MySwag.org The Off-road Camper Trailer Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Rowanb on January 15, 2011, 10:51:36 PM
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With all this Greatwall X240 stuff on telly thought I would go have a look (not that I'm really looking to sell), so I go for a drive, goes ok has a baby Mitsu engine and probably running gear. I ask ol mate how does it go off-road towing a camper trl? He doesn't know never had one off-road, but assures me the Patrol would be better. So I ask what the Patrol is worth he goes for a burn comes back and says mate nice car the best I can do is 5 grand. Now ill admit my 4b is used but well looked after has a few battle scars from being off-road, new cyl head and serviced regularly, he goes oh ok then well mate could probably go to 7 then says mate id be lucky to get 8 for it in the lot. So I thank ol mate and leave this 2 bit caryard in a cloud of 2.8 Turbo Diesel smoke.
Who would have thought that the X240 is such a good car it makes a GU patrol worth only 5 Grand. Serves myself right for being curious.
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Trade ins suck
Traded my gu with suspension barwork tyres and a few other bits and only got 10k for it
But I have ask what were you smoking to even look at a one of those
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But I have ask what were you smoking to even look at a one of those
You have to start at the absolute bottom, so you can see the benefits available as you go up in $$
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Drive your rig till the wheels fall off ( no nissan pun intended ) My last Paj after 13 years was only worth 3k as a trader , put another 3>4k into it & its still an old Paj . When its time to trade up then their time has come . Though you would want to have a dam good rearon to trade a patrol for the unproven Great wall . Dose anybody remember the Niva ???OOOooohhh. At least the heated rear window kept your hands warm as you pushed it .Do you ever see one on the road except on the Simms metal truck ???. Oh yeaaar do you read Chinglisgas the service bok kould be ard tu hunderstrand Though some like a chalange :o
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The GreatWall seems underpowered to me??????
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Dont knock the great walls too much. I go 4wding often with one. It does lack a little compared to my GU and some of the other cars - but keeps up with the hilux that comes along. The only real downfall is the lack of rear LSD - although the guy is fixing that with a locker!
I understand peoples thoughts they are unproven. But they are a rodeo chassis and mitsubishi engine - both well proven here and overseas.
It is underpowered - but not as bad as it looks on paper.
Of course, if you can afford it - the patrol is a much better car!
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With selling a 4WD you are usually better off price wise to sell it privately. Most of the time you will get a bit more cash for it.
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They do come up nice though, remember this thread, very good mods
http://myswag.org/forum/index.php?topic=6408.0
Wil
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Company I worked for in the uk a few yrs ago thought they would save by buying dual cab tata' from India, mecedes deisel engine etc. Not one lasted the 2 years of the project.
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Was looking and curious (not bi curious) It wasn't a bad"car" but is a soft roader and it shows in the shared parts its built with. The Rodeo is not a serious off-roader, sorry to all those Rodeo drivers, they can be built into a capable machine. Will be getting rid of the Patrol in 2040 though probably be very second hand by then.
Speewa we will be having words too (you have hurt my feelings :'( ) I had a Lada I loved it and put it places some guys would not put there Patrols and cruisers ok I needed a run up and it scored a few battle scars in the process. Oh and BTW the rear window heater did not warm your hands normally the fire in the engine bay warmed your hands as you opened the bonnet to put the fire out.
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Rowanb My mistake you had the upmarket rig with the built in BBQ kit . Chuck the snags on the bonnet so the CFA will have something to eat when they arrive , those boys are good on the fang .
So where is the Niva now ?
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Isn't the 'Great Wall' the winch challenge wall during the Outback Challenge? ;D
(http://image.fourwheeler.com/f/10948935+w750+st0/129_0810_10_z+moroccan_desert_outback_challenge_morocco_outback_challenge+wall_climb.jpg)
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The poor Lada was retired and left her in Darwin as I could not get her to Brissy at the time got 800 bucks for it though.
DFD no the great wall is a car that thinks its a 4wd you could be right though. :cheers:
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What a scam $800 for that bet they still looking for you >:D
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>:( Got away clean but I still get a ribbing from a mate (its been like 9yrs now)who owns of all things a Landrover so he has no credibility.
I am actually on the prowl for another one I liked it that much (bring on the slander)
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Greatwall v Patrol.
WTF????
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You generally get what you pay for. The adverts on tele should be a warning when they are feeling sorry for you if you just spent $30K on a 4wd and they can sell you one for $24 or whatever the prices actually are. Patrols are great 4wds but without lots of luxuries in them, generally pretty basic compared to most other vehicles out there and sell for a bit over $50K. To me that means there is at least $25K worth of something missing from a GW. Probably in reliability would be my gut feeling.
I know with the GW twin cabs that have a safety rating of bugger all that from an OHS point of view we couldn't buy one as a work vehicle when there are other equivalent vehicles with up to 5 star safety ratings.
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Agreed the Patrol will be with us for awhile but when the other halfs wants to go and have a look cause "im bored" will I probably deserved all the flack I get :'(
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You generally get what you pay for. The adverts on tele should be a warning when they are feeling sorry for you if you just spent $30K on a 4wd and they can sell you one for $24 or whatever the prices actually are. Patrols are great 4wds but without lots of luxuries in them, generally pretty basic compared to most other vehicles out there and sell for a bit over $50K. To me that means there is at least $25K worth of something missing from a GW. Probably in reliability would be my gut feeling.
They are cheap for a number of reasons - first is the obvious one - cheap labour. It costs Ford avg of $48 per hour for labour - GW has less than $8. They also save on research - they will spend less on engine research over 5 years than Toyota does in 3 months - yes this means poor power. They also saved on the chassis - bough it super cheap from GM - at something like $125 a car! Research is a big cost of cars. For example - when the AU ford came out - the car actually only cost $6800 to make in parts - or so I have been told.
I know with the GW twin cabs that have a safety rating of bugger all that from an OHS point of view we couldn't buy one as a work vehicle when there are other equivalent vehicles with up to 5 star safety ratings.
The current Nissan Patrol has a 3 star rating. The current Great Wall Ute has a 3 star rating (they got 2 stars in last test where a seatbelt failed - which all have been replaced on a recall). Navara, Colorado also scored 3 stars in last ancap test. The hilux and triton have 4 stars. Not a huge difference. see www.ancap.com.au
The other part here is that a Patrol is not a comparison to the V240. A patrol is a totally different car.
Dont get me wrong - I drive a GU patrol - andLOVE it. I just dont like people saying bad things about something they dont know all the facts about.
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The current add on the tele (at least here in Albury) is for a X240 which isn't a ute but a wagon and though I don't think it is as big as a Patrol that is what was being compared in this thread. I suppose labour costs do play a big part if there is $40 per hour difference
According to the ANCAP web site V240 has a 2 star rating, not 3.... I only mentioned the V240 because being involved with OHS when it comes to making decisions about safety of workers we need to do assessments on tools and machinery that we purchase, this applies to vehicles as well. I know you are allowed to use cost to justify purchasing items that may not include as many safety features as another more expensive product but when you look at the risk and outcomes of accidents, ANCAP say you are twice as likely to be seriously injured or killed in a one star vehicle verses a 5 star vehicle so there is a big difference between the two ends of the spectrum. They rate a two star vehicle as weak, a four star as acceptable.
BTW I also drive a Patrol and love it. The Patrol test was done on an ST-S 2004 model and yes it got three stars. Sounds like we have to wait until 2012 to see the new Patrol here and sometime after that until the crash tests are done... To be honest, 4wd ability was the main reason behind us buying a Patrol.
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I cant believe any one would consider one of those cheap, unreliable , poorly made, pieces of poo.... come on . No normal person would buy a patrol....
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I cant believe any one would consider one of those cheap, unreliable , poorly made, pieces of poo.... come on . No normal person would buy a patrol....
Boom Tish.
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I think a few of you guys have missed the point here I'm not trying to compare a Patrol against a Greatwall but making a point about how little you can get offered by car salesman. Do I love my Patrol you bet would I sell it you bet but my lotto numbers have not come up yet.
The only car I "would" compare a Patrol to is the Prius, now there is a good car with some great off-road ability and power to boot (watch movie other guys as the rear wheels spin not bad for a east-west engine lol) a fair comparison I reckon. :cheers:
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I think a few of you guys have missed the point here I'm not trying to compare a Patrol against a Greatwall
;D, your tread title is "Greatwall X240 Vs GU Patrol" :cup:
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When I win Powerball, I will be buying a Patrol V8 with ALL the extras.
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we were on the beach yesterday. we saw a x240 trying to get off there. using maxtrax, it was moving one metre at a time! the engine was completely gutless.
avoid. at. all. costs.
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we were on the beach yesterday. we saw a x240 trying to get off there. using maxtrax, it was moving one metre at a time! the engine was completely gutless.
avoid. at. all. costs.
Were they in the right gear, was it in 4wd, were the tyre pressures reduced, was it in low range? The GW cars have similar power to weight to my patrol - so I dont think that is the problem. Most issues relate to driver error/lack of ability, not the car.
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You can put an experieced offroad driver in a sedan and a novice in a bells and whistles 4x4 and generally the experienced driver will still go further off the beaten track.
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I can't see anything in the Great Wall specs that indicates it has low range - that makes it a softroader not a 4x4 in my book.
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we were on the beach yesterday. we saw a x240 trying to get off there. using maxtrax, it was moving one metre at a time! the engine was completely gutless.
avoid. at. all. costs.
Probably more the fact he was using maxtrax....
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Greatwall v Patrol.
WTF????
About even i thought (ha ha) ;)
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I can't see anything in the Great Wall specs that indicates it has low range - that makes it a softroader not a 4x4 in my book.
I dont know about the wagon - but the dual cab has low range.
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I can't see anything in the Great Wall specs that indicates it has low range - that makes it a softroader not a 4x4 in my book.
Agree Pipeliner, it is low range, ground clearance (and driver) which ultimately determines how far you get, and hence what is / not a 'softroader'.
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The twin cab Great Wall 4x4 has an electronic transfer case, my Subaru Forester has a manual one so i guess going by that and the comments above by Pipeliner this makes the Subee a hardcore 4x4? even if the reduction is only 20%.
Hardcore/softcore what a load of old cobblers, we took an EH ex rally car up the OTL using a Tirfor to get us out of trouble in 1975, we made a pontoon out of 44's to cross the Jardine. We had previously crossed the deserts from W.A to Alice then across to Birdsville in a series IIA 4 cyl Landy running on broken axles and spinifex propping up the blown block tread tyres, we made 15 mile in 12hours on some legs. I have owned Toyota 4x4's and old Patrols and a Pinzgauer and a 1992 Holden rodeo twin cab 4x4 that easily did the Canning and a bucket load of other tracks. These cars left me no challenge per se so i went for a Forester and boy have i taken this thing some places that make you pucker up, with a common comment of how did you get that into here, reply "drove it".
No one knowes how well a great wall will go, they havent been in the country long enough or had a chance to tackle the outback often enough. I believe after a few teething problems with the 1st gen the next gen with the diesel will be even better.
Would i buy one? No! because i like the Isuzu DMax in the twin cab class and The Challenger in the sedan class and the 3 tonne towing capacity of both.
At the end of the day i like the challenge of the Forester and will for a few more yrs yet.
To each his/her own just enjoy yourself out there in whatever you can afford to be driving.
;D
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Hardcore/softcore what a load of old cobblers, we took an EH ex rally car up the OTL using a Tirfor to get us out of trouble in 1975, we made a pontoon out of 44's to cross the Jardine. We had previously crossed the deserts from W.A to Alice then across to Birdsville in a series IIA 4 cyl Landy running on broken axles and spinifex propping up the blown block tread tyres, we made 15 mile in 12hours on some legs. I have owned Toyota 4x4's and old Patrols and a Pinzgauer and a 1992 Holden rodeo twin cab 4x4 that easily did the Canning and a bucket load of other tracks. These cars left me no challenge per se so i went for a Forester and boy have i taken this thing some places that make you pucker up, with a common comment of how did you get that into here, reply "drove it".
A good driver, well prepared, can get just about any vehicle to anywhere (minor things like approach and rampover angles excepted, and even those can be overcome with a bit of shovel work) whilst a bad driver can get bogged in a fully equipped Land Cruiser. However most of us are neither 'good' drivers or 'bad' drivers - just average, and we want to select a vehicle that stands a reasonable chance of getting us to where we want to go in a reasonable period of time and reasonable comfort - and 15 miles in 12 hours coupled with stuffing tyres with spinifex doesn't cut it for most of us.
I've sat at the side of the road for many hours rebuilding a front suspension with whatever was available. Am I glad that I was able to do it and keep going? Yes. Would I have preferred to have a vehicle that didn't need that sort of work? Of course!
I think the old MkI Landie was a great vehicle and I'd still like to own one - but no way would I pick that for a trip across from Brisbane to Perth; I'd take my Jeep with comfortable seats and air conditioning! Life these days means most of us have to know how long the trip is going to take as we have to get back to work some time, so vehicle reliability is of prime importance.
All this is rather off the Great Wall topic but it is slightly relevant - I'm sure tonyw could take a Great Wall into places where a lot of us would have problems with a Patrol, but would he select a Great Wall in the first place for that sort of driving? I doubt it!
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I reckon great walls are a good choice if you are unaware of anything else.
No seriously, buy one.
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Would I have preferred to have a vehicle that didn't need that sort of work? Of course!
Can you name a vehicle that is 100% reliable 100% of the time?
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Can you name a vehicle that is 100% reliable 100% of the time?
No but some vehicles are 100% reliable more often than others.
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No but some vehicles are 100% reliable more often than others.
You must be getting old and mature that nearly makes sense, But still no xamples ?
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Can you name a vehicle that is 100% reliable 100% of the time?
PRADO, LANDCRUISER, RAV4, KLUGER etc etc
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If i were going to select a vehicle to stay out in the bush and drive hard day in day out, cross creeks rivers and run through deserts and sand dunes towing an offroad camper? well thats easy
70 series Landcruiser Wagon ;D
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You must be getting old and mature that nearly makes sense, But still no xamples ?
Landrover Discovery TD5....
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Quote Can you name a vehicle that is 100% reliable 100% of the time?"
PRADO, LANDCRUISER, RAV4, KLUGER etc etc
What the??? When I did my research while looking for a 4WD with low range.
Prado, front diff is weak,
Landcruiser, front diff is weak, engine valves need lots of adjusting, found a buyers guide list the other day for the 100 series that makes a Discovery look good.
RAV4, eats autos at 150,000km
Kluger, only known car to be rolled by the stability control, has traction problems.
In the end I went with everyone I spoke to in the 4WD shops and all the web reviews. I bought a R50 Pathfinder. :cup:
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The bloke at work goes wheeling/camping with another couple and they have a Great Wall.
He says it goes most places he does with out much fuss and travels ok overall.
Would he own one nope, but as they(the couple say) we bought a $20,000 car
and got a 20k car. Cant, wont & dont compair it to a 40or50k+ car...
Cheers Ian.
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Saw a Great Wall twin cab following a Navara twin cab down the road today, wouldn't pick em apart from behind, save for the name badges.
If the Great Wall is similar mechanicals to older Navaras and similar, presumably they should get anywhere those get. Similar $ to an older Navara, etc, but with new parts.
Can't see a down side in terms of 'horse for the course' - not that I'm in the market.