 01:15:35 PM
Good read in The Land today about the challenges of HR burns:
https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520462/hazard-reduction-debate-simply-frustrating/?cs=4941 (https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520462/hazard-reduction-debate-simply-frustrating/?cs=4941)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 02, 2019, 01:24:06 PM
Good read in The Land today about the challenges of HR burns:
https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520462/hazard-reduction-debate-simply-frustrating/?cs=4941 (https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520462/hazard-reduction-debate-simply-frustrating/?cs=4941)
You missed the more important article there
https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520461/questions-over-the-fate-of-the-pub-with-no-beer/?cs=4941 (https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520461/questions-over-the-fate-of-the-pub-with-no-beer/?cs=4941)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on December 02, 2019, 01:31:06 PM
You missed the more important article there
https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520461/questions-over-the-fate-of-the-pub-with-no-beer/?cs=4941 (https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520461/questions-over-the-fate-of-the-pub-with-no-beer/?cs=4941)

That was the next article I read - and knew that one of you lot would pick up on it... it also seemed to be a non-story if it's panning out as it sounds.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 03, 2019, 08:29:43 AM
Good read in The Land today about the challenges of HR burns:
https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520462/hazard-reduction-debate-simply-frustrating/?cs=4941 (https://www.theland.com.au/story/6520462/hazard-reduction-debate-simply-frustrating/?cs=4941)

I like the way the so called 'experts' who criticise Hazard Reduction can only 'blame' Climate Change' for the 'worsening' Bushfires, appear to concede defeat by offering no alternative to mitigating Bushfires. While the article is critical of a number of incidents about Hazard Reduction not being effective it states, " Hazard reduction, strategic planning, equipment and training are all important contributors to successful fire management." So sad they wish to put blame on something else for a situation they have had a hand in building themselves.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 03, 2019, 09:12:03 AM
Quote from: alnja
So sad they wish to put blame on something else for a situation they have had a hand in building themselves.
Its easier...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 03, 2019, 01:17:17 PM
Its easier...

That's about the only answer there is
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 03, 2019, 04:10:29 PM
Its easier...
Yep,
I'm not responsible for myself, someone else  is.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 06, 2019, 02:04:15 PM
680 homes lost this fire season in NSW.
 :'(

Take care,  Guys & Girls.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 06, 2019, 02:29:41 PM
680 homes lost this fire season in NSW.
 :'(

Take care,  Guys & Girls.
its funny how many people think fires are new, never happened bfore... gotta laugh at the comments..

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-fires-live-updates-rfs-continues-to-fight-blazes-20191205-p53hek.html (https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-fires-live-updates-rfs-continues-to-fight-blazes-20191205-p53hek.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 06, 2019, 03:41:47 PM
You wanna pop down for a few days Hairs? Got a few odd jobs you can do while ya here ;)


Quote
Huge amount of fire': Blazes join to create 60km front

Deputy RFS Commissioner Rob Rogers said the Central Coast blazes that joined to create a megafire had created a huge front for firefighters to tackle.

"They've all just basically joined together now and it's almost like 60km of fire going from the Hawkesbury area all the way up to Singleton and at various staging moving towards the east,"he told Nine. "It's a huge amount of fire."

The Gospers Mountain fire alone has burnt more than 250,000 hectars, and has joined with the Little L Complex blaze and the Paddock Run fire. All those blazes are burning out of control.

"We will do our best to save homes but lives are the most important thing this afternoon."
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: wada4wd on December 06, 2019, 05:14:40 PM
its funny how many people think fires are new, never happened bfore... gotta laugh at the comments..

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-fires-live-updates-rfs-continues-to-fight-blazes-20191205-p53hek.html (https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-fires-live-updates-rfs-continues-to-fight-blazes-20191205-p53hek.html)

Fires have been going for centuries.

They are getting faster, and burning at places that didn't had it before. High winds, Higher air heats, and lost of water in the dirt.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on December 06, 2019, 05:49:03 PM
Have a read of this post:
https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2830568603674099&id=162875140443472 (https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2830568603674099&id=162875140443472)

Thats why the fires this year are a problem...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 06, 2019, 06:06:59 PM
This is why
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/99/Fire_tetrahedron.svg/1024px-Fire_tetrahedron.svg.png)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 06, 2019, 07:00:54 PM
This is why
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/99/Fire_tetrahedron.svg/1024px-Fire_tetrahedron.svg.png)

Yep....and lack of rain to halt the spread.

No rain forecast for a few weeks yet...grim times ahead.....but it will rain, just don't know when ?

BEFORE global warming, google California 1930's drought...and we think we have it bad ??
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: speewa158 on December 06, 2019, 07:20:08 PM
Please Santa can we have l  400mm of rain over the next few weeks on the hot stuff in NSW /QLD  .
They haven't been that bad up there
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 06, 2019, 07:27:27 PM
Please Santa can we have l  400mm of rain over the next few weeks on the hot stuff in NSW /QLD  .
They haven't been that bad up there
Praying for the same.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on December 06, 2019, 07:38:52 PM
Praying for the same.
Not much for prayer so I guess I’ll start dancing!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 07, 2019, 05:23:08 AM
Not much for prayer so I guess I’ll start dancing!
There is a Group in Yamba that are everyday.
Rain Dancing.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 07, 2019, 06:34:21 AM
This is why
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/99/Fire_tetrahedron.svg/1024px-Fire_tetrahedron.svg.png)

This is what people just do not understand.   This is the basic simple science of Fire.  Remove one of the elements, Heat, Oxygen or fuel and that stops the chain reaction causing fire.  Climate Change or no Climate Change does not change that fact.   To just blame Climate Change as many want to, is not and will not do anything for Bushfires.  It definitely is not investigating into the cause of the Bushfires and future ways to mitigate the chance of a Bushfire or how to better fight a bushfire.  Listening to some of the 'experts' blaming Climate Change stating Hazard Reduction Burns either do not work or are too dangerous to conduct and just should not be conducted, to further stating current fire fighting techniques and technologies are not working but today have not said what the alternatives are.
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: wada4wd on December 07, 2019, 07:07:41 AM
This is what people just do not understand.   This is the basic simple science of Fire.  Remove one of the elements, Heat, Oxygen or fuel and that stops the chain reaction causing fire.  Climate Change or no Climate Change does not change that fact.   To just blame Climate Change as many want to, is not and will not do anything for Bushfires.  It definitely is not investigating into the cause of the Bushfires and future ways to mitigate the chance of a Bushfire or how to better fight a bushfire.  Listening to some of the 'experts' blaming Climate Change stating Hazard Reduction Burns either do not work or are too dangerous to conduct and just should not be conducted, to further stating current fire fighting techniques and technologies are not working but today have not said what the alternatives are.
 

The problem is that the heat of the world is getting warmer. We cannot remove Heat, Oxygen or fuel because the world has been getting hotter.

Yes, Climate change over years is making it harder for the world to keep the fires under control. Yes, Oxygen, Heat, Fuel and Chain Reaction is getting stronger for years. And the heat is reducing the water in the dirt causing more change for fires.

Climate change is showing us what is happening. If the Climate never changed then the fires would be the same it was before. Obviously, it has been changing.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 07, 2019, 07:27:03 AM
Have a read of this post:
https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2830568603674099&id=162875140443472 (https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2830568603674099&id=162875140443472)

Thats why the fires this year are a problem...

The bloke he is talking about Mark Graham.  I was having a fb discussion on a post that appeared to be deleted before I could get back to him to continue our discussion.  But he was saying the likes of New England National Park has never had a fire in it for 50 million years due to some organism being present.  thought that was a pretty big claim considering the Ebor Volcano last erupted 16-19 million years ago and may have had some impact on the 30 million years before that.  His reply was I do not understand deep time.  Deep time is the concept of geologic time going back to the time of the dinosaurs.   Not sure if that means recent time events don't matter.   His belief is that as the Gondwana rainforest have never had a fire in them for 50 million years we simple should not be conducting any Hazard Reduction Burns at all and now that they are burning it is only prove of Climate Change causing the fires. 
I was going to ask him about that deep time and the time before of the dinosaurs when CO2 levels were at record levels and it was a little warmer then it is today how the earth had such an explosion of plant and animal growth why it didn't automatically burst into flames as the scientist are predicting for our future. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 07, 2019, 08:18:01 AM
To just blame Climate Change as many want to, 

From the SMH article above, I see Malcolm Turnbull has now also jumped on that bandwagon - as somebody commented on his post "Pity you didn't actually do something about it when you had the chance" >:D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 07, 2019, 08:20:41 AM
But he was saying the likes of New England National Park has never had a fire in it for 50 million years

Saw the comment that it has been 3 million years since there has been severe fires in the Border Ranges Gondwana rainforests, where Binna Burra Lodge was recently destroyed!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 07, 2019, 09:12:32 AM
Saw the comment that it has been 3 million years since there has been severe fires in the Border Ranges Gondwana rainforests, where Binna Burra Lodge was recently destroyed!

While the chances of a fire starting in a wet rainforest is greatly reduced, given the right weather conditions a bushfire, like a drought and hot dry winds, which we have had numerous times before a bush fire started in a dry forest will move into a wet rainforest, drying it out and burning it. 
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 07, 2019, 11:23:58 AM
Listening to some of the 'experts' blaming Climate Change stating Hazard Reduction Burns either do not work or are too dangerous to conduct and just should not be conducted, to further stating current fire fighting techniques and technologies are not working but today have not said what the alternatives are.

Not true. The alternatives have been on the table for years now - mitigation of anthropogenic climate change.

But no-one is listening, in fact we have opinions being taken as fact, rather than listening to the facts as reported using rigorous scientific principles.

I'm an SES member of 20 years standing, I've spent a lot of that time assisting RFS. What is going on is pretty clear to me.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 07, 2019, 11:29:51 AM
Not true. The alternatives have been on the table for years now - mitigation of anthropogenic climate change.

But no-one is listening, in fact we have opinions being taken as fact, rather than listening to the facts as reported using rigorous scientific principles.

I'm an SES member of 20 years standing, I've spent a lot of that time assisting RFS. What is going on is pretty clear to me.

Explain, exactly how mitigation of 'anthropogenic climate change' will mitigate bush fires from starting or stop bush fires when they are burning?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 07, 2019, 11:45:34 AM
That's unnecessary.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on December 07, 2019, 02:20:34 PM
That's unnecessary.

I would hazard a guess it was aimed at the "greenish" elements in their ivory towers, not the mass population of Sydney.
Well I hope so anyway.

And yes, unnecessary.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 07, 2019, 05:52:06 PM
The problem is that the heat of the world is getting warmer. We cannot remove Heat, Oxygen or fuel because the world has been getting hotter.



This is probably correct. The world is getting hotter.....by last count 1/2 to 1 degree.

When you consider the temps in Australia vary from 30 to 40 deg during summer, that 1 degree will make absolutely no difference to bushfires..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on December 07, 2019, 07:15:05 PM
And 3mm of average sea level rise is meaningless to us.
Unless you live on an Island 1m above sea level.
Frogs in pots.

Cheers Glen

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: wada4wd on December 07, 2019, 09:14:39 PM
This is probably correct. The world is getting hotter.....by last count 1/2 to 1 degree.

When you consider the temps in Australia vary from 30 to 40 deg during summer, that 1 degree will make absolutely no difference to bushfires..

Increasing the hot, causing lose of moist in the ground, increases the wind and others. Makes it more chance of fires. The heat is getting higher and fast.

(https://tamino.files.wordpress.com/2019/11/nasa.jpg)

https://tamino.wordpress.com/2019/11/25/climate-models/
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 07, 2019, 09:45:43 PM
yep, you do also understand there is a difference between Climate and Weather
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 08, 2019, 12:10:40 PM
https://volcano.si.edu/gvp_currenteruptions.cfm (https://volcano.si.edu/gvp_currenteruptions.cfm)  There goes any climate data collected .. No way to ever know what is normal  or not when this and other events are happening each and everyday,  year in, year  out to differing levels ....    any attempt too is pure guess work and unicorns .. Shame on you Mother Nature.. But thats life Jim, not as we know it ! .. ;D ;D ..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 08, 2019, 01:05:31 PM
https://volcano.si.edu/gvp_currenteruptions.cfm (https://volcano.si.edu/gvp_currenteruptions.cfm)  There goes any climate data collected .. No way to ever know what is normal  or not when this and other events are happening each and everyday,  year in, year  out to differing levels ....    any attempt too is pure guess work and unicorns .. Shame on you Mother Nature.. But thats life Jim, not as we know it ! .. ;D ;D ..
I’m not sure I get your point here.

Are you saying because volcanos are continuing to erupt today, just as they have done for millions of years, that all of the data collected from proven and reliable sources (eg; ice core drilling) until today is now somehow guess work?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 08, 2019, 01:31:42 PM
Not true. The alternatives have been on the table for years now - mitigation of anthropogenic climate change.

But no-one is listening, in fact we have opinions being taken as fact, rather than listening to the facts as reported using rigorous scientific principles.

I'm an SES member of 20 years standing, I've spent a lot of that time assisting RFS. What is going on is pretty clear to me.
We all seem to agree that natural events have always and will always continue.
What interests me is how it appears that when faced with the facts about the increased intensity and the cause of this change, some people really struggle with the reality of it all.

Bush fires have always burnt in Australia, true. We all accept that.
The fact that it’s so early in the season and so much of the country is burning which such ferociously is really concerning. It appears when things out of the ordinary like this happen some of us look to far more educated people then ourselves for answers, others seem to just want to hear opinions that they agree with getting shouted at them so loudly and with such venom it must be factual.

Myself, I just can’t wait for the drought to break and the flooding rains to return.
It will just be interesting to hear the opinions shouted at us of why the wet season is longer and worse then it was before..... ;)

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on December 08, 2019, 02:43:54 PM
We all seem to agree that natural events have always and will always continue.
What interests me is how it appears that when faced with the facts about the increased intensity and the cause of this change, some people really struggle with the reality of it all.

Bush fires have always burnt in Australia, true. We all accept that.
The fact that it’s so early in the season and so much of the country is burning which such ferociously is really concerning.

Nor sure I agree with the “fires burning early”  In my 30 years previously living in the Northern edge of the Blue Mts and only some 12 km ( as the bird flies) from the southern edge of the current Gosper Mt fire  and participating in rfs activities, I can recall that  we had fires in September, October, November, December and January all of which these days would be given the yellow flag of watch and act.
The last 2 significant fires we lived through both originated from a similar location to the current fire with the last occurring October 2013.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on December 08, 2019, 08:19:57 PM
Sydney weekender showed the footage they shot over the winter (I suspect) in the Gondwana area, covering Dorrigo, Ebor and Point Lookout.

https://7plus.com.au/sydney-weekender?episode-id=7SWE26-042 (https://7plus.com.au/sydney-weekender?episode-id=7SWE26-042) @ 5 minutes.

What's interesting is why these 40 areas were made into the World Heritage area 25 years ago - they are all that remains (remained?) of the Gondwana continent's rainforest... and most of those areas have now had fires come through them.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: dogbox on December 08, 2019, 08:30:45 PM
We all seem to agree that natural events have always and will always continue.
What interests me is how it appears that when faced with the facts about the increased intensity and the cause of this change, some people really struggle with the reality of it all.

Bush fires have always burnt in Australia, true. We all accept that.
The fact that it’s so early in the season and so much of the country is burning which such ferociously is really concerning. It appears when things out of the ordinary like this happen some of us look to far more educated people then ourselves for answers, others seem to just want to hear opinions that they agree with getting shouted at them so loudly and with such venom it must be factual.

Myself, I just can’t wait for the drought to break and the flooding rains to return.
It will just be interesting to hear the opinions shouted at us of why the wet season is longer and worse then it was before..... ;)

someone on the tele stated that the bushfires have cause 50 million tons of co2 to be released into the atmosphere so should we be worried
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 08, 2019, 09:46:54 PM
Sydney weekender showed the footage they shot over the winter (I suspect) in the Gondwana area, covering Dorrigo, Ebor and Point Lookout.

https://7plus.com.au/sydney-weekender?episode-id=7SWE26-042 (https://7plus.com.au/sydney-weekender?episode-id=7SWE26-042) @ 5 minutes.

What's interesting is why these 40 areas were made into the World Heritage area 25 years ago - they are all that remains (remained?) of the Gondwana continent's rainforest... and most of those areas have now had fires come through them.

Interesting when the Gondwana Rainforest come from a time much high CO2
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 08, 2019, 11:35:52 PM
[quote ]
I’m not sure I get your point here.

[/quote]

Just trying to say, the mobs screaming about unprecedented man made temp / co2 and what ever else, heres the figure XYZ  to prove the rises and our points etc ..
 There is IMO no way those  figures  could be accurate and can be tagged as all man made..  The amounts of junk / heat and what ever else blown  skywards by natural events  would vary in virtualy unknown quantities and throw what ever data they collect out of wack  to the point of being near useless ...
Yes the ice cores are our best tool and they do show rises and falls dust pollen etc of what ever happened over a period of ...... Millions of years ..
When someone looks at the ice cores in the future, they might be able to say Oh look the CO2 etc blipped a little here, a thousand years ago, but not much compared to what it did in the entire time line before or after ..
 Then again they might say Oh look it rose here and never went down for xx of years, but then that was the time of those volcanoes  all blew their tops ..
Based on past figures and  data and the best minds / computer modeling etc  ... These mobs are virtualy trying to say tomorrow nights lotto numbers are going to be xxxxxxxx ... Even with the best of the best super this n thats , they wont even be close .
But thats just my uneducated probably ill informed opinion of it all .. My crystal ball is just as cloudy as theirs .   ;D ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Raym on December 09, 2019, 05:47:23 AM
Pinched from Facebook.

https://australiascience.tv/vod/dr-karl-do-you-believe-in-climate-change/?fbclid=IwAR1hLuaV8pdEKukCtxDyTIsvFo3lL_oo4s-L8fEsCYf9HPUmsdxJRzqWmSc
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on December 09, 2019, 10:36:52 AM
Pinched from Facebook.

https://australiascience.tv/vod/dr-karl-do-you-believe-in-climate-change/?fbclid=IwAR1hLuaV8pdEKukCtxDyTIsvFo3lL_oo4s-L8fEsCYf9HPUmsdxJRzqWmSc
What?
Mega companies controlling and manipulating us through the media to make more profit at our expense?
Couldn't be  true could it?


Cheers Glen

Title: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 09, 2019, 11:23:38 AM
What?
Mega companies controlling and manipulating us through the media to make more profit at our expense?
Couldn't be  true could it?


Cheers Glen
No way...???

Next you’ll be saying that Murdoch press and Sky News employ a mining director, that happens to have a geological degree (technically making them a scientist) to put forward complete falsehoods and make opinions sound like facts...

Seriously, how could anyone think that an upstanding man like Ian Plimer, who only earns around $500,000.00 as the non executive director of a few mining companies and currently only holds about 5.4 million shares in just one mining company, would ever write anything about the environment that’s not 100% factual.

There’s even a heap of word for word quotes of Ian’s in some of the posts above, so the mining director must be right....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Kangaron on December 09, 2019, 01:37:31 PM
What?
Mega companies controlling and manipulating us through the media to make more profit at our expense?
Couldn't be  true could it?


Cheers Glen

Hey Glen, Uncle Frank taught us that in 1973.
https://youtu.be/w-sREpqDiUo



"I am gross and perverted
I'm obsessed 'n deranged
I have existed for years
But very little has changed
I'm the tool of the Government
And Industry too
For I am destined to rule
And regulate you

I may be vile and pernicious
But you can't look away
I make you think I'm delicious
With the stuff that I say
I'm the best you can get
Have you guessed me yet?
I'm the slime oozin' out
From your "TV set" (INTERNET)

You will obey me while I lead you
And eat the garbage that I feed you
Until the day that we don't need you
Don't go for help . . . no one will heed you
Your mind is totally controlled
It has been stuffed into my mold
And you will do as you are told
Until the rights to you are sold

That's right, folks . . .
Don't touch that dial
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on December 09, 2019, 01:49:32 PM
Hey Glen, Uncle Frank taught us that in 1973.
https://youtu.be/w-sREpqDiUo



"I am gross and perverted
I'm obsessed 'n deranged
I have existed for years
But very little has changed
I'm the tool of the Government
And Industry too
For I am destined to rule
And regulate you

I may be vile and pernicious
But you can't look away
I make you think I'm delicious
With the stuff that I say
I'm the best you can get
Have you guessed me yet?
I'm the slime oozin' out
From your "TV set" (INTERNET)

You will obey me while I lead you
And eat the garbage that I feed you
Until the day that we don't need you
Don't go for help . . . no one will heed you
Your mind is totally controlled
It has been stuffed into my mold
And you will do as you are told
Until the rights to you are sold

That's right, folks . . .
Don't touch that dial
Thats a clever clip.
He is sorely missed, it would be interesting to see him expressing himself amidst the media's poisonous atmosphere of today.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191209/0b26a1ef2307ae254f56c67941eb62ee.jpg)

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: JusyApples on December 09, 2019, 03:39:46 PM
No way...???

Next you’ll be saying that Murdoch press and Sky News employ a mining director, that happens to have a geological degree (technically making them a scientist) to put forward complete falsehoods and make opinions sound like facts...

Seriously, how could anyone think that an upstanding man like Ian Plimer, who only earns around $500,000.00 as the non executive director of a few mining companies and currently only holds about 5.4 million shares in just one mining company, would ever write anything about the environment that’s not 100% factual.

There’s even a heap of word for word quotes of Ian’s in some of the posts above, so the mining director must be right....
So you are having a go at mining companies.... Perhaps a little research should be conducted in who sponsors Australia’s science channel... that being The Royal Institution of Australia.. who does it list as their founding partner.. Santos.. what does Santos do? So to say mining companies have an agenda is a bit rich when they sponsor the same institute where this Dr Karl thing comes from.

Why does Dr Karl’s thoughts on climate change have more weight then Professor Plimer? Dr Karl also makes money out of his opinion. Perhaps he also earns $400k a year?

Why does a wage even come into it? Because a person earns lots of money their theories, opinions and research holds less weight then anyone else?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 09, 2019, 04:10:50 PM
Why does Dr Karl’s thoughts on climate change have more weight then Professor Plimer?
One conveys proven facts, the other is a proven lier.  ???

Professor Plimer;
"There is no problem with global warming. It stopped in 1998. The last two years of global cooling have erased nearly 30 years of temperature increase."
Reality;
The last decade 2010-2019 was the hottest on record.

Professor Plimer;
"Human additions of CO2 to the atmosphere must be taken into perspective.
Over the past 250 years, humans have added just one part of CO2 in 10,000 to the atmosphere. One volcanic cough can do this in a day."
Reality;
(https://skepticalscience.com/pics/volcanicco2smaller.jpg)

But I’m never going to convince you that Murdoch/Sky commentators are misrepresenting the facts to suit their agendas, and your never going to convince me that their opinions are actually science based facts.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 09, 2019, 04:13:22 PM
Looks like tomorrow is going to be another horrible day in NSW. I hope they got their back burning done today.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191209/0183fccdcd98719f58a5446dd0e3bc87.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 09, 2019, 07:24:39 PM
Got to love science.   It is so.....confusing. 

Reading recent articles from the BoM regarding the combination of weather events currently affecting Australia, explaining how the weather is causing the drought along with the heatwave conditions in the north of the Country while there is cold events happening in the southern States.   

Reading on in the article was reference to the current weather event over the Antarctic being good for the Hole in the Ozone.  Apparently PSCs are the vital to the destruction of the Ozone and cause of the Hole in the Ozone.  Now trying to work out the role of CFCs causing the Hole.  Now the new cause for the Hole in the Ozone is the Greenhouse Gas affect.   

From what I have seen the science of this one is far from settled.     
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Gazza00 on December 09, 2019, 08:04:27 PM
At least they will be OK come summer      there's  FA left to burn
Now that the place has had a good clean out, maybe they will try to keep it that way





Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 09, 2019, 08:44:01 PM
At least they will be OK come summer      there's  FA left to burn
Now that the place has had a good clean out, maybe they will try to keep it that way

Not all, just a fair chunk in places.  Plenty of unburnt bits in the mosaic. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 09, 2019, 10:12:37 PM
Just trying to say, the mobs screaming about unprecedented man made temp / co2 and what ever else, heres the figure XYZ  to prove the rises and our points etc ..
 There is IMO no way those  figures  could be accurate and can be tagged as all man made..

So you're not a scientist, meaning you have no idea whatsoever how the figures you are talking about are actually attained - and because it's beyond your comprehension, you'll just call it a bunch of bullShit? Sorry mate but that's not a particularly constructive approach to the discussion. In all seriousness, the discussion really has to move on from that level - that's ten years ago, we have no time for it today.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on December 09, 2019, 10:58:11 PM
For those too lazy to look for themselves.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/what-exxon-knew-about-climate-change

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/15092015/Exxons-own-research-confirmed-fossil-fuels-role-in-global-warming

Google actuaries, reinsurers and global warming.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/rob-magazine/an-industry-that-has-woken-up-to-climate-change-no-deniers-at-global-resinsurance-giant/article15635331/

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: prodigyrf on December 10, 2019, 01:10:30 AM
For those too lazy to look for themselves.



None of it matters anymore mate as this year was the 30th anniversary of the UN announcement that we're all doomed anyway- 
https://apnews.com/bd45c372caf118ec99964ea547880cd0

Some of you haven't experienced much dooming and may be inclined to panic and not accept the dooming but all I can say is stay calm for the young people and be stoic about it for their sakes. British stiff upper lip and all that as we experienced doomsters well know. During the Cold War we had to practice crouching under the school desks if we saw the flash and kissing our ass goodbye. Then there was the Club of Rome and running out of oil in the 70s and we'd all starve like Malthus warned-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Club_of_Rome

Followed by the worry about the coming of the next Ice Age with the cooling from the 1940s to the 1970s-
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/03/01/global-cooling-compilation/

Some of us seasoned veterans also survived the Adelaide Tidal Wave too even if we didn't join the preppers and head for the hills and had no internet to warn us all-
http://www.adelaiderememberwhen.com.au/adelaides-tidal-wave-the-one-that-never-happened/

Then there was Y2k when we had the computers to model all the potential dooming but that looked like we'd be doomed trying to do that.

Remember don't panic stay calm and let the dooming come to you so good luck to you all with the dooming and may your God travel with you  :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: JusyApples on December 10, 2019, 04:23:30 AM
One conveys proven facts, the other is a proven lier.  ???

Professor Plimer;
"There is no problem with global warming. It stopped in 1998. The last two years of global cooling have erased nearly 30 years of temperature increase."
Reality;
The last decade 2010-2019 was the hottest on record.

Professor Plimer;
"Human additions of CO2 to the atmosphere must be taken into perspective.
Over the past 250 years, humans have added just one part of CO2 in 10,000 to the atmosphere. One volcanic cough can do this in a day."
Reality;
(https://skepticalscience.com/pics/volcanicco2smaller.jpg)

But I’m never going to convince you that Murdoch/Sky commentators are misrepresenting the facts to suit their agendas, and your never going to convince me that their opinions are actually science based facts.
How can you determine its the hottest on record? Records haven’t been kept for very long in Australia at all. Also the way temperatures are read has changed. The BOM have also admitted to fudging the figures. Talk about agendas.

Just by looking at the records I can see different states hottest days on records comprise of 1960 x 2 , 1939, 1889 unofficially in Cloncurry, 1998.

In January 1939, 1000 homes were destroyed by a bushfire in Victoria.

Even locally for me in the 1940s is the worst drought we have had, the dam went dry and the Hawkesbury river stopped flowing. There are pictures of this available.

You just preach the scaremongering line of climate change without doing any research because you are left leaning. Climate change is all about making money.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 10, 2019, 06:47:02 AM
So you're not a scientist, meaning you have no idea whatsoever how the figures you are talking about are actually attained - and because it's beyond your comprehension, you'll just call it a bunch of bullShit? Sorry mate but that's not a particularly constructive approach to the discussion. In all seriousness, the discussion really has to move on from that level - that's ten years ago, we have no time for it today.


Ok Professor ...  Hugs n  :-* :-*    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEoSf43cDdo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEoSf43cDdo)     ::)     "   we have no time for it    "            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFEoMO0pc7k (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFEoMO0pc7k)  ;D ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on December 10, 2019, 08:06:15 AM
The Adelaide Tidal Wave that brings back memories, Jan 19th 1976 if my memory is correct, my first day of work as an apprentice cabinetmaker, asked the boss if he would sign my papers as qualified because we were all going to die at 11 am anyway.
Don Dunstan saved us all standing on the end of the Glenelg jetty. ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Robbo on December 10, 2019, 08:29:12 AM
I think that both sides of this debate are getting a little too carried away and personal.
Lighten up lads as our opinions are not going to change a thing.  :cheers: :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Spada on December 10, 2019, 08:40:24 AM
.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: doc evil on December 10, 2019, 09:35:04 AM
just adding fuel to the fire........... ;D ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 10, 2019, 10:46:35 AM
Still some nasty Shit happening out round Buchan :(


This Watch & Act message is being issued for Timbarra Settlement.

    There is a bushfire at 6km east of Ensay that is not yet under control.
    The bushfire is travelling in a easterly direction towards Timbarra Settlement.
    The fire has crossed Helipad Track heading towards Watts Creek Track
    Fire fighters are assessing the spread of the fire from yesterday.
    The Timbarra Road and the Bruthen-Buchan Road remains open at this stage. This may change subject to fire behaviour. 

Don't wait, leaving now is the safest option - conditions may change and get worse very quickly.

The Timbarra Road and the Bruthen-Buchan Road remains open at this stage. This may change subject to fire behaviour. 



https://www.emergency.vic.gov.au/respond/#!/warning/9590 (https://www.emergency.vic.gov.au/respond/#!/warning/9590)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: KeithB on December 10, 2019, 10:55:53 AM
We live close to Sydney Harbour and the smoke coming in from the north west has brought visibility down to less than 500 metres. And it's getting worse every hour. Shopping malls in the burbs are starting to fill up with smoke.
My thoughts go out to the poor buggers who have to live through these fires and my admiration to the dedicated but exhausted firefighters.
Keith
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 10, 2019, 02:35:17 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ELFWvn1XUAASz_l.jpg:large)



Mile Creek Fire, up road from hairs
Firefighters and aircraft working on the Myall Creek Road fire north of Maclean. Hot and dry conditions are fanning the fire
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ELFRk-yVAAAP--x.jpg:large)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 10, 2019, 03:08:31 PM
At least water resupp is close ..
Helicopters all but drained the small dam at my Nephews place last week, Now him and his 15 yro son after nearly two weeks of fighting fires in the local area  are now faced with a fire aprox 500 m from their home and virtualy no water to fight it.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 10, 2019, 03:10:41 PM
Rain, a floods worth is the only thing that's going to put out these fires.
Crews are spent, but keep going.Communities are fearful, many are in disbelief how long this has been going on for.
Just saw some pictures of the country around Tommy's Rocks lookout, over looking the Newton Boyd area(upper Mann River), it looks like the Flinders Ranges, devoid of any vegetation or colour.


A bloke, Drew Cruchshank shared these pic of the country  looking from Toomy's Rocks.
The country is going to take along time recovery, if it does get a chance to.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191210/6f50f63438421228a5deffa47afa0f21.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 10, 2019, 03:13:22 PM


At least water resupp is close ..
Helicopters all but drained the small dam at my Nephews place last week, Now him and his 15 yro son after nearly two weeks of fighting fires in the local area  are now faced with a fire aprox 500 m from their home and virtualy no water to fight it.

That's not good at all mate.
That's bad.
:(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 10, 2019, 04:22:58 PM
I know alot of people have been effected by these fires. Jezuz alot of country has been burnt.
Not much of the Clarence Valley has been spared.
It has nearly made it from coast to the Great Dividing Range to the coast again.
Take care guys & girls.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191210/97783ace025a89c9cacbf8c411d529a8.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 10, 2019, 05:20:14 PM
Lets hope these storms don't cause more heartache.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191210/1fd118f5bf463194f7412a67b90e9980.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 10, 2019, 05:33:36 PM
A bloke, Drew Cruchshank shared these pic of the country  looking from Toomy's Rocks.
The country is going to take along time recovery, if it does get a chance to.

Those images are phenomenal. :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 10, 2019, 06:04:28 PM
Those images are phenomenal. :(
Mate,
I've travelled that country a few times.
The landscape around Nymboida, I have been told is the same.
So would all the country that has suffered the furiey of these fires.
Ok, Sydney residents have endured smoke, many in NSW have lost more.
:(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rockrat on December 10, 2019, 06:13:11 PM
I have no doubt that humans have and will continue to have a big impact on the earth, not just climate change, but in a multitude of ways.   But as the graphic below shows, the earth did pretty well without humans for a very very long time and I have no doubt it will do so again in the future.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 10, 2019, 06:31:42 PM
I have no doubt that humans have and will continue to have a big impact on the earth, not just climate change, but in a multitude of ways.   But as the graphic below shows, the earth did pretty well without humans for a very very long time and I have no doubt it will do so again in the future.

Looks like f all from midnight to 11.58..43 and then humans!  So in 1 minute 17 seconds we certainly have screwed up big time.

What hope have we got when falous invisible mate is going to burn all the same sex voters and morrisson is throwing buckets of hope and sympathy at the fires.  We sure do have some Shit for brain people in charge of things..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 11, 2019, 08:46:20 AM
I think that both sides of this debate are getting a little too carried away and personal.
Lighten up lads as our opinions are not going to change a thing.  :cheers: :cheers:

See, it's all his fault :D

Look what that bloody cigarette did to the country round him :o
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 11, 2019, 08:50:45 AM
A bloke, Drew Cruchshank shared these pic of the country  looking from Toomy's Rocks.
The country is going to take along time recovery, if it does get a chance to.

That is unbelievable :'(

& then, when it does rain, all the dirt is just going to wash down those hills, as there's nothing to hold it in place :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 11, 2019, 08:58:44 AM
ya wouldnt wanna be alive before 6:08 eh..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 11, 2019, 09:42:15 AM
That is unbelievable :'(

& then, when it does rain, all the dirt is just going to wash down those hills, as there's nothing to hold it in place :'(

Wrong mate...Morrissons hopes and prayers will see it stick together.   Govt has an obligation to its citizens.  Looks like the current mob are not too worried about us at all. Previous ones as well.  We have a big history of fires in this nation and yet we still have no where near enough fire fighting equipment to handle 1 state...let alone the country.  Wonder what would happen if all the volunteers let Canberra burn whilst they sat around thinking hope and prayers will extinguish it? Same goes for the drought...no govt action or ideas on how to fix many of the govt cluster f*&^s that have added to the problem. So many lives of humans and animals lost as well as land, houses and other property.  The whole of Oz is almost one big disaster area.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 11, 2019, 10:33:36 AM
Quote from: Bigfish
Wrong mate...Morrissons hopes and prayers will see it stick together.   Govt has an obligation to its citizens.

na, hes released the latest version of the Religious bullShit bill again - so that should have the fires out and the smoke cleared by 4pm sarvo.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 11, 2019, 01:35:39 PM
That is unbelievable :'(

& then, when it does rain, all the dirt is just going to wash down those hills, as there's nothing to hold it in place :'(
That's it mate.
And the ash, it's bad :(
It's going to take a long time to recover.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 11, 2019, 04:58:07 PM
That's it mate.
And the ash, it's bad :(
It's going to take a long time to recover.

Be okay if we get steady rain, not the hard heavy gully rackers.  The ash will be good fertiliser.  Couple of weeks/months and the trees will be regenerating with new growth.   Some of the Forestry earlier burnt is already regenerating.  Part of the Aussie bush. 

The bigger problem is while the fires have been bad, most of the fires haven't been that server.  Was just talking to my Dad about the fires and he was saying his Dad told of a fire that came from the southeast and burnt through to the northwest.  Everyone thought that would be it.  Trouble was a week later an old stump that was still burning underground flared up again this time burning the opposite way.  The first fire burnt the undergrowth and ground fuel.  During that week all the now dead leaves fell and the second fire burnt the leaves and other fallen burnt timber catching everyone out. 

If you take a run up the highway from Iluka to New Italy, see all the leaf litter and other fallen timber, branches etc, ready to burn again.  In patches along the highway there are sections of trees completely burnt while others still have a lot of leaves, ready to burn again.  Sadly all depends on the weather we get. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 11, 2019, 05:09:10 PM


Be okay if we get steady rain, not the hard heavy gully rackers.  The ash will be good fertiliser.  Couple of weeks/months and the trees will be regenerating with new growth.   Some of the Forestry earlier burnt is already regenerating.  Part of the Aussie bush. 

The bigger problem is while the fires have been bad, most of the fires haven't been that server.  Was just talking to my Dad about the fires and he was saying his Dad told of a fire that came from the southeast and burnt through to the northwest.  Everyone thought that would be it.  Trouble was a week later an old stump that was still burning underground flared up again this time burning the opposite way.  The first fire burnt the undergrowth and ground fuel.  During that week all the now dead leaves fell and the second fire burnt the leaves and other fallen burnt timber catching everyone out. 

If you take a run up the highway from Iluka to New Italy, see all the leaf litter and other fallen timber, branches etc, ready to burn again.  In patches along the highway there are sections of trees completely burnt while others still have a lot of leaves, ready to burn again.  Sadly all depends on the weather we get.

I haven't had a need to travel up the H/way or anywhere, maybe that's a good thing, I reckon it would be numbing.

You are right about the logs, branches and leaves falling and causing another  problem.

It's not good.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 11, 2019, 05:11:52 PM
This storm front will cause more problems than it solves.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191211/5b8a9c14ca0ad2b769f6414a3eee74cc.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Brij on December 11, 2019, 07:43:30 PM
Some interesting thoughts, and data, particularly the "Chinese Effect", and solar radiation variabls, and longer term temp records/trends, not just the last 200 years of industrial revolution, but 1000s of years of trends.

http://thelongview.com.au/documents.html (http://thelongview.com.au/documents.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 11, 2019, 08:02:12 PM
The bigger problem is while the fires have been bad, most of the fires haven't been that server.  Was just talking to my Dad about the fires and he was saying his Dad told of a fire that came from the southeast and burnt through to the northwest.  Everyone thought that would be it.  Trouble was a week later an old stump that was still burning underground flared up again this time burning the opposite way.  The first fire burnt the undergrowth and ground fuel.  During that week all the now dead leaves fell and the second fire burnt the leaves and other fallen burnt timber catching everyone out.

I've seen that - it doesn't even take a maverick burning stump, a fire that comes in through unburnt bush can roar straight across a recent fireground without losing any intensity. A ranger mate down the NSW South Coast told me it's happened a few times following winter/spring burn-offs. Standing hardwood that has been burnt still has a lot to give to a good firefront.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 11, 2019, 08:22:08 PM
Some interesting thoughts, and data, particularly the "Chinese Effect", and solar radiation variabls, and longer term temp records/trends, not just the last 200 years of industrial revolution, but 1000s of years of trends.

http://thelongview.com.au/documents.html (http://thelongview.com.au/documents.html)


A lot of different weather events all combining to affect separate areas.  We have been in drought conditions for a while and haven't really had enough rain to say we are out of drought, just enough rain to keep us on the cusp of drought.  Last year didn't help nor did a very dry winter.  It's all about the weather events. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 11, 2019, 08:35:05 PM


I've seen that - it doesn't even take a maverick burning stump, a fire that comes in through unburnt bush can roar straight across a recent fireground without losing any intensity. A ranger mate down the NSW South Coast told me it's happened a few times following winter/spring burn-offs. Standing hardwood that has been burnt still has a lot to give to a good firefront.

With the right weather conditions fire will go most places the fuel is. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 11, 2019, 09:12:39 PM
With the right weather conditions fire will go most places the fuel is. 

Kind of brings it back to the current issue - the effect of climate change on fires. This is quite literally the start of what we can expect for the next 5-10 years, after which it will get worse - assuming there's anything left to burn.

Because those right weather conditions are becoming business as usual. Here on the Sunshine Coast we had a visit from RFS in June, they wanted to tell us that the fire season start would be in July. Usually it's around October. So by late July we were doing drills with RFS - we're working on being their refillers, so they can come off the fireground and have some downtime while we man the pumps before they go back out again.

But here's another problem - SES are now coming into storm season, our primary function, but it looks like we'll still be supporting RFS at the same time. So that overlap is yet another thing we're going to have to cope with.

Anyone want to join RFS/CFS/SES? We're going to need you.

(Volunteer membership of above entities drops every year, although thankfully my SES unit and the RFS units we support are still strong)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 11, 2019, 10:17:10 PM
Kind of brings it back to the current issue - the effect of climate change on fires. This is quite literally the start of what we can expect for the next 5-10 years, after which it will get worse - assuming there's anything left to burn.

Because those right weather conditions are becoming business as usual. Here on the Sunshine Coast we had a visit from RFS in June, they wanted to tell us that the fire season start would be in July. Usually it's around October. So by late July we were doing drills with RFS - we're working on being their refillers, so they can come off the fireground and have some downtime while we man the pumps before they go back out again.

But here's another problem - SES are now coming into storm season, our primary function, but it looks like we'll still be supporting RFS at the same time. So that overlap is yet another thing we're going to have to cope with.

Anyone want to join RFS/CFS/SES? We're going to need you.

(Volunteer membership of above entities drops every year, although thankfully my SES unit and the RFS units we support are still strong)

I know a lot of RFS have left over the past decade as they just were not doing what they joined up to do. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 11, 2019, 10:43:18 PM
I'll leave that one for current/former RFS members to comment on - but it doesn't change the fact that we need people. Even if you can't walk 500 metres, you're useful on a radio.

And to everyone out there - don't put the volunteers at risk just because you're a lazy c%$^! Clean your place up NOW, make an effort. Here's a tip - when the volunteer crew turns up at your place and they just see Shit everywhere, they'll get on the radio to other teams in the area and figure out which properties really deserve their protection. And fair enough too. Their personal well-being is primary.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 12, 2019, 01:36:59 PM
Some interesting thoughts,

Very interesting, but I hope he's wrong ??? :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 17, 2019, 03:58:37 PM
Hey,
On a bright note,
Must be the first time in months that we have had a Blue Sky, thanks to the easterly.
Don't get me wrong, the RFS and others have worked their arses off.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191217/fcfff3f89d10ac0485b6f70f1bddf1a9.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 17, 2019, 04:41:54 PM
Hey,
On a bright note,
Must be the first time in months that we have had a Blue Sky, thanks to the easterly.
Don't get me wrong, the RFS and others have worked their arses off.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191217/fcfff3f89d10ac0485b6f70f1bddf1a9.jpg)
I could see a few camper trailers parked up on the left/center/right just there.... ;)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 17, 2019, 09:49:05 PM
Hey,
On a bright note,
Must be the first time in months that we have had a Blue Sky, thanks to the easterly.
Don't get me wrong, the RFS and others have worked their arses off.

Another bright side for Jon, travelling back from up north today and some of the burnt section between New Italy and Iluka starting to reshoot.  All those fresh new leaves. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 18, 2019, 12:54:51 PM
I could see a few camper trailers parked up on the left/center/right just there.... ;)
Plenty of room
Cheers
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 18, 2019, 09:30:16 PM
Yep climate change .. Interesting vid ..  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WppbuIoyXdg&t=115s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WppbuIoyXdg&t=115s)   .. and this isnt Robinson Carusso with news records .
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Rodt on December 19, 2019, 06:21:05 AM
Hey,
On a bright note,
Must be the first time in months that we have had a Blue Sky, thanks to the easterly.

It's all blown over our way  :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 19, 2019, 08:14:04 AM
Yep climate change .. Interesting vid ..  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WppbuIoyXdg&t=115s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WppbuIoyXdg&t=115s)   .. and this isnt Robinson Carusso with news records .

If you havent heard...this bullShit that BOM was hiding and manipulating data has been shown to be absolute crap.  Several months ago there was a full run down on the whole process of transferring all records to digital. Just wish I had kept the article because I get sick of hearing crap news and conspiracy theories from ignorant trolls.

Heres one .

Google has quite a few conspiracy theories.  They also say man never walked on the moon...the cheese would have melted from the spacecrafts engines
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Craig Tomkinson on December 19, 2019, 08:49:25 AM
Sorry Squalo, I would love to join but I put in 30 years taught by the old fellows in the field, then spent around another 7 years in the BFB I did all the training chain saw courses and this and that, I loved the old way were we trained them in house on the job,did not need a ticket to use something on mostly private property,  Left in the end got sick of doing up dates on stuff I did not think needed doing and had a run in with NO 1 officer as I was 2ic, A lot of the trouble on the coast people choose to live with all the bush right up to there house, I do not, my block is clean no trees or bush near the place or on the block just for fires would love the shade but hate rubbish that can burn around my house, there were 27 different palms and trees and crap right up to the house when we bought it 3 years ago we cleared it all away for fire control,  But theses people that live in bush want some poor bastard to help them when a fire gets going and out of control, I got sick the greeny Fwits burning without permits and proper control measures, The first photo is my house nice and clean, lawn needs mowing , second photo is my neighbours house with trees right up to it and all the gardens mulched 8 inchs deep, if there a fire its gone, the trees you can see are all on both Neighbours blocks both sides of me it Shits me as they are Shit scared of fires all the time but do nothing about it, Craig   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 19, 2019, 12:53:28 PM
Unprecedented is one word used a lot with the current fires.  Guess you can say that when you don't look at what has happened before.   

"Large fires in the east and west
1974-75 also saw the most severe fire season for perhaps 30 years in the far west of the State with 3,755,000 hectares burnt, 50,000 stock lost and 10,170km of fencing destroyed. One and a half million hectares were burnt in the Cobar Shire and 340,000ha in the Balranald Shire. At that time, the Moolah-Corinya fire was the largest fire ever to be put out by firefighters. The perimeter was over 1,000km. Three people died in the fire, 100 were hurt and 40 homes were destroyed.

In the late 1970s, the Blue Mountains endured two bad fire seasons. In late 1976, 65,000ha were burnt. The following year, one life was lost, 49 buildings were destroyed alongside of a further 54,000ha. Serious fires occurred in the Southern Highlands two years later in 1978-79. Major fires were widespread for the 1979-80 fire season burning over one million hectares in total across the State.
"

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/about-us/history (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/about-us/history)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: krisandkev on December 19, 2019, 03:15:57 PM
Unprecedented is one word used a lot with the current fires.  Guess you can say that when you don't look at what has happened before.   

Totally agree. I have read similar articles but I guess the media are loving all the current drama. Take the most nationally pushed news item, poor Sydney having smoke! Like we all must be living there, no we don't. Like do other places have bad smoke - yes we do!
I also read history on fires in Tasmania. Very interesting and on the west coast you can still see huge areas where the fires have been. But I suppose this time it is the gov fault, as some have been saying.  Kevin
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 19, 2019, 04:13:18 PM
9 news,
40 homes lost today.
Sheeeesh.
:(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 19, 2019, 05:11:27 PM
Why do reporters have to scream/shout about reporting these fires now around Sydney?
The rest of the East coast has been burning for nearly 5 months, but now it is closer to Sydney it is an emergency.
Oh I forgot, they have smoke haze as well.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: bmwfreak on December 19, 2019, 05:56:03 PM
[quote author=krisandkev
Take the most nationally pushed news item, poor Sydney having smoke! Like we all must be living there, no we don't. Like do other places have bad smoke - yes we do!
[/quote]
Just took this photo out the front at home. Not a reporter in sight, ahh that’s right, we don’t live in Sydney
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191219/94583898e51f8ab51b380bd231cb8223.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191219/6992e77832dd7f673e52dec86152b25e.jpg)



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 19, 2019, 06:06:40 PM
[quote author=krisandkev
Take the most nationally pushed news item, poor Sydney having smoke! Like we all must be living there, no we don't. Like do other places have bad smoke - yes we do!

Just took this photo out the front at home. Not a reporter in sight, ahh that’s right, we don’t live in Sydney
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191219/94583898e51f8ab51b380bd231cb8223.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191219/6992e77832dd7f673e52dec86152b25e.jpg)



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Fark the media,
Seariously they get it wrong more times than right.
10, The Project, just said there are over 100 fires impacting Sydney, WTF.
Fires Near Me does not show this.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 19, 2019, 06:21:06 PM
Fark the media,
Seariously they get it wrong more times than right.
10, The Project, just said there are over 100 fires impacting Sydney, WTF.
Fires Near Me does not show this.

that would be 100 fires in NSW so they are impacting Sydney as Sydney is NSW
Title: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 19, 2019, 06:33:46 PM
I also read history on fires in Tasmania. Very interesting and on the west coast you can still see huge areas where the fires have been. But I suppose this time it is the gov fault, as some have been saying.  Kevin
Interesting you mention Tasmania fires.
Was reading this just the other day;  https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/dec/15/tasmanias-flowering-giants-we-will-never-see-such-trees-again (https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/dec/15/tasmanias-flowering-giants-we-will-never-see-such-trees-again)

(https://i-guim-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org/ii/w1200/s/i.guim.co.uk/img/media/00fa056e6135acc38c0e7f3fbc191912510bec61/0_0_2400_1441/master/2400.jpg?width=605&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=7c9178b8c814c590709317857ed7d741)

“Adventure photographer Steve Pearce recently photographed the collapsed giant. Before its fall, it was a contender for the world’s biggest flowering tree by volume at 360 cubic metres, which is roughly the equivalent volume of three Boeing 737-300s. “This tree was 87 metres tall. It had a circumference of 17.2 metres. Now it is just a crumpled mess,” said Pearce.”
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on December 19, 2019, 08:04:43 PM
Why do reporters have to scream/shout about reporting these fires now around Sydney?
The rest of the East coast has been burning for nearly 5 months, but now it is closer to Sydney it is an emergency.
Oh I forgot, they have smoke haze as well.

Hairs. I not sure what your problem is , it’s not a p#ssing contest. The fires that are burning now near Sydney are some 80 to plus 100km from Sydney. You may think they are a stroll up the road from down town Parramatta but they are not. These are rural and semi rural villages.
The community I lived in for 30 years in the north west of Sydney on the northern side of the BlueMountains is  one off these communities.
It is a district renowned for their mountain apple orchards, stone fruit For others it is a place that they can grow fresh flowers. And area that thrives because of its black volcanic soil.
The fires are an emergency, they are burning in both remote ravines , wild country but also around the villages that live on the edge of this landscape. Not all people live on the properties but live in the villages where the school is the pub is the fire shed, a bit like where you live.
Tell my mate Sam  that the fire is not an emergency, he has a productive orchard at which he lost his cool room, his packing shed, another building where he produces one of the best apple pies in Australia. In his cool room was 6 months worth of apples, his orchard has also been damaged.

To the south west of Sydney there is another fire some 100 km from Sydney and again a rural area that also has a village area. I believe houses have been lost here this afternoon.
 The people of these areas can’t help that the media are out in force doing their job.
What is real is if the fires are not contain then the fires will run to the edges of Sydney where a  thousands of people live, people with little kids, elderly people. This is why it is a story.

Like the rfs in your area my mates have been out fighting other fires for ever, they are tied but now the fires are in their community and so they are still going harder than ever but also ever thankful for the support that is coming from other brigades include those fro finge bush land suburbs of Sydney.

Maybe I should have posted this in the rant, it just annoys the sh# t out of me that you can look upon these unfortunate people with a lessor care than those that live further from the largest metropolis in Australia.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 19, 2019, 08:20:41 PM
Hairs. I not sure what your problem is , it’s not a p#ssing contest. The fires that are burning now near Sydney are some 80 to plus 100km from Sydney. You may think they are a stroll up the road from down town Parramatta but they are not. These are rural and semi rural villages.
The community I lived in for 30 years in the north west of Sydney on the northern side of the BlueMountains is  one off these communities.
It is a district renowned for their mountain apple orchards, stone fruit For others it is a place that they can grow fresh flowers. And area that thrives because of its black volcanic soil.
The fires are an emergency, they are burning in both remote ravines , wild country but also around the villages that live on the edge of this landscape. Not all people live on the properties but live in the villages where the school is the pub is the fire shed, a bit like where you live.
Tell my mate Sam  that the fire is not an emergency, he has a productive orchard at which he lost his cool room, his packing shed, another building where he produces one of the best apple pies in Australia. In his cool room was 6 months worth of apples, his orchard has also been damaged.

To the south west of Sydney there is another fire some 100 km from Sydney and again a rural area that also has a village area. I believe houses have been lost here this afternoon.
 The people of these areas can’t help that the media are out in force doing their job.
What is real is if the fires are not contain then the fires will run to the edges of Sydney where a  thousands of people live, people with little kids, elderly people. This is why it is a story.

Like the rfs in your area my mates have been out fighting other fires for ever, they are tied but now the fires are in their community and so they are still going harder than ever but also ever thankful for the support that is coming from other brigades include those fro finge bush land suburbs of Sydney.

Maybe I should have posted this in the rant, it just annoys the sh# t out of me that you can look upon these unfortunate people with a lessor care than those that live further from the largest metropolis in Australia.
Hes more complaining about the way they report... they way they make it sound - you'd believe 50ft flames are raging down George St heading for the Rocks.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on December 19, 2019, 08:36:35 PM
Hes more complaining about the way they report... they way they make it sound - you'd believe 50ft flames are raging down George St heading for the Rocks.

Bird I can read into Hairs post, he is implying because the media are reporting on the fires that it is an emergency, when in fact it’s just some scrub fire over the back of a paling fence.
The government has declared it as an emergency based on the advise of emergency services.
The residents will think its an emergency, fark even the climate brigade are crying it’s an emergency and where the hell is the pm
Whether it has been burning for 5 months or 5 minutes is irrelevant. And yes the media have been reporting on the fires in the Grafton area otherwise how did I know about it.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 20, 2019, 05:50:50 AM
Hey Rags,
Please tell me what my problem is.
Cause I have no idea.
Cheers
:)

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on December 20, 2019, 06:56:27 AM
Its the same in every state.
In Qld back in 2011, 1/2 eastern part of the state was under water, Rockhampton had areas evacuated, the runway under water and the airport buildings were sandbagged so they wouldn't be flooded. Bundaburg had the river flowing down the main street, the population of whole towns were loaded in helicopters and moved out...

then Brisbane copped the rain and the rest of the state didn't rate a mention anymore.


In other news; 2 fire fighters died and 3 injured in a MVA last night and another 3 in a serious condition after they were over run by the fire yesterday afternoon.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-20/two-volunteer-firefighrers-dead-after-nsw-rfs-truck-rolls/11816732
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 20, 2019, 09:12:16 AM
2 young firefighting dads have been killed today.  Very sad.  I just hope that the govt has some sort of life insurance in place for these volunteers...Families will need emotional, family community and financial support.  More than a bucket of hope and prayers.  Without these and other volunteers Australia would be a cesspool.  We can get by with a lot less pollies but every volunteer is highly needed.  R.I.P....Heroes.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 20, 2019, 01:43:04 PM
There is supposed to be insurance cover, but how do you put a $ value on life without a dad :'(

RIP
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: speewa158 on December 20, 2019, 06:02:05 PM
OK  lets settle down  , we are being wiped into a frensy on reports in the press . Alobo wants to spill his guts on TV about paying Vols with a council truck in the back ground not a fire truck .
l have just returned from my  2nd deployment to NSW to fight fires    ,   its not fun .
We are not doing enough Pre fire season burns to manage the bush fuel load . This will slow the bulk of litter on the bush floor but the creepie crallies wont have any where to live . The Greens are not really in the picture on this . DO Pre Season Burns  to reduce the fuel load . Less Fuel /Less Fire

Let the trolls start on this Horry Old Bone  , or stand on a fire truck
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 20, 2019, 06:09:02 PM


OK  lets settle down  , we are being wiped into a frensy on reports in the press . Alobo wants to spill his guts on TV about paying Vols with a council truck in the back ground not a fire truck .
l have just returned from my  2nd deployment to NSW to fight fires    ,   its not fun .
We are not doing enough Pre fire season burns to manage the bush fuel load . This will slow the bulk of litter on the bush floor but the creepie crallies wont have any where to live . The Greens are not really in the picture on this . DO Pre Season Burns  to reduce the fuel load . Less Fuel /Less Fire

Let the trolls start on this Horry Old Bone  , or stand on a fire truck

Hey Jamie,
Been thinking you have been out giving of you time.
Thanks Mate.
The media have played us for fools.

You rest up, enjoy your cold beer.
Cheers.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on December 20, 2019, 06:13:30 PM
OK  lets settle down  , we are being wiped into a frensy on reports in the press . Alobo wants to spill his guts on TV about paying Vols with a council truck in the back ground not a fire truck .
l have just returned from my  2nd deployment to NSW to fight fires    ,   its not fun .
We are not doing enough Pre fire season burns to manage the bush fuel load . This will slow the bulk of litter on the bush floor but the creepie crallies wont have any where to live . The Greens are not really in the picture on this . DO Pre Season Burns  to reduce the fuel load . Less Fuel /Less Fire

Let the trolls start on this Horry Old Bone  , or stand on a fire truck

Well said brother!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: speewa158 on December 20, 2019, 06:20:27 PM

Hey Jamie,
Been thinking you have been out giving of you time.
Thanks Mate.
The media have played us for fools.

You rest up, enjoy your cold beer.

Got that happening        :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 20, 2019, 07:26:58 PM
Quote from: speewa158
We are not doing enough Pre fire season burns to manage the bush fuel load
You'll get tarred n feathered for bringing logic to this discussion, or any on the fires...

oh and you forgot to say Coal and Scomo.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: speewa158 on December 20, 2019, 08:02:27 PM
You'll get tarred n feathered for bringing logic to this discussion, or any on the fires...

oh and you forgot to say Coal and Scomo.

Used to pay Good Money for such ,,,, Young People Today wouldn't know if a Large Brown Dog was upon them ,,,,,,, Coal & l voted for Scomo     Could l also say  " Doze in a Greenie/Vegan "

That ort to set them on fire  , at least a back burn ,,,,,
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 20, 2019, 10:42:55 PM
OK  lets settle down  , we are being wiped into a frensy on reports in the press . Alobo wants to spill his guts on TV about paying Vols with a council truck in the back ground not a fire truck .
l have just returned from my  2nd deployment to NSW to fight fires    ,   its not fun .
We are not doing enough Pre fire season burns to manage the bush fuel load . This will slow the bulk of litter on the bush floor but the creepie crallies wont have any where to live . The Greens are not really in the picture on this . DO Pre Season Burns  to reduce the fuel load . Less Fuel /Less Fire

Let the trolls start on this Horry Old Bone  , or stand on a fire truck

Yep it really is that simple. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 20, 2019, 10:47:32 PM
Dunno bout up there, but its dropped dramatically here and there might be a light shower.. just enough to make humidity hit 500%
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Brij on December 21, 2019, 12:22:00 PM
Dunno bout up there, but its dropped dramatically here and there might be a light shower.. just enough to make humidity hit 500%

Temp dropped but winds got up. East Gippsland fires made a run overnight. When I went to bed at 11pm they were at 50,000 hectares.

I checked again at 10am and had grown to 90,000 hectares.

Looks like we are trying to catch up to our neighbours to the north 😕

Went to a district briefing last Monday. Got told we would no longer be sending members interstate for foreseeable future. We were going to be to busy in our own back yard as 4 major fires join together over next few weeks.

Last night they got half way there.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 21, 2019, 05:08:34 PM
Interesting map on the Gospers

https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/nsw/the-monster-a-short-history-of-australia-s-biggest-forest-fire-20191218-p53l4y.html (https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/nsw/the-monster-a-short-history-of-australia-s-biggest-forest-fire-20191218-p53l4y.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 21, 2019, 07:26:24 PM
Yep it really is that simple.
It should be.
But egos, politics wont allow it

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 21, 2019, 11:48:20 PM
It should be.
But egos, politics wont allow it

Egos and politics won't allow hazard reduction burns? Do you know anything at all about the topic?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on December 22, 2019, 06:23:05 AM
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-09-13/is-the-prescribed-burn-window-closing-in-australia/10236048 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-09-13/is-the-prescribed-burn-window-closing-in-australia/10236048)


Yes it's media, yes its more than likely biased, but it sounds about right to my unedumacated brain.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 22, 2019, 07:22:34 AM
Egos and politics won't allow hazard reduction burns? Do you know anything at all about the topic?
Yes I do mate,
Christ.
Talking with rfs captains over the past few months, they are frustrated, talking with farmers, they are frustrated.
Talking with NPWS, the blokes on the ground, they are frustrated.
But what would I know?
Please enlighten us with your expert opinion.
Go on, learn me.


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: achjimmy on December 22, 2019, 07:42:39 AM
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-09-13/is-the-prescribed-burn-window-closing-in-australia/10236048 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-09-13/is-the-prescribed-burn-window-closing-in-australia/10236048)


Yes it's media, yes its more than likely biased, but it sounds about right to my unedumacated brain.

The seasons have swung around , but is also everybodies Failure and getting blame. Hazard reductions have gone wrong in the past . By nature there risky but in today’s blame everyone for my woes society a mistake can’t be tolerated ! Hence the risk is mitigated to the point that the window is even tighter imo
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: raider on December 22, 2019, 08:53:16 AM
The seasons have swung around , but is also everybodies Failure and getting blame. Hazard reductions have gone wrong in the past . By nature there risky but in today’s blame everyone for my woes society a mistake can’t be tolerated ! Hence the risk is mitigated to the point that the window is even tighter imo

Spot on. No one wants to make a mistake because they get crucified.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 22, 2019, 09:07:15 AM
Spot on. No one wants to make a mistake because they get crucified.

Lets not forget that some of the major fires were arson, lightning strikes and hay bales self igniting.

Until the fed govts get their act together and produce a plan then Oz will always be the dumping ground for the world and a once pristine country turned into a giant Shithole.  Forget coal , cattle and gold.  Until we have a foolproof water plan for the nation the rest are nothing.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 22, 2019, 02:03:52 PM
The seasons have swung around , but is also everybodies Failure and getting blame. Hazard reductions have gone wrong in the past . By nature there risky but in today’s blame everyone for my woes society a mistake can’t be tolerated ! Hence the risk is mitigated to the point that the window is even tighter imo

As a young bloke I remember the Hazard Burns being done evening and night.  Then they changed to afternoon and now moved forward to a daytime burns.  During the day time there is very little chance of meeting the prescription to be able to do a burn.  To achieve the cool burn they need to go back to a night time burn, but they would go against too many things. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 22, 2019, 04:12:13 PM
Quote from: alnjan
As a young bloke I remember the Hazard Burns being done evening and night.  Then they changed to afternoon and now moved forward to a daytime burns.  During the day time there is very little chance of meeting the prescription to be able to do a burn.  To achieve the cool burn they need to go back to a night time burn, but they would go against too many things.
Agree..
I remember many weekends where burns were planned, Friday arvo/nights through to Sundays...
Backburns were also a great training situation for cadets/new members.

Have drip torch will travel.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 22, 2019, 04:15:46 PM
Farkles...

Cant imagine this....
Quote
There isn't much left'

There is "not much left" of the township of Balmoral following Saturday's devastating firestorm through the hamlet south west of Sydney, Premier Gladys Berejiklian said.

"We have got the devastating news that there's not much left in fact [in the] town of Balmoral."

"It's devastating not knowing whether your property is standing or not. Unfortunately, we have received bad news. There isn't much left.

"I understand expert teams are going in on the ground in a lot of those communities today, to make full assessments and to let people know when it is safe to go back. Even if people have lost their properties, they still want to go back to see what's left and if there is anything they can salvage. We know that's part of the recovery. We want people to have access to their land, to their property, as soon as they can, but it has to be safe," she said.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 22, 2019, 05:48:48 PM
Agree..
I remember many weekends where burns were planned, Friday arvo/nights through to Sundays...
Backburns were also a great training situation for cadets/new members.

Have drip torch will travel.

And that reminds me of the other thing from the old day to now.  If the weekend was no good, the burn was done on whatever night it was a good night to be burn, mid week or whenever.  Now if it can't be done on the weekend, it can't be done regardless of how good conditions may be mid week.  When you take five days out of each week, you are left with a very smaller window of opportunity. 

Dosen't sound good for Balmoral. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 22, 2019, 06:22:05 PM
It also doesnt help when news  sites use sensationalist headlines that are bullShit..

The headlines and then the truth .....in other words..they have no idea!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 22, 2019, 06:56:02 PM
Quote from: alnjan
And that reminds me of the other thing from the old day to now.  If the weekend was no good, the burn was done on whatever night it was a good night to be burn, mid week or whenever.  Now if it can't be done on the weekend, it can't be done regardless of how good conditions may be mid week. 
Yep... its just Shitful... mainly to do with all the blowin bullShit departments that "need" to be informed.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on December 22, 2019, 07:23:22 PM
Thankfully we have not had the amount of deaths that happened from the fires Victoria experienced years ago.


I think we can all vent our frustrations on Climate change, politicians etc but that’s not going to put the fires out. At the end of the day, after all the fires are extinguished, there needs to be a summit on future prevention and learn from what went wrong.

Yes, reduce the amount of fuel that feeds the fires, allow clearing around property’s etc.

Regarding planes, helicopters dropping water, does it really work. It looks like the water evaporates before it hits the flames due to the intense heat, I am not an expert on this.

Mark


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 22, 2019, 07:29:02 PM
Thankfully we have not had the amount of deaths that happened form the fires Victoria experienced years ago.


I think we can all vent our frustrations on Climate change, politicians etc but that’s not going to put the fires out. At the end of the day, after all the fires are extinguished, there needs to be a summit on future prevention and learn from what went wrong.

Yes, reduce the amount of fuel that feeds the fires, allow clearing around property’s etc.

Regarding planes, helicopters dropping water, does it really work. It looks like the water evaporates before it hits the flames due to the intense heat, I am not an expert on this.

Mark

We had 23 of Australias foremost experts asking for meetings many months  ago with regards to the potential of the current fires. Govt wasn't interested!! 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 22, 2019, 07:41:08 PM
Thankfully we have not had the amount of deaths that happened form the fires Victoria experienced years ago.


I think we can all vent our frustrations on Climate change, politicians etc but that’s not going to put the fires out. At the end of the day, after all the fires are extinguished, there needs to be a summit on future prevention and learn from what went wrong.

Yes, reduce the amount of fuel that feeds the fires, allow clearing around property’s etc.

Regarding planes, helicopters dropping water, does it really work. It looks like the water evaporates before it hits the flames due to the intense heat, I am not an expert on this.

Mark

There will have to be an Inquiry in the deaths and Bushfires in General but yes after the fires will be the time for States and Federal to be involved in some serious debate on all aspects of the Bushfires.  From Property Protection involving all aspects of Fire Prevention Mitigation, including land and buildings, not just Hazard Reduction but also all building requirements to help fireproof buildings.  Then the combating of fire, of all types of fire by all means possible and whatever future technology there may be for fighting the big wildfires. 

My biggest concern is the above will be smothered by those that continue to blame Climate Change as the cause of the fires.  If Climate Change is the cause of the fires then why is there no fires in Deserts.  I mean they are probably hotter and more affected by Climate Change but I don't see the same fires.   Maybe fuel load has something to do about it. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on December 22, 2019, 08:55:53 PM
Regarding planes, helicopters dropping water, does it really work. It looks like the water evaporates before it hits the flames due to the intense heat, I am not an expert on this.

Mark

Yes it works, but only to an extent. Same as the use of air power in any battle.

It will knock the fire down and slow its progression, but you really need boots on the ground to ensure it is out and won't reignite.

I was at a fire on Monday and we had a Blackhawk armed with a 3000L bucket in support. The fire jumped the break and we were just about out of water, so whistled up the bomber and 3000L was dumped on the problem bit. We then had to step in with the hoses to make sure the edges were out.
While we were out and re-filling the NP crew were were assisting were told they were on their own as the pilot had restricted visibility and we were working close to power lines.

So our little 51 medium attack tanker can hold a whopping 1500L, NP's G-Wagon 1000L and where we were working was around 20 minutes in low range each way to get a re-fill, we were also the closest vehicles to the water.

The Blackhawk could deliver 3000L with around a 5 minute transit time to the dam and back, so, yeah, they can really knock a fire down, slow its progression and stop it getting away.

Like any aircraft they are restricted by weather and visibility. In hot weather their performance is degraded (less lift), if a drone is sighted anywhere in the area, then they leave and we were lucky to have a nice massive water source within a few km of the operation area.
The large and very large tankers can drop 15000L+, but need access to a large airport and a lot in infrastructure, so can dump a lot more in a pass, but have significantly longer transit times each way and even with the engines still turning and burning it takes a while to pump 15000L aboard.
 
You still need someone on the ground to ensure it is out or burnt up to and stopped at a fire break. You also need someone to patrol those breaks for days afterwards to make sure that a burnt tree hasn't/isn't going to fall across it or sparks blow across and start it all off again.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on December 22, 2019, 08:59:17 PM
We had 23 of Australias foremost experts asking for meetings many months  ago with regards to the potential of the current fires. Govt wasn't interested!!

 Fixed for you

We had 23 former retired experts in inner city building fires,  who think they are experts in bush fires and newly acquired climate change skills, who didn’t take there opportunity when they had relevance, funded by a group lead by a bloke whose specialty is looking under rocks for bones and calls themselves the Climate Change Action group.
These experts have no other agenda than to be a nuisance whiles attempting to build their profile before standing for candidacy of some green political group at the next election.
 
I would much rather the advise come from current relevant operational experts.
I understand their former colleagues are shaken their heads in disbelief of these  people.
I also understand that to date these experts have turned down the opportunity to meet with the relevant ministers of the government because they thought that only the PM should be engaged. Some would say grandstanding.


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on December 22, 2019, 09:15:39 PM

The large and very large tankers can drop 15000L+, but need access to a large airport and a lot in infrastructure, so can dump a lot more in a pass, but have significantly longer transit times each way and even with the engines still turning and burning it takes a while to pump 15000L aboard.
 


Thought I would share how mobile tankers are being utilised and refilled. in the fire grounds of the Gosper fires on the Bells Line of Rd.
So here’s how they are utilising 2 trucks  like in the photo.
These quarry trucks are strategically placed next to spring hydrants on the water mains. They are continually filling from the main, and as the mobile tanker trucks arrive they can rapidly ( because of the quarry truck pump capacity) refill into the mobile tankers including  a B double Toll tanker. These tankers then spread out over the fire district to resupply fire appliances
Working well and didn’t need the PM to  come up with this idea either, the experts were already on the job.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 22, 2019, 09:19:42 PM
. At the end of the day, after all the fires are extinguished, there needs to be a summit on future prevention and learn from what went wrong.


Mark

The same as happened (NOT ) from the black saturday fires in Victoria..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Jeepers Creepers on December 23, 2019, 05:12:08 AM
A 1.5 million dollar summit will reveal we should do something.
Bugger all will happen regarding a fix or solution.
It will happen again..... then we can ask/blame/moan all the same Shit again.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: achjimmy on December 23, 2019, 07:02:29 AM
Rags is right we don’t need prof Flannery chairing anything to do with the fires ( remember the sea level fear mongering from him ! Now he lives by the sea ) anyway we have excellent clearing rules now in NSW but people aren’t abiding by them ! How many places do you see nestled in trees that are going up . We are the problem we choose to live in these wooded paradises but squeal and blame everyone else when they burn.

Maybe go back to where council would access your property each year and send you notice to clear or they’d appoint a contractor to do so .
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 07:19:07 AM
Fixed for you

We had 23 former retired experts in inner city building fires,  who think they are experts in bush fires and newly acquired climate change skills, who didn’t take there opportunity when they had relevance, funded by a group lead by a bloke whose specialty is looking under rocks for bones and calls themselves the Climate Change Action group.
These experts have no other agenda than to be a nuisance whiles attempting to build their profile before standing for candidacy of some green political group at the next election.
 
I would much rather the advise come from current relevant operational experts.
I understand their former colleagues are shaken their heads in disbelief of these  people.
I also understand that to date these experts have turned down the opportunity to meet with the relevant ministers of the government because they thought that only the PM should be engaged. Some would say grandstanding.


Not fixed Rags.

Grandstanding...I dont think so...seems they knew what was going to happen and had major concerns...All this 8 months before the fires.....Maybe if someone had listened less lives and property would have been lost.  I dare say these people are more experienced than 99.9% on the forum. I think their comments are pretty well what everyone is talking about now. Anyone who thinks climate change hasnt contributed to the fire s are out of step with the majority of people.  Even morrisson,s govt has backtracked and admitted it is real!!

 Former fire chiefs warn Australia unprepared for escalating climate threat
This article is more than 8 months old

Major parties must recognise ‘national firefighting assets’ are needed to fight worsening natural disasters, say fire experts

Lisa Cox

Wed 10 Apr 2019 04.09 AEST
Last modified on Wed 10 Apr 2019 11.54 AEST

Shares
2,567
Two dozen former fire and emergency chiefs from all over Australia want the next prime minister to ensure emergency services have the resources to fight natural disasters caused by climate change.
Two dozen former fire and emergency chiefs from all over Australia want the next prime minister to ensure emergency services have the resources to fight natural disasters caused by climate change. Photograph: Rob Griffith/AFP/Getty Images

More than 20 former fire and emergency chiefs from multiple states and territories say Australia is unprepared for worsening natural disasters from climate change and governments are putting lives at risk.

In a statement issued before a federal election date is announced, 23 former emergency services leaders and senior personnel have called on both major parties to recognise the need for “national firefighting assets”, including large aircraft, to deal with the scale of the threat.

The signatories include: Greg Mullins, the second-longest serving fire and rescue commissioner in New South Wales and now a councillor with the Climate Council; Neil Bibby, a former chief executive of Victoria’s Country Fire Authority; Phil Koperberg, a former NSW rural fire service commissioner and former Labor MP and NSW environment minister.

The document calls on the next prime minister to meet former emergency service leaders “who will outline, unconstrained by their former employers, how climate change risks are rapidly escalating”.
Electric cars: separating the facts from the propaganda
Read more

The group also wants the next government to commit to an inquiry into whether Australia’s emergency services are adequately resourced to deal with increased risks from natural disasters caused by climate change.

They said some large firefighting aircraft were prohibitively expensive for states and territories and leased from the northern hemisphere, and access to them was becoming more restricted as fire seasons started to overlap.

“I started firefighting in 1971 and the bushfire seasons were extremely predictable,” Mullins said. “They’d start in Queensland and move south progressively.

“You knew when there was a bad season coming because there was an El Nino and drought. In the 90s, I stopped being able to predict it.”

Australia’s emergency resources were still equipped for “what was happening in the 1970s to the 1990s”.

“The first thing is we need whoever is in government nationally to take climate change seriously, rather than making jokes about it in parliament with lumps of coal,” he said.

“It’s just frustrating to hear the lip service being given to ‘Oh yes, we now believe in climate change and need to do something’ when every effort to do something about it is rubbished.”

Last year, in Australia alone, the NSW fire season began in early August, a heatwave led to fires in rainforest areas of Queensland in early December, and forest in Tasmania’s world heritage area caught fire in January, Australia’s hottest month on record.
Sign up to the Green Light email to get the planet's most important stories
Read more

For the past week the government has been running attacks on Labor’s proposal for electric vehicle targets to reduce carbon emissions.

“You look at any of your headlines over the last six months,” Bibby said. “The hottest month. The hottest summer.

“We know the problem, and the only way to get politicians to do something about these things is put their jobs on the line.”

Bibby said an additional concern was that Australia relied so heavily on volunteers during natural disasters.

As extreme weather becomes more frequent, and fire seasons longer, that would put strain on the system and volunteers helping their communities were at risk of burnout.

There needed to be a review of the methods used to tackle large fires, cyclones and floods that was backed by research from experienced people working on the ground.

“We’re doing the same old things when things are getting worse. We need to find new ways to tackle this problem,” Bibby said.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: achjimmy on December 23, 2019, 07:29:45 AM

Not fixed Rags.

Grandstanding...I dont think so...seems they knew what was going to happen and had major concerns...All this 8 months before the fires.....Maybe if someone had listened less lives and property would have been lost.  I dare say these people are more experienced than 99.9% on the forum. I think their comments are pretty well what everyone is talking about now.

 Former fire chiefs warn Australia unprepared for escalating climate threat
This article is more than 8 months old

Major parties must recognise ‘national firefighting assets’ are needed to fight worsening natural disasters, say fire experts

Lisa Cox

Wed 10 Apr 2019 04.09 AEST
Last modified on Wed 10 Apr 2019 11.54 AEST

Shares
2,567
Two dozen former fire and emergency chiefs from all over Australia want the next prime minister to ensure emergency services have the resources to fight natural disasters caused by climate change.
Two dozen former fire and emergency chiefs from all over Australia want the next prime minister to ensure emergency services have the resources to fight natural disasters caused by climate change. Photograph: Rob Griffith/AFP/Getty Images

More than 20 former fire and emergency chiefs from multiple states and territories say Australia is unprepared for worsening natural disasters from climate change and governments are putting lives at risk.

In a statement issued before a federal election date is announced, 23 former emergency services leaders and senior personnel have called on both major parties to recognise the need for “national firefighting assets”, including large aircraft, to deal with the scale of the threat.

The signatories include: Greg Mullins, the second-longest serving fire and rescue commissioner in New South Wales and now a councillor with the Climate Council; Neil Bibby, a former chief executive of Victoria’s Country Fire Authority; Phil Koperberg, a former NSW rural fire service commissioner and former Labor MP and NSW environment minister.

The document calls on the next prime minister to meet former emergency service leaders “who will outline, unconstrained by their former employers, how climate change risks are rapidly escalating”.
Electric cars: separating the facts from the propaganda
Read more

The group also wants the next government to commit to an inquiry into whether Australia’s emergency services are adequately resourced to deal with increased risks from natural disasters caused by climate change.

They said some large firefighting aircraft were prohibitively expensive for states and territories and leased from the northern hemisphere, and access to them was becoming more restricted as fire seasons started to overlap.

“I started firefighting in 1971 and the bushfire seasons were extremely predictable,” Mullins said. “They’d start in Queensland and move south progressively.

“You knew when there was a bad season coming because there was an El Nino and drought. In the 90s, I stopped being able to predict it.”

Australia’s emergency resources were still equipped for “what was happening in the 1970s to the 1990s”.

“The first thing is we need whoever is in government nationally to take climate change seriously, rather than making jokes about it in parliament with lumps of coal,” he said.

“It’s just frustrating to hear the lip service being given to ‘Oh yes, we now believe in climate change and need to do something’ when every effort to do something about it is rubbished.”

Last year, in Australia alone, the NSW fire season began in early August, a heatwave led to fires in rainforest areas of Queensland in early December, and forest in Tasmania’s world heritage area caught fire in January, Australia’s hottest month on record.
Sign up to the Green Light email to get the planet's most important stories
Read more

For the past week the government has been running attacks on Labor’s proposal for electric vehicle targets to reduce carbon emissions.

“You look at any of your headlines over the last six months,” Bibby said. “The hottest month. The hottest summer.

“We know the problem, and the only way to get politicians to do something about these things is put their jobs on the line.”

Bibby said an additional concern was that Australia relied so heavily on volunteers during natural disasters.

As extreme weather becomes more frequent, and fire seasons longer, that would put strain on the system and volunteers helping their communities were at risk of burnout.

There needed to be a review of the methods used to tackle large fires, cyclones and floods that was backed by research from experienced people working on the ground.

“We’re doing the same old things when things are getting worse. We need to find new ways to tackle this problem,” Bibby said.

Yeah but tbh Bigfish if you’d spoke to anybody in the blue mtns here they would have warned you of the same thing and a lot longer ago than 9mths! I was interviewed by the SMH during the 2013 fires and told the reporter much the same as below. We have been on tenterhooks for several years now given there has been no burn or effective reduction in fuel loads in the Grose Valley since 94 and yet the development along ridgelines have increased. Further more with climate change the August winds are coming later during the hotter season and are potentially disastrous   And if you think back to the 94 fires the development and the professionalism of the rural fires services have progressed so yep we don’t need some media fueled circus imo.

But here’s an idea ? Have a forum invite all the so called experts , give them jetstar tickets to Canberra and ask for a signed pledge of bi partisanship and a deed they won’t engage in any political party or lobby group for a decade and they can come along  :cheers: other than that they can go fcuk themselves and there headline seeking junkets !
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GeoffA on December 23, 2019, 07:39:07 AM
Sustained drought + no controlled burns for years + fire bugs = big fires

It's a very simple equation......
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on December 23, 2019, 07:40:39 AM
But here’s an idea ? Have a forum invite all the so called experts , give them jetstar tickets to Canberra and ask for a signed pledge of bi partisanship and a deed they won’t engage in any political party or lobby group for a decade and they can come along  :cheers:

 :cup:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 07:56:33 AM
:cup:

But isnt that what we want our elected govt and opposition to do.  Engage in bi partisan projects that actually help Australian citizens.    Sorry mate...there is too much money and behind the closed doors of parliament that means the country will always play second fiddle to the self interests of egomaniacs both in govt and business..  Spose we can dream though!

 :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on December 23, 2019, 08:13:45 AM
But isnt that what we want our elected govt and opposition to do.  Engage in bi partisan projects that actually help Australian citizens.    Sorry mate...there is too much money and behind the closed doors of parliament that means the country will always play second fiddle to the self interests of egomaniacs both in govt and business..  Spose we can dream though!

 :cheers:
You can change it, you could always run for politics and change the world, maybe start locally and work your way up. Ride the gravy train.  :D ;D :D ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 23, 2019, 08:23:02 AM


Grandstanding...I dont think so...seems they knew what was going to happen and had major concerns...All this 8 months before the fires.....Maybe if someone had listened less lives and property would have been lost.  I dare say these people are more experienced than 99.9% on the forum. I think their comments are pretty well what everyone is talking about now. Anyone who thinks climate change hasnt contributed to the fire s are out of step with the majority of people.  Even morrisson,s govt has backtracked and admitted it is real!!

 Former fire chiefs warn Australia unprepared for escalating climate threat
This article is more than 8 months old

If these Former Fire Chiefs knew so much, the big question is, what did they do about it when they were Fire Chiefs?  Obviously nothing to mitigate or prevent the situation.  They can cry and blame lack of Government action, but just what did they do as Fire Chiefs.  Their inaction has aided and assisted in the creation of the current Bushfires.  They are now not talking about Bushfires but Climate Change.  Big Difference.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Craig Tomkinson on December 23, 2019, 08:24:58 AM
Spot on Achjimmy, its a lot to do with were they live, and the control measures around there houses and farm you do,, years ago there was a bad fire season coming, dad ploughed the paddocks around the house to bear dirt, Craig
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on December 23, 2019, 08:50:04 AM
But isnt that what we want our elected govt and opposition to do.  Engage in bi partisan projects that actually help Australian citizens.    Sorry mate...there is too much money and behind the closed doors of parliament that means the country will always play second fiddle to the self interests of egomaniacs both in govt and business.

Yes, that's what we want, I find it hard to believe that's what the fire 20 odd ex fire chiefs (largely at the political appointment level) actually want. That's why I think the comment was good, take away the political/grandstanding opportunities from what they are proposing and we then get to see how motivated they still are.

To my cursory view, it looks like some ex fire chiefs advocating for federal funding for something that has traditionally been the realm of the states. Then if federal funds are offered, I guess we would then need some "experts" to advise on how to best use them, maybe say a panel made up of ex fire chiefs for example, all would then need to be very handsomely rewarded for their advisory capacity.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 08:56:39 AM
If these Former Fire Chiefs knew so much, the big question is, what did they do about it when they were Fire Chiefs?  Obviously nothing to mitigate or prevent the situation.  They can cry and blame lack of Government action, but just what did they do as Fire Chiefs.  Their inaction has aided and assisted in the creation of the current Bushfires.  They are now not talking about Bushfires but Climate Change.  Big Difference.

I have no idea what they did as former fire chiefs.  Do you?  I wouldnt assume they did f all as bureaucracy is a bullShit paddock . It doesnt really matter...the point was that they saw this disaster coming and wanted a forum to discuss how to tackle the impending situation, So what if they believe in climate change , like the majority of Australians?..as I said they were ignored.   The same way the govt ignores the bank scandals, tax evasion, poverty, homelessness etc.etc.  Until the govt acknowledges that things are definitely getting warmer (its not just Oz) then sooner, rather than later, we will just be one big desert with no green belts at all. 

When I lived in the territory all houses had to have a safe room in case of cyclones.  I had the bottom of my dwelling made into a 3 x 3 meter bunker with core filled cement blocks and steel beam roof.  Used it a few times during decent cyclones...why aren,t houses in forested areas required to have a safety shelter?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 23, 2019, 09:09:24 AM
Sustained drought + no controlled burns for years + fire bugs = big fires

It's a very simple equation......
The winner
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 09:13:29 AM
The winner

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: tryagain on December 23, 2019, 09:28:09 AM
the point was that they saw this disaster coming and wanted a forum to discuss how to tackle the impending situation, So what if they believe in climate change , like the majority of Australians?..as I said they were ignored.   

You will notice they used the term "the next prime minister" just before the last election, this was when everyone expected Shorten to soon be PM, there is no coincidence in the timing of their press release, they didn't want an audience with Morrison, they could have already asked for this, they wanted an audience with a sympathetic Shorten with his hands on the purse strings.

I was chatting to the head of the division I have been doing some work in at the Christmas party last week, he has just been made redundant due to the sell of the division, previously he had been reasonably high up in a state gov department, I asked him what he was looking for and his response was it depends on what happens at the next state election here in QLD, if there was a change of gov he would be headed back to a gov role, and he is below the level of what the ex fire/emergency chiefs are at. At the level they are at, they are basically pollies disguised bureaucrats, I therefore view whatever they say through the lens of them being a politician as opposed to being impartial expert.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on December 23, 2019, 10:23:14 AM
Fixed for you

We had 23 former retired experts in inner city building fires,  who think they are experts in bush fires and newly acquired climate change skills, .....

When they are in the job they are actually restricted from speaking their minds in public. Jobs like that are as political as any and they most definitely serve at the pleasure of the premier.
They might be able to speak out behind closed doors, but still have to tow the official line in public and support the premier's party line and not be seen to fight in front of the kids.

After they resign they retain the knowledge that got them the gig in the 1st place, so remain experts (and often get consultancy jobs with the Dept.), but now have a new found freedom to actually say what they really think. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on December 23, 2019, 01:42:43 PM
When they are in the job they are actually restricted from speaking their minds in public. Jobs like that are as political as any and they most definitely serve at the pleasure of the premier.
They might be able to speak out behind closed doors, but still have to tow the official line in public and support the premier's party line and not be seen to fight in front of the kids.

After they resign they retain the knowledge that got them the gig in the 1st place, so remain experts (and often get consultancy jobs with the Dept.), but now have a new found freedom to actually say what they really think.

Believe me I know how it works, the Minister sets the direction but the  department DG facilitates between the Minister and stakeholders relying on the public servants to deliver policy. In the case of a Commissioned officer  role they have equal access to the Minister and rightly so, and a significant level of arm twisting of the Minister.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rags on December 23, 2019, 02:24:26 PM
Taken from the Thoughthub.com.au

You know what, I am outraged about Prime Minister Scott Morrison’s holiday. I am outraged that a social media campaign, led by people still bitter about the May 18 election, seeks to exploit a crisis to prosecute their political agenda and hound a man into submission. That’s what I’m outraged about.

Two people have died fighting the fires, and dullards who only need the faintest whiff of an excuse to spew their bile could not jump on social media quickly enough to make hay from the tragedy. Let’s be frank: the majority of the people complaining don’t actually care about the fires or those who fight them. What they care about is prosecuting their political agenda against someone who they would never vote for anyway. The fires are just a convenient excuse.

Note how even the Australian Labor Party has largely been silent in their criticism of Morrison. This is to their credit. Why? Because they understand that there’s little more he can do than show up for a photo opportunity while comforting victims (which he has already done – see image). One might say that Morrison could help fight the fires himself, but we had a Prime Minister who did that once. He was hounded out of office by the same people.

You have probably missed it, but this is just some of what the Morrison government has been doing in response to the fires: (*all sources listed below in case you wish to check)

An extra $11 million in emergency funding has been allocated to support the firefighting effort.
Since November 8, the Australian Defence Force has provided jets to transfer firefighters, air support, refuelling and water supply and lent out some of its bases for storing equipment.
From November 8 to February 1, Air Force is providing airlift support to move large groups of firefighters and their equipment between interstate locations.
From November 17 to December 22, Army is supplying personnel to prepare and cook three meals a day for 250 firefighters at the Rural Fire Service staging ground in the Northern Rivers Region, NSW. This support is to enable respite for the volunteers who have been providing meals.
Since November 29, HMAS Albatross has assisted with water refuelling and retardant loading of aircraft fighting the Currowan fires from Naval Air Station Nowra. Seven New South Wales Rural Fire Service aircraft continue to operate from Nowra, comprising four fixed-wing and three helicopters.
From November 26 to January 13, Army is providing the New South Wales Rural Fire Service with ground logistic support for the movement of vehicles, stores and equipment in the Wauchope, Glen Innes, Kempsey, Casino, Wollondilly and Hawkesbury areas.
On December 20, support provided from RAAF Base Edinburgh, South Australia, to refuel two Large Aircraft Tankers fighting fires near Cudlee Creek and Munno Para.
For more information, check the defence department website: https://news.defence.gov.au/national/defence-continues-bushfire-support

What this entire episode shows is the dissonance between real action and symbolism. People on social media love a clever quote or a compelling photo or a heartwarming video. What they don’t take the time to look for is substance and real action. Morrison trusts cabinet process. He trusts that Australia’s ministers and their departments can manage in his absence, if only for a few days. I wonder how many people who just could not wait to smash their keyboards while chugging down a soy frappuccino (too hot for a cappuccino) actually looked further than The Guardian’s outrage inducing headlines to read what real experts have to say about the crisis on the ground.

Here’s what the Australasian National Council for Fire and Emergency Services said about the Federal Government’s response on December 21:

The National Council for fire and emergency services (AFAC) welcomes the increase in Federal Government funding for Australia’s aerial firefighting capacity for 2019/20 announced by the Prime Minister on Thursday 12 December.

The lift of $11 million, in addition to an existing $15 million provided by the Commonwealth annually, will provide the National Aerial Firefighting Centre (NAFC) with additional capacity to engage and extend critical aerial assets supporting firefighting efforts across Australia.

Here is also what they said about support received, as reported:

The Australasian Fire and Emergency Service Authorities Council (Afac) said cross-state firefighting resources were funnelled and distributed across the country where they had been requested, by its national resource sharing centre.

“While many volunteers are not available to travel far from their homes or interstate due to local responsibilities, employment or managing drought-stricken stock that require daily feeding, others are prepared to deploy,” Afac said.

It said there was integrated engagement with the commonwealth and national protocols for managing incident responses and the available fleet of 140 aircraft and international personnel.

“Australia has never been better prepared to face natural disasters,” it said.

Surprised? Probably. Because the main thing that has been reported is the Emergency Leaders for Climate Action group. They are a LOBBY group of FORMER firefighters who are only too happy to critique the current PM. Yet what’s interesting is what happens when you go to the source: emergency workers, defence personnel, and actual authorities charged with coordinating the efforts on the ground.

Please do not let social media dictate the national narrative. The outrage is being fueled by bitter, angry people sitting in sumptuous, air conditioned homes who only care about one thing: vengeance for losing the ‘unloseable election’ in May.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 03:16:41 PM
Taken from the Thoughthub.com.au

You know what, I am outraged about Prime Minister Scott Morrison’s holiday. I am outraged that a social media campaign, led by people still bitter about the May 18 election, seeks to exploit a crisis to prosecute their political agenda and hound a man into submission. That’s what I’m outraged about.

Two people have died fighting the fires, and dullards who only need the faintest whiff of an excuse to spew their bile could not jump on social media quickly enough to make hay from the tragedy. Let’s be frank: the majority of the people complaining don’t actually care about the fires or those who fight them. What they care about is prosecuting their political agenda against someone who they would never vote for anyway. The fires are just a convenient excuse.

Note how even the Australian Labor Party has largely been silent in their criticism of Morrison. This is to their credit. Why? Because they understand that there’s little more he can do than show up for a photo opportunity while comforting victims (which he has already done – see image). One might say that Morrison could help fight the fires himself, but we had a Prime Minister who did that once. He was hounded out of office by the same people.

You have probably missed it, but this is just some of what the Morrison government has been doing in response to the fires: (*all sources listed below in case you wish to check)

An extra $11 million in emergency funding has been allocated to support the firefighting effort.
Since November 8, the Australian Defence Force has provided jets to transfer firefighters, air support, refuelling and water supply and lent out some of its bases for storing equipment.
From November 8 to February 1, Air Force is providing airlift support to move large groups of firefighters and their equipment between interstate locations.
From November 17 to December 22, Army is supplying personnel to prepare and cook three meals a day for 250 firefighters at the Rural Fire Service staging ground in the Northern Rivers Region, NSW. This support is to enable respite for the volunteers who have been providing meals.
Since November 29, HMAS Albatross has assisted with water refuelling and retardant loading of aircraft fighting the Currowan fires from Naval Air Station Nowra. Seven New South Wales Rural Fire Service aircraft continue to operate from Nowra, comprising four fixed-wing and three helicopters.
From November 26 to January 13, Army is providing the New South Wales Rural Fire Service with ground logistic support for the movement of vehicles, stores and equipment in the Wauchope, Glen Innes, Kempsey, Casino, Wollondilly and Hawkesbury areas.
On December 20, support provided from RAAF Base Edinburgh, South Australia, to refuel two Large Aircraft Tankers fighting fires near Cudlee Creek and Munno Para.
For more information, check the defence department website: https://news.defence.gov.au/national/defence-continues-bushfire-support

What this entire episode shows is the dissonance between real action and symbolism. People on social media love a clever quote or a compelling photo or a heartwarming video. What they don’t take the time to look for is substance and real action. Morrison trusts cabinet process. He trusts that Australia’s ministers and their departments can manage in his absence, if only for a few days. I wonder how many people who just could not wait to smash their keyboards while chugging down a soy frappuccino (too hot for a cappuccino) actually looked further than The Guardian’s outrage inducing headlines to read what real experts have to say about the crisis on the ground.

Here’s what the Australasian National Council for Fire and Emergency Services said about the Federal Government’s response on December 21:

The National Council for fire and emergency services (AFAC) welcomes the increase in Federal Government funding for Australia’s aerial firefighting capacity for 2019/20 announced by the Prime Minister on Thursday 12 December.

The lift of $11 million, in addition to an existing $15 million provided by the Commonwealth annually, will provide the National Aerial Firefighting Centre (NAFC) with additional capacity to engage and extend critical aerial assets supporting firefighting efforts across Australia.

Here is also what they said about support received, as reported:

The Australasian Fire and Emergency Service Authorities Council (Afac) said cross-state firefighting resources were funnelled and distributed across the country where they had been requested, by its national resource sharing centre.

“While many volunteers are not available to travel far from their homes or interstate due to local responsibilities, employment or managing drought-stricken stock that require daily feeding, others are prepared to deploy,” Afac said.

It said there was integrated engagement with the commonwealth and national protocols for managing incident responses and the available fleet of 140 aircraft and international personnel.

“Australia has never been better prepared to face natural disasters,” it said.

Surprised? Probably. Because the main thing that has been reported is the Emergency Leaders for Climate Action group. They are a LOBBY group of FORMER firefighters who are only too happy to critique the current PM. Yet what’s interesting is what happens when you go to the source: emergency workers, defence personnel, and actual authorities charged with coordinating the efforts on the ground.

Please do not let social media dictate the national narrative. The outrage is being fueled by bitter, angry people sitting in sumptuous, air conditioned homes who only care about one thing: vengeance for losing the ‘unloseable election’ in May.

This turkey sounds just as bitter and dimwitted as the people he is spewing forth on..sounds like an arsehole to me with his wild accusations.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: achjimmy on December 23, 2019, 03:22:39 PM

When I lived in the territory all houses had to have a safe room in case of cyclones.  I had the bottom of my dwelling made into a 3 x 3 meter bunker with core filled cement blocks and steel beam roof.  Used it a few times during decent cyclones...why aren,t houses in forested areas required to have a safety shelter?

Because it would become a human hungi  ;D

Be much more effective to have mandated clearing laws and fireproof building codes like they do once it’s been declared a flame zone and then actively fining those in breach who plant forests around there property and refuse to clear it
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 04:04:54 PM
Because it would become a human hungi  ;D

Be much more effective to have mandated clearing laws and fireproof building codes like they do once it’s been declared a flame zone and then actively fining those in breach who plant forests around there property and refuse to clear it

They only have to keep heat out for a few hours max.  A bloke survived the fire last week shielding behind some heat proof cladding. Fire proof cladding and solid bricks would do it no worries...used ram earth if you wanted.  I shake my head at some of the houses people build in thick forest and have no fire breaks or fire plan.  A shelter as a last ditch means wouldn't be expensive and could save your families life....naturally getting away from the fire is the first move!  Its all about planning and knowing your environment.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 23, 2019, 04:12:30 PM


naturally getting away from the fire is the first move!  Its all about planning and knowing your environment.
We have a winner.
Spot on mate.
And it is really that simple.
You are responsible for yourself, no one else is, you are.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GeoffA on December 23, 2019, 04:37:41 PM
They only have to keep heat out for a few hours max.  A bloke survived the fire last week shielding behind some heat proof cladding. Fire proof cladding and solid bricks would do it no worries...used ram earth if you wanted.  I shake my head at some of the houses people build in thick forest and have no fire breaks or fire plan.  A shelter as a last ditch means wouldn't be expensive and could save your families life....naturally getting away from the fire is the first move!  Its all about planning and knowing your environment.

An old uncle of mine was a woodsman in Powelltown VIC.
He survived the '39 Black Friday fire by taking refuge in a dugout, but I'm told he wasn't the same man afterwards.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 04:39:54 PM
An old uncle of mine was a woodsman in Powelltown VIC.
He survived the '39 Black Friday fire by taking refuge in a dugout, but I'm told he wasn't the same man afterwards.

Sitting in a small cyclone shelter can scare the Shit out of you too.   Suppose any real life threatening event will.  As I said..plan and prepare.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GeoffA on December 23, 2019, 04:42:03 PM
Sitting in a small cyclone shelter can scare the Shit out of you too.   Suppose any real life threatening event will.  As I said..plan and prepare.

Agree with all of that....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 04:43:50 PM
If only....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 23, 2019, 04:52:46 PM
A rello who lived in Macedon had a major fire go thru 20 or 30yrs ago ( you mexicans would know the one ). He was an engineer by trade, installed sprinklers on the roof ( long before it was deemed a good idea ) and had a diesel pump beside the small dam. Family high tailed it, he stayed and manned the pump......when the fire front came over the hill, the pump spluttered for a few seconds ( lack of oxygen ), but kept going......his house was fine, neighbours not so.
Was it a terrifying experience.....yep, he thought it was. Would he do it again.....he doesn't know ?
But it showed with a bit of planning, and some common sense, and a 5 acre block fairly clear of "bush", that survival is possible.


I googled it...was in 1983 !!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 23, 2019, 04:57:04 PM
Not NSW but for the Qld Fires.  Any Public outrage here

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/bushfires-double-standards-call-on-qld-premier-annastacia-palaszczuks-leave/news-story/5e22112d2b8e7c85f42bac67fd7e7624 (https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/bushfires-double-standards-call-on-qld-premier-annastacia-palaszczuks-leave/news-story/5e22112d2b8e7c85f42bac67fd7e7624)

Queensland Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk’s decision to take leave as bushfires continue to burn throughout the state has sparked a rebuke from an opposition frontbencher who called out perceived double standards.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 23, 2019, 05:00:06 PM
Not NSW but for the Qld Fires.  Any Public outrage here

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/bushfires-double-standards-call-on-qld-premier-annastacia-palaszczuks-leave/news-story/5e22112d2b8e7c85f42bac67fd7e7624

Queensland Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk’s decision to take leave as bushfires continue to burn throughout the state has sparked a rebuke from an opposition frontbencher who called out perceived double standards.

The only problem with the link is you need to subscribe to "the australian" to get access !!
Some of the other news articles on the web are blocked by my adblocker ???
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GeoffA on December 23, 2019, 05:07:44 PM
......
I googled it...was in 1983 !!

Ash Wednesday....horrible....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 23, 2019, 05:14:44 PM
The only problem with the link is you need to subscribe to "the australian" to get access !!
Some of the other news articles on the web are blocked by my adblocker ???

More and more media is doing it and then they complain their news is not getting out there. 

From the article

Bushfires: ‘Double standards’ call on Qld Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk’s leave

Queensland Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk’s decision to take leave as bushfires continue to burn throughout the state has sparked a rebuke from an opposition frontbencher who called out perceived double standards.

As Scott Morrison returned to Australia and apologised after cutting short his holiday in Hawaii, The Australian confirmed Ms Palaszczuk has taken Christmas leave.

Opposition industrial relations and education spokesman Jarrod Bleijie tweeted: “So it seems the left-wing trolls have a problem with the PM spending time with his family on a short holiday but have no problem with the leader of the state … who (by the way) is responsible for fire response being on holidays and apparently just boarded a cruise.”

There were dozens of fires burning throughout Queensland on Sunday, but they did not pose any immediate threat to people or property.

Ms Palaszczuk’s leave was advertised in the Government Gazette on December 16, with an announcement that she would be replaced by Acting Premier Jackie Trad.

A spokesman said Ms Palaszczuk planned to spend some of her holiday on North Stradbroke Island.

“The Premier is on leave in Queensland and is able to return at any time if needed,” the spokesman told The Australian.

The decision to go on leave amid a time of heightened fire danger came as Morrison faced a barrage of public criticism for his Hawaiian holiday.

The Prime Minister ultimately cut his family vacation short and flew back to NSW where he yesterday said he accepted criticism of his decision to leave the country.

In September, Mr Bleijie publicly criticised Ms Palaszczuk’s decision to fly to Switzerland on a business trip to promote Queensland’s Olympic Games bid while fires burned throughout the state.

The premier later cut her trip short to return to the fire zone.

South Australian Premier Steven Marshall cancelled his own scheduled overseas holiday on Friday as fires gripped the state.Mr Marshall, who had planned to travel to New Zealand, told The Sunday Mail he didn’t think it was “appropriate” to go on holiday on Friday while the State Emergency Centre was operational.

“While that still remains in force and my primary focus is to do everything that I can,” he said.

“I understand that I can’t be much practical use in one of these fires, I’m not on the front line, but there are powers I have as Premier which need to be available if things start going in the wrong direction.”

South Australian Premier Steven Marshall cancelled his scheduled overseas holiday on Friday as fires gripped the state.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: D4D on December 23, 2019, 05:29:28 PM
Terrible fires and they bring back memories of Black Saturday.

For the discussion around bunkers and building codes. We're 10 years on from Black Saturday and whilst a lot has been learnt, what has been identified is that it is very hard/almost impossible to build a fire bunker/refuge and even rebuilding a burnt out property in some areas is not an option due to lack of anybody willing to sign it off. There have been some lucky escapes using makeshift bunkers, would you trust your life to one or just gtfo.

Regarding 'fire-proofing' your house, a friend of mine who owned a property at Benloch built a house to withstand a Black Saturday scale fire. It was very interesting to understand the engineering that went into that place with multiple redundant systems. In the end it cost him almost five times the cost of building a normal house and was pretty ugly. After it was all done he said he'd still leave if a big fire came through.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 23, 2019, 05:35:12 PM
I think people inc the media (not making it a ****in selling papers type story) need to start thinking of 800+ families with nothing... That could be 2000 people with nothing and nowhere to go..

'More than 830 homes and 62 facilities have been destroyed in NSW so far this fire season.'
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 23, 2019, 06:20:19 PM
Terrible fires and they bring back memories of Black Saturday.

For the discussion around bunkers and building codes. We're 10 years on from Black Saturday and whilst a lot has been learnt, what has been identified is that it is very hard/almost impossible to build a fire bunker/refuge and even rebuilding a burnt out property in some areas is not an option due to lack of anybody willing to sign it off. There have been some lucky escapes using makeshift bunkers, would you trust your life to one or just gtfo.

Regarding 'fire-proofing' your house, a friend of mine who owned a property at Benloch built a house to withstand a Black Saturday scale fire. It was very interesting to understand the engineering that went into that place with multiple redundant systems. In the end it cost him almost five times the cost of building a normal house and was pretty ugly. After it was all done he said he'd still leave if a big fire came through.

I dare say once a fire has gone through you,ll never get insurance . Unless you have deep pockets. Even here in Cairns a lot of insurers wont touch a dwelling. And we dont get fires  (yet!)   cyclones..but nothing like we got in Gove and Darwin.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on December 23, 2019, 06:30:45 PM
Not NSW but for the Qld Fires.  Any Public outrage here

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/bushfires-double-standards-call-on-qld-premier-annastacia-palaszczuks-leave/news-story/5e22112d2b8e7c85f42bac67fd7e7624 (https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/bushfires-double-standards-call-on-qld-premier-annastacia-palaszczuks-leave/news-story/5e22112d2b8e7c85f42bac67fd7e7624)

Queensland Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk’s decision to take leave as bushfires continue to burn throughout the state has sparked a rebuke from an opposition frontbencher who called out perceived double standards.

No outrage here, wrong side of politics for any outrage it would seem. ;D ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 23, 2019, 07:58:01 PM
Yes I do mate,
Christ.
Talking with rfs captains over the past few months, they are frustrated, talking with farmers, they are frustrated.
Talking with NPWS, the blokes on the ground, they are frustrated.
But what would I know?
Please enlighten us with your expert opinion.
Go on, learn me.

What exactly are they frustrated about? The only imaginable scenario I can come up with is the governments lack of action in tackling climate change, am I on track with that?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 23, 2019, 09:39:08 PM
What exactly are they frustrated about? The only imaginable scenario I can come up with is the governments lack of action in tackling climate change, am I on track with that?

https://www.2gb.com/podcast/scientist-david-packham-on-whats-really-causing-the-bushfires/?fbclid=IwAR3cQ-f-4R-bsgXkFwgaWbIhuFVvXUFJUnldU1wcpMoUR724AOhEShuH9Rw (https://www.2gb.com/podcast/scientist-david-packham-on-whats-really-causing-the-bushfires/?fbclid=IwAR3cQ-f-4R-bsgXkFwgaWbIhuFVvXUFJUnldU1wcpMoUR724AOhEShuH9Rw)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 23, 2019, 10:24:16 PM
Quote from: alnjan
david packham on whats really causing the bushfires (https://www.2gb.com/podcast/scientist-david-packham-on-whats-really-causing-the-bushfires/?fbclid=IwAR3cQ-f-4R-bsgXkFwgaWbIhuFVvXUFJUnldU1wcpMoUR724AOhEShuH9Rw)
;D ;D ;D
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/Fire_triangle.svg/220px-Fire_triangle.svg.png)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: krisandkev on December 24, 2019, 06:14:22 AM
What exactly are they frustrated about? The only imaginable scenario I can come up with is the governments lack of action in tackling climate change, am I on track with that?

BUT. As people who actually know have stated,  we are so small in the world nothing we do will make any difference in climate change. So what can we do? Prepare for a changing future yes.  Kevin
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 24, 2019, 06:24:14 AM
BUT. As people who actually know have stated,  we are so small in the world nothing we do will make any difference in climate change. So what can we do? Prepare for a changing future yes.  Kevin

We are not so small in the world mate.  We are the biggest threat to the earth of any organism. Its because of our over population, destruction of habitat, obscene and un controlled pollution, govt greed, corporate greed, drugs and generally just being an arsehole of a species with scant regard for anyone or anything else.   I dont hold out much future for mankind in the future..however I do believe that we must TRY and do something for our kids and grandkids futures.

I feel like going on a rampage at times when I find out that peopel are doing the right thing and recycling only to have council dump everything in landfill because they not right in the head state and fed govts dont have recycle facilities for all...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 24, 2019, 08:30:16 AM
;D ;D ;D
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/Fire_triangle.svg/220px-Fire_triangle.svg.png)


Science in it's simplest form, that can be repeated with the same result.   When constantly told to follow the science, this basic science is the first one left out. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: krisandkev on December 24, 2019, 11:51:53 AM
We are not so small in the world mate.  We are the biggest threat to the earth of any organism. Its because of our over population, destruction of habitat, obscene and un controlled pollution, govt greed, corporate greed, drugs and generally just being an arsehole of a species with scant regard for anyone or anything else.   I dont hold out much future for mankind in the future..however I do believe that we must TRY and do something for our kids and grandkids futures.

I feel like going on a rampage at times when I find out that peopel are doing the right thing and recycling only to have council dump everything in landfill because they not right in the head state and fed govts dont have recycle facilities for all...

OMG. The experts are all wrong. Our little country is causing all this in the world. There you go. And I thought it was countries like China, India, Asia and America. Nope it is us!  Kevin
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Jeepers Creepers on December 24, 2019, 12:06:47 PM
OMG. The experts are all wrong. Our little country is causing all this in the world. There you go. And I thought it was countries like China, India, Asia and America. Nope it is us!  Kevin




Ha ha ha ha, you owe me a new keyboard...... this one has coffee spray all over it.  :D

No, on second thoughts, its that ScoMo's fault cause he went on holidays.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on December 24, 2019, 01:20:03 PM
OMG. The experts are all wrong. Our little country is causing all this in the world. There you go. And I thought it was countries like China, India, Asia and America. Nope it is us!  Kevin

Spot on, 7.800,000,000 people on earth, Australia app 26,000,000, we represent less than 1/3 of  1% of the worlds population. Yes we are a developed nation but geez how much can we really achieve.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 24, 2019, 05:25:51 PM
Spot on, 7.800,000,000 people on earth, Australia app 26,000,000, we represent less than 1/3 of  1% of the worlds population. Yes we are a developed nation but geez how much can we really achieve.
You've missed the whole reasoning behind Climate Change. :)
I have sent my cheque off to the UN, money will fix it.
Maybe the UN needs a Go Fund Me Page.
Then a 10 year old in India can help.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 24, 2019, 05:44:44 PM
OMG. The experts are all wrong. Our little country is causing all this in the world. There you go. And I thought it was countries like China, India, Asia and America. Nope it is us!  Kevin

Really?  Think you better get back on your meds.  I didnt say our country was causing all the Shit going on...I said mankind(include yourself if its appropriate).


Anyways....Hope everyone has a great xmas and enjoy themselves... :cheers: :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 24, 2019, 06:51:15 PM
Quote from: krisandkev
OMG. The experts are all wrong. Our little country is causing all this in the world. There you go. And I thought it was countries like China, India, Asia and America. Nope it is us!

... but what would the lemmings have to protest about then ??? They'd have to get jobs... EEeeeekk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on December 24, 2019, 11:23:23 PM
Not a lot of critical thinking going on in this topic. Lots of backslapping though. Good to see you guys are happy, heads buried in the sand and all. Leave it for the kids to deal with.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Jeepers Creepers on December 25, 2019, 04:44:57 AM
I just thought they were arguing
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on December 25, 2019, 04:56:02 AM
I just thought they were arguing

Thats enough from you.....now I,m offended!     :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 25, 2019, 12:08:47 PM
Quote from: Squalo
Not a lot of critical thinking going on in this topic. Lots of backslapping though. Good to see you guys are happy, heads buried in the sand and all. Leave it for the kids to deal with.

I'd say when China catches up to our pissy output level we should then start to worry.
No point us destroying what industry we have left when nobody else in the world gives a ****... Some countries talk lots, but have no action.  And they are smart enough to realise you cant just shut down coal powered overnight.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 26, 2019, 10:22:27 PM
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/commentary/bushfire-crisis-climate-wailing-ignores-fuel-buildups/news-story/13858ba2f9b6b08c7e2b4532d9e3ac92?fbclid=IwAR2meSmLvB3LjNjHeipJJSF1tmKEfvbljwTIQLfyb3GMGOU85B2SrlOUDEI (https://www.theaustralian.com.au/commentary/bushfire-crisis-climate-wailing-ignores-fuel-buildups/news-story/13858ba2f9b6b08c7e2b4532d9e3ac92?fbclid=IwAR2meSmLvB3LjNjHeipJJSF1tmKEfvbljwTIQLfyb3GMGOU85B2SrlOUDEI)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 27, 2019, 06:29:28 AM


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/commentary/bushfire-crisis-climate-wailing-ignores-fuel-buildups/news-story/13858ba2f9b6b08c7e2b4532d9e3ac92?fbclid=IwAR2meSmLvB3LjNjHeipJJSF1tmKEfvbljwTIQLfyb3GMGOU85B2SrlOUDEI (https://www.theaustralian.com.au/commentary/bushfire-crisis-climate-wailing-ignores-fuel-buildups/news-story/13858ba2f9b6b08c7e2b4532d9e3ac92?fbclid=IwAR2meSmLvB3LjNjHeipJJSF1tmKEfvbljwTIQLfyb3GMGOU85B2SrlOUDEI)

Sorry Al,
It's paywalled, :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 27, 2019, 07:27:52 AM

Sorry Al,
It's paywalled, :(

Very annoying and the media wonder why people are turning away from main stream media.   Stop trying to suck us dry with having to subscribe, their articles are still full of adds to make their money.  Tight a$$ idiots. 

"Bushfire crisis: Climate wailing ignores fuel build-ups
ROGER UNDERWOOD

A group of former “fire chiefs” is blaming the current bushfires across Australia on climate change and demanding that Scott Morrison take urgent action to fix the climate. This, it claims, will fix the bushfire threat.

Even if we could change the climate (cooler summers, saturating winter rains, light breezes, no more droughts), it would not influence the current weather patterns or stop the fierce bushfires coming up the driveway this afternoon.

Even if we knew exactly how to change the climate, anything we did in Australia would have to be replicated globally (especially in China and India) to make any difference; and even if global measures were applied tomorrow, the desired new climate might not cut in for many years.

The “climate change is causing bushfires” position has two killer flaws. It takes no account of fuels. And it prescribes no practical actions that will help with the immediate bushfire threat. Ignoring fuel is an error of astonishing magnitude. In Bushfire 101 we learned about the fire triangle. A bushfire can occur only if three things are present: oxygen (in the air), fuel (to burn) and heat (a source of ignition to get the fire started).

If any one of the three is missing, no fire.

Nothing can be done to remove the air and the oxygen it contains. Nothing can be done to stop bushfires starting. They will be lit by lightning strikes or started by humans, deliberately or accidentally.

But bushfire fuel can be removed, or at least the quantity of fuel around a house or in the bush can be reduced to a point where a fire will burn at a relatively low intensity, allowing firefighters to deal with it relatively comfortably.

If fuel is allowed to build up, as happens in long-unburnt eucalypt bushland, the eventual fire will be of high intensity. If a crown fire results, generating a downwind ember storm, the fire will be impossible to control and highly damaging, no matter how many thousands of firefighters and water bombers you throw at it.

Blaming climate change for the current spate of bushfires ignores the fact these bushfires have proven almost impossible to control once they got going. This is because they are burning heavy fuels dried out by drought. Ignoring fuel is the ultimate cop-out. It absolves the authorities of any responsibility for the incubation of this fire epidemic through the years as dangerous levels of fuel were allowed to build up in the nation’s bushlands.

But what of the solutions proposed by the “fire chiefs”? I have yet to see any, other than the usual suggestions to curtail CO2 emissions, shut down coal-fired power stations, no coalmines, switch to electric cars, use trains instead of aircraft, and so on. What will these measures actually achieve? There is no agreement. When will their impact on the climate become significant? There is no agreement on this either, other than vague statements about 2030 or 2040. As far as I can see the “fire chiefs” have offered nothing of any practical or immediate value in terms of bushfire management.

However, I am in full agreement with them on one thing: something must be done to fix the bushfire crisis in Australia.

A good start would be for governments and bureaucrats to acknowledge the three great truths about bushfires in this country. First, Australia is naturally bushfire-prone. This is because of our hot, dry summers, periodic droughts, flammable vegetation and abundant sources of ignition. Second, bushfires cannot be prevented. Third, their severity and damage can be minimised but this requires effective management.

The effective approach is well understood and field-tested. You must harden-up rural and semi-rural communities to increase their resilience in the expectation of fire. You should reduce the fuels in the bush. And you need an efficient firefighting force. It won’t work with only one of the three; you must have them all, properly integrated.

Trouble is, the nation as a whole does not understand or agree on these key points. There is confusion about priorities. Thus we see “fire chiefs” focusing on climate change, environmentalists on protecting biodiversity, the fire services on firefighting, and the aviation industry (backed by the media) pushing for more and bigger water bombers.

Meanwhile, politicians are scrambling to please everyone, and pleasing nobody. The leadership vacuum is devastating.

In my opinion, the intervention from the “fire chiefs” is political, based on the “take action on climate change” agenda rather than the “fix the bushfire crisis now” agenda.

There is nothing the matter with being a climate activist, per se, but advocating policies that distract the authorities from dealing with the immediate bushfire threat can be described only as irresponsible.

Roger Underwood is chairman of the Perth-based Bushfire Front. He has 60 years’ experience in bushfire management.
"
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 27, 2019, 09:53:05 AM
Cheers mate.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: nab on December 27, 2019, 10:20:55 AM
I agree, climate change will have bugger all effect on bushfires on its own.

One of the reasons Australia should do something about emissions/climate change/workplace regulation is it shows the less developed countries which direction to go in the future. Sort of like how features that were in Mercedes Benz 20 years ago are now becoming standard on cheap cars. Mercedes didnt save many lives installing ABS on its cars in the 80s, but how many lives have been saved in main stream cars due to ABS since?

Someone has to lead the way, whether we can financially sustain it is above my pay grade...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 27, 2019, 11:43:07 AM
One way the 'Climate Change' phenomenon has affected the Bushfires involves the 'Carbon Credits' schemes.  A company 'buys a forest' to gain 'Carbon Credits' to offset it's 'Carbon Emissions'.  They are then not allowed to remove anything from the forest as any form of removal from the forest would result in a loss of 'Carbon Credits'.   Therefore to maintain their 'Carbon Credits' there is no reduction of the fuel load, no Hazard Reduction, large fuel loads and bigger hotter fires with no fire preventative measures, no fire breaks etc.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 27, 2019, 01:14:02 PM
I agree, climate change will have bugger all effect on bushfires on its own.

One of the reasons Australia should do something about emissions/climate change/workplace regulation is it shows the less developed countries which direction to go in the future. Sort of like how features that were in Mercedes Benz 20 years ago are now becoming standard on cheap cars. Mercedes didnt save many lives installing ABS on its cars in the 80s, but how many lives have been saved in main stream cars due to ABS since?

Someone has to lead the way, whether we can financially sustain it is above my pay grade...
Finally someone gets it. :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on December 27, 2019, 03:34:42 PM


I agree, climate change will have bugger all effect on bushfires on its own.

One of the reasons Australia should do something about emissions/climate change/workplace regulation is it shows the less developed countries which direction to go in the future. Sort of like how features that were in Mercedes Benz 20 years ago are now becoming standard on cheap cars. Mercedes didnt save many lives installing ABS on its cars in the 80s, but how many lives have been saved in main stream cars due to ABS since?

Someone has to lead the way, whether we can financially sustain it is above my pay grade...

X2
Another reason to get in early on the renewable technology charge is economics.
We all know we cant just turn off our old generation systems. But there is a change coming. Through history theres been narrow windows of major technology changes. Those countries that embraced, developed and lead the way in introducing the technologies set their economies up for strong futures. Sadly instead of making things, we are becoming a country of baristas and wedding planners.
European countries with high labour costs are still leading the charge in both manufacturing and developing technologies. Unfortunately we dont seem to have the leadership or courage to be able to. Something is seriously broken here.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 27, 2019, 03:41:04 PM


Unfortunately we dont seem to have the leadership or courage to be able to. Something is seriously broken here.

I would suggest that we don't run our own show these days.



Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 27, 2019, 05:01:18 PM
Quote from: glenm64
We all know we cant just turn off our old generation systems. But there is a change coming.
But there are millions of brain dead people think its that easy.. Flick th switch and the climate will change overnight - watching too much Disney..

**** the fact some people need electricity to stay alive or dialysis or keep their food, etc...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 27, 2019, 05:08:09 PM


But there are millions of brain dead people watching too much Disney
Sorry to edit your post, but I thought this was more appropriate.
 

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: krisandkev on December 27, 2019, 05:16:09 PM
And I don't think we are thought about by other countries that much. We are very small. Nothing we do would have much of a impact. There are counters that are just wishing we would cut our coal exports so they can sell their coal, mined with no thought to the environment. Travel the world and you really understand how we stand in the world. Lead by example. Sounds good but not so sure. Even the kiwi's did not follow our lead with gun laws. Kevin
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 27, 2019, 05:30:32 PM
Quote from: krisandkev
We are very small. Nothing we do would have much of a impact.
We again have a winner.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: GeoffA on December 27, 2019, 06:01:03 PM
And I don't think we are thought about by other countries that much........

Yep. As a nation, we have an over-inflated view of our global importance.....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 27, 2019, 06:18:05 PM
Yep. As a nation, we have an over-inflated view of our global importance.....
You are so right mate.
We are 26M in population, but some believe we are in the same league as the Big Boys.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on December 27, 2019, 06:46:43 PM
Interesting when I was working at Hardly Normal, many years ago, talking to the reps of companies about how significant the Australain market was to them :

Sony brand back in late 90's the Australain market in comparison to the rest of the world was  . 01 %

The huge LG factories back then, could make in 2 days, all the white goods Australia bought in a year.

Other manufacturers would use Australia as a dumping ground for old technology.

Back then we had a population of around 19 million.

Naturally things have changed,  our population has grown,  but I dont think that much to warrant us as a country of much significance in buying power.

Mark
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 27, 2019, 07:50:26 PM
But there are millions of brain dead people think its that easy.. Flick th switch and the climate will change overnight - watching too much Disney..

**** the fact some people need electricity to stay alive or dialysis or keep their food, etc...

I am more intrigued to know just what kind of Climate our 'fixed' Climate will be. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 27, 2019, 08:18:20 PM


We all know we cant just turn off our old generation systems. But there is a change coming.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

Yes there is...but it can't happen overnight. But we keep shutting down coal fired power stations with no replacement for them...so in the short term, we have a problem.
With no way to store power ( hydro is miniscule and batteries are not worth talking about ), and a big reduction in quick response base load power ( coal and gas ) we are headed for blackouts in the next few years, even if there is big scale production of solar or wind farms.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 27, 2019, 09:02:19 PM
You are so right mate.
We are 26M in population, but some believe we are in the same league as the Big Boys.
If I may channel my inner Allan Jones for a moment and throw some numbers out there to be considered (I promise I want be getting out my grains of rice to prove my point though);

Our (under) 26M population today equates to 0.33% of the total world population.
In 2016 we produced 1,712 million tonnes of emissions.
Or 3.6% of the total global emissions of that year.

If you only look at emissions from burning fossil fuels in that year; then our little 0.33% of the global population was responsible for producing 4.8% of the global total fossil fuel emissions.

Yes our population is relatively small, but we are responsible for exporting so much pollution for the rest of the to pump into the atmosphere on our behalf.

The above numbers don’t include our “recycling” goods that currently get shipped over the Thailand and Indonesia to be piled up and burnt on our behalf....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 27, 2019, 09:35:18 PM
After being able to catch up with the nephew for a couple of hours on Christmas day before he went back to fight fires, The sentiment amongst the locals was pretty much along these lines .. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVZ13HKlMOs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVZ13HKlMOs) .. 2:30 mark ..   Theyre not happy at having their hands tied by people hundreds of K's away .
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 27, 2019, 09:40:38 PM
After being able to catch up with the nephew for a couple of hours on Christmas day before he went back to fight fires, The sentiment amongst the locals was pretty much along these lines .. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVZ13HKlMOs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVZ13HKlMOs) .. Theyre not happy at having their hands tied by people hundreds of K's away .

If the current way of not being allowed to do things under the banner of RFS, I can see it will be like the second bloke they interviewed, it will go back to pre RFS days were neighbours just got together and did their thing and went about doing their business as they know it needs to be done.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 27, 2019, 09:41:46 PM
The second bloke sums up the feelings pretty well ..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 27, 2019, 09:49:02 PM
The second bloke sums up the feelings pretty well ..

Agreed. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 27, 2019, 10:39:56 PM


If you only look at emissions from burning fossil fuels in that year; then our little 0.33% of the global population was responsible for producing 4.8% of the global total fossil fuel emissions.

Yes our population is relatively small, but we are responsible for exporting so much pollution for the rest of the to pump into the atmosphere on our behalf.



These numbers you quote....are you saying our power stations emit 4.8% of global emissions ?? Or are you saying what we produce and export are burnt by other countries and that is somehow our figure ??

What some people ignore is the fact that our coal is some of the best in the world, and if we didn't export it, then other countries would, and the emissions would be a lot worse...so even though some greenies don't like the idea of us exporting our "clean" coal, until OTHER countries stop burning coal, we believe it or not , are actually keeping emissions at a lower level than if we stopped exporting.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 27, 2019, 11:20:19 PM
Quote from: alnjan
I am more intrigued to know just what kind of Climate our 'fixed' Climate will be.

****ed if I know... I don't think there's anything we can do to change it... the planet will do what it needs to keep going, although I do believe the planet is far to over populated to be healthy... so many countries wiping out rain forests, and the amazon burning doesnt help
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: krisandkev on December 28, 2019, 06:09:40 AM
****ed if I know... I don't think there's anything we can do to change it... the planet will do what it needs to keep going, although I do believe the planet is far to over populated to be healthy... so many countries wiping out rain forests, and the amazon burning doesnt help

Like I heard many years ago. It has nothing to do with saving the planet. It is about us. The planet would love to get rid of us. The planet would recover. Kevin
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 28, 2019, 08:13:21 AM
Considering it was only a few years ago CO2 was at a very dangerously low level with a very real threat to just about all living things on Earth and the recent very minor rise in CO2, compared to historic levels of CO2.  The reactions by some people to that minor rise really has me concerned just what CO2 level they want and from there just what impact on the planet they want.  Climate is Climate but we will always have weather, whether that be drought, heat wave floods or whatever. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on December 28, 2019, 08:14:54 AM
Just as George Carlin said all those years ago, Kev ..   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7W33HRc1A6c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7W33HRc1A6c)   .............     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rnl_BnrUxjU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rnl_BnrUxjU)        I identify tooo much with George Carlins views                              .. ;D :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: krisandkev on December 28, 2019, 08:48:32 AM
Just as George Carlin said all those years ago, Kev ..   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7W33HRc1A6c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7W33HRc1A6c)   .............     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rnl_BnrUxjU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rnl_BnrUxjU)        I identify tooo much with George Carlins views                              .. ;D :cheers:

There you go. I think he is spot on. Thanks for the link. Kevin
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 28, 2019, 09:24:15 AM
Here is another good video of the subject !! Don't know why the link is so long, but it works..


https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FnkoRm9A7xr8%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR2fV00LMm6acsFvm-5K1A_A1ktRl_iErADAvkwhO0TfIWdHPYBhCfxYHC0&h=AT2j1RQgemOggF0tCUzq5eL9NQ1WTmdKg8yGmFr82bgpoh6vKtklbby5X24VVKu8oq9pvkU8cTieCejIu0E_q-jMOzx_sGlTZ55aH6QqQFmZkeihOEPNq7AoVmGo0qulcHlS28gqn-OFoXYdW-hElnQUQ7eRSwXhHlc21NFhx6340VaF9JNyeBrWm5XvMhVd5VBR9nVjYULMx5wZij9czPN-c59uUDPAu1oXy25N5yePTEK6XBs61_zZU3o1S73_w4_rnf1EBzfIpfIMkABqidQVD3xjOv7sTUtCCMQPzMbLuJ5K0YShYTEX4t5vVlRyfhrVdSNVXRz_iUUbZGiIUyRbTWYJuarkbkHfYs0DGM-T2RvmsR17AGPit5OEnrTmP2HvbGbs9gWFby8MqF2cgeH4_cZ0DONcCvEdaOYGYphX9zi177ePd9BOPyBJFR1fc8y72Wn1y9uZ97DiEPDaKQ9Oi94bAuM3IiusOg5jQXq12OOxpU849OtZZ9NB1wkGTEBg-X4KPS-FXj8UhYZ1xWOsIS8Qz4_pdPpbrAcmKRJEhSSWQn1mfbbFC5IR9QS_7VZ5i-5sTyBzyNH1GXVQKApIjyi2ieMclGpf4jTqNI1f38NMZuz3M_W1CmQGgfeNNKzFEYIphIkw7aJaAx7_MoIYl59Sdkq1zKKtz-S0pg
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 28, 2019, 09:55:50 AM
Here is another good video of the subject !! Don't know why the link is so long, but it works..


https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FnkoRm9A7xr8%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR2fV00LMm6acsFvm-5K1A_A1ktRl_iErADAvkwhO0TfIWdHPYBhCfxYHC0&h=AT2j1RQgemOggF0tCUzq5eL9NQ1WTmdKg8yGmFr82bgpoh6vKtklbby5X24VVKu8oq9pvkU8cTieCejIu0E_q-jMOzx_sGlTZ55aH6QqQFmZkeihOEPNq7AoVmGo0qulcHlS28gqn-OFoXYdW-hElnQUQ7eRSwXhHlc21NFhx6340VaF9JNyeBrWm5XvMhVd5VBR9nVjYULMx5wZij9czPN-c59uUDPAu1oXy25N5yePTEK6XBs61_zZU3o1S73_w4_rnf1EBzfIpfIMkABqidQVD3xjOv7sTUtCCMQPzMbLuJ5K0YShYTEX4t5vVlRyfhrVdSNVXRz_iUUbZGiIUyRbTWYJuarkbkHfYs0DGM-T2RvmsR17AGPit5OEnrTmP2HvbGbs9gWFby8MqF2cgeH4_cZ0DONcCvEdaOYGYphX9zi177ePd9BOPyBJFR1fc8y72Wn1y9uZ97DiEPDaKQ9Oi94bAuM3IiusOg5jQXq12OOxpU849OtZZ9NB1wkGTEBg-X4KPS-FXj8UhYZ1xWOsIS8Qz4_pdPpbrAcmKRJEhSSWQn1mfbbFC5IR9QS_7VZ5i-5sTyBzyNH1GXVQKApIjyi2ieMclGpf4jTqNI1f38NMZuz3M_W1CmQGgfeNNKzFEYIphIkw7aJaAx7_MoIYl59Sdkq1zKKtz-S0pg

In attempts to discredit the video, the Climate Alarmists are simply writing it off as it is allegedly funded by the big bad coal/gas companies and therefore it is full of lies. Really makes no difference to something funded by parties representing the renewable energies or funded via UN/IPCC. 

But yes if we do not look at the past and recognise the historical facts it is very easy to make up a new history to support a new theory.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 29, 2019, 11:14:41 AM
Our (under) 26M population today equates to 0.33% of the total world population.

I thought the worlds population is close to 6 billion.
I'm  lost :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 29, 2019, 11:27:26 AM
Just as George Carlin...
love to see him do Greta or wat ever its name is
Title: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 29, 2019, 12:35:07 PM
I thought the worlds population is close to 6 billion.
I'm  lost :(
* The current population of Australia is 25,348,657 as of Saturday, December 28, 2019, based on Worldometers elaboration of the latest United Nations data.
* Australia population is equivalent to 0.33% of the total world population.
* Australia ranks number 55 in the list of countries (and dependencies) by population.

 https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/australia-population/ (https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/australia-population/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 29, 2019, 12:48:28 PM
These numbers you quote....are you saying our power stations emit 4.8% of global emissions ?? Or are you saying what we produce and export are burnt by other countries and that is somehow our figure ??
Our total contribution to the worlds problem, domestic and exported.




I’m not going to be polluting this bushfire thread with any more climate change stuff.
It’s a messy and decisive topic, and it’s pretty clear what everyone’s thoughts are on both sides.

There’s a great bunch of guys and girls on here and I recon we’d all get along great sitting around a campfire somewhere in our great outdoors enjoying nature together.
And I guess that’s what surprises me, a group of people that apparently all love getting out into nature can have a standup argument about how it’s perfectly fine to keep pumping crap into our atmosphere and destroying what we all supposedly love to enjoy.

So I’m not entering into more arguments on here, because I’m sure eventually we will all see the errors of our current way of doing things and will make a change for the betterment of everything on this planet and not just our tiny little economy....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 29, 2019, 12:50:41 PM
* The current population of Australia is 25,348,657 as of Saturday, December 28, 2019, based on Worldometers elaboration of the latest United Nations data.
* Australia population is equivalent to 0.33% of the total world population.
* Australia ranks number 55 in the list of countries (and dependencies) by population.

 https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/australia-population/ (https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/australia-population/)
Sorry mate,
Didn't have me glass on and I didn't see the piont before the 33
My bad.
God I love this getting old crap :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 29, 2019, 01:03:51 PM
Our total contribution to the worlds problem, domestic and exported.


And I guess that’s what surprises me, a group of people that apparently all love getting out into nature can have a standup argument about how it’s perfectly fine to keep pumping crap into our atmosphere and destroying what we all supposedly love to enjoy.



No stand up argument from me ?  Also haven't heard anyone say it's perfectly fine to keep pumping crap into the atmosphere either ?
But for the same reason I dislike having a discussion about religion, I know I can't change someones belief....no matter how many facts I can throw at them, so I'll leave it as is as well !!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 29, 2019, 02:07:29 PM
So we close the coal power stations and theres no more fires ever and we all live happily ever after in our disney movie I guess..

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on December 29, 2019, 02:18:25 PM
So we close the coal power stations and theres no more fires ever and we all live happily ever after in our disney movie I guess..

What was that quote about rose coloured glasses ??   ;D ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 29, 2019, 02:23:15 PM

And I guess that’s what surprises me, a group of people that apparently all love getting out into nature can have a standup argument about how it’s perfectly fine to keep pumping crap into our atmosphere and destroying what we all supposedly love to enjoy.


I hope you are not including CO2 in the 'crap'.  We need it or we will die. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 29, 2019, 03:02:33 PM
I hope you are not including CO2 in the 'crap'.  We need it or we will die.

Don't think there's much danger of it running out ???

Was watching a David Attenborough show on South America last night. He was talking about volcanoes & said that this one "erupts with the force of an atomic bomb, every 10 seconds" :o
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 30, 2019, 06:42:55 PM
 :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

Quote
Volunteer firefighter dies after truck rolls near Albury

A Rural Fire Service volunteer firefighter has died this evening, with two others suffering burns while battling the Green Valley fire, 70 kilometres east of Albury.

It is believed that their truck rolled after being hit by extreme winds while battling the Green Valley Fire, one of four emergency fires burning around the state as of 7pm.

The fire is moving fast due to strong winds, and is increasing on River Road in the Jingelic area, to the northern side of the Murray river.

This marks the third RFS volunteer to lose their life during this catastrophic fire season, after Andrew O'Dwyer and Geoffrey Keaton were killed in a motor vehicle accident on the Green Wattle Creek fireground south-west of Sydney in the week before Christmas.

North of the Green Valley fire, the Dunns Road fire is also at emergency level, south-east of Wagga Wagga.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/volunteer-firefighter-dies-after-truck-rolls-near-albury-20191230-p53nqm.html (https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/volunteer-firefighter-dies-after-truck-rolls-near-albury-20191230-p53nqm.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 30, 2019, 07:06:30 PM
Never good when that happens, just saw it on Facebook feeds. 

Watching the News and following on from the PM going to compensate RFS members for fighting the fires they do a story on the big downturn of tourists to places like the blue Mountains and how it is affecting the Tourist related business there.  Suggestion made they should have some sort of compensation as well.  Yeah Nah.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 30, 2019, 07:40:03 PM
Never good when that happens, just saw it on Facebook feeds. 

Watching the News and following on from the PM going to compensate RFS members for fighting the fires they do a story on the big downturn of tourists to places like the blue Mountains and how it is affecting the Tourist related business there.  Suggestion made they should have some sort of compensation as well.  Yeah Nah.   

Few years ago as well as fire relief work with farmers etc (we helped a family that the father was in hospital with massive 3rd degree burns after the wind changed and came across his paddocks as a 4km front :'( they were so appreciative of our 4 days there they gave is a massive cook up!!! :D :D :D :D  ) but a few clubs down here got together and traveled the fire ravaged areas, buying fuel, buying lunch at shops in small towns, few beers at the pubs, staying overnight in motels, buying few t-shirts that dont fit me :'( ,  stubby holders etc... locals really appreciated feeling wanted and the few bux I hope helped.

Would love to do the same thing this year.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 11:37:53 AM
Got some friends evacuated down on the beach near Mogo/Tomikin in NSW....

They arent in a good way apparently.

photo from Twitter of Batemans Bay
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ENE-YxdVAAEmRVA.jpg:large)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 12:13:25 PM
Reading up on the young bloke killed yesterday and his injured crew..


Quote
The volunteer firefighter who died when his truck rolled at a NSW-Victoria border town has been named as father-to-be Samuel McPaul.

The fatal truck rollover near Jingellic on Monday night was caused by an "extraordinary weather event" when a "fire tornado" lifted a 10-12 tonne Rural Fire Service truck and flipped it onto its roof, Rural Fire Service Commissioner Shane Fitzsimmons said.

"As it turns out, not only did a truck get blown over, but another command vehicle in the same extraordinary weather event was blown over," Mr Fitzsimmons said.

I knew fire can create its own weather but FARKLES... :(

Young bloke with a kid on the way too :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 12:37:14 PM
Not sounding good for friends house at Tomakin :(

https://twitter.com/hashtag/BatemansBay?src=tren (https://twitter.com/hashtag/BatemansBay?src=tren)



Batemans Bay 12 noon
https://twitter.com/i/status/1211819329311789056 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1211819329311789056)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ENE_nDoU0AENVuS.jpg:large)

(https://betadailytelegraphatnewscorpau.files.wordpress.com/2019/12/newsmmglpict000204262061.jpg?w=600)





Sarah McPhee
32 minutes ago

Approximately 200 animals have been locked inside Mogo Zoo "as much as possible" by 15 staff onsite trying to keep them safe from the out-of-control Clyde Mountain bushfire. The park is home to primates, zebras, white rhinos, lions, tigers, giraffes etc. More soon on @newscomauHQ
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on December 31, 2019, 12:44:55 PM
From another forum

"The situation around Batemans Bay looks pretty horrendous and the fire's jumped the Princes Highway near Mogo. "

"The industrial area in South Bateman bay is on fire. I am told Bunnings along with other shops and factories is burning."

Jesus, I don't even want to think about what a fire in the BGS would be like :o
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 12:46:33 PM
From another forum

"The situation around Batemans Bay looks pretty horrendous and the fire's jumped the Princes Highway near Mogo. "

"The industrial area in South Bateman bay is on fire. I am told Bunnings along with other shops and factories is burning."

Jesus, I don't even want to think about what a fire in the BGS would be like :o


Yea, Mogo Zoo - the staff are stuck trying to sve the animals - and the fireys cant get anywhere near the joint

(https://images.scribblelive.com/2019/12/31/df0e9164-6145-40bb-b971-a921f10822af.jpeg)
From Tomakin Road, across from the zoo




Latest fire updates
Vic Emergency website (http://emergency.vic.gov.au/respond/)
Rural Fire Service website (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/)
Tasmania Fire Service website (http://www.fire.tas.gov.au/)
Listen to ABC Melbourne 774 AM (https://www.abc.net.au/radio/melbourne/live/)
Listen to ABC Gippsland 828 AM (https://www.abc.net.au/radio/gippsland/live/)
Listen to ABC Sydney 702 AM (https://www.abc.net.au/radio/sydney/live/)
Listen to ABC Canberra 666 AM (https://www.abc.net.au/radio/canberra/)
Listen to ABC Hobart 936 AM (https://www.abc.net.au/radio/hobart/live/)





Edit:
Southerly change reaches Batemans Bay

The Rural Fire Service has confirmed the southerly change has reached Batemans Bay and significantly dropped temperatures.

It's unclear yet what impact the change in wind direction has had on the town as phone and internet coverage is poor, but with fire burning to its south there is likely to be some damage.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 31, 2019, 12:56:12 PM
F%& that ain't good

From RFS website

EMERGENCY WARNING
EMERGENCY WARNING - Clyde Mountain (Eurobodalla LGA)

Posted:31/12/2019 13:50

Close modal
A bush fire is burning to the south of the Kings Highway in the Clyde Mountain area. The fire is more than 31,000 hectares in size and is out of control.

Current Situation

A strong southerly change is expected across the fireground. This will push the fire in a northerly direction. While you may not be at threat now, the fire may reach your area.

This large fire is burning on the southern side of the Kings Highway, in the Buckenbowra and Runnyford areas.
The fire has crossed the Princes Highway near Mogo. The Princes Highway is now closed.
Fire activity is increasing. Spot fires are burning ahead of the main fire front.
This fire has grown from the Currowan fire on the southern flank.
Latest

Multiple fires are currently burning between Cooma, Bega and Batemans Bay and a number of these pose a serious threat to life.
We urge you to seriously consider if you should be in this area today. People in bush fire prone area between Batemans Bay and Bega should move towards a larger town away from bushland areas, such as Narooma, Moruya, Bega and Batemans Bay, if the path is clear.
Advice

Areas north of the Moruya River and Mogendoura

It is too late to leave.
Seek shelter as the fire approaches. Protect yourself from the heat of the fire.
Buckenbowra, Runnyford and Nelligen

Fire activity is increasing in the area moving in an easterly direction towards the Buckenbowra River.
It is too late to leave.
Seek shelter as the fire approaches. Protect yourself from the heat of the fire.
Coastal areas east of the Princes Highway from Batemans Bay to Broulee

It is too late to leave.
Seek shelter as the fire approaches. Protect yourself from the heat of the fire.
Araluen and Reidsdale

Fire activity is increasing in the area.
If your plan is to leave or you are not prepared, leave west via Majors Creek towards Braidwood.
North Batemans Bay, Surfside, Long Beach, South Durras, Maloneys Beach and Long Beach

Monitor the conditions.
Be alert to embers and spot fires.
Know what you will do if the fire threatens.
Mogo, Bimbimbie and Mogendoura

Continue to monitor conditions.
If your plan is to leave, leave early in the morning before fire threatens.
Follow your bush fire survival plan, and know what you will do if the fire threatens.
Deua River Valley

Monitor the changing conditions. Follow your bush fire survival plan, and know what you will do if the fire threatens.
Mogendoura and Buckenbowra

Monitor the changing conditions. Follow your bush fire survival plan, and know what you will do if the fire threatens.
If you are threatened by fire

Do not be in the path of the fire.
Protect yourself from the heat of the fire. Wear protective clothing and footwear. Cover all exposed skin.
If the fire impacts, seek shelter in a solid structure to protect yourself from the heat of the fire.
If your life is at risk, call Triple Zero (000).
Neighbourhood Safer Places

Neighbourhood Safer Places are a place of last resort during a bush fire emergency.
Wharf Street Car Park - Wharf Street, Nelligen (adjacent to the wharf)
Hanging Rock Oval - Cnr Beach Road & Hanging Rock Road, Catalina
NSW RFS Training Building - Eurobodalla Training Ground, Bimbimbie Road, Mogo
Malua Bay Beach Reserve - George Bass Drive, Malua Bay (south of the Surf Club)
Jack Buckley Park - Sunpatch Parade, Tomakin
Mossy Point Foreshore - Intersection of Annetts Parade, Pacific Street and Surfside Avenue, Mossy Point
Moruya Showground - Albert Street, Moruya
Maloneys Beach - Cnr Maloneys Drive and Hibiscus Close, Maloneys Beach
Araluen Recreational Reserve - Araluen Road, Araluen
Evacuation Centres

For a list of evacuation centres visit Disaster Assistance.
People are encouraged to register online at Register Find Reunite before attending evacuation centres.
Other Information

Stay up to date on bush fires in your area by checking the NSW RFS website, listening to your local radio station, or by calling the NSW RFS Bush Fire Information Line on 1800 679 737.
All National Parks in the area are closed today. Before visiting national parks, check for closures at NSW Parks and Wildlife Service.
People with respiratory conditions who are affected by bush fire smoke should activate their health management plan and seek medical advice if necessary. Take precautions, such as staying indoors and closing windows.
For information on road closures, check Live Traffic NSW. Roads may be closed without warning.
Monitor weather conditions and weather warnings at Bureau of Meteorology.
The next update on this fire will be issued by 31/12/2019 14:25 or if the situation changes.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 12:59:37 PM
F%& that ain't good
Long beach looking back at batemans bay itself

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ENE0RHVVAAAql6B.jpg)

Twitter feeds say Surfside is gone.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Long+Beach+NSW+2536/@-35.6933892,150.2099343,14z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m5!3m4!1s0x6b15bf9dcee7932b:0x50609b4904428a0!8m2!3d-35.6866084!4d150.2284437 (https://www.google.com/maps/place/Long+Beach+NSW+2536/@-35.6933892,150.2099343,14z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m5!3m4!1s0x6b15bf9dcee7932b:0x50609b4904428a0!8m2!3d-35.6866084!4d150.2284437)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 31, 2019, 02:44:20 PM
Another sad day

NSW premier Gladys Berejiklian said two people have died in bushfires which swept through a small NSW south coast town, and another is missing.

"There are two deceased persons in Cobargo and there are grave concerns for another," she said.

The father and son were found in a house west of Cobargo.

Fears of more deaths with people missing. 

https://www.9news.com.au/national/bushfires-near-me-live-coverage-victoria-nsw-residents-evacuated-ahead-of-catastrophic-fire-conditions/d2fd78c3-c1b4-46f9-adb7-ba2cf6d6a3b8
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 06:14:37 PM
Another sad day

NSW premier Gladys Berejiklian said two people have died in bushfires which swept through a small NSW south coast town, and another is missing.

"There are two deceased persons in Cobargo and there are grave concerns for another," she said.

The father and son were found in a house west of Cobargo.

Fears of more deaths with people missing. 

https://www.9news.com.au/national/bushfires-near-me-live-coverage-victoria-nsw-residents-evacuated-ahead-of-catastrophic-fire-conditions/d2fd78c3-c1b4-46f9-adb7-ba2cf6d6a3b8
was a great little town... looking at the latest - its all but wiped out. :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on December 31, 2019, 06:21:44 PM
was a great little town... looking at the latest - its all but wiped out. :'(
Just catching up on the news now

So very sad
:(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 06:22:51 PM
Navy now involved evacuating from the beaches down the coast.. choppers and some landing craft boat thingys
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on December 31, 2019, 08:48:01 PM
Unbelievable footage from on-board a Fire and Rescue NSW truck

The crew from Fire and Rescue NSW Station 509 Wyoming recorded this video showing the moment their truck was overrun by the bushfire burning South of Nowra. The crew was forced to shelter in their truck as the fire front passed through.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-fires-live-multiple-bushfires-burning-at-emergency-level-on-new-year-s-eve-20191231-p53nrr.html (https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-fires-live-multiple-bushfires-burning-at-emergency-level-on-new-year-s-eve-20191231-p53nrr.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on December 31, 2019, 08:54:26 PM
Far out man, that is intense!!

My nephew’s GF is trapped at her workplace near Nowra tonight. Saw some footage that she took of the guys there trying to save all the animals out of the paddocks and keep the fire out of the stables and buildings.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on December 31, 2019, 09:02:47 PM
Not the place you want to be.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 01, 2020, 02:20:39 PM
Not the place you want to be.
Story goes they were in a convoy of 4 trucks... heading out to the field. Driver decided it was too dangerous, so crew leader called convoy to turn back
They started turning around as did 2 trucks behind them.

2 trucks behind them had their brake lines MELT.... they were in Shit..
first truck made it past other 2, as did last to safety

2nd nad 3rd trucks had to sit out the storm - their trucks catching fire..
when safe to - they donned the BA and made for the 3rd truck to find it brakes locked too

both crews then BA and headed up the road to an RFS tanker and then onto control point for checking and met up with other tanker crews.

not sure wat happened to 4th truck - but all were safe in the end.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 01, 2020, 02:26:27 PM
This is awesome from Esso


Gas company Esso had sent one ship and two helicopters to Mallacoota as of Wednesday morning, with another being prepared to head to the small East Gippsland town. Esso was asked by state emergency services to provide such support.

"We have made an offshore support vessel, the Far Saracen, available and the vessel is now at Mallacoota and supporting response actions there. We are preparing a second vessel, the Far Senator, to be available to mobilise to Mallacoota in the coming days," an Esso spokesman said.

"Two of Esso’s fleet of helicopters are also being made available to evacuate impacted community members from Mallacoota, as well as assist emergency services personnel in getting to those impacted."

The Esso ships provided food and water and stand ready to assist in whatever way possible.

pic of the ship thats arrived
(http://www.shipspotting.com/photos/middle/3/4/4/1748443.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 01, 2020, 02:28:49 PM
Story goes they were in a convoy of 4 trucks... heading out to the field. Driver decided it was too dangerous, so crew leader called convoy to turn back
They started turning around as did 2 trucks behind them.

2 trucks behind them had their brake lines MELT.... they were in Shit..
first truck made it past other 2, as did last to safety

2nd nad 3rd trucks had to sit out the storm - their trucks catching fire..
when safe to - they donned the BA and made for the 3rd truck to find it brakes locked too

both crews then BA and headed up the road to an RFS tanker and then onto control point for checking and met up with other tanker crews.

not sure wat happened to 4th truck - but all were safe in the end.

Bugger.   Do the F&R trucks have a sprinkler system like the RFS trucks? 

Not that it would make that much difference with that hot a fire. 

Not sure which fire it was now but heard the aircraft were called off a fire after a helicopter dropped his bucket to have the water turn to steam before it hit the tree tops. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 01, 2020, 02:32:52 PM
This is awesome from Esso

Great to see people helping out where and how they can. 

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Wazza999 on January 01, 2020, 03:25:54 PM
Check out the Sat image and photos from NZ.
[URL]https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-01/smoke-shrouds-australia-as-nsw-bushfires-continue/11835734?pfmredir=sm[URL]
Not looking forward to returning to Canberra. Air quality has been bad since 7th December but nothing like this!

2011 NT Pajero; 2007 Goldstream Crown 4B

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 01, 2020, 04:22:34 PM


This is awesome from Esso

Some clown tourist on the news,
Saying what a slap in the face it is to the locals, concidering that Esso is the cause of these fires through Climate Change.

Just no pleasing some.


Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: MDS69 on January 01, 2020, 05:16:34 PM
Bugger.   Do the F&R trucks have a sprinkler system like the RFS trucks? 


No the F&R trucks do not have the sprinkler system.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 01, 2020, 06:13:41 PM
No the F&R trucks do not have the sprinkler system.

Didn't think they did at least they had their BA gear. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 01, 2020, 06:14:03 PM

Some clown tourist on the news,
Saying what a slap in the face it is to the locals, concidering that Esso is the cause of these fires through Climate Change.

Just no pleasing some.
I hope someone clubbed that **** stain with a club. or chased him into the fire.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 01, 2020, 06:22:35 PM
I hope someone clubbed that **** stain with a club. or chased him into the fire.
Even the ABC reporter was struggling to deal with him.
She said, we have heard they are they to assist,
He cut her off saying, he can't see any activity,  so why it there?
What a flog.
I got the empression she wanted to terminate the interview, but he kept dribbling on about the damage from this company.
I don't know, some people have barrow to push no matter what.
Btw, he was a tourist to the area, :(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 01, 2020, 06:26:21 PM
I like the ABC report in his yellow reporting from the fire ground at a burnt out car commenting how the fire was that hot it melted the paint off the car which ran down the hill.  Looking at the footage I think he may be a bit confused with aluminium instead of paint. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 01, 2020, 06:27:12 PM
Even the ABC reporter was struggling to deal with him.
She said, we have heard they are they to assist,
He cut her off saying, he can't see any activity,  so why it there?
What a flog.
I got the empression she wanted to terminate the interview, but he kept dribbling on about the damage from this company.
I don't know, some people have barrow to push no matter what.
Btw, he was a tourist to the area, :(
Someone should tell teh Esso crew and point him out so they leave him behind and give him nothing.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 01, 2020, 09:06:16 PM
Wow

NSW

    15 lives lost, four in the past 24 hours
    Two people remain missing
    More than 100 bushfires burning
    3.6 million hectares burned, greater than the size of Belgium
    1087 homes confirmed destroyed
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 01, 2020, 09:39:29 PM
Wow

NSW

    15 lives lost, four in the past 24 hours
    Two people remain missing
    More than 100 bushfires burning
    3.6 million hectares burned, greater than the size of Belgium
    1087 homes confirmed destroyed

NSW,

We have a history of Fire.  Not that many want to look at History. 

"Large fires in the east and west

1974-75 also saw the most severe fire season for perhaps 30 years in the far west of the State with 3,755,000 hectares burnt, 50,000 stock lost and 10,170km of fencing destroyed. One and a half million hectares were burnt in the Cobar Shire and 340,000ha in the Balranald Shire. At that time, the Moolah-Corinya fire was the largest fire ever to be put out by firefighters. The perimeter was over 1,000km. Three people died in the fire, 100 were hurt and 40 homes were destroyed.

In the late 1970s, the Blue Mountains endured two bad fire seasons. In late 1976, 65,000ha were burnt. The following year, one life was lost, 49 buildings were destroyed alongside of a further 54,000ha. Serious fires occurred in the Southern Highlands two years later in 1978-79. Major fires were widespread for the 1979-80 fire season burning over one million hectares in total across the State.
"

It's all there in the RFS website, easy to find.  I dare say as it was burning in the State's far west there was not the population to cause the same problem as the coast burning. 

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/about-us/history
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Shippo on January 01, 2020, 10:55:59 PM
This is awesome from Esso


Gas company Esso had sent one ship and two helicopters to Mallacoota as of Wednesday morning, with another being prepared to head to the small East Gippsland town. Esso was asked by state emergency services to provide such support.

"We have made an offshore support vessel, the Far Saracen, available and the vessel is now at Mallacoota and supporting response actions there. We are preparing a second vessel, the Far Senator, to be available to mobilise to Mallacoota in the coming days," an Esso spokesman said.

"Two of Esso’s fleet of helicopters are also being made available to evacuate impacted community members from Mallacoota, as well as assist emergency services personnel in getting to those impacted."

The Esso ships provided food and water and stand ready to assist in whatever way possible.

pic of the ship thats arrived
(http://www.shipspotting.com/photos/middle/3/4/4/1748443.jpg)


Thats my old ship!  We had heard rumours through the grapevine that the Saracen had been seconded to a rescue mission..and only today were told it was to provide support for the people affected by the bushfires.
There are a few guys Ive worked with that live in the gippsland area. Havent heard yet whether they still have their homes.
Weve had smaller fires around where I live in SA, it frightens me to see the magnitude of the ones Vic and NSW are experiencing now
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on January 02, 2020, 06:34:49 AM
Wow

NSW

    15 lives lost, four in the past 24 hours
    Two people remain missing
    More than 100 bushfires burning
    3.6 million hectares burned, greater than the size of Belgium
    1087 homes confirmed destroyed

This morning the count on homes lost increased to 1,298..
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Spada on January 02, 2020, 06:44:08 AM
I like the ABC report in his yellow.....

Spent a little time yesterday watching the coverage on various channels. I'm far removed from the effects, but still share concern for the situation. In the end I turned it off cause I got sick of the reporters wearing fire suits interviewing people in shorts and thongs from places like the Bega showgrounds, or some place where the fire had been and gone and locals were allowed to return. It was obvious they were just wanking it up to make it look good for the telly, as some didn't even have the jackets done up? One clown was even wearing the helmet and face shield when reporting, with people milling about in a playground the background.

Far as I'm concerned, if your going to wear the pyjama's then put down your microphone and pick up a hose........ must be infuriating to locals that are directly affected by the fires, and even more insulting to the RFS people?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rockrat on January 02, 2020, 07:02:19 AM
NSW,

We have a history of Fire.  Not that many want to look at History. 

"Large fires in the east and west

1974-75 also saw the most severe fire season for perhaps 30 years in the far west of the State with 3,755,000 hectares burnt, 50,000 stock lost and 10,170km of fencing destroyed. One and a half million hectares were burnt in the Cobar Shire and 340,000ha in the Balranald Shire. At that time, the Moolah-Corinya fire was the largest fire ever to be put out by firefighters. The perimeter was over 1,000km. Three people died in the fire, 100 were hurt and 40 homes were destroyed.

In the late 1970s, the Blue Mountains endured two bad fire seasons. In late 1976, 65,000ha were burnt. The following year, one life was lost, 49 buildings were destroyed alongside of a further 54,000ha. Serious fires occurred in the Southern Highlands two years later in 1978-79. Major fires were widespread for the 1979-80 fire season burning over one million hectares in total across the State.
"

It's all there in the RFS website, easy to find.  I dare say as it was burning in the State's far west there was not the population to cause the same problem as the coast burning. 

https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/about-us/history
Pretty sure they didn’t have the same technology (water bombers etc) to help fight the fires back then so once out of control it was probably inevitable that huge areas were burnt out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Troopy_03 on January 02, 2020, 07:07:23 AM
Pretty sure they didn’t have the same technology (water bombers etc) to help fight the fires back then so once out of control it was probably inevitable that huge areas were burnt out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep, and with limited resources, their main concern would have been in saving houses and lives, at the expense of letting grazing land burn. There is simply no comparison between that fire and the current fires. Geez nearly 1300 homes lost so far.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: KevG on January 02, 2020, 07:18:59 AM
We are a couple of hundred kms inland from the coast fires. For the last couple of weeks we have had lots of smoke and a couple of grass fires out on the Hume Highway, which pales against what is happening down on the coast.

That said, a visitor to the region decided to light a fire last night on a riverbank. Apparently said visitor now has met a few locals and was given a very expensive reminder of the holiday!

I don't mind people doing stupid and/or dangerous things if the only person who will get hurt is the person doing the stupid and/or dangerous thing. I do object to people doing stupid and dangerous things when it could have a severe effect on a whole community.

Be safe and sensible out there.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on January 02, 2020, 07:30:44 AM
I like the ABC report in his yellow reporting from the fire ground at a burnt out car commenting how the fire was that hot it melted the paint off the car which ran down the hill.  Looking at the footage I think he may be a bit confused with aluminium instead of paint.

First rule of journalism (if that what it is!)....never gets facts get in the way of a good story.

 :cheers:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on January 02, 2020, 07:36:12 AM
Wifes sister and husband have lost their house.  Wasn't in bush either!  Fires were just too fast, too hot and too intense for anything in their paths.  Hope to hell that they are extinguished soon. Such a bad start to a new year...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 02, 2020, 07:44:16 AM
We are a couple of hundred kms inland from the coast fires. For the last couple of weeks we have had lots of smoke and a couple of grass fires out on the Hume Highway, which pales against what is happening down on the coast.
Mate now lives in Goulburn and said on phone new yers night that the smoke was intense where he lived, and the fires were a long way away.. :(



Quote
Be safe and sensible out there.
X eleventy.. just hope people on the Vic/NSW coast take notice and GTFO town before the Shit weather on Saturday
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 02, 2020, 08:17:43 AM
Someone should tell teh Esso crew and point him out so they leave him behind and give him nothing.

Yep, leave him behind - in the middle of Bass Strait! >:D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on January 02, 2020, 04:21:24 PM
First rule of journalism (if that what it is!)....never gets facts get in the way of a good story.

 :cheers:

2nd rule: If it bleeds, it leads.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rockrat on January 02, 2020, 05:32:43 PM
Wifes sister and husband have lost their house.  Wasn't in bush either!  Fires were just too fast, too hot and too intense for anything in their paths.  Hope to hell that they are extinguished soon. Such a bad start to a new year...
Sad to hear that, mate.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 02, 2020, 07:57:07 PM
Talkin to a mate at Tomakin near Mogo... Their house was saved, they are on top of a hill too.. currently they have 9 fire trucks out the front, they are using the court they live in as a staging spot and look out area..

Her brother lives down near Bermagui and it isnt looking good at all for the town, Rob believes it wont survive :(

Her brother is on his way up now and their plan b is the beach again like other day.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rockrat on January 02, 2020, 08:48:31 PM
I don’t want to start another s*&t fight but it seems our PM has taken a new liking to using the word ‘climate’, although not necessarily followed directly by ‘change’. He is also talking about hazard reduction in national parks and land zoning among other things.

Hopefully the end result will be a pragmatic approach that undoubtedly won’t satisfy those at the far left/right but will move us in the right direction.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 02, 2020, 09:19:25 PM
I don’t want to start another s*&t fight but it seems our PM has taken a new liking to using the word ‘climate’, although not necessarily followed directly by ‘change’. He is also talking about hazard reduction in national parks and land zoning among other things.

Hopefully the end result will be a pragmatic approach that undoubtedly won’t satisfy those at the far left/right but will move us in the right direction.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

After the fires are out and have been investigated the Inquiry/Summit/Commsission will be held and it will be interesting what the out come will be.  What Fire mitigation plans will be put in place and further more will they be enacted on or left pretty much ignored like they have been in Victoria regardless of it regularly burning.  Will also be interesting what changes there may be to the 'Bushfire Management and National Environment Law'

https://www.environment.gov.au/epbc/publications/factsheet-bushfire-management-and-national-environment-law (https://www.environment.gov.au/epbc/publications/factsheet-bushfire-management-and-national-environment-law)

While the Bushfires are the Responsibility of the States and Territories, will there be more Federal Resources that can be made available or acquired. 

There is so much within Fire Mitigation that can be done and needs to be investigated.  My biggest concern is that it will be buried or glossed over by Climate Change.   
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 02, 2020, 09:31:27 PM
I don’t want to start another s*&t fight but it seems our PM has taken a new liking to using the word ‘climate’, although not necessarily followed directly by ‘change’. He is also talking about hazard reduction in national parks and land zoning among other things.

Hopefully the end result will be a pragmatic approach that undoubtedly won’t satisfy those at the far left/right but will move us in the right direction.

He got chased out of Cobargo today  :cup:

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/go-back-to-kirribilli-morrison-heckled-by-angry-residents-in-cobargo-20200102-p53ogb.html (https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/go-back-to-kirribilli-morrison-heckled-by-angry-residents-in-cobargo-20200102-p53ogb.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 02, 2020, 09:42:04 PM
Saw that on the news.  Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 02, 2020, 09:51:50 PM
Quote from: alnjan
Saw that on the news.  Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

IMWO - HIs actions were far too late - although the state leaders should have a good kicking too.. But HE should have taken initiative when he saw Shit going down as it was

and I still cant get over the holiday... same with the NSW disaster minster pissing off to London few days ago.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 02, 2020, 10:11:29 PM
IMWO - HIs actions were far too late - although the state leaders should have a good kicking too.. But HE should have taken initiative when he saw Shit going down as it was

and I still cant get over the holiday... same with the NSW disaster minster pissing off to London few days ago.

Maybe, but maybe more a case of going under the radar of media right from the start.  He was at a lot of the earlier NSW fires with the NSW Premier making sure things were being down.  He was also there without the Premier.  He just did it without the media circus unlike the other bloke that is looking for media shots.  Do you want a PM quietly going about doing things, making sure things are in place when needed?  Or  some bloke trying to be popular?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 03, 2020, 05:56:39 AM
Story goes they were in a convoy of 4 trucks... heading out to the field. Driver decided it was too dangerous, so crew leader called convoy to turn back
They started turning around as did 2 trucks behind them.

2 trucks behind them had their brake lines MELT.... they were in Shit..
first truck made it past other 2, as did last to safety

2nd nad 3rd trucks had to sit out the storm - their trucks catching fire..
when safe to - they donned the BA and made for the 3rd truck to find it brakes locked too

both crews then BA and headed up the road to an RFS tanker and then onto control point for checking and met up with other tanker crews.

not sure wat happened to 4th truck - but all were safe in the end.

The Team have done a little Facebook vid saying what happened. 

https://www.facebook.com/frnsw/videos/2647486995338740/UzpfSTE0NzcyNTA1MTY6MTAyMjEyNjQxMTQ3NDA1NDY/ (https://www.facebook.com/frnsw/videos/2647486995338740/UzpfSTE0NzcyNTA1MTY6MTAyMjEyNjQxMTQ3NDA1NDY/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 03, 2020, 07:43:51 AM
After initially ****ing up massively being too slow and clumsy - I reckon that the 2 state leaders deserve a pat on the back and a beer for getting their Shit together

Nothing like this has ever happened and lets hope nothing like this or close to this ever happens again - but there will be lessons learned by so many, local councils, all emergency services, local gov, state gov, Feds, the works.

its a shame that Shit like this has to happen to learn.

Listening to one of the pollys that lives near Malua Bay I think it was who lived through the nightmare, he was saying on tele this morning when asked about the Cobargo locals giving ScoMo a GTFO of town message,  he said that he hadnt had a phone call from Morrison and didnt even know he was coming, - and that morrison got what he deserved...  :cup: :cup:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on January 03, 2020, 07:57:25 AM
After initially ****ing up massively being too slow and clumsy - I reckon that the 2 state leaders deserve a pat on the back and a beer for getting their Shit together

Nothing like this has ever happened and lets hope nothing like this or close to this ever happens again - but there will be lessons learned by so many, local councils, all emergency services, local gov, state gov, Feds, the works.

its a shame that Shit like this has to happen to learn.

Listening to one of the pollys that lives near Malua Bay I think it was who lived through the nightmare, he was saying on tele this morning when asked about the Cobargo locals giving ScoMo a GTFO of town message,  he said that he hadnt had a phone call from Morrison and didnt even know he was coming, - and that morrison got what he deserved...  :cup: :cup:
Just saw an interview with the Victorian Premiere, he was asked if Scomo and the Federal Govtt were doing enough, his reply, yes, in constant contact with the PM and  that he has offered considerable assets and services.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Moggy on January 03, 2020, 08:01:11 AM
Listening to one of the pollys that lives near Malua Bay I think it was who lived through the nightmare, he was saying on tele this morning when asked about the Cobargo locals giving ScoMo a GTFO of town message,  he said that he hadnt had a phone call from Morrison and didnt even know he was coming, - and that morrison got what he deserved...  :cup: :cup:

Don't know what people expect him to do, it's not like he struck the match.
Damned if he doesn't turn up & damned when he does.
I'm not a big supporter, but reckon a fair bit of the flak he cops is purely because of his beliefs.

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 03, 2020, 08:02:30 AM
While the Bushfires are the Responsibility of the States and Territories, will there be more Federal Resources that can be made available or acquired. 

Yes, they are State problems, but need to be dealt with as a National cross-border matter.

We need to get rid of the maps that show this fire burning right up to a dead straight line that happens to be the border.

The large aircraft should also be owned by the Fed Govt, so they can be sent where needed instantly, not after discussions between state govt's.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 03, 2020, 08:14:08 AM
Talkin to a mate at Tomakin near Mogo... Their house was saved, they are on top of a hill too.. currently they have 9 fire trucks out the front, they are using the court they live in as a staging spot and look out area..

Her brother lives down near Bermagui and it isnt looking good at all for the town, Rob believes it wont survive :(

Her brother is on his way up now and their plan b is the beach again like other day.
Photos from outside mates place.. you'd feel a bit safer living on top of a hill with these boys using your house as a lookout frmo top of the hill!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 03, 2020, 10:26:34 AM
Moruya bridge looking north

(https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/81293992_1665459513594000_851268621215727616_n.jpg?_nc_cat=101&_nc_oc=AQmZBVGO8cd3i8A03Q5r7ri_OOoyGux0BCod1u6ZIJa9A0O8aReyujemlffhVaXccGo&_nc_ht=scontent-syd2-1.xx&oh=1d17c4f42b4c13d8ccfd7b969e706c87&oe=5EA81592)

(https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/81976184_1665438770262741_3119037187732013056_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&_nc_oc=AQnxovs4FX5yUP_tI98tCVOk0q_99-ViXts6CZlyiRIk5VEFxCPucDcLRLXJ1tyuKd8&_nc_ht=scontent-syd2-1.xx&oh=78a45a26117d03a31411b259d6b48fb6&oe=5EA204AA)

https://www.facebook.com/pg/braidwoodbugle/photos/?ref=page_internal (https://www.facebook.com/pg/braidwoodbugle/photos/?ref=page_internal)
From teh Braidwood Bugle
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 03, 2020, 10:49:47 AM
Harvey Norman in Batemans Bay teamed up with Meals on Wheels have put free food in freezers out the front for people..  :cup: :cup: :cup: :cup:

'ANYONE URGENTLY NEEDING A MEAL?? Meals on Wheels have placed frozen meals out the front of our store for anyone in need. Help yourself 🥰
And don't forget to call in for a free coffee, we are also streaming the news live and can charge up your phones and powerbanks.'

(https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/s960x960/81382282_10220206519251760_2105976822058450944_o.jpg?_nc_cat=101&_nc_oc=AQn_7Y_EbzPLZd83-vU39i08fyOYRy8ckudOfIzHQEmfALCkQ8h8ac3nEqHo-751-Vs&_nc_ht=scontent-syd2-1.xx&oh=95d592443496a7418cc814ab93777407&oe=5E669FB1)


how awesome are some people
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1444256279100563&set=a.115287841997420&type=3&theater&ifg=1 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1444256279100563&set=a.115287841997420&type=3&theater&ifg=1)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on January 03, 2020, 12:33:24 PM


its a shame that Shit like this has to happen to learn.



But will they learn ?
There was a royal commission after the 1939 Vic bushfires.
There was another after the black Saturday fires of 2009.

Did they implement anything from these ?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 03, 2020, 01:04:49 PM
Wondered how long it would take for this Shit to happen.

Quote
Man arrested after allegedly stealing from evacuated home

A man has been arrested after a car and valuables were stolen from a vacant home about 110km south-east of Wagga Wagga.

About 3.30pm yesterday a man broke into a rural property on Old Tumbarumba Road at Batlow. The home was unoccupied at the time because the residents had evacuated the property due to bushfire activity.

The man allegedly searched through the house before stealing a Ford Falcon sedan.

A short time later, officers from Riverina Police District saw the vehicle driving erratically along Old Tumbarumba Road.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: McGirr on January 03, 2020, 04:25:26 PM
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2959629134056716&id=125982670754724 (https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2959629134056716&id=125982670754724)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 03, 2020, 04:41:19 PM
Saw that on the news.  Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.
Hmmm,
Best post today in our Ratepayers and Business owners group was from a Leftie, ex depty mayor, that Morrison Does Not deserve the criticism.
People needs to calm down.

Bird,
Nick Ritar is the name of the clown  that was bagging Esso,
He was just on ABC NEWS again being evacuated on the Navy Ship, still having ago at the goverment.
His words,
'We are Australia's first Cilmate Change Refugees'
WTF?
No Dickhead, you are camper on holidays that thought better than the people who told you to leave a few days ago.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on January 03, 2020, 04:58:31 PM

Nick Ritar is the name of the clown  that was bagging Esso,
He was just on ABC NEWS again being evacuated on the Navy Ship, still having ago at the goverment.
His words,
'We are Australia's first Cilmate Change Refugees'
WTF?
No Dickhead, you are camper on holidays that thought better than the people who told you to leave a few days ago.

Wonder how he got there?
Drove there using than filthly Esso petrol by chance??
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 03, 2020, 05:05:31 PM
Wonder how he got there?
Drove there using than filthly Esso petrol by chance??
He might drive a Prius ;)

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 03, 2020, 05:48:16 PM
He might drive a Prius ;)
whats it made of ...and hows that made.... I'd say by eating lots of licorice LMAO
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 03, 2020, 06:10:36 PM
whats it made of ...and hows that made.... I'd say by eating lots of licorice LMAO
Ehehehe.
Cheers
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on January 04, 2020, 09:48:04 AM
One for the people who think that Australian action on climate change is pointless.

Australia was the fourth largest producer of coal in 2017, according to the International Energy Agency. It also has one of the highest per capita greenhouse gas emission rates globally. The 2020 Climate Change Performance Index ranked Australia last of 57 countries for its climate policy, saying it had gone backwards under the Morrison government.

Intelligence levels also seem to be going backwards.

Anyway, I hope there's no further loss of life, but I am sure to be disappointed on that one. This is just the start of the climate change disaster; we aint seen nothing yet.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on January 04, 2020, 10:11:21 AM
One for the people who think that Australian action on climate change is pointless.

Australia was the fourth largest producer of coal in 2017, according to the International Energy Agency. It also has one of the highest per capita greenhouse gas emission rates globally. The 2020 Climate Change Performance Index ranked Australia last of 57 countries for its climate policy, saying it had gone backwards under the Morrison government.

Intelligence levels also seem to be going backwards.

Anyway, I hope there's no further loss of life, but I am sure to be disappointed on that one. This is just the start of the climate change disaster; we aint seen nothing yet.

Just like in the 1900's, bad bushfires are nothing new.
As for the other stuff there mate, that subject has been locked once already.....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on January 04, 2020, 10:12:53 AM
Just had a post from the local Team come up:
https://www.facebook.com/northerntablelandsteam/posts/2587953554591450 (https://www.facebook.com/northerntablelandsteam/posts/2587953554591450)

Quote
One Team. Many Players.

Yesterday NSW State Emergency Service Commissioner Carlene York visited the New England Fire Control Centre on day 120 of the on-going multi agency firefighting effort at the Northern Tablelands Fire Control Centre.

NSW SES Volunteers from across the State have supported this effort since the start of our bush fire emergency on the 5th September 2019. Their members have provided invaluable assistance in logistics, transport and communications; critical elements that ultimately assist firefighters in containing fires.

121 days, and we still have something around 700,000ha in the process of being controlled or under control, never mind what has already burnt.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 04, 2020, 12:23:14 PM
WOW.......

Convoy of cars drive into the lake to avoid the fire
convoy-of-cars-drive-into-the-lake-to-avoid-fire  LINK FIXED (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-01/convoy-of-cars-drive-into-the-lake-to-avoid-fire/11836056)

Something I hadnt thought about - what do you do if your diabetic or otherwise etc and your prescriptions are lost in teh house....????

Good on this bloke!!
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/amid-the-ruins-of-the-nsw-bushfires-this-pharmacist-is-keeping-his-doors-open (https://www.sbs.com.au/news/amid-the-ruins-of-the-nsw-bushfires-this-pharmacist-is-keeping-his-doors-open)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 04, 2020, 02:22:50 PM
can take the worst of a situation to bring out the best of some people
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 04, 2020, 05:26:15 PM
Just saw on ABC site

"New South Wales is facing a major electricity supply crisis due to bushfires.
 
The state government has confirmed fire has taken out two electricity substations in the Snowy Mountains region.
 
The destruction has resulted in supply issues in the state.
 
People are being urged to switch off any unnecessary equipment including pool pumps."
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 04, 2020, 05:46:40 PM
This has got farken searious Shaggers, in all States.
The blame game, the pointing of fingers has to stop, until this can be contained making it a politcal football doesn't help anyone.
Our country is hurting, not only people/communities, our farmers, but our Wildlife, waterways, yep our enviroment has taken a huge hit.
Might be time for many to reflect on how good we have it.
We can only hope that lessons will be learnt, and positive solutions and we become better prepared, even still self awareness are actioned.
Lets hope weather events like this are not going to beome norm,
A bit of self reflection goes a long way.
Take Care Swaggers.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 04, 2020, 06:20:45 PM
This has got farken searious Shaggers, in all States.
The blame game, the pointing of fingers has to stop, until this can be contained making it a politcal football doesn't help anyone.
Our country is hurting, not only people/communities, our farmers, but our Wildlife, waterways, yep our enviroment has taken a huge hit.
Might be time for many to reflect on how good we have it.
We can only hope that lessons will be learnt, and positive solutions and we become better prepared, even still self awareness are actioned.
Lets hope weather events like this are not going to beome norm,
A bit of self reflection goes a long way.
Take Care Swaggers.

well said Jon. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on January 04, 2020, 07:26:59 PM
This has got farken searious Shaggers, in all States.
The blame game, the pointing of fingers has to stop, until this can be contained making it a politcal football doesn't help anyone.
Our country is hurting, not only people/communities, our farmers, but our Wildlife, waterways, yep our enviroment has taken a huge hit.
Might be time for many to reflect on how good we have it.
We can only hope that lessons will be learnt, and positive solutions and we become better prepared, even still self awareness are actioned.
Lets hope weather events like this are not going to beome norm,
A bit of self reflection goes a long way.
Take Care Swaggers.

We are most certainly reaping the results of decisions made or avoided 20, 30 or 40 years ago and all levels of government certainly have ash on their hands for it. There have been a few Royal Commissions and Coroner investigations in the past 50 years, so although the extent is unprecedented, the contributing factors have been seen before.

It appears that there is:
no clear systematic plan for hazard reduction,
restrictions on clearing,
pandering to inner city green groups,
cutting Forestry management staff,
turning worked forests into National parks but not giving them the staff to manage it and a bunch of other reasons.

A couple of years of drought and a warming climate certainly haven't made it any better.

I don't blame the Greens, I blame the parties that actually held power having policies that pandered to the likely Green voters, but not committing the budget to do the job properly.

You can't look surprised when you take a forest, lock it up, allow 30 years of leaf litter to accumulate and then you get a dry spell with a wind behind it and it burns. Who would have thought ????
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 04, 2020, 07:33:48 PM
Quote from: Hairs
The blame game, the pointing of fingers has to stop, until this can be contained making it a politcal football doesn't help anyone.
Agree
Quote
Take Care Swaggers.
Agree.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on January 05, 2020, 10:04:29 PM
It appears that there is:
no clear systematic plan for hazard reduction,
restrictions on clearing,
pandering to inner city green groups,
cutting Forestry management staff,
turning worked forests into National parks but not giving them the staff to manage it and a bunch of other reasons.

A couple of years of drought and a warming climate certainly haven't made it any better.

I don't blame the Greens, I blame the parties that actually held power having policies that pandered to the likely Green voters, but not committing the budget to do the job properly.

You can't look surprised when you take a forest, lock it up, allow 30 years of leaf litter to accumulate and then you get a dry spell with a wind behind it and it burns. Who would have thought ????

There s a clear plan for hazard reduction and a lot of the time it is being met or exceeded
The only restrictions on clearing require council approval, which is usually given
Inner city green groups are white noise
Yes, some issues with NPWS cuts, and budget is a really big problem. But apparently there is no climate change crisis, so no need for funding.

One of the major problems is that the number of people available to burn is dropping - volunteer numbers are reducing, and so is the capacity for NPWS (who do the majority of burns) to keep up. And the second, and probably equal problem, is that the window of opportunity is reduced every year, thanks to climate change. To the point where it's now likely impossible to keep up with the required planning.

That said, nothing could have been done to mitigate what we're going through, and this is the new normal for the future. Thanks to climate change.

We really have nothing in the tank now. It doesn't matter where you live, it is now a good idea to keep a bag or three packed in the car, and have your old photos and documents packed in a box ready to go. All of us are at risk. Tasmania and QLD are next on the list.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 05, 2020, 11:14:30 PM
There s a clear plan for hazard reduction and a lot of the time it is being met or exceeded
The only restrictions on clearing require council approval, which is usually given
Inner city green groups are white noise
Yes, some issues with NPWS cuts, and budget is a really big problem. But apparently there is no climate change crisis, so no need for funding.

One of the major problems is that the number of people available to burn is dropping - volunteer numbers are reducing, and so is the capacity for NPWS (who do the majority of burns) to keep up. And the second, and probably equal problem, is that the window of opportunity is reduced every year, thanks to climate change. To the point where it's now likely impossible to keep up with the required planning.

That said, nothing could have been done to mitigate what we're going through, and this is the new normal for the future. Thanks to climate change.

We really have nothing in the tank now. It doesn't matter where you live, it is now a good idea to keep a bag or three packed in the car, and have your old photos and documents packed in a box ready to go. All of us are at risk. Tasmania and QLD are next on the list.

If only it was that easy.

There are many and varied reason the Hazard Reduction Burns are not being don like they once were.  Too many reason to go into here.  But I'll give you just one example.     

Was talking to my Father in law over Christmas lunch.  40 plus years ago he was in the NSW Forestry and had been for sometime.  An expert turned up one day and wanted to do some research on the way Forestry did it's burn offs.  One evening he goes out with the crew and as they usual did, at the top of the ridge started running the drip torch out along the road, then sat back and watched the small flames trickle slowly down the hill side.  After an hour or two of sitting in the night air the export was becoming bored and stated he didn't have all night to sit around and do nothing and wanted the fire lit at the bottom of the hillside.  Despite protests from the Forestry Workers and regardless of all they told him he still wanted the fire lit at the bottom of the hill. 

Against their better knowledge and combined years of experience a fire was lit at the bottom of the hill.  For those that know fire you will know what happened.   From the bottom of the hill the flames quickly became larger and larger and then fire does it's magic act of attracting fire to fire and the two fires increased to one another.  The result one very big fire then went up and crowned sending embers everywhere. 

Long story short the Forestry guys were putting out fires for the next couple of weeks and the expert disappeared stating Hazard Reduction Burns were dangerous and should not be conducted. 

Shortly after that episode a new 'boss' took over the running of the Forestry.  He very quickly demonstrated he had no idea of anything Forestry, with all trees being Blackbutt.  Then one day out in the Forest the 'Boss' was going off.  Jumping up and down shouting out louder as he jumped higher saying, "What is this?  What is this?"  The workers were looking at each other wondering what this bloke was on.  Finally it was worked out he was going off about there being a Fire Trail in the Forest.  He had no idea why there should be a Fire Trail in the Forest and wanted the Fire Trail removed so there were more Blackbutts. 

The Father in law could see what was happening so he left the Forestry to drive Goods Trains.  Talking to him he said he didn't want to really talk about it cause it makes his blood boil that 'people' like these two examples could destroy what once was a good thing. 

From all those years ago when Hazard Reduction Burns or as they were called back then Burn Offs were routinely done similarly to the old style crop rotation to now where of all the land that could have a Hazard Reduction Burn, only 1 to 2 % is actually burnt.  Think about that. 

Even if 'Climate Change' could be 'fixed', we will still have weather events like drought with heatwave and strong winds which will make catastrophic fire dangers and we will continue to have Bushfires.  With all the tools we have available to fight Bushfires only allows Fire Fighters to be able to fight a fire up to a certain energy level, when the fuel loads are such that the Bushfire is producing 10 times that amount of energy, there is no way it can be fought.  The Science of fires is that simple. 
 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Brisbane Puff on January 06, 2020, 01:54:46 AM
This sort of an eulogy.. And I am sitting here lost as to what to say and keep it from boring everyone.

I was born and bred in Batlow. My grandfather was one of the pioneers of the fruit growing industry in Batlow. I still have his hand written diarys from when he arrived in the country, (Sydney) and how he traveled to Batlow and purchased land. He documented how he and many others cleared the bush, prepared the land and how he traveled to Melbourne to purchase the first apple trees. I am also very lucky to inherit faded photos of all this time. I had a relatively great upbringing living on the farm where all the family members lived and worked. (there were three daughters and their husbands (including my mother) living in their separate homes on the property). So I grew up during the time when Batlow apples were the be all and end all to the point where they were exported to all parts of the world.

Batlow was in it's hay day, the Forestry had it's regional head office in town along with a massive workshop. The SMA had it's northern office in town. My Grand father and some of the original growers started the Batlow Packing House which expanded into the Batlow cannery (Mountain Maid).. The railway had a line up the Gilmore Valley to ship the fruit and cannery produce direct to the Sydney markets. Things were good..No,,,, better then good. The cannery not only processed local fruit, but Peas, beans, and asparagus all trucked up from around Gundagai.. The cannery developed snap freezing, (Birds Eye) which changed the whole concept of fresh vegetables. Edgels, which I think owned the asparagus, and corn farms around Gundagai eventually bought Birds Eye and developed it to what it is today.

My mind is inundated with memories. I remember my grandfather installed the first flushing toilet septic system and I remember people from town visiting just to check it out. I remember buyers from the Sydney markets arriving and taking high tea on the verandah to discuss prices for fruit. I remember that we had our own apple grader and packing shed and made our own bushell boxes and loaded them straight on the train. We had 40 acres of cherries, supposedly the largest in the southern hemisphere.. (not real sure about that one though).
I remember that every second Saturday night, everyone that was anyone traveled into town to the movies complete with blankets cause it was friggin cold, and the town electricity was supplied by a local generator operated by a man Jackie Brown. It wasn't uncommon for the power to fail so everyone switched on their torches until Jackie got the power going again..
During the war years, before my time, my grandfather was the head of the Womens Land Army, and he built a large hostel on the property to house his workers. Later as I grew up, we still had Italians who remained from being internees and POW's living in the hostel.

But, now I'm starting to ramble, so I will get to the point... The decline of Batlow.

From before I can remember, the mountain ranges around Batlow were pine plantations. First, the forestry closed it's workshop. There was no more milling.. Big enterprise built mills down at Tumut. The local timber carters were over looked in favour of big time contractors. So Batlows only part of the forestry was a road through town, down the range to Tumut. Then the cannery did some sort of amalgamation with Leetona canned goods. Leetona went belly up and so did the local cannery. Then some time later the cannery burnt down. Then the Batlow Packing House (co-op) burnt down.. The railway stopped running trains, and in fact they pulled up the tracks. But the local growers built a new Cold store/packing house and things struggled on against a growing need for cheap imported fruit.

But time also was running out for the original pioneers who were ageing and like my Grandfather who developed cancer like so many others. Probably cause in those days, the orchids were sprayed with substances like Arsenet of Lead and other niceties like DDT.

Then the big game changer.. The fruit trees had come to the end of their fruit bearing life and needed to be grubbed out and replaced. For many, the costs were not viable against the market prices of imports. So the number of orchids decreased dramatically.. The younger generation left town to find employment.. A lot of properties were sold, but some bit the bullet and replanted. Which leads me to my point.

I have been following the NSW fire map(s).. (Go to their site and click on 'fires near you'.  If the maps are correct, (and I think they are a little understated, but more about that shortly).
The map shows that the biggest farms have had the fire storm through them. Being the fire around the north of the town covering Mayday, Haroldene, and the Herrings property as well as any small ones in between. The fire that came in from the south shows that it didn't quite engulf Keenans road but that is the other area of orchids. However, I read a report that a service station with gas bottles caught fire (and blew up).. There is only 3 service stations in town, 2 are very close to the center where the pub is but the other, which I think was the local gas supply site is just at the south end of Pioneer street. If that is the case, and I hope to hell that I am wrong, then the fire has got to the south side of town called Sunnyside.

Either way, the only existence for Batlow to recover is the fruit growing industry. There are some orchids like Moats which has seemed to escape. But how many???

A couple of last things. It looks like the switching yard for T2 power satation at Cabramurra has taken a hit, and the switching yard at T3 at Talbingo would have defiantly suffered. Not too sure about the transmission lines along the Snubba Range but the tower are fairly high. Also, that video of all the dead sheep along the road is near Wondalga before your climb up the range.. Know the paddock, just up from the Wondalga bridge, not at Batlow..

I think that what has rocked me the most is that I have 3 generations buried in a historical family plot, ( there is a last plot for me, maybe soon),. It was a nice plot in a circle under a big fir tree and fir trees around the plot.
Used to travel down every so often to check things and spend some time.. Funny really, at 72 year old never been known by my name in town, always been refereed to as Charlie Buchele's grandson.
When the fire ripped through Mayday orchid, it took out the cemetery next.. All gone...

Don't know what is going to happen to my home town...... If you got this far, thanks for reading.... I'm done.       

   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: plusnq on January 06, 2020, 06:39:09 AM
Yes mate. It’s pretty sad what has happened. Your story is being repeated all over the country. Take care of yourself in these difficult times.

Cheers
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on January 06, 2020, 08:46:41 AM
Brisbane Puff, thank you for your story, sadly history is being lost across Australia at an astonishing rate.
I live in suburbia untouched by the fires other than a bit of smoke but like most have been following with a great deal of sadness what is happening around the country.
Many of the fire effected areas we have travelled to or stayed at over the years, so in some small way we can relate to what we are seeing. We will revisit these areas, hopefully others will as well and economies and towns will rebuild and some normality will return to people’s lives.
It will be a long road to recovery, and I do not pretend to understand what you are all feeling and enduring but you can be assured we are all thinking of you all.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 06, 2020, 09:04:23 AM
This sort of an eulogy.. And I am sitting here lost as to what to say and keep it from boring everyone.

I was born and bred in Batlow. My grandfather was one of the pioneers of the fruit growing industry in Batlow. I still have his hand written diarys from when he arrived in the country, (Sydney) and how he traveled to Batlow and purchased land. He documented how he and many others cleared the bush, prepared the land and how he traveled to Melbourne to purchase the first apple trees. I am also very lucky to inherit faded photos of all this time. I had a relatively great upbringing living on the farm where all the family members lived and worked. (there were three daughters and their husbands (including my mother) living in their separate homes on the property). So I grew up during the time when Batlow apples were the be all and end all to the point where they were exported to all parts of the world.

Batlow was in it's hay day, the Forestry had it's regional head office in town along with a massive workshop. The SMA had it's northern office in town. My Grand father and some of the original growers started the Batlow Packing House which expanded into the Batlow cannery (Mountain Maid).. The railway had a line up the Gilmore Valley to ship the fruit and cannery produce direct to the Sydney markets. Things were good..No,,,, better then good. The cannery not only processed local fruit, but Peas, beans, and asparagus all trucked up from around Gundagai.. The cannery developed snap freezing, (Birds Eye) which changed the whole concept of fresh vegetables. Edgels, which I think owned the asparagus, and corn farms around Gundagai eventually bought Birds Eye and developed it to what it is today.

My mind is inundated with memories. I remember my grandfather installed the first flushing toilet septic system and I remember people from town visiting just to check it out. I remember buyers from the Sydney markets arriving and taking high tea on the verandah to discuss prices for fruit. I remember that we had our own apple grader and packing shed and made our own bushell boxes and loaded them straight on the train. We had 40 acres of cherries, supposedly the largest in the southern hemisphere.. (not real sure about that one though).
I remember that every second Saturday night, everyone that was anyone traveled into town to the movies complete with blankets cause it was friggin cold, and the town electricity was supplied by a local generator operated by a man Jackie Brown. It wasn't uncommon for the power to fail so everyone switched on their torches until Jackie got the power going again..
During the war years, before my time, my grandfather was the head of the Womens Land Army, and he built a large hostel on the property to house his workers. Later as I grew up, we still had Italians who remained from being internees and POW's living in the hostel.

But, now I'm starting to ramble, so I will get to the point... The decline of Batlow.

From before I can remember, the mountain ranges around Batlow were pine plantations. First, the forestry closed it's workshop. There was no more milling.. Big enterprise built mills down at Tumut. The local timber carters were over looked in favour of big time contractors. So Batlows only part of the forestry was a road through town, down the range to Tumut. Then the cannery did some sort of amalgamation with Leetona canned goods. Leetona went belly up and so did the local cannery. Then some time later the cannery burnt down. Then the Batlow Packing House (co-op) burnt down.. The railway stopped running trains, and in fact they pulled up the tracks. But the local growers built a new Cold store/packing house and things struggled on against a growing need for cheap imported fruit.

But time also was running out for the original pioneers who were ageing and like my Grandfather who developed cancer like so many others. Probably cause in those days, the orchids were sprayed with substances like Arsenet of Lead and other niceties like DDT.

Then the big game changer.. The fruit trees had come to the end of their fruit bearing life and needed to be grubbed out and replaced. For many, the costs were not viable against the market prices of imports. So the number of orchids decreased dramatically.. The younger generation left town to find employment.. A lot of properties were sold, but some bit the bullet and replanted. Which leads me to my point.

I have been following the NSW fire map(s).. (Go to their site and click on 'fires near you'.  If the maps are correct, (and I think they are a little understated, but more about that shortly).
The map shows that the biggest farms have had the fire storm through them. Being the fire around the north of the town covering Mayday, Haroldene, and the Herrings property as well as any small ones in between. The fire that came in from the south shows that it didn't quite engulf Keenans road but that is the other area of orchids. However, I read a report that a service station with gas bottles caught fire (and blew up).. There is only 3 service stations in town, 2 are very close to the center where the pub is but the other, which I think was the local gas supply site is just at the south end of Pioneer street. If that is the case, and I hope to hell that I am wrong, then the fire has got to the south side of town called Sunnyside.

Either way, the only existence for Batlow to recover is the fruit growing industry. There are some orchids like Moats which has seemed to escape. But how many???

A couple of last things. It looks like the switching yard for T2 power satation at Cabramurra has taken a hit, and the switching yard at T3 at Talbingo would have defiantly suffered. Not too sure about the transmission lines along the Snubba Range but the tower are fairly high. Also, that video of all the dead sheep along the road is near Wondalga before your climb up the range.. Know the paddock, just up from the Wondalga bridge, not at Batlow..

I think that what has rocked me the most is that I have 3 generations buried in a historical family plot, ( there is a last plot for me, maybe soon),. It was a nice plot in a circle under a big fir tree and fir trees around the plot.
Used to travel down every so often to check things and spend some time.. Funny really, at 72 year old never been known by my name in town, always been refereed to as Charlie Buchele's grandson.
When the fire ripped through Mayday orchid, it took out the cemetery next.. All gone...

Don't know what is going to happen to my home town...... If you got this far, thanks for reading.... I'm done.

Mate, that was anything but boring...
I grew up in a small town of around 1000/1500... I love old school small town history, how the places became, and where they are now...

Thanks for sharing.

PS: I recommend you share your story with the media. Its a story people should hear.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hoyks on January 06, 2020, 11:23:37 AM
Mate, that was anything but boring...
I grew up in a small town of around 1000/1500... I love old school small town history, how the places became, and where they are now...

Thanks for sharing.

PS: I recommend you share your story with the media. Its a story people should hear.

Same. I grew up in a logging town, but the saw mills closed as the forest they worked was transferred to NP and now the trains just roll past.
Its a sad sight to go to the cemetery and see more residents there than in the actual town.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 06, 2020, 11:49:37 AM
Lot of memories there Brisbane Puff, thanks for sharing the History of your town.  Sad to see it go in flames. 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 06, 2020, 12:07:17 PM
Quote from: Hoyks
Same. I grew up in a logging town, but the saw mills closed as the forest they worked was transferred to NP and now the trains just roll past.
Its a sad sight to go to the cemetery and see more residents there than in the actual town.
Theres something awesome about that small town feel... Something I really miss.
on the flip side, sometimes not good for everyone to know everyones business ;)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Brisbane Puff on January 06, 2020, 06:36:31 PM
To all... Thanks for the comforting comments.. I do appreciate it...

To Bird... Maybe it would be a media story, but I am very much an introvert, (PTSD does that to you). Memories seem to be flooding back, maybe it's the age thing.. Things like riding a horse to school. And yes, the school had a horse paddock. Later on my Grandfather bought an old (new then) series 1 Land Rover (when everyone was still driving around in WW2 Jeeps) and taking the kids from the neighboring farms into school through a bush track.. (The local copper, I remember his name was Sgt Bush turned a blind eye as long as we parked it down by the creek on the edge of town) . Later on, there was never a high school in town so we traveled down the mountain to Tumut in an old Diamond Reo bus. When we got to the top of the 5 mile which was the first of the steep descents , the driver wrapped a piece of 8 gauge wire around the gear stick to hold it in first gear. Yep... Lots of memories.
I'm still friendly with the people that bought our main property, the son who inherited is about my age now.. Tried to phone. Looks like all the phones are out. Doubt if they even have power..

Thanks everyone.....

 
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 06, 2020, 06:54:40 PM
I like the ABC report in his yellow reporting from the fire ground at a burnt out car commenting how the fire was that hot it melted the paint off the car which ran down the hill.  Looking at the footage I think he may be a bit confused with aluminium instead of paint.

Someone recorded the ABC reporter and then added his own comment.  Sorry it's on facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/geoff.flack.9/videos/2605189166182866/ (https://www.facebook.com/geoff.flack.9/videos/2605189166182866/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 06, 2020, 07:03:58 PM
Someone recorded the ABC reporter and then added his own comment.  Sorry it's on facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/geoff.flack.9/videos/2605189166182866/ (https://www.facebook.com/geoff.flack.9/videos/2605189166182866/)
I like this one

https://twitter.com/i/status/1213438044256137216 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1213438044256137216)

Wonder if scomo will take him up on his offer of a face to face chat.. LOL
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 06, 2020, 07:17:02 PM
I like this one

https://twitter.com/i/status/1213438044256137216 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1213438044256137216)

Wonder if scomo will take him up on his offer of a face to face chat.. LOL

this puts a different view on the Former Fire Commissioners claims.  While as fire Commissioners didn't really say much at all.   

https://factnotfiction.media/2020/01/04/data-youve-never-seen-compiled-on-our-australian-fire-services/?fbclid=IwAR2t_4PvuhLbpQtVPmztDNmnZcs79PyfSNb_YACTv5f6UMGpES5l0X9RCLI (https://factnotfiction.media/2020/01/04/data-youve-never-seen-compiled-on-our-australian-fire-services/?fbclid=IwAR2t_4PvuhLbpQtVPmztDNmnZcs79PyfSNb_YACTv5f6UMGpES5l0X9RCLI)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rockrat on January 06, 2020, 08:28:58 PM
Love him or hate him, you’ve got to admire Warnie for putting his Baggy Green up for auction


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on January 06, 2020, 08:50:25 PM
I like this one

https://twitter.com/i/status/1213438044256137216 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1213438044256137216)

Wonder if scomo will take him up on his offer of a face to face chat.. LOL
The country needed a leader to stand up, and we got Scotty from marketing.

Cheers Glen

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on January 06, 2020, 10:13:43 PM
The country needed a leader to stand up, and we got Scotty from marketing.

Cheers Glen

Just been giving my brother some stick as he works in marketing... His comment was ScoMo is not a great example of marketing, and was ushered out the door a few times...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Squalo on January 07, 2020, 11:11:23 AM
A couple of last things. It looks like the switching yard for T2 power satation at Cabramurra has taken a hit, and the switching yard at T3 at Talbingo would have defiantly suffered. Not too sure about the transmission lines along the Snubba Range but the tower are fairly high. Also, that video of all the dead sheep along the road is near Wondalga before your climb up the range.. Know the paddock, just up from the Wondalga bridge, not at Batlow..

Don't know what is going to happen to my home town...... If you got this far, thanks for reading.... I'm done.       

   

Thanks for writing that, it's a wonderful if sad read.

I grew up in Cabramurra in the seventies, I've just learned that the school, ski club and many houses were lost including the one we lived in.

On the day the weather station just as you come into town registered 128km/h winds and a temp of 69.8C. Thank god the town had been evacuated.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 07, 2020, 11:18:06 AM
Quote from: rockrat
Love him or hate him, you’ve got to admire Warnie for putting his Baggy Green up for auction

Pickles Online

$315,500 Current Bid
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: ~!@LOCKER on January 07, 2020, 11:44:16 AM
Hey Guys I am sick and tied of everyone trying to justify there existence by blaming others these days. This relates to the current fire crisis and society in general, nobody will take responsibility for anything and will just blame whoever they can.

While the issue of global warming is real, society continues to take the attitude it is somebodies problem to fix and just keeps plundering the planet.

We live in a consumer society where everyone is wanting the newest and best all the the time with no regard to the long term affects this will make on our planet. a classic examples are cars they are manufactured not to last because everyone wants a new car ever few years, same goes with mobile phones.

Even renewable energy has major problems as solar panels will never recoup the the carbon and energy debt created in manufacturing the panel (when you factor in the mining of the materials, the energy used to create those materials and the transporting of those products around the world).

Here's a thought how about we put the planet first and look at the entire picture, if we we build things to last and use less energy and consume less in the long term everyone wins.

Everyone individually can make a difference if we just be happy with what we have and not try and keep up with the Jones's.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on January 07, 2020, 01:59:06 PM
Hey Guys I am sick and tied of everyone trying to justify there existence by blaming others these days. This relates to the current fire crisis and society in general, nobody will take responsibility for anything and will just blame whoever they can.

While the issue of global warming is real, society continues to take the attitude it is somebodies problem to fix and just keeps plundering the planet.

We live in a consumer society where everyone is wanting the newest and best all the the time with no regard to the long term affects this will make on our planet. a classic examples are cars they are manufactured not to last because everyone wants a new car ever few years, same goes with mobile phones.

Even renewable energy has major problems as solar panels will never recoup the the carbon and energy debt created in manufacturing the panel (when you factor in the mining of the materials, the energy used to create those materials and the transporting of those products around the world).

Here's a thought how about we put the planet first and look at the entire picture, if we we build things to last and use less energy and consume less in the long term everyone wins.

Everyone individually can make a difference if we just be happy with what we have and not try and keep up with the Jones's.

Yep, I'm willing to live in a cave.....But you 1st, and I'll follow.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on January 07, 2020, 02:30:55 PM
So if even renewable energy has its problem, as does coal and nuclear, what do we do?

We as consumers are energy hungry, from every thing we produce including food so how does one suggest we reduce our reliance on energy.

Life as we know it will continue to advance with new technologies, what they are is beyond me, there are far smarter people than me out there working on these things.

As for keeping up with the Jones’s I don’t know anyone by that name.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on January 07, 2020, 02:50:46 PM
Bloody parents ...How dare they put aside their differences and have sex, that time ..... Bloody thoughtless and inconsiderate it was ..
    Then look what happened ................... HELLO WORLD its me Mr ED ................................   :-* :-* ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: ~!@LOCKER on January 07, 2020, 03:00:19 PM
Guys I am not saying to live in a cave, simply look at the big picture. Technology is great but if it is not used wisely then we are worse off. Take LED lights they use less energy than older light technology, but what a lot of people have now done is used a lot more lights in their houses etc and leave them on all night. What happened to turn the lights of when you leave the room?

We can reduce energy used in a lot of simple ways, for example use a clothesline to dry clothes instead of a dryer, a lot of houses now a days don't even have a clothes line. It's our decision on how live and use our resources, please don't go blaming others when we all part of the problem and equally part of the solution.

We all need to be aware of our actions in the the big picture

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 07, 2020, 03:20:33 PM
Yes you're right (& welcome to MySwag BTW ;D), but I think you'll find that a lot of the members on here are already in agreement with you about repairing / reusing & so on.

Unfortunately, the world we now live in is "throw it away & get a new one", usually because there's no facility to repair the old item :'(

I replaced a ~4 year old electric razor as a Chrissie present. The old one was working fine until it got knocked off the bench a couple of months ago, a tiny piece of plastic inside the head broke, & the cutter heads wouldn't stay properly in place any more :'(

Repairable ??? - nup, as there are NO spare parts available.

& don't get me started on computer drivers! >:(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on January 07, 2020, 04:31:47 PM
Guys I am not saying to live in a cave, simply look at the big picture. Technology is great but if it is not used wisely then we are worse off. Take LED lights they use less energy than older light technology, but what a lot of people have now done is used a lot more lights in their houses etc and leave them on all night. What happened to turn the lights of when you leave the room?

We can reduce energy used in a lot of simple ways, for example use a clothesline to dry clothes instead of a dryer, a lot of houses now a days don't even have a clothes line. It's our decision on how live and use our resources, please don't go blaming others when we all part of the problem and equally part of the solution.

We all need to be aware of our actions in the the big picture

Until you can get rid of mans greed your flogging a dead horse.  I agree that we need a drastic change but that wont happen until its too late.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 07, 2020, 04:44:31 PM
Until you can get rid of mans greed your flogging a dead horse.  I agree that we need a drastic change but that wont happen until its too late.
Greed,
We have a winner folks.
Spot on mate.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Spada on January 07, 2020, 05:50:49 PM
Think we're wandering off track a bit?

I peeked in here to see if there was some local info on the fires, not for a climate debate. If you feel compelled to start a discussion about climate change, how bout starting a specific thread just for that?
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 07, 2020, 05:56:05 PM
Yep agree Spada

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Snow on January 07, 2020, 06:22:52 PM
Think we're wandering off track a bit?

I peeked in here to see if there was some local info on the fires, not for a climate debate. If you feel compelled to start a discussion about climate change, how bout starting a specific thread just for that?
Agree.

If a Climate Change thread is started be kind to each other or the subject will permanently go in the bin and keep religion and politics company.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rockrat on January 07, 2020, 09:17:17 PM
Agree.

If a Climate Change thread is started be kind to each other or the subject will permanently go in the bin and keep religion and politics company.
There was one but it has already been locked! I don’t know what tools moderators have available but rather than locking the whole thread, is it possible to just lock individuals who don’t place nice from posting to the specific thread in question?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: shakey55 on January 08, 2020, 05:28:58 AM
Think we're wandering off track a bit?

I peeked in here to see if there was some local info on the fires, not for a climate debate. If you feel compelled to start a discussion about climate change, how bout starting a specific thread just for that?
Spot on buddy. It’s getting a little out of hand and at times rammed down out throats.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on January 08, 2020, 08:12:36 AM
I don't think CC can be debated nicely. No one seems to have a middle ground on the subject,
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 08, 2020, 08:43:23 AM
I don't think CC can be debated nicely. No one seems to have a middle ground on the subject,
agree
if people wanna - try here

https://www.climate-debate.com/forum/ (https://www.climate-debate.com/forum/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: #jonesy on January 08, 2020, 09:10:27 AM
I don't think CC can be debated nicely. No one seems to have a middle ground on the subject,
You're wrong!  I do!!

Hang on I'm arguing about not arguing.  ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: gronk on January 08, 2020, 09:14:38 AM
agree
if people wanna - try here

https://www.climate-debate.com/forum/ (https://www.climate-debate.com/forum/)

Yep, many an hour could be wasted there  sifting through all the "stuff".....
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 10, 2020, 09:06:55 AM
Just reading this about rain in the Hunter Valley :D

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-10/drought-hunter-rejoice-after-patchy-rain/11856490 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-10/drought-hunter-rejoice-after-patchy-rain/11856490)

Liquid garbage flowing down the Creek, but great to see for all that :cup:

Although lots, lots more needed all over the place!
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 10, 2020, 10:01:42 AM
Will it happen?

Quote
Royal commission, federal inquiry into bushfires flagged

Prime Minister Scott Morrison has flagged that there could be both a federal inquiry and royal commission into bushfires across the country, as the country faces another day of extreme fire danger in some parts of the state.

Mr Morrison also said that states will receive their share of an initial $60 million fund for councils on Friday, with 42 local government areas to receive at least $1 million each to spend at their discretion.

"That money goes to state governments today and I'm sure they'll deploy that to councils as soon as possible," Mr Morrison told 2GB on Friday morning.

"We want the cash getting there, we don't want a lot of paperwork."
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 10, 2020, 12:57:54 PM
42 local government areas to receive at least $1 million each to spend at their discretion.

Why is it that my nasty, cynical side immediately thought of lots of ads saying how much your Council is doing for you right now :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 10, 2020, 02:13:08 PM
Why is it that my nasty, cynical side immediately thought of lots of ads saying how much your Council is doing for you right now :'(
What like

'WA Emergency Services Levy funding used to pay for $100,000 worth of artwork at fire stations'
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-09/emergency-services-levy-money-spent-on-wa-fire-station-artworks/11853124 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-09/emergency-services-levy-money-spent-on-wa-fire-station-artworks/11853124)
Title: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on January 11, 2020, 08:06:30 AM
Impressive footage from NASA shows the smoke from these fires reaching the stratosphere over Chile.

 https://youtu.be/_anHG8awnUg (https://youtu.be/_anHG8awnUg)

And this article from a (real) scientist covers a lot of interesting points to consider about the possible impacts that fires of this scale can have on the global weather patterns.

 https://www.forbes.com/sites/marshallshepherd/2020/01/05/how-fires-in-australia-could-alter-weather-elsewhere-too/#32efeb35e2c8 (https://www.forbes.com/sites/marshallshepherd/2020/01/05/how-fires-in-australia-could-alter-weather-elsewhere-too/#32efeb35e2c8)

I found this section especially interesting;
“Another potential and far-reaching impact is related to the Pyrocumulonimbus clouds that I mentioned earlier. A 2019 study published in the journal Geophysical Research Letters found that the smoke plumes from towering smoke-laden clouds can penetrate into the stratosphere. Using the 2017 fires in the Pacific Northwest, they found from modeling studies that the smoke aerosols can linger in the stratosphere up to 5 months and actually create net warming at the top of atmosphere. Smoke contains soot, an effective of absorber of solar radiation. This is counter to the temporary cooling effect that large volcanic eruptions can have on the climate system. Volcanic aerosols injected into the stratosphere tend to be more sulfate-based, which are more effective scatterers of solar energy.”

So we have smoke from our bush fires reaching the stratosphere above Chile. We now know that smoke in the stratosphere can have a net warming effect.

And for the last piece of the puzzle.
Many (real) scientists flagged mid last year that stratospheric warming above Antarctica would cause Australia to have an extremely hot summer, peaking in January 2020.

This article from September last year sums it up pretty clearly;
 http://theconversation.com/the-air-above-antarctica-is-suddenly-getting-warmer-heres-what-it-means-for-australia-123080 (http://theconversation.com/the-air-above-antarctica-is-suddenly-getting-warmer-heres-what-it-means-for-australia-123080)

Specifically this section;
“What can Australia expect?

Impacts from this stratospheric warming are likely to reach Earth’s surface in the next month and possibly extend through to January.

Apart from warming the Antarctic region, the most notable effect will be a shift of the Southern Ocean westerly winds towards the Equator.

For regions directly in the path of the strongest westerlies, which includes western Tasmania, New Zealand’s South Island, and Patagonia in South America, this generally results in more storminess and rainfall, and colder temperatures.

But for subtropical Australia, which largely sits north of the main belt of westerlies, the shift results in reduced rainfall, clearer skies, and warmer temperatures.

Past stratospheric warming events and associated wind changes have had their strongest effects in NSW and southern Queensland, where springtime temperatures increased, rainfall decreased and heatwaves and fire risk rose.”

And now we’ve come full circle.
Stratospheric warming over Antarctica helped cause Australia to heat up and dry out more then usual.
This hotter dryer weather caused bigger bush fires then usual.
The smoke from these bigger then usual fires has now reached the stratosphere and started warming the air above the Andes.

Will be very interesting to see what the global flow on affects of this smoke from our fires will have in the near future.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 11, 2020, 09:40:14 AM
and from the BOM

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/current/annual/aus/

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 12, 2020, 02:06:10 PM
Comment I just saw regarding the fires in NNSW

"Significant praise needs to be given to the 1000s of hours that have been given by the NSW Rural Fire Service Brigades, FRNSW, NPWS crews, Forestry Corp, QRFS, VIC CFA,VIC MFB, Parks and Forestry Victoria, SA CFS, SA MFB, SA Parks, SA Forestry, WA FRS, WA RFS, NZ FRS, NZ RFS, Canadian Fire Incident Management teams from British Columbia, Alberta, Ontario, Yukon and Saskatchewan provinces, NSW Police, SES, VRA, Marine Rescue, Australian Army, NSW Ambulance, Local Councils and staff, Heavy plant and operators, aircrew and operators and the many many other community groups and services who have all come together in combating what has been unprecedented fire activity never before seen in the Northern Rivers."

Did somebody say nobody was helping us out? :-)
Title: NSW Fires
Post by: shakey55 on January 13, 2020, 05:05:50 AM
@Fizzie - I second that


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 13, 2020, 03:36:02 PM
Just saw this article:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-13/community-campaigns-helping-bushfire-towns-bounce-back/11859990 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-13/community-campaigns-helping-bushfire-towns-bounce-back/11859990)

& here's the website they mention

https://www.roadtripforgood.org.au/locale/roadtrip-for-good (https://www.roadtripforgood.org.au/locale/roadtrip-for-good)

Damn good idea! :cup:
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 15, 2020, 01:35:04 PM
Just saw reference to this poor little beastie :'(

https://www.sciencealert.com/this-echidna-got-its-spikes-burnt-off-in-a-bushfire-and-we-can-t-stop-staring (https://www.sciencealert.com/this-echidna-got-its-spikes-burnt-off-in-a-bushfire-and-we-can-t-stop-staring)

But they reckon it's quite alright & that the spines will actually eventually grow back! :D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 15, 2020, 03:41:15 PM
interesting

https://waqi.info/#/c/22.483/88.402/3.8z (https://waqi.info/#/c/22.483/88.402/3.8z)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on January 15, 2020, 07:55:22 PM
 ;D Who would have guessed the air quality would have been so hazardous in India and china
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pete79 on January 15, 2020, 10:43:03 PM
;D Who would have guessed the air quality would have been so hazardous in India and china
And who would have thought that in that image there is only 3 sites in all of China and India that have a higher pollution level then currently recorded in Melbourne today. :P ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bigfish on January 16, 2020, 07:45:45 AM
Good article confirming what most of us know...A Royal Commission is a huge waste of money, resouces and time...we know what needs doing but govts wont act!!

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-16/we-do-not-need-bushfire-royal-commission-this-is-why/11870824
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on January 16, 2020, 07:57:07 AM
Now now Pete, thinking China / India have fairly steady track record of bad to extreme bad air quality for many many decades ..snap shot from 2015 shows Australia well and truly in the green ..  ;D
Fast forwards to when someone / thing  dropped a match and started  an Oz wide  BBQ,    weve now got a few tempory spots thats pretty bad ..



Good p*ss n a fart and a bit more Polly talk will blow that away and return us back to the green pretty much till the next rerun  ;D :P
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 16, 2020, 10:49:07 AM
Good article confirming what most of us know...A Royal Commission is a huge waste of money, resouces and time...we know what needs doing but govts wont act!!

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-16/we-do-not-need-bushfire-royal-commission-this-is-why/11870824

Guess this will be the first time Climate Change will be seriously raised.  Those areas set aside for Carbon Credits where any form of Hazard Reduction is seen as a Carbon Debit and therefore remain untouched.   

There should be built in penalties where recommendations coming from Royal Commissions are not implemented without justifiable reasons.  A lot of what will come out of the Bushfires will already have been covered in previous Royal Commissions.   Victoria is a classic example.  From previous Royal Commissions they have a set minimum Hazard Reduction of 5%, which some experts believe should be 10 to 15% depending on location, but the State continues to do about 1%.   Action should be taken for the States gross neglect. 

Others with State control over what the landowner can or more the case can not do to make their own property safe from bushfire.  A lot to be looked at.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: rockrat on January 16, 2020, 12:34:20 PM
Guess this will be the first time Climate Change will be seriously raised.  Those areas set aside for Carbon Credits where any form of Hazard Reduction is seen as a Carbon Debit and therefore remain untouched.   

There should be built in penalties where recommendations coming from Royal Commissions are not implemented without justifiable reasons.  A lot of what will come out of the Bushfires will already have been covered in previous Royal Commissions.   Victoria is a classic example.  From previous Royal Commissions they have a set minimum Hazard Reduction of 5%, which some experts believe should be 10 to 15% depending on location, but the State continues to do about 1%.   Action should be taken for the States gross neglect. 

Others with State control over what the landowner can or more the case can not do to make their own property safe from bushfire.  A lot to be looked at.
I really do hope that climate change is considered. It really is time for a mature conversation and hopefully a royal commission can help facilitate that. It would be a smart move by the Libs to let it happen too - it may give them a great excuse to pivot their policies ahead of the next election. It is clear they are already starting to shift and they need to. And not just because of the bushfires. I work, and have always worked, in mining and metals and believe we should continue to mine and export our minerals, including coal, well into the future. But that also shouldn’t stop us talking steps to lesson our impact on the environment in an economically sustainable way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 16, 2020, 03:38:30 PM
Hmmm ???

"Some of the recommendations of the Stretton Royal Commission following the Black Friday fires of 1939 have still not been fully implemented."

But you can't rush these things, can you ??? ::)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 16, 2020, 06:43:57 PM
I really do hope that climate change is considered. It really is time for a mature conversation and hopefully a royal commission can help facilitate that. It would be a smart move by the Libs to let it happen too - it may give them a great excuse to pivot their policies ahead of the next election. It is clear they are already starting to shift and they need to. And not just because of the bushfires. I work, and have always worked, in mining and metals and believe we should continue to mine and export our minerals, including coal, well into the future. But that also shouldn’t stop us talking steps to lesson our impact on the environment in an economically sustainable way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

By all means include it.  My concern is while the science says now it is unknown just how much or how little, Climate Change has added, to the affects of the Drought over the past few years and other weather events that created the catastrophic fire weather conditions, the focus has to be on all aspects impact on the bushfire and all aspect the bushfire impacted on.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Rodt on January 17, 2020, 06:54:04 AM
By all means include it.  My concern is while the science says now it is unknown just how much or how little, Climate Change has added, to the affects of the Drought over the past few years and other weather events that created the catastrophic fire weather conditions, the focus has to be on all aspects impact on the bushfire and all aspect the bushfire impacted on.

Agree. I am worried that every conversation that includes climate change results in it taking over the conversation and then people walk (or run) away from the real issue.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on January 17, 2020, 07:10:35 AM
Good article confirming what most of us know...A Royal Commission is a huge waste of money, resouces and time...we know what needs doing but govts wont act!!

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-16/we-do-not-need-bushfire-royal-commission-this-is-why/11870824

Last night saw the same article which included a little bit about the author and who funds him.  Hmmm easy to see why he wrote the cash for comment piece.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Champin on January 23, 2020, 12:42:23 PM
Very interesting interview. I'm technologically challenged so I have no clue how to post it, but if you search " Craig Kelly _ Australian bush fires -- the real experts" you'll get it. It's on Facebook.
Now while I admit you'll find an " expert" under every rock, these gents talk about what I have been thinking for a long time.

Sent from my TA-1024 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on January 23, 2020, 12:45:14 PM
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jan/22/uk-climate-scientist-corrects-australian-mp-craig-kellys-blatant-misrepresentation (https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jan/22/uk-climate-scientist-corrects-australian-mp-craig-kellys-blatant-misrepresentation)     This one ?   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13t0tCV8hW8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13t0tCV8hW8)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 23, 2020, 02:27:30 PM
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-23/nsw-rfs-air-tanker-crashes-near-numeralla-bushfire/11893554 (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-23/nsw-rfs-air-tanker-crashes-near-numeralla-bushfire/11893554)

:(

edit: sounds very bad all round
https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/ (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on January 23, 2020, 03:03:49 PM
Hope they were able to put it down and get out of it .. Instead of the likes of this happening https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PExzHamjqHE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PExzHamjqHE) .
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Robbo on January 23, 2020, 03:08:06 PM
Tragic news. Can only hope and pray that all crew have survived.

Sent from my SM-J600G using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 23, 2020, 03:30:46 PM
Hope they were able to put it down and get out of it .

4.28
Confirmation that the C-130 has crashed

ACT Emergency Services has confirmed a C130 water tanker plane has crashed while battling a blaze in southern NSW, it is unknown how many were on board.
There are initial reports that the wreckage of the C-130 Hercules plane which was feared to have crashed near Cooma, north-east of the Snowy Mountains, has been found.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Marcus73 on January 23, 2020, 03:53:15 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200123/471bd88c77bfb500a7b7f79dd0acf4a4.jpg)

Sad news


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: edz on January 23, 2020, 04:48:11 PM
America lost  three of its sons to help  Australia today.   R.I.P.   
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on January 23, 2020, 06:09:57 PM
Last night saw the same article which included a little bit about the author and who funds him.  Hmmm easy to see why he wrote the cash for comment piece.

Ahhhhhhhhhh. The truth behind the news.

One might think it was all about the money.

If one was cynical ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 23, 2020, 07:41:17 PM
America lost  three of its sons to help  Australia today.   R.I.P.
Yes,
:(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Champin on January 23, 2020, 10:35:02 PM
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jan/22/uk-climate-scientist-corrects-australian-mp-craig-kellys-blatant-misrepresentation (https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jan/22/uk-climate-scientist-corrects-australian-mp-craig-kellys-blatant-misrepresentation)     This one ?   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13t0tCV8hW8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13t0tCV8hW8)
Nope. Not that one

Sent from my SM-T700 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Fizzie on January 24, 2020, 07:49:30 AM
R.I.P.

 :'(
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on January 24, 2020, 11:17:52 AM
Interesting

https://www.theage.com.au/interactive/2020/like-a-bad-dream/index.html (https://www.theage.com.au/interactive/2020/like-a-bad-dream/index.html)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on January 24, 2020, 12:59:10 PM
Coupled with the drought, have any of the bad fires killed any large areas of forest?

Cheers Glen

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 24, 2020, 04:31:34 PM
Coupled with the drought, have any of the bad fires killed any large areas of forest?

Cheers Glen
Yep,
The Clarence area has lost a lot of timber, natural as well as plantation, private lands.
There are pictures on FB, local groups, of the devastation.
The East coast has suffered greatly.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200124/de67ec9124180f2e87bae5f6ceabd6dc.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200124/6f9113b9e5ac829c05150127c9d21df2.jpg)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on January 24, 2020, 05:46:56 PM
That is what I feared, after lose of life of course, that vast areas for animal refuge wont exist. Hopefully Im mistaken.
I watched the post Bird put up that showed the ferocity of the bushfires. All I can say is, to all the fire fighters out there, you are truly brave souls. We still have a while to go this summer. Stay safe, and thank you for your service.

Cheers Glen

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: glenm64 on January 24, 2020, 06:14:19 PM
Just received this email from the mob that did my solar.
If anyone here knows someone that could benefit.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200124/224c7a4f6f73f9f87f1b7ae3579c5cb0.jpg)

e-Solar, 22 Canham Way, Greenwood, WA 6024,
ph 6363 5420

Im only re-posting their email. They were excellent to deal with, and Im taking them on face value.

Cheers Glen

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on January 24, 2020, 06:17:16 PM
That is what I feared, after lose of life of course, that vast areas for animal refuge wont exist. Hopefully Im mistaken.
I watched the post Bird put up that showed the ferocity of the bushfires. All I can say is, to all the fire fighters out there, you are truly brave souls. We still have a while to go this summer. Stay safe, and thank you for your service.

Cheers Glen
The lost of wild life is huge, there are folk tring their best to help these animals, shouldn't call them that, we share our world with them.
Wonder what they think of us.
The RFS, other services have done an enormous service, we are in their debut.
Their effort is not lost, we have a couple of members of our 4wd club who have attended most of tbe fires in the Clarence.
Our area was the first to be impacted, back in August, then this stretched down the Eastern coast.
Many communities, a hell of alot of country has suffered.

One aspect that has only just come out,
The utter destruction of country, has now lead to an increase in wild dog attacks on not only stock(fences down) but wild life just tring to survive.


Not only NSW, But Vic  and SA.

Hey, tourism is a part, but all the other industies, they are hurting.

Hmmm
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Paddler Ed on January 24, 2020, 07:13:16 PM
Forestry have decided to log the only bit of green left around on Styx and the Kempsey Road...
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on February 02, 2020, 11:47:08 AM
Filled out the forms this morning to become a RFS member.
I'll hand the paper work in on Tuesday evening at their Meeting.
Friday arvo they held an information evening for communitty members wanting to know more about how the operate, and information if you wanted to join.
About 25 odd communitty members attended, men & women, as well as k8ds in their late teens/early 20's.
The Lawrence unit is a small one(as is many in country areas), only about dozen members, if they can get half the number that showed interest, it would help them heaps.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on February 02, 2020, 12:17:52 PM
Filled out the forms this morning to become a RFS member.
I'll hand the paper work in on Tuesday evening at their Meeting.
Friday arvo they held an information evening for communitty members wanting to know more about how the operate, and information if you wanted to join.
About 25 odd communitty members attended, men & women, as well as k8ds in their late teens/early 20's.
The Lawrence unit is a small one(as is many in country areas), only about dozen members, if they can get half the number that showed interest, it would help them heaps.

Well done Jon.   I'm going to rejoin.  They closed our local Brigade expecting us all to join a neighbouring Brigade.  I think the only one that stayed in the RFS was the Brigade Captain.  Bit of politicking went on behind the scenes with it all.  The Brigade we were supposed to go to has to move still to an unknown location.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on February 02, 2020, 12:26:57 PM
Cheers Al.
I know most of these guys & girls, I'm still trying to get young Jack to join.
I reckon it would do him the world of good.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: alnjan on February 11, 2020, 02:28:33 PM
Just saw this on facebook feed. 

Fire victims have received some comforting news today, with the NSW Government releasing an amendment to the legislation that prohibits caravans being used to house bushfire victims.

NSW residents who have been bushfire affected can now live in a caravan for up to TWO years, the previous law only allowing occupation for two days:


https://www.vanhomes.com.au/articles/nsw-government-changes-caravan-law?fbclid=IwAR1UZU7JW6r8nL33pZasGDnEodhyb76TCIdA3Vvd0mLvMd9si1M4BuNahUY (https://www.vanhomes.com.au/articles/nsw-government-changes-caravan-law?fbclid=IwAR1UZU7JW6r8nL33pZasGDnEodhyb76TCIdA3Vvd0mLvMd9si1M4BuNahUY)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Pottsy on February 11, 2020, 02:37:23 PM
Just saw this on facebook feed. 

Fire victims have received some comforting news today, with the NSW Government releasing an amendment to the legislation that prohibits caravans being used to house bushfire victims.

NSW residents who have been bushfire affected can now live in a caravan for up to TWO years, the previous law only allowing occupation for two days:


https://www.vanhomes.com.au/articles/nsw-government-changes-caravan-law?fbclid=IwAR1UZU7JW6r8nL33pZasGDnEodhyb76TCIdA3Vvd0mLvMd9si1M4BuNahUY (https://www.vanhomes.com.au/articles/nsw-government-changes-caravan-law?
fbclid=IwAR1UZU7JW6r8nL33pZasGDnEodhyb76TCIdA3Vvd0mLvMd9si1M4BuNahUY)

A vote for common sense.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on February 11, 2020, 02:40:47 PM
A vote for common sense.
About bloody time

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: briann532 on February 11, 2020, 03:05:17 PM
Just saw this on facebook feed. 

Fire victims have received some comforting news today, with the NSW Government releasing an amendment to the legislation that prohibits caravans being used to house bushfire victims.

NSW residents who have been bushfire affected can now live in a caravan for up to TWO years, the previous law only allowing occupation for two days:


https://www.vanhomes.com.au/articles/nsw-government-changes-caravan-law?fbclid=IwAR1UZU7JW6r8nL33pZasGDnEodhyb76TCIdA3Vvd0mLvMd9si1M4BuNahUY (https://www.vanhomes.com.au/articles/nsw-government-changes-caravan-law?fbclid=IwAR1UZU7JW6r8nL33pZasGDnEodhyb76TCIdA3Vvd0mLvMd9si1M4BuNahUY)


Shouldn't this be in the WTF section ???  ;D
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Bird on March 16, 2023, 07:28:00 PM
Just up the road from mates place.. Hume closed too.
https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/major-fire-updates/mfu?id=11135 (https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/major-fire-updates/mfu?id=11135)
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on March 16, 2023, 08:26:19 PM
Hey Bird,
Many places are still in flood, yet the state is burning.
At lest once a week I get an alert, 'Asking for members(RFS), crews/strike teams to depart to help.
There are many fire fronts around NSW, and other states.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230316/76548a2b83ba23866ead3ed0136c94cc.jpg)

You don't use magic to disappear, ya use a 4x4 & Swag.

Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: 6knights on March 16, 2023, 09:41:56 PM
Hey Bird,
Many places are still in flood, yet the state is burning.
At lest once a week I get an alert, 'Asking for members(RFS), crews/strike teams to depart to help.
There are many fire fronts around NSW, and other states.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230316/76548a2b83ba23866ead3ed0136c94cc.jpg)

You don't use magic to disappear, ya use a 4x4 & Swag.

 Not long home from putting out one of those little triangles.
Title: Re: NSW Fires
Post by: Hairs on March 17, 2023, 05:28:09 AM
Not long home from putting out one of those little triangles.
Rest up mate.


You don't use magic to disappear, ya use a 4x4 & Swag.